The official fire Chris Finch thread

[SSUBluesman]

Literally the only example in NBA history with the goat is now somehow the standard

Wrong again.

Detroit pistons coached by Rick Carlisle from 2001-2003, couldn’t get over the hump. After reaching the Conference Finals in just his third year Rick was fired. Replaced by Larry Brown. 2004 Detroit wins the NBA Championship against Shaquille O’Neil, Kobe Bryant and the greatest “greatest coach ever”, Phil Jackson.

Larry didn’t have the best team, the best player ever, he was not a players coach.Larry was a winner. Iverson as a player didn’t care too much for Larry Brown, Iverson post retirement has glowing things to say about Larry Brown.

Larry Brown is not the greatest coach ever.

I'd argue that shortsighted thinking like that from ownership is what led Detroit to making the playoffs just twice in 15 years not too long after that. Rick Carlisle is a very good coach, much in a similar tier as Finch. Sure, they won a title....but they might have won one without him too. Carlisle has as many championships to his name as the Pistons since his firing.

Rick Carlisle also was starting 34 year old Michael Curry and 36 year old Cliff Robinson while Larry Brown got 2nd year Tayshaun Prince and Rasheed Wallace. That's a pretty big infusion of talent.

If Sam doesn't get injured and the Pistons don't trade for Sheed they're not beating the Wolves in the finals, it doesn't matter if Carlisle or Brown is the coach.

[Neeva]

Why tf is he afraid to play TJ? He’s been our most productive bench player all season against the Thunder, smh so over thibs 2.0.

Last I checked, TJ played last night, so obviously he's not too afraid of it....

Yeah 8 minutes back to bootlicking i see

[BlacJacMac]

Why tf is he afraid to play TJ? He’s been our most productive bench player all season against the Thunder, smh so over thibs 2.0.

Last I checked, TJ played last night, so obviously he's not too afraid of it....

Yeah 8 minutes back to bootlicking i see

He did go out with a shoulder injury after his very good first stint.

[Loaf_of_bread]

I get it that I'm in the minority..

He's just too much of a "player's coach". Our guys laughing in interviews stating "Finch laid into them", is pretty transparent that they also take him lightly WHILE HE IS SO-CALLED DOING SO.

not common to see aired laundry of what goes down behind the scenes, and it's joked about.. it's just been a trend since the start.

There is a balance of authority that Finch isn’t good at.

[minimus]

We live in the real world, where money, egos, and player limitations are always in play.

Let’s break it down.
- Finch had success with the first group of players, and what happened after?
DLo, Beverley, Beasley, Vando, Nowell — none of them have shown anything meaningful on other teams.
- Finch had success with the second group of players, and again:
Anderson, McLaughlin — nothing particularly special elsewhere.
Towns? He’s been good in NYK, sure — but still has the same old issues: offensive fouls, kicking legs, hooking, bad defense, low 3PA numbers.
- Finch is now having success with the third group of players, and look:
Randle is having the best playoff series of his career.
DDV is struggling, yes — but we all know why.

The point is: Finch has taken on every challenge the situation handed him, developed players, and established a foundation.

Let’s not forget:
Our main star is 23 years old, and when he came into the NBA, he was widely considered a low-IQ athlete.
McDaniels? Considered a head case.
Naz Reid? Went undrafted.

Honestly, I find this whole thread funny.

This team has no chemistry issues.
No locker room cancer.
It’s overachieved, reaching two WCF appearances despite constant adversity.

Five years ago, as a MIN fan, I dreamed of being in this situation.

Fire Finch? Fire TC?
LOL.

[FrenchMinnyFan]

We live in the real world, where money, egos, and player limitations are always in play.

Let’s break it down.
- Finch had success with the first group of players, and what happened after?
DLo, Beverley, Beasley, Vando, Nowell — none of them have shown anything meaningful on other teams.
- Finch had success with the second group of players, and again:
Anderson, McLaughlin — nothing particularly special elsewhere.
Towns? He’s been good in NYK, sure — but still has the same old issues: offensive fouls, kicking legs, hooking, bad defense, low 3PA numbers.
- Finch is now having success with the third group of players, and look:
Randle is having the best playoff series of his career.
DDV is struggling, yes — but we all know why.

The point is: Finch has taken on every challenge the situation handed him, developed players, and established a foundation.

Let’s not forget:
Our main star is 23 years old, and when he came into the NBA, he was widely considered a low-IQ athlete.
McDaniels? Considered a head case.
Naz Reid? Went undrafted.

Totally agree. ANT, Jaden improve a lot with Finch, Naz too. He is a great coach and he achieve something no others coach did, 2 WCF in a row.


This team has no chemistry issues.
No locker room cancer.
It’s overachieved, reaching two WCF appearances despite constant adversity.

Five years ago, as a MIN fan, I dreamed of being in this situation.

Fire Finch? Fire TC?
LOL.

[Worm Guts]

Doug Collins coached a team from 1986-1989, made 3 straight conference finals in a row. Fired in 1989.


Sometimes the thing that needs changing to get over the hump isn’t just a roster issue. Sometimes you need a new coach (and the NBA to make a subset of rules named after your star player).

Literally the only example in NBA history with the goat is now somehow the standard

Wrong again.

Detroit pistons coached by Rick Carlisle from 2001-2003, couldn’t get over the hump. After reaching the Conference Finals in just his third year Rick was fired. Replaced by Larry Brown. 2004 Detroit wins the NBA Championship against Shaquille O’Neil, Kobe Bryant and the greatest “greatest coach ever”, Phil Jackson.

Larry didn’t have the best team, the best player ever, he was not a players coach.Larry was a winner. Iverson as a player didn’t care too much for Larry Brown, Iverson post retirement has glowing things to say about Larry Brown.

Larry Brown is not the greatest coach ever.

Larry Brown was a really good and well established coach though. Not many coaches have had success in as many different places as Larry Brown.
In hindsight, it is actually hard to believe Carlisle was fired after making the ECF with that Pistons team. Also in hindsight, Carlisle turned out to be a championship level coach as well.

[frankenwolf]

We live in the real world, where money, egos, and player limitations are always in play.

Let’s break it down.
- Finch had success with the first group of players, and what happened after?
DLo, Beverley, Beasley, Vando, Nowell — none of them have shown anything meaningful on other teams.
- Finch had success with the second group of players, and again:
Anderson, McLaughlin — nothing particularly special elsewhere.
Towns? He’s been good in NYK, sure — but still has the same old issues: offensive fouls, kicking legs, hooking, bad defense, low 3PA numbers.
- Finch is now having success with the third group of players, and look:
Randle is having the best playoff series of his career.
DDV is struggling, yes — but we all know why.

The point is: Finch has taken on every challenge the situation handed him, developed players, and established a foundation.

Let’s not forget:
Our main star is 23 years old, and when he came into the NBA, he was widely considered a low-IQ athlete.
McDaniels? Considered a head case.
Naz Reid? Went undrafted.

Honestly, I find this whole thread funny.

This team has no chemistry issues.
No locker room cancer.
It’s overachieved, reaching two WCF appearances despite constant adversity.

Five years ago, as a MIN fan, I dreamed of being in this situation.

Fire Finch? Fire TC?
LOL.

AMEN
Let's see what TC does this off -season and see what Ant works on and see if we make a third trip to the WCF. I am pleased with this team, this year. I would not have bet on the Wolves making the WCF after the KAT trade.

[m2002brian]

Literally the only example in NBA history with the goat is now somehow the standard

Wrong again.

Detroit pistons coached by Rick Carlisle from 2001-2003, couldn’t get over the hump. After reaching the Conference Finals in just his third year Rick was fired. Replaced by Larry Brown. 2004 Detroit wins the NBA Championship against Shaquille O’Neil, Kobe Bryant and the greatest “greatest coach ever”, Phil Jackson.

Larry didn’t have the best team, the best player ever, he was not a players coach.Larry was a winner. Iverson as a player didn’t care too much for Larry Brown, Iverson post retirement has glowing things to say about Larry Brown.

Larry Brown is not the greatest coach ever.

Larry Brown was a really good and well established coach though. Not many coaches have had success in as many different places as Larry Brown.
In hindsight, it is actually hard to believe Carlisle was fired after making the ECF with that Pistons team. Also in hindsight, Carlisle turned out to be a championship level coach as well.

So Mike Malone?

[shrink]

When the two big trades went down, I was told Gobert couldn’t work with KAT, and I was told Randle couldn’t work with Ant.

Finch found a way. And he also turned around that first team of NBA rejects as well, and got Ant some playoff experience.

To me, that’s a smart coach.

[Worm Guts]

Wrong again.

Detroit pistons coached by Rick Carlisle from 2001-2003, couldn’t get over the hump. After reaching the Conference Finals in just his third year Rick was fired. Replaced by Larry Brown. 2004 Detroit wins the NBA Championship against Shaquille O’Neil, Kobe Bryant and the greatest “greatest coach ever”, Phil Jackson.

Larry didn’t have the best team, the best player ever, he was not a players coach.Larry was a winner. Iverson as a player didn’t care too much for Larry Brown, Iverson post retirement has glowing things to say about Larry Brown.

Larry Brown is not the greatest coach ever.

Larry Brown was a really good and well established coach though. Not many coaches have had success in as many different places as Larry Brown.
In hindsight, it is actually hard to believe Carlisle was fired after making the ECF with that Pistons team. Also in hindsight, Carlisle turned out to be a championship level coach as well.

So Mike Malone?

??? I don't know what you're asking?

[ReggiesKnicks]

Wrong again.

Detroit pistons coached by Rick Carlisle from 2001-2003, couldn’t get over the hump. After reaching the Conference Finals in just his third year Rick was fired. Replaced by Larry Brown. 2004 Detroit wins the NBA Championship against Shaquille O’Neil, Kobe Bryant and the greatest “greatest coach ever”, Phil Jackson.

Larry didn’t have the best team, the best player ever, he was not a players coach.Larry was a winner. Iverson as a player didn’t care too much for Larry Brown, Iverson post retirement has glowing things to say about Larry Brown.

Larry Brown is not the greatest coach ever.

Larry Brown was a really good and well established coach though. Not many coaches have had success in as many different places as Larry Brown.
In hindsight, it is actually hard to believe Carlisle was fired after making the ECF with that Pistons team. Also in hindsight, Carlisle turned out to be a championship level coach as well.

So Mike Malone?

Are you going to respond to my post or admit you are completely wrong?

[m2002brian]

Larry Brown was a really good and well established coach though. Not many coaches have had success in as many different places as Larry Brown.
In hindsight, it is actually hard to believe Carlisle was fired after making the ECF with that Pistons team. Also in hindsight, Carlisle turned out to be a championship level coach as well.

So Mike Malone?

Are you going to respond to my post or admit you are completely wrong?

The post where you said we’d beat the pistons if they didn’t have Rasheed Wallace and we had A healthy Sam?

Well, unfortunately Detroit did have Rasheed Wallace and we didn’t have a healthy Sam.

What if there were no hypothetical questions?


The point I’ve been making is…..

We’ve been getting here (wcf) on talent, more than on coaching. Talent wins games, coaching wins championships.

And much like Doig Collins, Chris’s replacement is already sitting on the bench next to him. Micah Nori

It’s time to think about getting more out of our coaching. Out of bounds plays. Play calls in general, getting guys easy looks, timeout patterns, substitutions, in game adjustments. Planning ahead for specific situations and scenarios and having counters already in place if the situation arises. We seem very inflexible in game once the action starts. That’s coaching.

[ReggiesKnicks]

So Mike Malone?

Are you going to respond to my post or admit you are completely wrong?

The post where you said we’d beat the pistons if they didn’t have Rasheed Wallace and we had A healthy Sam?

Well, unfortunately Detroit did have Rasheed Wallace and we didn’t have a healthy Sam.

What if there were no hypothetical questions?

I never said that...I said the Pistons added Rasheed Wallace, who became their best player in 2004.

Here is what I said.

Detroit also traded for a player who was arguably better than Chauncey/Wallace in Rasheed Wallace mid-season. They also developed Tayshaun Prince, a rookie in 2003 who was a starter in 2004. Let's call Tayshaun Prince your guy's Rob Dillingham for a year 1 to year 2 massive jump.

How are your timberwolves acquiring a Rasheed Wallace-caliber player? For reference, Rasheed Wallace was acquired and Detroit went 17-4, outscoring opponents by 15 PPG in games Rasheed played.

Is Minnesota going to acquire a Top 15-20 player in the NBA next year?

[m2002brian]

Are you going to respond to my post or admit you are completely wrong?

The post where you said we’d beat the pistons if they didn’t have Rasheed Wallace and we had A healthy Sam?

Well, unfortunately Detroit did have Rasheed Wallace and we didn’t have a healthy Sam.

What if there were no hypothetical questions?

I never said that...I said the Pistons added Rasheed Wallace, who became their best player in 2004.

Here is what I said.

Detroit also traded for a player who was arguably better than Chauncey/Wallace in Rasheed Wallace mid-season. They also developed Tayshaun Prince, a rookie in 2003 who was a starter in 2004. Let's call Tayshaun Prince your guy's Rob Dillingham for a year 1 to year 2 massive jump.

How are your timberwolves acquiring a Rasheed Wallace-caliber player? For reference, Rasheed Wallace was acquired and Detroit went 17-4, outscoring opponents by 15 PPG in games Rasheed played.

Is Minnesota going to acquire a Top 15-20 player in the NBA next year?

The could. They have the chips and the young star to attract that type of player. We’ll see what happens. I actually think TSJ is closer to the Prince comparison, but Rob will be much better next year as our #2 PG.

[Klomp]

Wrong again.

Detroit pistons coached by Rick Carlisle from 2001-2003, couldn’t get over the hump. After reaching the Conference Finals in just his third year Rick was fired. Replaced by Larry Brown. 2004 Detroit wins the NBA Championship against Shaquille O’Neil, Kobe Bryant and the greatest “greatest coach ever”, Phil Jackson.

Larry didn’t have the best team, the best player ever, he was not a players coach.Larry was a winner. Iverson as a player didn’t care too much for Larry Brown, Iverson post retirement has glowing things to say about Larry Brown.

Larry Brown is not the greatest coach ever.

Larry Brown was a really good and well established coach though. Not many coaches have had success in as many different places as Larry Brown.
In hindsight, it is actually hard to believe Carlisle was fired after making the ECF with that Pistons team. Also in hindsight, Carlisle turned out to be a championship level coach as well.

So Mike Malone?

I do understand the point you are trying to hit at.

However, I think the coaching landscape is so dramatically different in 2025 than it was in 2003, that I don't think a change like that would have the same success rate. The early 2000s were filled with coaching legends, including Pat Riley, Jerry Sloan, Gregg Popovich, Phil Jackson, George Karl, Rudy Tomjanovich and more. If you didn't have a veteran coach, you were playing from behind.

The current coaching landscape is much, much different. The only coaches who have been with the same franchise for longer than Finch are Spoelstra, Kerr and Carlisle (Malone and Jenkins were both on this list before their firings). I actually wonder if this is a result of there being so much parity in the league, but I think it could also be a cause of the parity as well. There is no more consistency in the league from year to year.

[Worm Guts]

Larry Brown was a really good and well established coach though. Not many coaches have had success in as many different places as Larry Brown.
In hindsight, it is actually hard to believe Carlisle was fired after making the ECF with that Pistons team. Also in hindsight, Carlisle turned out to be a championship level coach as well.

So Mike Malone?

I do understand the point you are trying to hit at.

However, I think the coaching landscape is so dramatically different in 2025 than it was in 2003, that I don't think a change like that would have the same success rate. The early 2000s were filled with coaching legends, including Pat Riley, Jerry Sloan, Gregg Popovich, Phil Jackson, George Karl, Rudy Tomjanovich and more. If you didn't have a veteran coach, you were playing from behind.

The current coaching landscape is much, much different. The only coaches who have been with the same franchise for longer than Finch are Spoelstra, Kerr and Carlisle (Malone and Jenkins were both on this list before their firings). I actually wonder if this is a result of there being so much parity in the league, but I think it could also be a cause of the parity as well. There is no more consistency in the league from year to year.

Firing Mike Malone resulted in Denver reaching the same exact place they did last year. It’s undetermined whether it will have a long term benefit, so I guess it’s not a great point to me.

[Klomp]

So Mike Malone?

I do understand the point you are trying to hit at.

However, I think the coaching landscape is so dramatically different in 2025 than it was in 2003, that I don't think a change like that would have the same success rate. The early 2000s were filled with coaching legends, including Pat Riley, Jerry Sloan, Gregg Popovich, Phil Jackson, George Karl, Rudy Tomjanovich and more. If you didn't have a veteran coach, you were playing from behind.

The current coaching landscape is much, much different. The only coaches who have been with the same franchise for longer than Finch are Spoelstra, Kerr and Carlisle (Malone and Jenkins were both on this list before their firings). I actually wonder if this is a result of there being so much parity in the league, but I think it could also be a cause of the parity as well. There is no more consistency in the league from year to year.

Firing Mike Malone resulted in Denver reaching the same exact place they did last year. It’s undetermined whether it will have a long term benefit, so I guess it’s not a great point to me.

My interpretation of Brian's post was that he thinks Malone should be our Larry Brown (with Finch playing the role of Rick Carlisle). I might be off though.

[m2002brian]

I do understand the point you are trying to hit at.

However, I think the coaching landscape is so dramatically different in 2025 than it was in 2003, that I don't think a change like that would have the same success rate. The early 2000s were filled with coaching legends, including Pat Riley, Jerry Sloan, Gregg Popovich, Phil Jackson, George Karl, Rudy Tomjanovich and more. If you didn't have a veteran coach, you were playing from behind.

The current coaching landscape is much, much different. The only coaches who have been with the same franchise for longer than Finch are Spoelstra, Kerr and Carlisle (Malone and Jenkins were both on this list before their firings). I actually wonder if this is a result of there being so much parity in the league, but I think it could also be a cause of the parity as well. There is no more consistency in the league from year to year.

Firing Mike Malone resulted in Denver reaching the same exact place they did last year. It’s undetermined whether it will have a long term benefit, so I guess it’s not a great point to me.

My interpretation of Brian's post was that he thinks Malone should be our Larry Brown (with Finch playing the role of Rick Carlisle). I might be off though.

Not specifically Mike.

Sometimes, at no fault of the coach, the their voice and impact has run its coarse. Sometimes a new voice, new ideas and new strategies is the way forward. Change for changes sake isn’t going to help. Tim’s job is to identify what’s going right, what’s going wrong. What can be worked on in house and what may require going out of house. Could be players, could be coaches, could be scouting, could be a number of things.

Do Chris’s contributions far outweigh his deficiencies?

After 4.5 years, I can tell you that there are some glaring issues with Chris. Is there a coach out there that if given the same level of talent could bring the same positives while introducing a more consistent offensive game? Better in game adjustments? Planning ahead and prepare and put in place strategies to neutralize or take advantage of specific things teams may do to adjust to you?

[frankenwolf]

Firing Mike Malone resulted in Denver reaching the same exact place they did last year. It’s undetermined whether it will have a long term benefit, so I guess it’s not a great point to me.

My interpretation of Brian's post was that he thinks Malone should be our Larry Brown (with Finch playing the role of Rick Carlisle). I might be off though.

Not specifically Mike.

Sometimes, at no fault of the coach, the their voice and impact has run its coarse. Sometimes a new voice, new ideas and new strategies is the way forward. Change for changes sake isn’t going to help. Tim’s job is to identify what’s going right, what’s going wrong. What can be worked on in house and what may require going out of house. Could be players, could be coaches, could be scouting, could be a number of things.

Do Chris’s contributions far outweigh his deficiencies?

After 4.5 years, I can tell you that there are some glaring issues with Chris. Is there a coach out there that if given the same level of talent could bring the same positives while introducing a more consistent offensive game? Better in game adjustments? Planning ahead and prepare and put in place strategies to neutralize or take advantage of specific things teams may do to adjust to you?

Reading through this discussion, I think you are saying that the Jazz should have fired Sloan, because they plateaued , only won the West twice and never a championship. In that case, the only coach that might bring Minnesota a championship is Mike Malone, since he already has won one.

However, I believe that getting rid of Finch would be a huge mistake right now. He is the only coach to appear in the WCF the past two years. If Ant can get better, then Finch can also. He's been a head coach less time than Ant has been in the league.