NBA Trade Thread #12

[MrSparkle]

AK should try to buy low on every asset, until he finds a young, 2nd round (floor) team. It’s just a simple rule that makes a lot of sense.

Sabonis has proven to be a 1st-round ceiling star. He’s almost 30. Sacramento won’t give him away.

I’d rather gamble on a big at #12 and live with the 50/50 boom/bust odds, sooner than add $50M to the 2028 books and give up our few assets… again, become a play-in/lottery team that doesn’t even own its own FRPs.

This madness has to stop.

[sco]

AK should try to buy low on every asset, until he finds a young, 2nd round (floor) team. It’s just a simple rule that makes a lot of sense.

Sabonis has proven to be a 1st-round ceiling star. He’s almost 30. Sacramento won’t give him away.

I’d rather gamble on a big at #12 and live with the 50/50 boom/bust odds, sooner than add $50M to the 2028 books and give up our few assets… again, become a play-in/lottery team that doesn’t even own its own FRPs.

This madness has to stop.

I worry that the madness is intrinsic to AK's "replicate Denver or die trying" mantra. I feel like we are doomed to replace Vuc with a younger offense-only C. The madness will culminate with the signing of a 40 year old Joker when he wants to come back after being out of the league for 3 years...but that guy will still be better than Vuc.

[Infinity2152]

AK should try to buy low on every asset, until he finds a young, 2nd round (floor) team. It’s just a simple rule that makes a lot of sense.

Sabonis has proven to be a 1st-round ceiling star. He’s almost 30. Sacramento won’t give him away.

I’d rather gamble on a big at #12 and live with the 50/50 boom/bust odds, sooner than add $50M to the 2028 books and give up our few assets… again, become a play-in/lottery team that doesn’t even own its own FRPs.

This madness has to stop.

The trade proposed was Vuc, Collins, filler, POR 1st for Sabonis. How do we not have our own FRP's? Almost 30, means not yet 30 in a league where guys are playing till 40. Brunson is a year younger, leading a team to the conference Finals, he too old too? And you're seriously bringing up 2028 cap? Is that how long you want to wait to make a move?

What's the solution here? Don't get better? We can pretty easily be a play-in team without a Sabonis level addition. So we're still a play in team with him? Plus whoever we get at 12? Who better than Sabonis are we getting with that money? You must have some plan to use that money to get something better than a 29 year old 3x All Star with no durability issues.

How about getting the most out of Giddey and Matas? Does waiting to get them a great vet and drafting another rookie help their development much? Explained several times Bulls would still have enough money to add another $20+ mill player to Giddey, Matas, Sabonis, maybe $30-$40 mill, before we come close to the cap of contending teams. Sabonis, Giddey, Matas, Ball, Smith, Phillips would be our cap, relatively cheap. Tax is looking around 188 mill in 2026.

Your plan doesn't make sense simply because we have to pay Giddey this summer and Matas is already one year into his rookie contract. Year 2 next season. We're about to draft a lottery rookie. The clock starts when we pay Giddey. We have all our picks and multiple tradeable expiring contracts. Unless you're hoping we're saved by the draft in the next few years, perfect time to make a move, especially with Coby valuable and expiring.

[sco]

Hope this shuts down the speculation here on these guys:

https://sports.yahoo.com/article/celtics-shut-down-trade-talk-164140524.html

“Neither Jayson Tatum or Jaylen Brown are on their way out of Boston… League sources are insistent the Celtics have given zero indications that parting ways with Derrick White this summer is a possibility.”

[MrSparkle]

AK should try to buy low on every asset, until he finds a young, 2nd round (floor) team. It’s just a simple rule that makes a lot of sense.

Sabonis has proven to be a 1st-round ceiling star. He’s almost 30. Sacramento won’t give him away.

I’d rather gamble on a big at #12 and live with the 50/50 boom/bust odds, sooner than add $50M to the 2028 books and give up our few assets… again, become a play-in/lottery team that doesn’t even own its own FRPs.

This madness has to stop.

The trade proposed was Vuc, Collins, filler, POR 1st for Sabonis. How do we not have our own FRP's? Almost 30, means not yet 30 in a league where guys are playing till 40. Brunson is a year younger, leading a team to the conference Finals, he too old too? And you're seriously bringing up 2028 cap? Is that how long you want to wait to make a move?

What's the solution here? Don't get better? We can pretty easily be a play-in team without a Sabonis level addition. So we're still a play in team with him? Plus whoever we get at 12? Who better than Sabonis are we getting with that money? You must have some plan to use that money to get something better than a 29 year old 3x All Star with no durability issues.

How about getting the most out of Giddey and Matas? Does waiting to get them a great vet and drafting another rookie help their development much? Explained several times Bulls would still have enough money to add another $20+ mill player to Giddey, Matas, Sabonis, maybe $30-$40 mill, before we come close to the cap of contending teams. Sabonis, Giddey, Matas, Ball, Smith, Phillips would be our cap, relatively cheap. Tax is looking around 188 mill in 2026.

Your plan doesn't make sense simply because we have to pay Giddey this summer and Matas is already one year into his rookie contract. Year 2 next season. We're about to draft a lottery rookie. The clock starts when we pay Giddey. We have all our picks and multiple tradeable expiring contracts. Unless you're hoping we're saved by the draft in the next few years, perfect time to make a move, especially with Coby valuable and expiring.

Why the heck would Sacramento take that weak offer? They need atleast 1 Bulls FRP to entertain that.

[pipfan]

AK should try to buy low on every asset, until he finds a young, 2nd round (floor) team. It’s just a simple rule that makes a lot of sense.

Sabonis has proven to be a 1st-round ceiling star. He’s almost 30. Sacramento won’t give him away.

I’d rather gamble on a big at #12 and live with the 50/50 boom/bust odds, sooner than add $50M to the 2028 books and give up our few assets… again, become a play-in/lottery team that doesn’t even own its own FRPs.

This madness has to stop.

The trade proposed was Vuc, Collins, filler, POR 1st for Sabonis. How do we not have our own FRP's? Almost 30, means not yet 30 in a league where guys are playing till 40. Brunson is a year younger, leading a team to the conference Finals, he too old too? And you're seriously bringing up 2028 cap? Is that how long you want to wait to make a move?

What's the solution here? Don't get better? We can pretty easily be a play-in team without a Sabonis level addition. So we're still a play in team with him? Plus whoever we get at 12? Who better than Sabonis are we getting with that money? You must have some plan to use that money to get something better than a 29 year old 3x All Star with no durability issues.

How about getting the most out of Giddey and Matas? Does waiting to get them a great vet and drafting another rookie help their development much? Explained several times Bulls would still have enough money to add another $20+ mill player to Giddey, Matas, Sabonis, maybe $30-$40 mill, before we come close to the cap of contending teams. Sabonis, Giddey, Matas, Ball, Smith, Phillips would be our cap, relatively cheap. Tax is looking around 188 mill in 2026.

Your plan doesn't make sense simply because we have to pay Giddey this summer and Matas is already one year into his rookie contract. Year 2 next season. We're about to draft a lottery rookie. The clock starts when we pay Giddey. We have all our picks and multiple tradeable expiring contracts. Unless you're hoping we're saved by the draft in the next few years, perfect time to make a move, especially with Coby valuable and expiring.

Why the heck would Sacramento take that weak offer? They need atleast 1 Bulls FRP to entertain that.

For sure-Port would want the #12/Port pick/at least 1 more first (probably unprotected). Sabonis is an All Star-but not a good target for us

[Rose2Boozer]

The Bulls trade Zach Collins to the Jazz for Collin Sexton.

The Bulls trade Lonzo Ball to the Mavericks for Naji Marshall.

Giddey/Ayo
White/Sexton
Marshall/Huerter
Buzelis/Williams
Vucevic/Sorber

[Infinity2152]

AK should try to buy low on every asset, until he finds a young, 2nd round (floor) team. It’s just a simple rule that makes a lot of sense.

Sabonis has proven to be a 1st-round ceiling star. He’s almost 30. Sacramento won’t give him away.

I’d rather gamble on a big at #12 and live with the 50/50 boom/bust odds, sooner than add $50M to the 2028 books and give up our few assets… again, become a play-in/lottery team that doesn’t even own its own FRPs.

This madness has to stop.

The trade proposed was Vuc, Collins, filler, POR 1st for Sabonis. How do we not have our own FRP's? Almost 30, means not yet 30 in a league where guys are playing till 40. Brunson is a year younger, leading a team to the conference Finals, he too old too? And you're seriously bringing up 2028 cap? Is that how long you want to wait to make a move?

What's the solution here? Don't get better? We can pretty easily be a play-in team without a Sabonis level addition. So we're still a play in team with him? Plus whoever we get at 12? Who better than Sabonis are we getting with that money? You must have some plan to use that money to get something better than a 29 year old 3x All Star with no durability issues.

How about getting the most out of Giddey and Matas? Does waiting to get them a great vet and drafting another rookie help their development much? Explained several times Bulls would still have enough money to add another $20+ mill player to Giddey, Matas, Sabonis, maybe $30-$40 mill, before we come close to the cap of contending teams. Sabonis, Giddey, Matas, Ball, Smith, Phillips would be our cap, relatively cheap. Tax is looking around 188 mill in 2026.

Your plan doesn't make sense simply because we have to pay Giddey this summer and Matas is already one year into his rookie contract. Year 2 next season. We're about to draft a lottery rookie. The clock starts when we pay Giddey. We have all our picks and multiple tradeable expiring contracts. Unless you're hoping we're saved by the draft in the next few years, perfect time to make a move, especially with Coby valuable and expiring.

Why the heck would Sacramento take that weak offer? They need atleast 1 Bulls FRP to entertain that.

If you want to debate what Sacramento would accept for Sabonis, I guess we could, though I don't know how either of us would prove our point. Maybe I missed it, did somebody suggest we trade all our picks for Sabonis? Maybe they like one of our players. Maybe they love two of them. You/we simply don't know. Maybe they have a plan and they want a lot of expiring money to make a move.

It's also kind of besides the point. That's part of negotiation. Who cares what the Kings want, only care about the lowest price they'd accept, not the best. All trade offers start somewhere. You see how you changed it from "we won't have any of our FRP's" to "they need at least 1 Bulls FRP?" Who cares about giving up a first round pick to add an All-Star? Isn't that what you're trying to get with those picks in the first place? Except you have an actual All Star player, rather than a very unlikely chance to add one in the future. I swear it seems like some Bulls fans PLAN on us losing every deal, they want us to come out the door with our highest offer. It's simple, if they want 3-4 firsts, just don't do the trade.

If the deal is Coby, Matas, Vucevic, 3-4 first round picks, etc, doubt any of us say yes. If it's remotely like the deal that's actually being discussed here, that's an entirely different discussion.

So what would we have to give up to get Sabonis, in your opinion? Including at least 1 Bulls FRP. We can debate it from that starting point if it seems reasonable. Or is it just no at any price? Is your argument he's not likely to be a great addition to the team for the next 3-4 years, and an absolutely great trade piece if a superstar trade comes up. At 29, he could easily be a great player for at least another 5-8 years. Guess you wouldn't want Giannis either, he's 29 too.

[MrSparkle]

The trade proposed was Vuc, Collins, filler, POR 1st for Sabonis. How do we not have our own FRP's? Almost 30, means not yet 30 in a league where guys are playing till 40. Brunson is a year younger, leading a team to the conference Finals, he too old too? And you're seriously bringing up 2028 cap? Is that how long you want to wait to make a move?

What's the solution here? Don't get better? We can pretty easily be a play-in team without a Sabonis level addition. So we're still a play in team with him? Plus whoever we get at 12? Who better than Sabonis are we getting with that money? You must have some plan to use that money to get something better than a 29 year old 3x All Star with no durability issues.

How about getting the most out of Giddey and Matas? Does waiting to get them a great vet and drafting another rookie help their development much? Explained several times Bulls would still have enough money to add another $20+ mill player to Giddey, Matas, Sabonis, maybe $30-$40 mill, before we come close to the cap of contending teams. Sabonis, Giddey, Matas, Ball, Smith, Phillips would be our cap, relatively cheap. Tax is looking around 188 mill in 2026.

Your plan doesn't make sense simply because we have to pay Giddey this summer and Matas is already one year into his rookie contract. Year 2 next season. We're about to draft a lottery rookie. The clock starts when we pay Giddey. We have all our picks and multiple tradeable expiring contracts. Unless you're hoping we're saved by the draft in the next few years, perfect time to make a move, especially with Coby valuable and expiring.

Why the heck would Sacramento take that weak offer? They need atleast 1 Bulls FRP to entertain that.

If you want to debate what Sacramento would accept for Sabonis, I guess we could, though I don't know how either of us would prove our point. Maybe I missed it, did somebody suggest we trade all our picks for Sabonis? Maybe they like one of our players. Maybe they love two of them. You/we simply don't know. Maybe they have a plan and they want a lot of expiring money to make a move.

It's also kind of besides the point. That's part of negotiation. Who cares what the Kings want, only care about the lowest price they'd accept, not the best. All trade offers start somewhere. You see how you changed it from "we won't have any of our FRP's" to "they need at least 1 Bulls FRP?" Who cares about giving up a first round pick to add an All-Star? Isn't that what you're trying to get with those picks in the first place? Except you have an actual All Star player, rather than a very unlikely chance to add one in the future. I swear it seems like some Bulls fans PLAN on us losing every deal, they want us to come out the door with our highest offer. It's simple, if they want 3-4 firsts, just don't do the trade.

If the deal is Coby, Matas, Vucevic, 3-4 first round picks, etc, doubt any of us say yes. If it's remotely like the deal that's actually being discussed here, that's an entirely different discussion.

So what would we have to give up to get Sabonis, in your opinion? Including at least 1 Bulls FRP. We can debate it from that starting point if it seems reasonable. Or is it just no at any price? Is your argument he's not likely to be a great addition to the team for the next 3-4 years, and an absolutely great trade piece if a superstar trade comes up. At 29, he could easily be a great player for at least another 5-8 years. Guess you wouldn't want Giannis either, he's 29 too.

How are Sabonis and Giannis remotely comparable?

Sacramento got 3 FRPs and 3 SRPs along with the 2nd best prime player in the deal (Lavine), while dumping what they considered a deadweight contract in Huerter. Why would Sabonis’ price tag not be the same, if not higher? His numbers and advanced stats are much better; he’s got 3 ASGs to Fox’s 1.

There’s just no reason Kings would sell him for less than 3 FRPs or one really good player. Vuc, Collins and lotto protected Portland pick that may not convey? That’s the kind of offer you make for Kyle Kuzma, before he further tanked his value in Milwaukee.

Sure- they’ll take Coby, Vuc and 2 Bulls FRPs, but I don’t see them taking any less, and I don’t see why we would entertain that.

[Infinity2152]

Why the heck would Sacramento take that weak offer? They need atleast 1 Bulls FRP to entertain that.

If you want to debate what Sacramento would accept for Sabonis, I guess we could, though I don't know how either of us would prove our point. Maybe I missed it, did somebody suggest we trade all our picks for Sabonis? Maybe they like one of our players. Maybe they love two of them. You/we simply don't know. Maybe they have a plan and they want a lot of expiring money to make a move.

It's also kind of besides the point. That's part of negotiation. Who cares what the Kings want, only care about the lowest price they'd accept, not the best. All trade offers start somewhere. You see how you changed it from "we won't have any of our FRP's" to "they need at least 1 Bulls FRP?" Who cares about giving up a first round pick to add an All-Star? Isn't that what you're trying to get with those picks in the first place? Except you have an actual All Star player, rather than a very unlikely chance to add one in the future. I swear it seems like some Bulls fans PLAN on us losing every deal, they want us to come out the door with our highest offer. It's simple, if they want 3-4 firsts, just don't do the trade.

If the deal is Coby, Matas, Vucevic, 3-4 first round picks, etc, doubt any of us say yes. If it's remotely like the deal that's actually being discussed here, that's an entirely different discussion.

So what would we have to give up to get Sabonis, in your opinion? Including at least 1 Bulls FRP. We can debate it from that starting point if it seems reasonable. Or is it just no at any price? Is your argument he's not likely to be a great addition to the team for the next 3-4 years, and an absolutely great trade piece if a superstar trade comes up. At 29, he could easily be a great player for at least another 5-8 years. Guess you wouldn't want Giannis either, he's 29 too.

How are Sabonis and Giannis remotely comparable?

Sacramento got 3 FRPs and 3 SRPs along with the 2nd best prime player in the deal (Lavine), while dumping what they considered a deadweight contract in Huerter. Why would Sabonis’ price tag not be the same, if not higher? His numbers and advanced stats are much better; he’s got 3 ASGs to Fox’s 1.

There’s just no reason Kings would sell him for less than 3 FRPs or one really good player. Vuc, Collins and lotto protected Portland pick that may not convey? That’s the kind of offer you make for Kyle Kuzma, before he further tanked his value in Milwaukee.

Sure- they’ll take Coby, Vuc and 2 Bulls FRPs, but I don’t see them taking any less, and I don’t see why we would entertain that.

They're comparable if you're using age as a reason to disqualify Sabonis, they're both 29 yr old PF in good health. It's wild to treat 29 as old in the NBA.

Coby, Vucevic, we probably add another player in there to come close to matching salary. That makes up for a pick. The deal you're talking about was for De'Aaron Fox. The actual Sabonis trade was Haliburton, Buddy Hield and Tristan Thompson and in addition to Sabonis, the Kings got Justin Holiday, Jeremy Lamb, and a second round pick. This was the ACTUAL trade value for Sabonis. Haliburton was picked with pick 12 one years prior, averaging 15pts, 8 assists with average defense. Nowhere near 3 first round picks plus a 26 yr 20Pt scorer, plus an 18/10 center shooting 40% from 3 last year plus another player to match salary. Your trade value for Sabonis isn't close to what they actually gave up for him.

Again, state what you think the minimum offer the Kings would accept, and we can go from there. You still haven't said what this asking price will be that's too high for us. The Portland first was initially mentioned, no value to that? Couldn't our picks be protected too?

Sample offer: Coby, Vucevic, Ayo, Portland 1st, Bulls 2028 first for Sabonis. All three of those players could be gone in 2026, with us getting little in return. They're all expiring. So in 2026 we'd be talking about having the Portland 1st, our 2028 first and whatever assets we got from those players, vs Sabonis.

For the Kings, they already messed up taking the Lavine/Derozan contracts. These contracts plus picks give them way more flexibility in what they can do.

Of course they could say no. Maybe they have no plans at all to move Sabonis. Wouldn't stop me from trying. Who do you want to add to improve the team, or do you not want us to add better players? It's not going to be free. Welcoming some alternative prospects.

[sco]

If you want to debate what Sacramento would accept for Sabonis, I guess we could, though I don't know how either of us would prove our point. Maybe I missed it, did somebody suggest we trade all our picks for Sabonis? Maybe they like one of our players. Maybe they love two of them. You/we simply don't know. Maybe they have a plan and they want a lot of expiring money to make a move.

It's also kind of besides the point. That's part of negotiation. Who cares what the Kings want, only care about the lowest price they'd accept, not the best. All trade offers start somewhere. You see how you changed it from "we won't have any of our FRP's" to "they need at least 1 Bulls FRP?" Who cares about giving up a first round pick to add an All-Star? Isn't that what you're trying to get with those picks in the first place? Except you have an actual All Star player, rather than a very unlikely chance to add one in the future. I swear it seems like some Bulls fans PLAN on us losing every deal, they want us to come out the door with our highest offer. It's simple, if they want 3-4 firsts, just don't do the trade.

If the deal is Coby, Matas, Vucevic, 3-4 first round picks, etc, doubt any of us say yes. If it's remotely like the deal that's actually being discussed here, that's an entirely different discussion.

So what would we have to give up to get Sabonis, in your opinion? Including at least 1 Bulls FRP. We can debate it from that starting point if it seems reasonable. Or is it just no at any price? Is your argument he's not likely to be a great addition to the team for the next 3-4 years, and an absolutely great trade piece if a superstar trade comes up. At 29, he could easily be a great player for at least another 5-8 years. Guess you wouldn't want Giannis either, he's 29 too.

How are Sabonis and Giannis remotely comparable?

Sacramento got 3 FRPs and 3 SRPs along with the 2nd best prime player in the deal (Lavine), while dumping what they considered a deadweight contract in Huerter. Why would Sabonis’ price tag not be the same, if not higher? His numbers and advanced stats are much better; he’s got 3 ASGs to Fox’s 1.

There’s just no reason Kings would sell him for less than 3 FRPs or one really good player. Vuc, Collins and lotto protected Portland pick that may not convey? That’s the kind of offer you make for Kyle Kuzma, before he further tanked his value in Milwaukee.

Sure- they’ll take Coby, Vuc and 2 Bulls FRPs, but I don’t see them taking any less, and I don’t see why we would entertain that.

They're comparable if you're using age as a reason to disqualify Sabonis, they're both 29 yr old PF in good health. It's wild to treat 29 as old in the NBA.

Coby, Vucevic, we probably add another player in there to come close to matching salary. That makes up for a pick. The deal you're talking about was for De'Aaron Fox. The actual Sabonis trade was Haliburton, Buddy Hield and Tristan Thompson and in addition to Sabonis, the Kings got Justin Holiday, Jeremy Lamb, and a second round pick. This was the ACTUAL trade value for Sabonis. Haliburton was picked with pick 12 one years prior, averaging 15pts, 8 assists with average defense. Nowhere near 3 first round picks plus a 26 yr 20Pt scorer, plus an 18/10 center shooting 40% from 3 last year plus another player to match salary. Your trade value for Sabonis isn't close to what they actually gave up for him.

Again, state what you think the minimum offer the Kings would accept, and we can go from there. You still haven't said what this asking price will be that's too high for us. The Portland first was initially mentioned, no value to that? Couldn't our picks be protected too?

Sample offer: Coby, Vucevic, Ayo, Portland 1st, Bulls 2028 first for Sabonis. All three of those players could be gone in 2026, with us getting little in return. They're all expiring. So in 2026 we'd be talking about having the Portland 1st, our 2028 first and whatever assets we got from those players, vs Sabonis.

For the Kings, they already messed up taking the Lavine/Derozan contracts. These contracts plus picks give them way more flexibility in what they can do.

Of course they could say no. Maybe they have no plans at all to move Sabonis. Wouldn't stop me from trying. Who do you want to add to improve the team, or do you not want us to add better players? It's not going to be free. Welcoming some alternative prospects.

Trading real assets for Sabonis would be the closest possible move to redoing the trade for Vuc. This is a copycat league. When Joker flashed onto the scene, GM's kept looking for the pot of gold and the end of the "play-making, 3pt shooting, non-defending center" rainbow. AK found a bucket of sh*t at the end of the Vuc rainbow, and then paid for 2 more years for all of us fans to dig around in that bucket of sh*t to help AK find his gold.

Clearly there must be a different rainbow to follow

[sco]

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/280517/Mavericks-Looking-For-Fill-In-Starting-Point-Guard-Who-Can-Complement-Kyrie-Irving

Carter for Powell might be interesting? or Ayo + Carter + our 2nd for Washingtion?

[Infinity2152]

How are Sabonis and Giannis remotely comparable?

Sacramento got 3 FRPs and 3 SRPs along with the 2nd best prime player in the deal (Lavine), while dumping what they considered a deadweight contract in Huerter. Why would Sabonis’ price tag not be the same, if not higher? His numbers and advanced stats are much better; he’s got 3 ASGs to Fox’s 1.

There’s just no reason Kings would sell him for less than 3 FRPs or one really good player. Vuc, Collins and lotto protected Portland pick that may not convey? That’s the kind of offer you make for Kyle Kuzma, before he further tanked his value in Milwaukee.

Sure- they’ll take Coby, Vuc and 2 Bulls FRPs, but I don’t see them taking any less, and I don’t see why we would entertain that.

They're comparable if you're using age as a reason to disqualify Sabonis, they're both 29 yr old PF in good health. It's wild to treat 29 as old in the NBA.

Coby, Vucevic, we probably add another player in there to come close to matching salary. That makes up for a pick. The deal you're talking about was for De'Aaron Fox. The actual Sabonis trade was Haliburton, Buddy Hield and Tristan Thompson and in addition to Sabonis, the Kings got Justin Holiday, Jeremy Lamb, and a second round pick. This was the ACTUAL trade value for Sabonis. Haliburton was picked with pick 12 one years prior, averaging 15pts, 8 assists with average defense. Nowhere near 3 first round picks plus a 26 yr 20Pt scorer, plus an 18/10 center shooting 40% from 3 last year plus another player to match salary. Your trade value for Sabonis isn't close to what they actually gave up for him.

Again, state what you think the minimum offer the Kings would accept, and we can go from there. You still haven't said what this asking price will be that's too high for us. The Portland first was initially mentioned, no value to that? Couldn't our picks be protected too?

Sample offer: Coby, Vucevic, Ayo, Portland 1st, Bulls 2028 first for Sabonis. All three of those players could be gone in 2026, with us getting little in return. They're all expiring. So in 2026 we'd be talking about having the Portland 1st, our 2028 first and whatever assets we got from those players, vs Sabonis.

For the Kings, they already messed up taking the Lavine/Derozan contracts. These contracts plus picks give them way more flexibility in what they can do.

Of course they could say no. Maybe they have no plans at all to move Sabonis. Wouldn't stop me from trying. Who do you want to add to improve the team, or do you not want us to add better players? It's not going to be free. Welcoming some alternative prospects.

Trading real assets for Sabonis would be the closest possible move to redoing the trade for Vuc. This is a copycat league. When Joker flashed onto the scene, GM's kept looking for the pot of gold and the end of the "play-making, 3pt shooting, non-defending center" rainbow. AK found a bucket of sh*t at the end of the Vuc rainbow, and then paid for 2 more years for all of us fans to dig around in that bucket of sh*t to help AK find his gold.

Clearly there must be a different rainbow to follow

Did you miss the whole "play Sabonis at PF instead of center" which completely invalidates the whole comparison? Vucevic is 20lbs heavier and 5 years older than Sabonis and Sabonis has been in DPOY running, don't know why people keep acting like they're the same guy. Paired with the right center, his elite rebounding can help if the center is a good paint defender, but not elite rebounder. Like Brook Lopez or Myles Turner. He doesn't have to be the paint defender. Sabonis has a career defensive rating of 109.9, but it's generally much better at PF than center for him.

New copycat league is 6'6-6'8 lightweight switchable power forwards. Then you face Siakam, Porzingas, Zion, Lebron, KAT, Randle, Evan Mobley, Banchero, Aaron Gordon, Chet Holmgrem at PF in the playoffs and wonder why your team is getting destroyed in rebounds and all your PF's are in foul trouble. How many teams with big PF's in the playoffs, vs small ones?

Look at the T Wolves. Randle's defense and rebounding is worse than Sabonis. They're in the conference Finals. They have him paired with a defensive center. Don't think KAT is a better defender than Sabonis either. Conference Finals. Way better comparisons to Sabonis at PF than Vucevic at center. Let's talk about how the Knicks and Wolve's can't possibly win because their power forwards are not rim protectors or strong defenders.

[sco]

They're comparable if you're using age as a reason to disqualify Sabonis, they're both 29 yr old PF in good health. It's wild to treat 29 as old in the NBA.

Coby, Vucevic, we probably add another player in there to come close to matching salary. That makes up for a pick. The deal you're talking about was for De'Aaron Fox. The actual Sabonis trade was Haliburton, Buddy Hield and Tristan Thompson and in addition to Sabonis, the Kings got Justin Holiday, Jeremy Lamb, and a second round pick. This was the ACTUAL trade value for Sabonis. Haliburton was picked with pick 12 one years prior, averaging 15pts, 8 assists with average defense. Nowhere near 3 first round picks plus a 26 yr 20Pt scorer, plus an 18/10 center shooting 40% from 3 last year plus another player to match salary. Your trade value for Sabonis isn't close to what they actually gave up for him.

Again, state what you think the minimum offer the Kings would accept, and we can go from there. You still haven't said what this asking price will be that's too high for us. The Portland first was initially mentioned, no value to that? Couldn't our picks be protected too?

Sample offer: Coby, Vucevic, Ayo, Portland 1st, Bulls 2028 first for Sabonis. All three of those players could be gone in 2026, with us getting little in return. They're all expiring. So in 2026 we'd be talking about having the Portland 1st, our 2028 first and whatever assets we got from those players, vs Sabonis.

For the Kings, they already messed up taking the Lavine/Derozan contracts. These contracts plus picks give them way more flexibility in what they can do.

Of course they could say no. Maybe they have no plans at all to move Sabonis. Wouldn't stop me from trying. Who do you want to add to improve the team, or do you not want us to add better players? It's not going to be free. Welcoming some alternative prospects.

Trading real assets for Sabonis would be the closest possible move to redoing the trade for Vuc. This is a copycat league. When Joker flashed onto the scene, GM's kept looking for the pot of gold and the end of the "play-making, 3pt shooting, non-defending center" rainbow. AK found a bucket of sh*t at the end of the Vuc rainbow, and then paid for 2 more years for all of us fans to dig around in that bucket of sh*t to help AK find his gold.

Clearly there must be a different rainbow to follow

Did you miss the whole "play Sabonis at PF instead of center" which completely invalidates the whole comparison? Vucevic is 20lbs heavier and 5 years older than Sabonis and Sabonis has been in DPOY running, don't know why people keep acting like they're the same guy. Paired with the right center, his elite rebounding can help if the center is a good paint defender, but not elite rebounder. Like Brook Lopez or Myles Turner. He doesn't have to be the paint defender. Sabonis has a career defensive rating of 109.9, but it's generally much better at PF than center for him.

New copycat league is 6'6-6'8 lightweight switchable power forwards. Then you face Siakam, Porzingas, Zion, Lebron, KAT, Randle, Evan Mobley, Banchero, Aaron Gordon, Chet Holmgrem at PF in the playoffs and wonder why your team is getting destroyed in rebounds and all your PF's are in foul trouble. How many teams with big PF's in the playoffs, vs small ones?

Look at the T Wolves. Randle's defense and rebounding is worse than Sabonis. They're in the conference Finals. They have him paired with a defensive center. Don't think KAT is a better defender than Sabonis either. Conference Finals. Way better comparisons to Sabonis at PF than Vucevic at center. Let's talk about how the Knicks and Wolve's can't possibly win because their power forwards are not rim protectors or strong defenders.

Yeah Randle is a PF version of Demar. Minny is in the WC finals because they have an MVP-level player in Ant and an elite rim protector in Gobert. Those are things I'd be focusing on instead of Sabonis. If I wanted a PF, I'd much rather go get a guy like PJ Washington from DAL. Sabonis is an elite rebounder and passer, but we need to be injecting rim protection, 3pt shooting and POA defense into our roster...not to mention his cost.

[Infinity2152]

Trading real assets for Sabonis would be the closest possible move to redoing the trade for Vuc. This is a copycat league. When Joker flashed onto the scene, GM's kept looking for the pot of gold and the end of the "play-making, 3pt shooting, non-defending center" rainbow. AK found a bucket of sh*t at the end of the Vuc rainbow, and then paid for 2 more years for all of us fans to dig around in that bucket of sh*t to help AK find his gold.

Clearly there must be a different rainbow to follow

Did you miss the whole "play Sabonis at PF instead of center" which completely invalidates the whole comparison? Vucevic is 20lbs heavier and 5 years older than Sabonis and Sabonis has been in DPOY running, don't know why people keep acting like they're the same guy. Paired with the right center, his elite rebounding can help if the center is a good paint defender, but not elite rebounder. Like Brook Lopez or Myles Turner. He doesn't have to be the paint defender. Sabonis has a career defensive rating of 109.9, but it's generally much better at PF than center for him.

New copycat league is 6'6-6'8 lightweight switchable power forwards. Then you face Siakam, Porzingas, Zion, Lebron, KAT, Randle, Evan Mobley, Banchero, Aaron Gordon, Chet Holmgrem at PF in the playoffs and wonder why your team is getting destroyed in rebounds and all your PF's are in foul trouble. How many teams with big PF's in the playoffs, vs small ones?

Look at the T Wolves. Randle's defense and rebounding is worse than Sabonis. They're in the conference Finals. They have him paired with a defensive center. Don't think KAT is a better defender than Sabonis either. Conference Finals. Way better comparisons to Sabonis at PF than Vucevic at center. Let's talk about how the Knicks and Wolve's can't possibly win because their power forwards are not rim protectors or strong defenders.

Yeah Randle is a PF version of Demar. Minny is in the WC finals because they have an MVP-level player in Ant and an elite rim protector in Gobert. Those are things I'd be focusing on instead of Sabonis. If I wanted a PF, I'd much rather go get a guy like PJ Washington from DAL. Sabonis is an elite rebounder and passer, but we need to be injecting rim protection, 3pt shooting and POA defense into our roster...not to mention his cost.

Now we get back to the core. You have your preferences for what you think this team needs. Great. This team needs everything, we have two (kind of) guaranteed starters for 2026. Getting Sabonis at power forward has little/nothing to do with our rim protection and POA defense, and I don't know what he has to shoot to qualify as a good 3 pt shooter, if he hasn't already. POA would be dealt with by replacing Coby, rim protection by adding a center. Sure, I'd love a team with all players that can shoot threes and guard every position with every player. Not going to happen. Since Vuc is going in the deal, doesn't our rim protection jump right there? Smith is certainly a better rim protector.

Seems like you're trying to fix three problems that have little to do with the position we're talking about. We have a lottery pick and cap space/ other players. No, Sabonis is not going to be the top player on a championship team. Literally prefaced every statement with we'd need a defensive center (like Gobert). Would think it's obvious we'd also need a 1A. Getting Sabonis doesn't stop us from trying to get that 1A. Or maybe Giddey or Matas become that.

Re-sign Giddey $25 mill AAV
Coby, Vucevic, Ayo, Portland 1st, 2028 first for Sabonis. $42 mill
Actually play Jalen Smith 20 minutes/gm
Re-sign Tre Jones $8-$10 mill AAV
Draft a player at 12 to actually fit what you think you need (Maluach, Sorber, Joan Berringer) or defensive SG

Start the season:
Giddey/Jones
Ball/Huerter/Terry
Matas/Williams/Phillips
Sabonis/Williams
Smith/Collins/Maluach or Sorber or Berringer

Keep looking for 1A.

That team is just fine for now. Giddey and Matas get enough usage so we know how good they are. In the summer, you have another pick coming, Collins and Huerter come off the cap, and maybe Williams has regained some value. Plus you know where you stand with the 2025 rookie and whether you need to address center.

We'd need a coach who will play multiple bigs though, lmao!

[Dez]

When was Sabonis in the running for DPOY?

[Muzbar]

When was Sabonis in the running for DPOY?

He was tied 10th (with 3 other players) in 23-24...

[WesPeace]

Mavs thinking about Lonzo as option until Irving comes back.. Lonzo and Terry for Gafford and 2nd would be cool deal.

[Chi town]

Mavs thinking about Lonzo as option until Irving comes back.. Lonzo and Terry for Gafford and 2nd would be cool deal.

Link?

[Dan Z]

If you want to debate what Sacramento would accept for Sabonis, I guess we could, though I don't know how either of us would prove our point. Maybe I missed it, did somebody suggest we trade all our picks for Sabonis? Maybe they like one of our players. Maybe they love two of them. You/we simply don't know. Maybe they have a plan and they want a lot of expiring money to make a move.

It's also kind of besides the point. That's part of negotiation. Who cares what the Kings want, only care about the lowest price they'd accept, not the best. All trade offers start somewhere. You see how you changed it from "we won't have any of our FRP's" to "they need at least 1 Bulls FRP?" Who cares about giving up a first round pick to add an All-Star? Isn't that what you're trying to get with those picks in the first place? Except you have an actual All Star player, rather than a very unlikely chance to add one in the future. I swear it seems like some Bulls fans PLAN on us losing every deal, they want us to come out the door with our highest offer. It's simple, if they want 3-4 firsts, just don't do the trade.

If the deal is Coby, Matas, Vucevic, 3-4 first round picks, etc, doubt any of us say yes. If it's remotely like the deal that's actually being discussed here, that's an entirely different discussion.

So what would we have to give up to get Sabonis, in your opinion? Including at least 1 Bulls FRP. We can debate it from that starting point if it seems reasonable. Or is it just no at any price? Is your argument he's not likely to be a great addition to the team for the next 3-4 years, and an absolutely great trade piece if a superstar trade comes up. At 29, he could easily be a great player for at least another 5-8 years. Guess you wouldn't want Giannis either, he's 29 too.

How are Sabonis and Giannis remotely comparable?

Sacramento got 3 FRPs and 3 SRPs along with the 2nd best prime player in the deal (Lavine), while dumping what they considered a deadweight contract in Huerter. Why would Sabonis’ price tag not be the same, if not higher? His numbers and advanced stats are much better; he’s got 3 ASGs to Fox’s 1.

There’s just no reason Kings would sell him for less than 3 FRPs or one really good player. Vuc, Collins and lotto protected Portland pick that may not convey? That’s the kind of offer you make for Kyle Kuzma, before he further tanked his value in Milwaukee.

Sure- they’ll take Coby, Vuc and 2 Bulls FRPs, but I don’t see them taking any less, and I don’t see why we would entertain that.

They're comparable if you're using age as a reason to disqualify Sabonis, they're both 29 yr old PF in good health. It's wild to treat 29 as old in the NBA.

Coby, Vucevic, we probably add another player in there to come close to matching salary. That makes up for a pick. The deal you're talking about was for De'Aaron Fox. The actual Sabonis trade was Haliburton, Buddy Hield and Tristan Thompson and in addition to Sabonis, the Kings got Justin Holiday, Jeremy Lamb, and a second round pick. This was the ACTUAL trade value for Sabonis. Haliburton was picked with pick 12 one years prior, averaging 15pts, 8 assists with average defense. Nowhere near 3 first round picks plus a 26 yr 20Pt scorer, plus an 18/10 center shooting 40% from 3 last year plus another player to match salary. Your trade value for Sabonis isn't close to what they actually gave up for him.

Again, state what you think the minimum offer the Kings would accept, and we can go from there. You still haven't said what this asking price will be that's too high for us. The Portland first was initially mentioned, no value to that? Couldn't our picks be protected too?

Sample offer: Coby, Vucevic, Ayo, Portland 1st, Bulls 2028 first for Sabonis. All three of those players could be gone in 2026, with us getting little in return. They're all expiring. So in 2026 we'd be talking about having the Portland 1st, our 2028 first and whatever assets we got from those players, vs Sabonis.

For the Kings, they already messed up taking the Lavine/Derozan contracts. These contracts plus picks give them way more flexibility in what they can do.

Of course they could say no. Maybe they have no plans at all to move Sabonis. Wouldn't stop me from trying. Who do you want to add to improve the team, or do you not want us to add better players? It's not going to be free. Welcoming some alternative prospects.

It doesn't matter that Haliburton was picked #12. He was coming off a promising rookie season, which is why Indiana traded a 24/25 year old two time all-star for him (Sabonis).

Why would the Kings be interested in Coby? They currently have Malik Monk, Zach LaVine, Devin Carter and Keon Ellis at the guard positions. Is Coby worth the downgrade at C?

I know you added Vuc (meh) and the Portland 1st plus a 2028 first. Those picks have value, but if picks are what the Kings want for Sabonis then they can probably do better elsewhere (or a different trade with the Bulls).

My two cents is that the Bulls should be hesitant to trade future first round picks. We've all seen how that worked out with the Vucevic trade.