2025 Draft Thread - Part 2

[9 and 20]

You guys are way over thinking. The goal is always to get anengine if you don't have one. Am engine is a player capable of scoring at least 1800 at .50 percent efficiency or better. If they arent doing this college or coming close to theae numbers, they arent doing it in nba. Otherwise you are analyzing role players. If we dont have an engine and none of the players at our spot project out as an engine, them tou trade your assets for one. Siakam...players like that.

Efficiency is fga/fgm with volume and volume in nba is at least 1800 points. In order to get volume, you need to have a strong injury history so all these per game averages mean nothing because they dont ding players who cant put up volume.
So again nike jordan have seven season at 2500 pts shooting .50 percent or better. If you can get a player who can put volume with .50 percent efficiency and they ate young, yoil u have a building block. Sarr has shown signs but he failed to put up volume in his first season. We can project but until they have actually achieve it, it means nothing.
There only like 15 true engines in the entire league.

What if we got a little engine that could? Who could be that guy? I kid.

We're definitely missing a number one guy. That guy is, against all odds, going to Dallas this year. Coincidentally right after they traded their last guy to the Lakers for chump change.

Best we can do is add another good player so that a true number one can slot in into an already strong framework.

[WizarDynasty]

You guys are way over thinking. The goal is always to get anengine if you don't have one. Am engine is a player capable of scoring at least 1800 at .50 percent efficiency or better. If they arent doing this college or coming close to theae numbers, they arent doing it in nba. Otherwise you are analyzing role players. If we dont have an engine and none of the players at our spot project out as an engine, them tou trade your assets for one. Siakam...players like that.

Efficiency is fga/fgm with volume and volume in nba is at least 1800 points. In order to get volume, you need to have a strong injury history so all these per game averages mean nothing because they dont ding players who cant put up volume.
So again mike jordan have seven season at 2500 pts shooting .50 percent or better. If you can get a player who can put volume with .50 percent efficiency and they are young, you have a building block. Sarr has shown signs but he failed to put up volume in his first season. We can project but until they have actually achieve it, it means nothing.
There only like 15 true engines in the entire league.

All championship teams are built around an engine. If you dont have a player that can drop at least 1800 at .50 percent, you dont have a foundation.
Ted has never forced his GM to trade for a volume efficiency player nor has he drafted one with any of his GMs. Sarr shoots far too many outside shots and low FT numbers to get his volume and efficiency up.
Thats analysis that should be done. Poole is a jole. He is lsnt sniffing .50 with volume. Coulibaly is a role player that cant score with volume. Csrrington cant take it insode to boost his percentage and volume. Golden states model only works when you have draymond green. Okc works because they drafted players who can score volume and efficiency.

[doclinkin]

I'm not seeing the motivation for Philly to randomly trade down from #3 to #6. Ace Bailey is a pretty good fit there as a long term piece around Maxey and McCain.

Philly might contemplate a trade, but what they would be looking for in return isn't necessary more, later picks. They would want a win-now piece at a forward position, and/or the ability to shed Paul George's horrific contract off the payroll.

Interestingly, if we hadn't traded Deni he would be the perfect piece. Deni and Middleton for the #3 and Paul George would have worked out spectacularly to fit the needs of Philly.

But with that no longer an option, the best I can see is to trade them Middleton for Paul George as the primary incentive. And then figure out the picks part afterward. Is #18 plus Middleton for George and #3 fair? We are spending $110M to buy that pick so that's a lot. But is Philly willing to blatantly sacrifice picks to save money?

My deal on a trade with Philly has less to do with Ace and everything to do with Darrell Morey.

Morey is an analytics guy. Ace has holes in his game that will take a minutes and reps to patch. The 6ers have Maxey and Embiid as high usage guys. Nobody is force feeding looks to Ace to get him comfortable.

As for PG13, I figure a package with Middleton and Smart would actually be a good fit if healthy. Middleton wins the +/- game every night. Smart is an attitude fit for Philly. Dropping to a lower pick for a player that’s more game ready could look intriguing if they want to burn salary.

Who’d they take? Whatever the stats suggest. Asa Newell carries a solid BPM. Ditto Maluach if they’re not scared away by the politics and want an understudy for the often injured Embiid. I can see CMB thriving for that team. Embiids range leaving room underneath for Boyles junk ball game.

There are ready-to-play options in this draft. Carter Bryant’s defense helping cover for Maxey/McCain’s smallish size is the one that stands out to me. I can see Philly very happy with a net haul of KMidd Smart and Carter Bryant. While dropping that giant contract. How happy? Would they give up more than 3? Future 2nds? A conditional distant 1st?

I think Ace is worth more to us than other teams will offer. But getting out from PG13s deal has to be worth a haul to them.

[nate33]

You guys are way over thinking. The goal is always to get anengine if you don't have one. Am engine is a player capable of scoring at least 1800 at .50 percent efficiency or better. If they arent doing this college or coming close to theae numbers, they arent doing it in nba. Otherwise you are analyzing role players. If we dont have an engine and none of the players at our spot project out as an engine, them tou trade your assets for one. Siakam...players like that.

Efficiency is fga/fgm with volume and volume in nba is at least 1800 points. In order to get volume, you need to have a strong injury history so all these per game averages mean nothing because they dont ding players who cant put up volume.
So again mike jordan have seven season at 2500 pts shooting .50 percent or better. If you can get a player who can put volume with .50 percent efficiency and they are young, you have a building block. Sarr has shown signs but he failed to put up volume in his first season. We can project but until they have actually achieve it, it means nothing.
There only like 15 true engines in the entire league.

In other news: the sky is blue.

Of course the goal is to find a number 1 option to carry the team's offense. But sometimes, there just isn't one available. So you get guys who are good defenders and hopefully capable of being a number 2 or number 3 option, and wait for the next opportunity to come along to find a number one option. As you said, sometimes you have to trade for that number 1 option. And the only way to do that is to have a couple of good two-way players who are number 2/3 options on offense while also being good defenders.

[AFM]

You guys are way over thinking. The goal is always to get anengine if you don't have one. Am engine is a player capable of scoring at least 1800 at .50 percent efficiency or better. If they arent doing this college or coming close to theae numbers, they arent doing it in nba. Otherwise you are analyzing role players. If we dont have an engine and none of the players at our spot project out as an engine, them tou trade your assets for one. Siakam...players like that.

Efficiency is fga/fgm with volume and volume in nba is at least 1800 points. In order to get volume, you need to have a strong injury history so all these per game averages mean nothing because they dont ding players who cant put up volume.
So again mike jordan have seven season at 2500 pts shooting .50 percent or better. If you can get a player who can put volume with .50 percent efficiency and they are young, you have a building block. Sarr has shown signs but he failed to put up volume in his first season. We can project but until they have actually achieve it, it means nothing.
There only like 15 true engines in the entire league.

All championship teams are built around an engine. If you dont have a player that can drop at least 1800 at .50 percent, you dont have a foundation.
Ted has never forced his GM to trade for a volume efficiency player nor has he drafted one with any of his GMs. Sarr shoots far too many outside shots and low FT numbers to get his volume and efficiency up.
Thats analysis that should be done. Poole is a jole. He is lsnt sniffing .50 with volume. Coulibaly is a role player that cant score with volume. Csrrington cant take it insode to boost his percentage and volume. Golden states model only works when you have draymond green. Okc works because they drafted players who can score volume and efficiency.

You gotta enlighten us on who this engine might be.

[TheBlackCzar]

You guys are way over thinking. The goal is always to get anengine if you don't have one. Am engine is a player capable of scoring at least 1800 at .50 percent efficiency or better. If they arent doing this college or coming close to theae numbers, they arent doing it in nba. Otherwise you are analyzing role players. If we dont have an engine and none of the players at our spot project out as an engine, them tou trade your assets for one. Siakam...players like that.

Efficiency is fga/fgm with volume and volume in nba is at least 1800 points. In order to get volume, you need to have a strong injury history so all these per game averages mean nothing because they dont ding players who cant put up volume.
So again mike jordan have seven season at 2500 pts shooting .50 percent or better. If you can get a player who can put volume with .50 percent efficiency and they are young, you have a building block. Sarr has shown signs but he failed to put up volume in his first season. We can project but until they have actually achieve it, it means nothing.
There only like 15 true engines in the entire league.

All championship teams are built around an engine. If you dont have a player that can drop at least 1800 at .50 percent, you dont have a foundation.
Ted has never forced his GM to trade for a volume efficiency player nor has he drafted one with any of his GMs. Sarr shoots far too many outside shots and low FT numbers to get his volume and efficiency up.
Thats analysis that should be done. Poole is a jole. He is lsnt sniffing .50 with volume. Coulibaly is a role player that cant score with volume. Csrrington cant take it insode to boost his percentage and volume. Golden states model only works when you have draymond green. Okc works because they drafted players who can score volume and efficiency.

You gotta enlighten us on who this engine might be.

It's gone be Jeremiah Fears..... Somebody nobody was expecting....

[SUPERBALLMAN]

Watch on YouTube

[tontoz]

Imagine Kyrie with less shooting/handles/finishing. That is how I see Fears and that is if he improves a lot.

[TheBlackCzar]

Imagine Kyrie with less shooting/handles/finishing. That is how I see Fears and that is if he improves a lot.

This kid wasn't even expected to be I'm college he did his thing.... Kyrie went 1 and he might go 6th i don't get the comparison..... he has good handles and finishing with either hand...... When he ends up one of the best players from this draft then what will you say?

If we'd have drafted Halliburton instead of Deni we wouldn't need to draft a pg but we did not..... Such is life....

[TheBlackCzar]

Watch on YouTube

No he's not.... these unreal expectations going leave you heartbroken when he don't match that level.....

[tontoz]

Imagine Kyrie with less shooting/handles/finishing. That is how I see Fears and that is if he improves a lot.

This kid wasn't even expected to be I'm college he did his thing.... Kyrie went 1 and he might go 6th i don't get the comparison..... he has good handles and finishing with either hand...... When he ends up one of the best players from this draft then what will you say?

If we'd have drafted Halliburton instead of Deni we wouldn't need to draft a pg but we did not..... Such is life....

No actually he doesn't finish well, at all. He shoots 45% at the rim in the half court as was posted previously.

He's not a good playmaker either.

Kyrie is an elite shooter and finisher at the same size. Do we really want a poor man's Kyrie.

[closg00]

Imagine Kyrie with less shooting/handles/finishing. That is how I see Fears and that is if he improves a lot.

This kid wasn't even expected to be I'm college he did his thing.... Kyrie went 1 and he might go 6th i don't get the comparison..... he has good handles and finishing with either hand...... When he ends up one of the best players from this draft then what will you say?

If we'd have drafted Halliburton instead of Deni we wouldn't need to draft a pg but we did not..... Such is life....

No actually he doesn't finish well, at all. He shoots 45% at the rim in the half court as was posted previously.

He's not a good playmaker either.

Kyrie is an elite shooter and finisher at the same size. Do we really want a poor man's Kyrie.

The kid just turned 18 in October, you don’t know in-advance what his ceiling will be, I’m glad he was the first player we looked at.

[nate33]

This kid wasn't even expected to be I'm college he did his thing.... Kyrie went 1 and he might go 6th i don't get the comparison..... he has good handles and finishing with either hand...... When he ends up one of the best players from this draft then what will you say?

If we'd have drafted Halliburton instead of Deni we wouldn't need to draft a pg but we did not..... Such is life....

No actually he doesn't finish well, at all. He shoots 45% at the rim in the half court as was posted previously.

He's not a good playmaker either.

Kyrie is an elite shooter and finisher at the same size. Do we really want a poor man's Kyrie.

The kid just turned 18 in October, you don’t know in-advance what his ceiling will be, I’m glad he was the first player we looked at.

Exactly. If you want a guy who has a very high floor at #6, just draft Kneuppel. The problem is, Kneuppel has a low ceiling. I'm glad they're bringing in guys who have a high ceiling. Hopefully, their scouts will do a good job. Maybe Fears is the best guy left. Or maybe, it's a smoke screen to entice Brooklyn to trade up to #5 so Johnson falls to us.

[tontoz]

This kid wasn't even expected to be I'm college he did his thing.... Kyrie went 1 and he might go 6th i don't get the comparison..... he has good handles and finishing with either hand...... When he ends up one of the best players from this draft then what will you say?

If we'd have drafted Halliburton instead of Deni we wouldn't need to draft a pg but we did not..... Such is life....

No actually he doesn't finish well, at all. He shoots 45% at the rim in the half court as was posted previously.

He's not a good playmaker either.

Kyrie is an elite shooter and finisher at the same size. Do we really want a poor man's Kyrie.

The kid just turned 18 in October, you don’t know in-advance what his ceiling will be, I’m glad he was the first player we looked at.

You could say that about any player. If player X gets bigger and improves dramatically on their weaknesses then they could be a good player. Just because he is a year younger than other guys we are looking at doesn't make his prototype more attractive.

Who is your player comp for him?

[Northwest Roddy]

I was just messing around with the player comparisons at Tankathon:



It's a pretty apples-to-apples comparison. Both guys are extremely long roll-men playing in the same Duke system just 2 years apart from each other. Lively proved to be one of the better picks in his draft. Might Maluach do just as well? Maluach lacks Lively's timing on shot blocking and he gets virtually no steals, but he is a more prolific and efficient finisher and a much better free throw shooter. He is also a half-year younger and has a more massive frame.

Fascinating. Thanks for doing this. And Lively surprised to the upside. Any chance you could compare their agility scores at the combine? Is Maluach meaningfully slower?

[nate33]

Fascinating. Thanks for doing this. And Lively surprised to the upside. Any chance you could compare their agility scores at the combine? Is Maluach meaningfully slower?

Unfortunately, Lively didn't attend the combine. I can't even find an accurate wingspan measurement of him. There definitely isn't an accurate lane agility score.

[dobrojim]

Actually if a player is somewhat younger, it does
make them somewhat more attractive. If Bub had
done what he did last year at age 21-22, it would be less
remarkable.

Same thing with Sarr.

[nate33]

No actually he doesn't finish well, at all. He shoots 45% at the rim in the half court as was posted previously.

He's not a good playmaker either.

Kyrie is an elite shooter and finisher at the same size. Do we really want a poor man's Kyrie.

The kid just turned 18 in October, you don’t know in-advance what his ceiling will be, I’m glad he was the first player we looked at.

You could say that about any player. If player X gets bigger and improves dramatically on their weaknesses then they could be a good player. Just because he is a year younger than other guys we are looking at doesn't make his prototype more attractive.

Who is your player comp for him?

I think Dat2U mentioned Devin Harris. They're about the same physically, though Fears is slightly quicker going by combine measurements. Harris' counting stats as a junior were quite similar to Fears' as a freshmen, except that Harris was more efficient and turned the ball over less (as one would expect from a junior).

With Fears, the hope would be that his 85% FT% eventually translates into him being a knock-down shooter off the pull-up. If that happens, then he could conceivably go from being the next Devin Harris to the next Damian Lillard, or maybe at least the next Tyrese Maxey.

[tontoz]

The kid just turned 18 in October, you don’t know in-advance what his ceiling will be, I’m glad he was the first player we looked at.

You could say that about any player. If player X gets bigger and improves dramatically on their weaknesses then they could be a good player. Just because he is a year younger than other guys we are looking at doesn't make his prototype more attractive.

Who is your player comp for him?

I think Dat2U mentioned Devin Harris. They're about the same physically, though Fears is slightly quicker going by combine measurements. Harris' counting stats as a junior were quite similar to Fears' as a freshmen, except that Harris was more efficient and turned the ball over less (as one would expect from a junior).

With Fears, the hope would be that his 85% FT% eventually translates into him being a knock-down shooter off the pull-up. If that happens, then he could conceivably go from being the next Devin Harris to the next Damian Lillard, or maybe at least the next Tyrese Maxey.

Fears averaged roughly twice as many turnovers per 40 as those two guys. Maxey was listed at 198 in college.

So if Fears gets bigger, and improves his shot dramatically, and cuts down his turnovers dramatically, then he could be a good player. That is a lot of ifs.

[nate33]

You could say that about any player. If player X gets bigger and improves dramatically on their weaknesses then they could be a good player. Just because he is a year younger than other guys we are looking at doesn't make his prototype more attractive.

Who is your player comp for him?

I think Dat2U mentioned Devin Harris. They're about the same physically, though Fears is slightly quicker going by combine measurements. Harris' counting stats as a junior were quite similar to Fears' as a freshmen, except that Harris was more efficient and turned the ball over less (as one would expect from a junior).

With Fears, the hope would be that his 85% FT% eventually translates into him being a knock-down shooter off the pull-up. If that happens, then he could conceivably go from being the next Devin Harris to the next Damian Lillard, or maybe at least the next Tyrese Maxey.

Fears averaged roughly twice as many turnovers per 40 as those two guys. Maxey was listed at 198 in college.

So if Fears gets bigger, and improves his shot dramatically, and cuts down his turnovers dramatically, then he could be a good player. That is a lot of ifs.

Fair enough. I'm not really in love with Fears either. I just think he has enough promise to be worth inviting him to a workout and seeing what makes him tick. The bottom line is that all the guys available at #6 have real weaknesses that cast doubt on their ability to become stars. Scouting is a matter of figuring out who is most likely to overcome their weaknesses.

The turnovers issue is indeed a big red flag.