Trade down options: Pick 9

[Godaddycurse]

And Pritchard, who has value by himself.

You were replying to my quote which was in reply to an offer without pritchard

This is disingenuous, as you were already rejecting the initial offer with Pritchard included:

28, 32, 2026 1st and Payton Pritchard from the Celtics…..too much or not enough?

Not enough

Then you should quote the original offer/reply.

Regardless i think boston will be trying to win next year if they dont own their 2026 1st so i dont think highly of it even with Tatum out

[Myth]

Yeah this would add salary which is not a Celtics goal. Removing Pritchard probably makes it closer.
Even with the Celtics issues next year they won’t be a lotto team. That pick is likely around 20, possibly better or possibly worse. The variance that it could be worse gives it some value.
So maybe 28,32 and the 2026 pick is enough value for 9? Maybe we top 10 protect the pick.
As a Celtics fan I would do that.

28, 32 and a projected non lotto pick next year is not worth 9.

So with Pritchard is it? Or does the pick need to remain unprotected? Or just not enough?

I think Raptors need a star, and the #9 is much more likely to land one than 28 and 32, and I believe Celtics will still be a playoff team, so that pick doesn’t become more likely. Pritchard has value, but he’ll never be a star, so I think the fit in Toronto doesn’t make sense. What does he do for the Raptors besides make them slightly better and more likely to treadmill? I think Pritchard has more value to a team trying to win.

[Saul Goodman]

Assume Malauch is gone the raptors should look into it. If he’s there he’s a raptor for sure


#9 to OKC


#15/2026 Philly 1-4 protected to Toronto

[brackdan70]

Assume Malauch is gone the raptors should look into it. If he’s there he’s a raptor for sure


#9 to OKC


#15/2026 Philly 1-4 protected to Toronto

That feels like a bit too much. Philly has so much variance, that could easily be a top 10 pick next year.

[shi-woo]

Pritchard is not worth a lotto pick

Yeah this would add salary which is not a Celtics goal. Removing Pritchard probably makes it closer.
Even with the Celtics issues next year they won’t be a lotto team. That pick is likely around 20, possibly better or possibly worse. The variance that it could be worse gives it some value.
So maybe 28,32 and the 2026 pick is enough value for 9? Maybe we top 10 protect the pick.
As a Celtics fan I would do that.

28, 32 and a projected non lotto pick next year is not worth 9.

I wish I knew a better way to look up trades involving picks, but all I have is my memory and bbalref. Here are a bunch of modern trades involving similar picks.

Kawhii at pick #15 was traded for George Hill (lol)

Donovan Mitchell drafted #13 traded for Trey Lyles (lol)

Brridges drafted #10 and traded for #16 and a future first

Cam Johnson at #11 was traded for Culver

#9 Trey Burke was traded for Shabazz M and Dieng

#8 Hayes and #17 plus multiple 2nds were traded to move up to #4 and take Deandre Hunter

Pappagiannis at #13 was traded with Bogy for MArquice Chriss

Dougy Buckets at #11 was traded for #19 and a 2nd (Gary Harris and Nurk)

Bismack was picked #7 and traded for #10 Jimmer and John Salmons

Jaryd Bayess at #11 was traded for Jarret Jack and Brandon Rush.

Cole Aldrich at #11 was traded for Mo Pete and Quincy Pondexter

Nerlens Noel at #6 was traded for Jrue and a FRP

Jeff Green at #5 was traded in a blockbuster for Ray Allen


I added the last two because I assume that's what you think the value of pick #9 is, and you are probably hoping for a Deandre Hunter type of trade, but the reality is those trades were the outliers.

History shows us that the #9 pick is worth either an okay starter like George Hill, Jack, and Lyles, a middling pick and some form of future pick, or a middling pick and some form of cap relief.

Expecting anything more than that is bugging for a #9 pick. Pritchard, 28, and 32 would historically be an overpay, let alone with an unprotected pick thrown in, which would be malpractice.

28, 32, and a protected 2026 pick would be fair value, or protected 26 and Hauser would be fair value.

[Godaddycurse]

Yeah this would add salary which is not a Celtics goal. Removing Pritchard probably makes it closer.
Even with the Celtics issues next year they won’t be a lotto team. That pick is likely around 20, possibly better or possibly worse. The variance that it could be worse gives it some value.
So maybe 28,32 and the 2026 pick is enough value for 9? Maybe we top 10 protect the pick.
As a Celtics fan I would do that.

28, 32 and a projected non lotto pick next year is not worth 9.

I wish I knew a better way to look up trades involving picks, but all I have is my memory and bbalref. Here are a bunch of modern trades involving similar picks.

Kawhii at pick #15 was traded for George Hill (lol)

Donovan Mitchell drafted #13 traded for Trey Lyles (lol)

Brridges drafted #10 and traded for #16 and a future first

Cam Johnson at #11 was traded for Culver

#9 Trey Burke was traded for Shabazz M and Dieng

#8 Hayes and #17 plus multiple 2nds were traded to move up to #4 and take Deandre Hunter

Pappagiannis at #13 was traded with Bogy for MArquice Chriss

Dougy Buckets at #11 was traded for #19 and a 2nd (Gary Harris and Nurk)

Bismack was picked #7 and traded for #10 Jimmer and John Salmons

Jaryd Bayess at #11 was traded for Jarret Jack and Brandon Rush.

Cole Aldrich at #11 was traded for Mo Pete and Quincy Pondexter

Nerlens Noel at #6 was traded for Jrue and a FRP

Jeff Green at #5 was traded in a blockbuster for Ray Allen


I added the last two because I assume that's what you think the value of pick #9 is, and you are probably hoping for a Deandre Hunter type of trade, but the reality is those trades were the outliers.

History shows us that the #9 pick is worth either an okay starter like George Hill, Jack, and Lyles, a middling pick and some form of future pick, or a middling pick and some form of cap relief.

Expecting anything more than that is bugging for a #9 pick. Pritchard, 28, and 32 would historically be an overpay, let alone with an unprotected pick thrown in, which would be malpractice.

28, 32, and a protected 2026 pick would be fair value, or protected 26 and Hauser would be fair value.

People used to pay 3 million for a first. Using really outdated examples doesn't help your cause. Picks are worth way more now in the new cba

[wemby]

28, 32, and a protected 2026 pick would be fair value, or protected 26 and Hauser would be fair value.

Last year Spurs traded #8 to the TWolves for a far out unprotected pick 2031 and a far out, top 1 protected swap. That is a much more recent point of reference than those you listed. #9 in this class is probably more valuable than #8 last year, so I would expect any offer to be a bit better than that one.
Unprotected 31 TWolves >>> protected 26 Celtics
top 1 protected TWolves swap < 28 + 32 (but close).
I don't think that offer gets it done. I'd certainly offer 14 + 38 + a couple future 2nds at least for 9, which is IMO better than the offer you listed.

[shi-woo]

28, 32, and a protected 2026 pick would be fair value, or protected 26 and Hauser would be fair value.

Last year Spurs traded #8 to the TWolves for a far out unprotected pick 2031 and a far out, top 1 protected swap. That is a much more recent point of reference than those you listed. #9 in this class is probably more valuable than #8 last year, so I would expect any offer to be a bit better than that one.
Unprotected 31 TWolves >>> protected 26 Celtics
top 1 protected TWolves swap < 28 + 32 (but close).
I don't think that offer gets it done. I'd certainly offer 14 + 38 + a couple future 2nds at least for 9, which is IMO better than the offer you listed.

Facts, and That's why in my OG post I said we are bad trading partners, Celtic's would need to overpay significantly for an asset that isn't significantly valuable.

While that is true about the value of this pick being more than last years, that would also mean the value of 28 and especially 32 is more valuable. We've seen the value of early 2nds sky rocket, and it's the sweetspot in the draft for finding upperclass rotation pieces for teams. That pick would not just be a throw it, it hold legit value. I always question the value of "a strong draft class" when we aren't talking top 5 picks.

I don't think using the trade last year really resets the barometer, I think it all just depends on the type of team you are trading with and how you view your own team. If they are one piece away in their rebuild or rotation, they will probably overpay like Minn last year. If not, and it's more of an egalitarian help me help you trade, you see more trades like the Bridges trade, which is like the one you proposed.

I agree, your trade is better in a vacuum, but a lot of that would be determined on how TOR views their team and cap situation. Getting the 6moty locked up for 7 mil on a team looking to contend and not pay high taxes could make up the difference in value. Only TOR knows their current situation, so if they want a rotation piece and can't find a blockbuster trade to level up, this would essentially be like the Caruso trade for them, and what Hill, Jack, and Lyles were to the teams that traded for them. The value of a pick changes based on team need, and right now i'm curious to where TOR sees themselves after the BI trade. It's def. something worth thinking about, and keeping in mind when watching the draft later this year

But I agree 100% and think TOR should and would take your offer of moving back and snagging 3 2nds, and thinking that's more inline with History.

[Godaddycurse]

28, 32, and a protected 2026 pick would be fair value, or protected 26 and Hauser would be fair value.

Last year Spurs traded #8 to the TWolves for a far out unprotected pick 2031 and a far out, top 1 protected swap. That is a much more recent point of reference than those you listed. #9 in this class is probably more valuable than #8 last year, so I would expect any offer to be a bit better than that one.
Unprotected 31 TWolves >>> protected 26 Celtics
top 1 protected TWolves swap < 28 + 32 (but close).
I don't think that offer gets it done. I'd certainly offer 14 + 38 + a couple future 2nds at least for 9, which is IMO better than the offer you listed.

Facts, and That's why in my OG post I said we are bad trading partners, Celtic's would need to overpay significantly for an asset that isn't significantly valuable.

While that is true about the value of this pick being more than last years, that would also mean the value of 28 and especially 32 is more valuable. We've seen the value of early 2nds sky rocket, and it's the sweetspot in the draft for finding upperclass rotation pieces for teams. That pick would not just be a throw it, it hold legit value. I always question the value of "a strong draft class" when we aren't talking top 5 picks.

I don't think using the trade last year really resets the barometer, I think it all just depends on the type of team you are trading with and how you view your own team. If they are one piece away in their rebuild or rotation, they will probably overpay like Minn last year. If not, and it's more of an egalitarian help me help you trade, you see more trades like the Bridges trade, which is like the one you proposed.

I agree, your trade is better in a vacuum, but a lot of that would be determined on how TOR views their team and cap situation. Getting the 6moty locked up for 7 mil on a team looking to contend and not pay high taxes could make up the difference in value. Only TOR knows their current situation, so if they want a rotation piece and can't find a blockbuster trade to level up, this would essentially be like the Caruso trade for them, and what Hill, Jack, and Lyles were to the teams that traded for them. The value of a pick changes based on team need, and right now i'm curious to where TOR sees themselves after the BI trade. It's def. something worth thinking about, and keeping in mind when watching the draft later this year

But I agree 100% and think TOR should and would take your offer of moving back and snagging 3 2nds, and thinking that's more inline with History.

14 and 3 seconds dont get to 9. 3 seconds dont even get you a late 1st.

OKC ate 17M in salary (worth more than 3 seconds) to trade up from 12 to 10 to draft wallace.

[jayjaysee]

I’d trade 28 and 32 for a distant swap just in case..

Maybe not all Front Offices have that ability though

[islandboy53]

Toronto needs to add some quality depth in this draft, and are well positioned to do so with the 9th pick. If Maluach is still on the board when they pick, that's their guy, and they're done. If he's gone, they might make a small move like flipping with Houston for #10 and a 2nd or two, or even Atlanta for 13 and 22, but I don't see them moving down further than that.