KD to the Spurs

[-Luke-]

I'm sure you all saw the Shams news that there was mutual interest between KD and the Spurs during last trade deadline, and that there could still be interest this summer.

Spurs get: Kevin Durant

Suns get: Harrison Barnes, Keldon Johnson, #14, 2026 Spurs first, 2029 swap

Why for Spurs?
- They get KD, whom they apparently want
- They keep all their major assets (#2, Castle, Sochan, even Vassell)

Why for Suns?
- Barnes is an expiring contract, plus a solid vet for one season
- K. Johnson has two years remaining (17.5 mil)
- That gives the Suns tons of cap space in the summer of 2027, when Beal is also off the books
- They get two firsts for a guy that turns 37 before the start of the season and has one year left on his contract

The 2029 swap is a bit of a fake one, because the Spurs will likely be very good then. It's for Ishbia to tell the fanbase that they got three firsts for KD.

[LarsV8]

Seems like an overpay, but maybe Spurs fans feel differently.

[Texas Chuck]

Switch Vassell for Barnes so the Spurs can extend Durant pain free and this seems about right.

[Bornstellar]

I would not do this deal. Spurs should absolutely not use any other picks/swaps to get him aside from the 14th pick. KD is old, who knows when father time will take him, has injury history, etc. This is not even 2021 KD anymore. He does not have the same value imo especially given his price tag and the fact he will need to be re-signed. Using multiple assets to get a player on his last legs that is far older than the core of our roster is a bad idea. I think he would fit well on offense but realistically Spurs need 3/D forwards next to Wemby in the SL, and while Durant can do the 3 part, he is not much of a defender anymore.

I would top out at Keldon/Vassell/14 for KD. IMO KD will ultimately determine where he plays, so if he wants to play with Wemby, that should be enough to get it done

[wemby]

Seems like an overpay, but maybe Spurs fans feel differently.

No we don't. I'm eager to revisit these proposals once a KD trade is finalized.

[ReggiesKnicks]

Barnes, Vassell, Sochan and #14

[wemby]

Barnes, Vassell, Sochan and #14

This is probably what I feel a realistic KD trade to the Spurs would look like. And I'm not even sure I'm sold, mainly because IMO 1) This hurts the Spurs if we're thinking 3+ years into the future 2) It doesn't help the Spurs be true contenders in the next 2 years 3) I don't believe Sochan is neutral and Vassell negative, as some on these boards do
So, while not being crazy off base value wise, it's not the direction I'd go.

[ReggiesKnicks]

Barnes, Vassell, Sochan and #14

This is probably what I feel a realistic KD trade to the Spurs would look like. And I'm not even sure I'm sold, mainly because IMO 1) This hurts the Spurs if we're thinking 3+ years into the future

Does it?

Vassell is a low-end starting wing being paid a decent starting wing salary. Honestly, moving him doesn't change anything in 3 years, if anything it provides flexibility.
Sochan isn't a long-term piece.
Barnes is expiring.
#14 could be something I guess?

The only pain it causes is #14, which could be offset with deep playoff runs, Wemby/Castle and company gaining playoff experience and growing because of playoff battles. Remember, stars just don't go into the post-season and wreak havoc. They take time to learn and grow from their shortcomings.

2) It doesn't help the Spurs be true contenders in the next 2 years

I think it does. Healthy Wemby is a Top 5 player in the NBA. Fox is a Top 30-40 player. Durant is still an All-NBA caliber player (Top 15-20) with an incredibly resilient playoff game. This team is a Top 4-5 team out West, barring injury. That's a title contender.

3) I don't believe Sochan is neutral

Me neither, I have him negative

and Vassell negative, as some on these boards do

What makes him more valuable than R.J. Barrett? DeMar DeRozan? Cam Johnson?

[BlazersBroncos]

I really like Vassell, Keldon and 14 for KD and potentially 29.

PHX takes a big at 14 and runs -

G Beal / FA PG
G Booker / Grayson
F Vassell / Keldon
F Royce / Keldon
C Sorber (14)

SAS takes Harper and runs -

G - Fox / Castle
G - Harper / Castle
F - Barnes / #29
F - Durant / Sochan
C - Wemby / Sochan

[Bornstellar]

Barnes, Vassell, Sochan and #14

This is probably what I feel a realistic KD trade to the Spurs would look like. And I'm not even sure I'm sold, mainly because IMO 1) This hurts the Spurs if we're thinking 3+ years into the future

Does it?

Vassell is a low-end starting wing being paid a decent starting wing salary. Honestly, moving him doesn't change anything in 3 years, if anything it provides flexibility.
Sochan isn't a long-term piece.
Barnes is expiring.
#14 could be something I guess?

The only pain it causes is #14, which could be offset with deep playoff runs, Wemby/Castle and company gaining playoff experience and growing because of playoff battles. Remember, stars just don't go into the post-season and wreak havoc. They take time to learn and grow from their shortcomings.

2) It doesn't help the Spurs be true contenders in the next 2 years

I think it does. Healthy Wemby is a Top 5 player in the NBA. Fox is a Top 30-40 player. Durant is still an All-NBA caliber player (Top 15-20) with an incredibly resilient playoff game. This team is a Top 4-5 team out West, barring injury. That's a title contender.

3) I don't believe Sochan is neutral

Me neither, I have him negative

and Vassell negative, as some on these boards do

What makes him more valuable than R.J. Barrett? DeMar DeRozan? Cam Johnson?

Uh, Sochan is one of the better 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA and just barely turned 22 and is still on his rookie deal. Zero chance he has negative value around the league

[Texas Chuck]

I would not take bad contracts and a mid 1st for KD. I can't imagine Phoenix will. Its fine for Spurs fans of course to say hey this is as high as I'm willing to go. But I think at that point the Suns tell KD to name another team. That does absolutely nothing for Phoenix. Better to just keep KD knowing he's going to play hard because he wants another big contract.

[ReggiesKnicks]

Uh, Sochan is one of the better 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA and just barely turned 22 and is still on his rookie deal. Zero chance he has negative value around the league

So are Josh Okogie, Matisse Thybulle, Kris Dunn and Jaylen Clark.

[balsamic_ducks]

I really like Vassell, Keldon and 14 for KD and potentially 29.

PHX takes a big at 14 and runs -

G Beal / FA PG
G Booker / Grayson
F Vassell / Keldon
F Royce / Keldon
C Sorber (14)

SAS takes Harper and runs -

G - Fox / Castle
G - Harper / Castle
F - Barnes / #29
F - Durant / Sochan
C - Wemby / Sochan

This is about the most i would trade for KD if I'm the spurs. They have a long run way and plenty of assets. No need to rush things for a 37 yo KD.

[Bornstellar]

Uh, Sochan is one of the better 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA and just barely turned 22 and is still on his rookie deal. Zero chance he has negative value around the league

So are Josh Okogie, Matisse Thybulle, Kris Dunn and Jaylen Clark.

None of those players are as good as Sochan. Jeremy's shot is still a work in progress but he is a good rebounder and a solid opportunistic scorer. And again he barely turned 22 recently. Okogie is 26. Dunn is 31. Thybulle is 28. Those are all finished products. Including Clark, a rookie who has only played 40 games and barely saw the court is an odd choice. But in any event none of those players are comparable. Nice try though. He doesn't have negative value regardless of your opinion

[ReggiesKnicks]

Uh, Sochan is one of the better 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA and just barely turned 22 and is still on his rookie deal. Zero chance he has negative value around the league

So are Josh Okogie, Matisse Thybulle, Kris Dunn and Jaylen Clark.

None of those players are as good as Sochan.

The difference isn't much.

Jeremy's shot is still a work in progress but he is a good rebounder and a solid opportunistic scorer. And again he barely turned 22 recently. Okogie is 26. Dunn is 31. Thybulle is 28. Those are all finished products. Including Clark, a rookie who has only played 40 games and barely saw the court is an odd choice. But in any event none of those players are comparable. Nice try though

All you said was "He is one of the better 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA". That's it. I simply responded to what you said since I can't read your mind, unfortunately. I provided a list of players who don't see play or hold little value yet are comparable in that they are "some of the best 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA".

Jarred Vanderbilt is and has been better than Sochan. Probably the best comparison given the size. He is signed for a contract < MLE.

[Bornstellar]

So are Josh Okogie, Matisse Thybulle, Kris Dunn and Jaylen Clark.

None of those players are as good as Sochan.

The difference isn't much.

Jeremy's shot is still a work in progress but he is a good rebounder and a solid opportunistic scorer. And again he barely turned 22 recently. Okogie is 26. Dunn is 31. Thybulle is 28. Those are all finished products. Including Clark, a rookie who has only played 40 games and barely saw the court is an odd choice. But in any event none of those players are comparable. Nice try though

All you said was "He is one of the better 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA". That's it. I simply responded to what you said since I can't read your mind, unfortunately. I provided a list of players who don't see play or hold little value yet are comparable in that they are "some of the best 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA".

Jarred Vanderbilt is and has been better than Sochan. Probably the best comparison given the size. He is signed for a contract < MLE.

I also said he was barely 22 and still on a rookie scale deal in response to you claiming he has negative value. He has plenty of room to improve and is not a finished product yet. You are free to believe whatever you want but I'm free to point out that your opinion that he has negative value is wrong. I assume you think Vando also has negative value?

[ReggiesKnicks]

None of those players are as good as Sochan.

The difference isn't much.

Jeremy's shot is still a work in progress but he is a good rebounder and a solid opportunistic scorer. And again he barely turned 22 recently. Okogie is 26. Dunn is 31. Thybulle is 28. Those are all finished products. Including Clark, a rookie who has only played 40 games and barely saw the court is an odd choice. But in any event none of those players are comparable. Nice try though

All you said was "He is one of the better 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA". That's it. I simply responded to what you said since I can't read your mind, unfortunately. I provided a list of players who don't see play or hold little value yet are comparable in that they are "some of the best 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA".

Jarred Vanderbilt is and has been better than Sochan. Probably the best comparison given the size. He is signed for a contract < MLE.

I also said he was barely 22 and still on a rookie scale deal in response to you claiming he has negative value. He has plenty of room to improve and is not a finished product yet. You are free to believe whatever you want but I'm free to point out that your opinion that he has negative value is wrong. I assume you think Vando also has negative value?

Vando is a negative value on his contract, yes. He was good in 2022, but what ends up happening with players like Vanerbilt (and Sochan) is they can't stay on the floor in the postseason.

For the record, Vanderbilt was much better than Sochan in 2022 and still held minimal value around the league.

Vanderbilt 2021 and 2022 Seasons: 11.5% OREB, 17.7% TREB, 2.6% STL, 2.8% BLK
Sochan 2025 season: 10.0% OREB, 13.8% TREB, 1.6% STL, 1.8% BLK

At the end of the day, this archetype isn't a sought-after archetype. No team values these players highly because they are incredibly difficult to build around, and in the postseason, they create a true chink-in-the-armor for any postseason offense.

I get you love the kid, all fans should love their prospects. But sometimes you need to step back and view these players and their archetypes, compare them to others around the league, and see what value that holds. Maybe Sochan improves in leaps and bounds, shows more in the future than he ever has currently. It's possible, but incredibly unlikely. The most likely scenario is that he is a less-disruptive, more durable Jared Vanderbilt. That's just not a sought-after asset.

I'm just being realistic here. I have nothing personal against players in the NBA, and I certainly don't have anything to gain by expressing my viewpoint of "one of the best 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA". Lots of the best 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA see limited minutes, like Jaylen Clark. The fact you pointed out his games and minutes to me is actually not the argument you think it is.

[Chinook]

Seems like an overpay, but maybe Spurs fans feel differently.

I'm not keen to give up any of the picks with swaps attached. So that rules out 2026, 2028, 2030 and 2031. I don't see any team beating Johnson, Barnes, Branham, Wesley, 14 and SAS 29. I think some teams can beat that, but I don't think any will that Durant agrees to go to.

I don't think there's any point in having the same fight over negative contracts when they aren't necessary to the trade. Either Vassell will be included because one of the teams involves thinks he's a good player to have, or he won't be in the deal.

I don't think a team like Phoenix who will struggle to have meaningful cap space so long as Beal is on the roster will consider taking on money as a bad thing. They can save a considerable amount of real dollars moving Barnes to another team or for salary relief or just stretching him. That matters. But it behooves them to hang on to contracts they can use to make future deals rather than just a bunch of expirings. Yes, Vassell is a uniquely bad fit for a team with Booker and Beal. But I don't think they'd see Johnson's extra year as a minus at all.

[BlazersBroncos]

Uh, Sochan is one of the better 1 on 1 defenders in the NBA and just barely turned 22 and is still on his rookie deal. Zero chance he has negative value around the league

So are Josh Okogie, Matisse Thybulle, Kris Dunn and Jaylen Clark.

None of those players are as good as Sochan. Jeremy's shot is still a work in progress but he is a good rebounder and a solid opportunistic scorer. And again he barely turned 22 recently. Okogie is 26. Dunn is 31. Thybulle is 28. Those are all finished products. Including Clark, a rookie who has only played 40 games and barely saw the court is an odd choice. But in any event none of those players are comparable. Nice try though. He doesn't have negative value regardless of your opinion

Advanced stats do not show Sochan as a better defender than Okogie, MT, Dunn or even Clark.

Sochan has never posted better than 117DRtg or -0.4 DBPM.

Thybulle for example has a career average DRtg of 109 and a career average DBPM of a whopping +3.4 with highs of a whopping of 103 and +5.1.

Not saying Sochan doesnt have more value, but he is not a great defender (yet) by all advanced metrics.

[LarsV8]

Again, not a fan of San Antonio, but.....

Fox is going to want a new deal after next year and could get 50m (not worth it imo)
Durant is going to be 50m (not worth it imo)
Wemby of course will get max, so 40m
Sochan will probably need atleast 20m

Then there is Castle and Harper....

This team is going to get very expensive, very fast. I was never a fan of them adding Fox, same for Durant, but that is just me.