Lets admit the obvious: SGA is a better player than Luka

[morosis]

what does "better player" mean really.

Luka is one of the most naturally talented players we've seen in awhile. He does things that don't make sense, like they aren't even a big deal. Maybe because he's so naturally talented, he's never been forced to put the discipline around it like other pros have.

SGA has the professionalism and consistency that Luka doesn't. he's developed over a longer time horizon, and does both the "skill" things and "effort" things. he's also more portable and versatile. he didn't have the weight of hype or initial expectations that Luka did, so that gave him time to build himself into the player we see today.

I think in 2025 its fair to say SGA is the more complete player. I think its also fair to say that Luka is the more talented player.

[CobraCommander]

.not one of the guys on the OKC roster would be a first option like gordon was in Orlando...

Why are we acting like the bar to be the best player on a bottom 5 team is a high. OKC has a bunch of guys who'd be the best player on a team like the current Nets

who?????

but the better point is this...would any of the guys on OKC other than SGA make a bottom 5 team respectable?

say that because you make it seem like SGA is playing with Steph or KD or Kyrie or Wade or Love or Bosh or AD or Pip or Rodman or Mchale or when at best he is playing with maybe Klay OR Draymond or Kukoc or Dumars or Lambeer.... Like im not saying he isn't playing with a good team...but they are not some super team...Jdub has had 7 points in a game this playoffs and he was horrible last year against the mavs and Chet has been ok but not great...

SGA has gotten more out his teammates than nearly anyone...

Luka played with Kyrie, Lively, Gafford, Derrick jones jr, Morris twin, Maxi, PJ,Powell... SGA could get that team to the finals too...you don't think Kyrie and SGA would be special? Maybe not as special as Luka and Kyrie offensively but special because SGA does play defense...

either way at this point SGA is just better...that ship has sailed to most people. Luka in year 8 and needs to figure it out before its really a foregone conclusion

but it says something that 3 years in a row people picked SGA over luka on mvp...

take this into consideration...nearly the same people vote for all nba team as mvp...and luka only has 4 first place mvp votes all time.

that means that Luka has won the all nba 1st team 5 times but only 4 times have those guys also thought he was the best player in the league or the player having the best season. SGA has WON the award...from those same people that picked Luka as all nba first team....


that says a lot...cause y'all keep saying...luka is first team all nba...and that means something....but its the same people that said he isn't the mvp...so that means something too.

my point is...you can't say "the people that voted for luka as 1st team are right and should be trusted". but then when those same people say SGA, Jokic last year, Embiid the year before, then Jokic and then ginnians are all wrong when it comes to mvp...

[Dadouv47]

These guys are in the heart of their prime. It’s silly to say one is clearly the better player. Obviously SGA had a better season than Luka but the narrative could change next year if Luka gets on ozempic. This is like saying a close game is already over because of who is ahead at the half.

pretty much this. It's way too early to draw any conclusion. I think 2025 Shai is better than Luka but a very good offseason from Luka to get back in shape could change everything because we know how talented he's.

[CobraCommander]

These guys are in the heart of their prime. It’s silly to say one is clearly the better player. Obviously SGA had a better season than Luka but the narrative could change next year if Luka gets on ozempic. This is like saying a close game is already over because of who is ahead at the half.

pretty much this. It's way too early to draw any conclusion. I think 2025 Shai is better than Luka but a very good offseason from Luka to get back in shape could change everything because we know how talented he's.

so if the question was, is SGA a better player RIGHT NOW...would you say SGA?

cause I don't think anyone thinks SGA is more talented than Luka...

but its been 8 years...at some point we gotta stop talking about "when luka gets in shape" or "when he gets perfect teammates". or "when luka is healthy for a full year" or "when luka learns how to control his temper with refs" or "when luka starts taking defense seriously - consistently"....and we gotta accept that Luka is who he is until further notice...which by default makes the MVP better than a guy that hasn't won an MVP...

I think Luka is more talented, but SGA is [url]nearly[/url]as talented, but SGA outworks luka my a considerable amount on defense and in the offseason to get in shape....

..and this is the age old situation where hard work with decent talent beats the lazy guy with no work ethic... kinda tortiis and the hare type situation...

sga is the slow boring baller that just constantly puts the work in and luka is a amazing talent that doesn't try hard...showed up as the next great but ate his way into never cracking the top 3 while SGA was drafted outside the lottery and worked his way into the mvp conversation slowly...

[Dadouv47]

These guys are in the heart of their prime. It’s silly to say one is clearly the better player. Obviously SGA had a better season than Luka but the narrative could change next year if Luka gets on ozempic. This is like saying a close game is already over because of who is ahead at the half.

pretty much this. It's way too early to draw any conclusion. I think 2025 Shai is better than Luka but a very good offseason from Luka to get back in shape could change everything because we know how talented he's.

so if the question was, is SGA a better player RIGHT NOW...would you say SGA?

cause I don't think anyone thinks SGA is more talented than Luka...

but its been 8 years...at some point we gotta stop talking about "when luka gets in shape" or "when he gets perfect teammates". or "when luka is healthy for a full year" or "when luka learns how to control his temper with refs" or "when luka starts taking defense seriously - consistently"....and we gotta accept that Luka is who he is until further notice...which by default makes the MVP better than a guy that hasn't won an MVP...

I think Luka is more talented but SGA is nearly as talented but outworks luka my a considerable amount...and this is the age old situation where hard work with decent talent beats the lazy guy with no work ethic... kinda tortiis and the hare type situation...

sga is the slow boring baller that just constantly puts the work in and luka is a amazing talent that doesn't try hard...showed up as the next great but ate his way into never cracking the top 3 while SGA was drafted outside the lottery and worked his way into the mvp conversation slowly...

yeah Shai is a better player right now to me (since last year tbh). He worked very hard for that and he isn't as talented as Luka but he is good to elite at almost everything. Just saw a ton of videos of Shai rookie/sophomore seasons and he had to work very hard to get stronger because he was way too skinny. He could never have been an all star if he didn't work very hard.

[MrPainfulTruth]

Everytime you guys say Shai is on a better team we watch OKC get led by SGA and SGA makes his team better- but SGAs teammates didn’t have better playoff runs than Gordon or Murray… or LeBron on Rui - or Randle or Naz…or Brown and etc etc

You gotta be joking. Besides, #2 and #3 on the Nuggets are Murray and MPJ, not Gordon. And you seriously say OKC's starters - and bench (!!) - werent brutally outperforming everoyne on the Nuggets outside of Jokic and Gordon, MPJ, Braun and the joke they call a bench?

im not joking...YOU GUYS HAVE A RING BRO....Gordon got hurt...Gordon used to be the NUMBER ONE IN ORLANDO...Murray has had moments where he was the best player on the court with Jokic there. I love Denver bro...live part of the year in cherry creek....I go to games... MJP is scary because he is always seriously hurt...I like him but no way in hell would I have given him a contract with that back...but im just saying OKC roster is def better than the sum of their parts...not one of the guys on the OKC roster would be a first option like gordon was in Orlando...

Gordon was overachieving until the last two games - he ran out of fuel even before the injury but i was always a great fan of his game, and attitude.

Murray is utterly useless and so is MPJ - and he was before he got that injury. I kept writing all season, these two show up for one game in five. Braun is also not playoffs ready, he played scared and turned down open shots. The bench is Westbrook, and a bunch of G League players. Who does Strather compare to on any other playoff team?

I dont know how you can follow Denver and not see that Jokic has no help at all outside of Gordon. He was triple teamed, passed to the open guys and they did literally nothing with it. When SGA passes to his all star guy or Caruso or Dort they will punish the team that double teamed him. Noone can overcome such a handicap by his own.

[CobraCommander]

pretty much this. It's way too early to draw any conclusion. I think 2025 Shai is better than Luka but a very good offseason from Luka to get back in shape could change everything because we know how talented he's.

so if the question was, is SGA a better player RIGHT NOW...would you say SGA?

cause I don't think anyone thinks SGA is more talented than Luka...

but its been 8 years...at some point we gotta stop talking about "when luka gets in shape" or "when he gets perfect teammates". or "when luka is healthy for a full year" or "when luka learns how to control his temper with refs" or "when luka starts taking defense seriously - consistently"....and we gotta accept that Luka is who he is until further notice...which by default makes the MVP better than a guy that hasn't won an MVP...

I think Luka is more talented but SGA is nearly as talented but outworks luka my a considerable amount...and this is the age old situation where hard work with decent talent beats the lazy guy with no work ethic... kinda tortiis and the hare type situation...

sga is the slow boring baller that just constantly puts the work in and luka is a amazing talent that doesn't try hard...showed up as the next great but ate his way into never cracking the top 3 while SGA was drafted outside the lottery and worked his way into the mvp conversation slowly...

yeah Shai is a better player right now to me (since last year tbh). He worked very hard for that and he isn't as talented as Luka but he is good to elite at almost everything. Just saw a ton of videos of Shai rookie/sophomore seasons and he had to work very hard to get stronger because he was way too skinny. He could never have been an all star if he didn't work very hard.

oh then im with that 100%.... I don't think anyone realistically can say we have seen anyone as talented as Luka offensively...maybe harden at just pure shooting and passing with size and agility...Luka and Harden are 1 and 1a of just insane offensive talent and with reasonable size and luka may have the most talent period SINCE LEBRON...but my man just collecting checks and being mid while he has the talent to be top 10 all time. NO ONE HAS LUKA TRENDING top 10 at this point...Lukas career is at the half way point...if not more...Luka is not playing till he is 40...

[bbms]

i think shai and luka were a wash in 2023 and 2024 (with a slight edge to shai in 2024) and 2025 shai set a clear superiority over luka.

luka was never on the level shai is now. luka has even more volume box score stuffing but the difference in efficiency (specially in the turnover department) is huge.

almost 8 point difference in ortg in the period 2022-23 to 2024-25. almost 2 turnovers per game.

[UglyBugBall]

Luka is better on offense than lebron?

y'all do know lebron is
Points: LeBron James is currently the NBA's all-time leading scorer.
Assists: He ranks 4th all-time in assists.
Rebounds: He is ranked 25th in all-time rebounds.
Steals: LeBron James is 6th in all-time steals.

lebron is a machine that just wins and plays and wins and plays and is healthy

and LUKA aint never been anywhere close to lebron on defense....I don't even know how to comprehend you saying luka is 90% of lebron on defense when peaking...

Luka is 26 years old and teams are picking on a 26 year old Wing....no one switched ONTO lebron in his prime...wtf....if you switched onto lebron it's because you wanted to try to get him into foul trouble.

Watch on YouTube

you might be WAY too young for this...but LeBron came in second for Defensive Player of the Year voting TWICE....in 2009 and 2013

the fact that you are insane enough to say Lukas peak is 90% of lebrons Peak defense is crazy

you UGLY BUG BALL have indeed ....as my man said...LOST ALL CREDIBLITY

someone come get your boy...he is out here on some stronger than legal stuff

Wow I just watched the video. That is some pathetic defense by Luka lol

That guy broke down the defense - play by play - move by move- Luka not only was out of shape, he was out of position on most plays and his fundamentals of defense were horrible. His defensive foot work is highschool level bad… This proves that it’s bigger than being in shape… but these are things he can fix - but in year 8 its embarrassing to have a guy this good on offense to be this bad at the overall game- Luka cost the lakers the series because he couldn’t stay in front of anyone in a critical games- if Luka scored 51 they may have still lost

Luka is not a good 1 on 1 defender. He's an excellent team defender, like a Draymond. Theres a reason he's been on multiple top defensive teams.

[CobraCommander]

Wow I just watched the video. That is some pathetic defense by Luka lol

That guy broke down the defense - play by play - move by move- Luka not only was out of shape, he was out of position on most plays and his fundamentals of defense were horrible. His defensive foot work is highschool level bad… This proves that it’s bigger than being in shape… but these are things he can fix - but in year 8 its embarrassing to have a guy this good on offense to be this bad at the overall game- Luka cost the lakers the series because he couldn’t stay in front of anyone in a critical games- if Luka scored 51 they may have still lost

Luka is not a good 1 on 1 defender. He's an excellent team defender, like a Draymond. Theres a reason he's been on multiple top defensive teams.

No man he isn’t a good team defender - watch the video - he was the reason the defense broke down and accounted for 41 points in a single game-

You think someone is a good defender just because the other 4 guys make up for them?

Luka was horrible at defense in the Minnesota series - there are receipts man - show the video of Luka playing good defense

[Hair Jordan]

I’d go so far to say that SGA is better than Kobe. SGA shoots a higher percentage from the field, the arc and the FT line. He’s also averaged 30+ for the last three seasons which matches Kobe’s output over his 20 year career and he’s done it while shooting 50% from the floor. Kobe’s best season was 46%. He’s about to win a title without riding Shaq’s coattails or without Phil Jackson. His MVP already matches Kobe’s career output. If he finishes his career with 2-3 MVP’s, 2-3 titles, 2-3 FMVP’s and better all around stats (especially advanced metrics) how can you put him behind Kobe?

[The Master]

I’d go so far to say that SGA is better than Kobe. SGA shoots a higher percentage from the field, the arc and the FT line. He’s also averaged 30+ for the last three seasons which matches Kobe’s output over his 20 year career and he’s done it while shooting 50% from the floor. Kobe’s best season was 46%. He’s about to win a title without riding Shaq’s coattails or without Phil Jackson. His MVP already matches Kobe’s career output. If he finishes his career with 2-3 MVP’s, 2-3 titles, 2-3 FMVP’s and better all around stats (especially advanced metrics) how can you put him behind Kobe?

I don't think you can compare raw boxscore stats in a way you're doing it between the late 00s and the mid-20s.

That being said, SGA generated the highest EPM and LEBRON ranking in the whole league (I don't think Kobe was at any point the best in other advanced metrics, although was in ~top5 for a ~decade), and had boxscore production (BPM) on the level of Giannis in his MVP seasons. His playoff output is also very good.

I'm not that much interested in these historical comparisons nor long term projections of accolades, but where I can easily agree is that some people clearly can't look beyond their sympathies and acknowledge how amazing this season of SGA is.

[HMFFL]

You straight swap Luka with SGA team for team and OKC sweeps the playoffs and the Lakers get swept by the wolves instead of taking a game.

SGA is an amazing individual talent, he's not an offensive engine, hes a guy who can get buckets.
Proof enough is him having a garbage game yesterday and his team still getting a blowout in the playoffs.
Its the same as comparing a player like Lebron (system) to Durant.

Are you taking leadership into account?

If so, I believe SGA is a better leader.

[Special_Puppy]

Why are we acting like the bar to be the best player on a bottom 5 team is a high. OKC has a bunch of guys who'd be the best player on a team like the current Nets

who?????

Do you really think not a single one of Shai’s teammates is better than D’Lo and Cam Johnson?

[Special_Puppy]

You straight swap Luka with SGA team for team and OKC sweeps the playoffs and the Lakers get swept by the wolves instead of taking a game.

SGA is an amazing individual talent, he's not an offensive engine, hes a guy who can get buckets.
Proof enough is him having a garbage game yesterday and his team still getting a blowout in the playoffs.
Its the same as comparing a player like Lebron (system) to Durant.

Are you taking leadership into account?

If so, I believe SGA is a better leader.

I can’t take the leadership stuff seriously. There’s just zero evidence either way for it.

[sp6r=underrated]

You straight swap Luka with SGA team for team and OKC sweeps the playoffs and the Lakers get swept by the wolves instead of taking a game.

SGA is an amazing individual talent, he's not an offensive engine, hes a guy who can get buckets.
Proof enough is him having a garbage game yesterday and his team still getting a blowout in the playoffs.
Its the same as comparing a player like Lebron (system) to Durant.

Are you taking leadership into account?

If so, I believe SGA is a better leader.

I can’t take the leadership stuff seriously. There’s just zero evidence either way for it.

It is reasonable to say we as fans lack sufficient information to evaluate players' personality traits but it is kind of silly to say personality traits shouldn't be taken seriously.

[MrBigShot]

SGA is just so locked in. Everything on the court he does is with intention, and it's impossible to throw him off his game. Ant just isn't there yet.

[bbms]

well in this thread i read luka and draymond green in the same sentence as defenders.

what's happening with this board?

as much as i hate green and like luka, come on... luka when he's trying he's almost a mediocre defender. green is perennial elite.

[bbms]

I’d go so far to say that SGA is better than Kobe. SGA shoots a higher percentage from the field, the arc and the FT line. He’s also averaged 30+ for the last three seasons which matches Kobe’s output over his 20 year career and he’s done it while shooting 50% from the floor. Kobe’s best season was 46%. He’s about to win a title without riding Shaq’s coattails or without Phil Jackson. His MVP already matches Kobe’s career output. If he finishes his career with 2-3 MVP’s, 2-3 titles, 2-3 FMVP’s and better all around stats (especially advanced metrics) how can you put him behind Kobe?

I don't think you can compare raw boxscore stats in a way you're doing it between the late 00s and the mid-20s.

That being said, SGA generated the highest EPM and LEBRON ranking in the whole league (I don't think Kobe was at any point the best in other advanced metrics, although was in ~top5 for a ~decade), and had boxscore production (BPM) on the level of Giannis in his MVP seasons. His playoff output is also very good.

I'm not that much interested in these historical comparisons nor long term projections of accolades, but where I can easily agree is that some people clearly can't look beyond their sympathies and acknowledge how amazing this season of SGA is.

i think sga just solved the historical rift between analytics and kobe's memory. he's like the love child of two problematic people. like if romeo and juliet had a baby before dying and the baby is sga.

[HMFFL]

SGA is just so locked in. Everything on the court he does is with intention, and it's impossible to throw him off his game. Ant just isn't there yet.

His IQ for the game is on a different level than any other player in the series. I could be wrong and it might be an over look on my behalf.