2025 NBA Draft Discussion Part 8

[WuTang_CMB]

OKC's first workout was with Cedric Coward

[VanWest82]

You guys are still crazy with the Cedric Coward hype lol. He's going to be available in the 20s. If we really want him, we can just trade back into the back half of the first round.

Interesting that Givony now has Noa Essengue at #9 on his big board. I guess NBA front offices must really like him. He looks like a Chris Boucher energy forward to me but he's still so young so I get the intrigue. Demin and Carter Bryant seem to be holding their ground with NBA scouts. The latter seems like a much more likely target than Coward if we want to go with a 3+D guy @ 9. I still like Jak or Demin for us.

[S.W.A.N]

I think it is going to be a massive test of scouting and projection skills to choose between Bryant, Coward and Powell.
I'm a Bryant guy, myself.

I think this is exactly it.

But the pool is even bigger
For the wings Bryant,Coward,Powell and Noa all kinda fit that same toolsy two way wing profile. But sample size, competition level age etc etc make them difficult evals.

For the PGs Fears,Jak, Demin all have massive potential but you have to make a leap of faith that they can improve certain areas as you develop them

Same for the bigs..
Khaman was in a very limited role and is raw, Queen offensively could be amazing but can he defend enough to justify his offensive talents.

I think half of these guys are going to end up being studs and half are going to be duds/role players. Getting the choice right is going to be massively impactful on the teams championship goals.

My board hasn't changed much lately and I still think there is a big tier of guys at 9 that could be great so I not worried, but I am fascinated to see how this draft plays out.

I do love seeing highly respected draft guys like Vecenie and O'Connor giving Coward love. It is one more guy that I love his analytics and want to know more about.

I love me some 2 way players.

[Clutch0z24]

You guys are still crazy with the Cedric Coward hype lol. He's going to be available in the 20s. If we really want him, we can just trade back into the back half of the first round.

Interesting that Givony now has Noa Essengue at #9 on his big board. I guess NBA front offices must really like him. He looks like a Chris Boucher energy forward to me but he's still so young so I get the intrigue. Demin and Carter Bryant seem to be holding their ground with NBA scouts. The latter seems like a much more likely target than Coward if we want to go with a 3+D guy @ 9. I still like Jak or Demin for us.

It may sound crazy but i remember when we had the 5th pick in the 2011 Draft.....I remember a few people advocating to pick Kawhi at 5th....I was one of them....But i was also saying "Yeah it would be crazy to pick him that high" But if you look back it is not really that crazy....Not Saying Coward will be that good but you never should put a player in a bubble with where they are mocked.....If you can get a trade back and get the guy you want sure go for it but if you actually believe Coward is the best player just take him...

[Dalek]

You guys are still crazy with the Cedric Coward hype lol. He's going to be available in the 20s. If we really want him, we can just trade back into the back half of the first round.

Interesting that Givony now has Noa Essengue at #9 on his big board. I guess NBA front offices must really like him. He looks like a Chris Boucher energy forward to me but he's still so young so I get the intrigue. Demin and Carter Bryant seem to be holding their ground with NBA scouts. The latter seems like a much more likely target than Coward if we want to go with a 3+D guy @ 9. I still like Jak or Demin for us.

Noa feels like a tweener to me. He is a skinny 6'8/6'9 who want to play more as a wing rather than a frontcourt player. He has to really figure out his handle and develop more skill because he is almost only scoring on cuts and a couple catch and shoot jumpers.

Watch on YouTube

He has some good moments here scoring, but some wild misses, bad rotations, and lost balls. He reminds me a bit of Jalen (not Jaden) McDaniels.

[VanWest82]

You guys are still crazy with the Cedric Coward hype lol. He's going to be available in the 20s. If we really want him, we can just trade back into the back half of the first round.

Interesting that Givony now has Noa Essengue at #9 on his big board. I guess NBA front offices must really like him. He looks like a Chris Boucher energy forward to me but he's still so young so I get the intrigue. Demin and Carter Bryant seem to be holding their ground with NBA scouts. The latter seems like a much more likely target than Coward if we want to go with a 3+D guy @ 9. I still like Jak or Demin for us.

It may sound crazy but i remember when we had the 5th pick in the 2011 Draft.....I remember a few people advocating to pick Kawhi at 5th....I was one of them....But i was also saying "Yeah it would be crazy to pick him that high" But if you look back it is not really that crazy....Not Saying Coward will be that good but you never should put a player in a bubble with where they are mocked.....If you can get a trade back and get the guy you want sure go for it but if you actually believe Coward is the best player just take him...

I would generally agree wrt guys grouped in your range. Like, if we believe Carter Bryant (#12 on Givony's board) is the best prospect then we should just take him at #9 and not mess around. Cedric Coward is currently #29. There are other supposed draft "gurus" who mock him higher because they're all aboard the media hype train trying to get clicks, but until I see Shams or Givony reporting that NBA front offices are seriously considering him top 10 then to me it's just hype.

BTW Kawhi who was 19 at the time not 22, was picked 15th. You do the trade down or trade back in for a second pick in that scenario.

[Mark_83]

You guys are still crazy with the Cedric Coward hype lol. He's going to be available in the 20s. If we really want him, we can just trade back into the back half of the first round.

I think he'll go in the teens personally but I'm also ok with taking him at 9 if our scouts deem him worthy. I think people need to watch game film rather than just highlights though. You need to see both makes and misses to really put the stats and reports into context.

Watch on YouTube

;t=521s

Watch on YouTube

;t=1886s

[SpezNc]

9. Toronto Raptors: Cedric Coward, G, Washington State

Many executives around the NBA expect the Raptors to lean toward selecting a player that can help the team win games in the short-term with this pick, rather than a raw project. A number of choices would make sense here, but none more than Coward, who will be 22 years old as a rookie and has the maturity of a grown man, in part due to his fascinating journey: Coward has gone from a Division III player to a potential first-round pick in just a few years behind his rapid development into a prospect with a valued 3-and-D skill-set. At the draft combine, he was one of the biggest risers measuring in at 6-foot-5 barefoot with a 7-foot-2 wingspan, while shooting the hell out of the ball. And Coward brings even higher upside thanks to his passing vision. For more on Coward, watch or listen to my one-on-one interview with him.

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=0YpMScWXY2zRUqR8fH-usg

I'm a fan of Cowards as he was one of my early sleepers before the combine. But I don't really see how he fits unless we move one of Walter, Dick, RJ, or Ochai. All those guys fit best at the SG position, so if we could move one for a big or a wing, picking Coward would make a lot more sense.

Drafting Coward probably would means that the FO going to look if not already into trading one of RJ, Gradey or Ochai.

Right now Coward at #9 is mostly speculative. But let’s say he is our picks, this means it’s getting interesting!

Contrary to us the front office has some insight on their Short term, mid term and long term plan . Therefore they may not evaluate the FIT the same way as us.

[junot111]

It shocks me how many people will fight tooth and nail to say Maluach is this elite player when he's really really raw and not NBA ready right now

Can he develop into an all-star calibre C? Maybe... But I think he's in the traditional C model like Hasheem Thabeet or James Wiseman with upside of Gobert. These guys just don't work in the new modern NBA. At C you want agile, switchable defensive guys like Lively, Chet or Wemby or elite skill guys like Jokic, Embiid, Sengun

That's why I'd rather just take Fleming over KM if we want a big. Who's realistically going to close a game? An athletic and mobile 6'9 guy with a 7'5 wingspan or a lumbering 7'2 guy? Even Gobert doesn't close games over Naz Reid

Gobert doesn't close games because he's a 64% career free throw shooter and potentially a target for the treatment Mitchell Robinson is getting in the Knicks/Pacers series. Even at almost 33 with his best days behind him he's still the Wolves' starting centre and playing more minutes than Naz Reid for good reasons (defence and rebounding).

We tried going the route of no player over 6'9" all smallball for years and it didn't work out all that well for us, I don't see that drafting Chris Boucher 2.0 in Rasheer Fleming and playing him at centre is going to work out all that well for us either.

Goberts crunch time problems can't be reduced to just ft shooting. He poses no threat on offense such that the opposing team can just stick a small on him. On defense he's a target for elite perimeter players (even though he is better there than the media portrays him to be). And yeah obviously he's a 4 time dpoy, I named him as one of the best case scenarios for maluach who still has clear limitations.

We never had someone like fleming. Our biggest player was Pascal has a 2 inch reach and wingspan disadvantage compared to fleming and is visibly lighter. If he doesn't turn out to be a bust, he'll very likely be closing games as a 5

[Bull-E]

You guys are still crazy with the Cedric Coward hype lol. He's going to be available in the 20s. If we really want him, we can just trade back into the back half of the first round.

Interesting that Givony now has Noa Essengue at #9 on his big board. I guess NBA front offices must really like him. He looks like a Chris Boucher energy forward to me but he's still so young so I get the intrigue. Demin and Carter Bryant seem to be holding their ground with NBA scouts. The latter seems like a much more likely target than Coward if we want to go with a 3+D guy @ 9. I still like Jak or Demin for us.

Interesting you raise the Boucher comparison. If Essengue's floor is a more refined, better defending Chris Boucher, that actually would be great value at 9.

[Rapsfan07]

As of today i settled on a few options

Trade up for Tre Johnson
Jase Richardson
Cedric Coward
Kon Knueppel
-------------------
Derik Queen
Rasheer Fleming
Kasparas Jak

Would be disappointed but gotta trust Masai
Carter Bryant
Maluach
Noa Essengue
CMB

My position is similar. Assuming we stay at #9.

Preferred:
1. Coward
2. Fleming
3. Kasparas

Less excited but I'd try to get behind it:
1. Knueppel
2. Richardson
3. Bryant

Calling for Masai's head:
1. Maluach
2. CMB
3. Queen
4. Essengue

Ideally I'd want to pick up Coward and Fleming with #13 and #22 but I don't think either of them are going to last that long. If they do, that's a homerun draft IMO.

[grant101]

You guys are still crazy with the Cedric Coward hype lol. He's going to be available in the 20s. If we really want him, we can just trade back into the back half of the first round.

Interesting that Givony now has Noa Essengue at #9 on his big board. I guess NBA front offices must really like him. He looks like a Chris Boucher energy forward to me but he's still so young so I get the intrigue. Demin and Carter Bryant seem to be holding their ground with NBA scouts. The latter seems like a much more likely target than Coward if we want to go with a 3+D guy @ 9. I still like Jak or Demin for us.

Interesting you raise the Boucher comparison. If Essengue's floor is a more refined, better defending Chris Boucher, that actually would be great value at 9.

That’s absolutely not his floor. Chris is a much better rebounder, shot blocker, ball handler and shooter. His floor is Josh Minott

[rim_killa]

won't be mad if we draft flemming

[GIZMO]

Watch on YouTube

So the premise of this guys valuation is that Maluach is African and since Masia covets
Africans then we should trade 9, 39 and Shead to move up two spots to select Maluach.

It's quite comical! I have seen better thought out reasoning from many posters on here.

[Coco Costanza]

All this discussion just makes me even less sure of who we should draft. I'll let you guys tell me how I should feel once we've made our selection.

[earthtone]

As of today i settled on a few options

Trade up for Tre Johnson
Jase Richardson
Cedric Coward
Kon Knueppel
-------------------
Derik Queen
Rasheer Fleming
Kasparas Jak

Would be disappointed but gotta trust Masai
Carter Bryant
Maluach
Noa Essengue
CMB

My position is similar. Assuming we stay at #9.

Preferred:
1. Coward
2. Fleming
3. Kasparas

Less excited but I'd try to get behind it:
1. Knueppel
2. Richardson
3. Bryant

Calling for Masai's head:
1. Maluach
2. CMB
3. Queen
4. Essengue

Ideally I'd want to pick up Coward and Fleming with #13 and #22 but I don't think either of them are going to last that long. If they do, that's a homerun draft IMO.

I love this draft because three of your ‘calling for Masai’s head’ guys are three of my top choices at 9.

Lots of variations after the top 5 on boards this year, gonna be interesting to see how it plays out

[Spates]

Omg! I forgot about Nique Clifford. One of my favs from last year

He's undoubtedly another option at 9 for me. He leapfrogs Jase.

[Indeed]

Just posted, having 20% defensive rebounding rate is bad, and everyone know rebounding translate to the NBA.

His quickness and leaping are bottom 5 in this class, close to Queen, so I am unsure how he is not described as slow. He is described as drop big, not switch. And his stone hands are legitimate concern if you even watch full games. Many scouting reports have his hands as concern, though his measurement isn't bad for his hand, which seems more to be his basketball IQ.

It shocks me how many people will fight tooth and nail to say Maluach is this elite player when he's really really raw and not NBA ready right now

Can he develop into an all-star calibre C? Maybe... But I think he's in the traditional C model like Hasheem Thabeet or James Wiseman with upside of Gobert. These guys just don't work in the new modern NBA. At C you want agile, switchable defensive guys like Lively, Chet or Wemby or elite skill guys like Jokic, Embiid, Sengun

I've never said he's an elite player, I've always been consistent that I think his career is being a solid starting centre. If he was doing all the things you guys want him to do in college at 18 he'd be drafted top 3 and would be completely out of our range, any proven C with the skills you want will always be grabbed with a very high draft pick, like Anthony Davis (1st), Evan Mobley (3rd), Karl-Anthony Towns (1st), Chet Holmgren (2nd) as examples, we never draft high enough to get that type of player because we are unlucky and unwilling to really bottom out. We drafted Jakob Poeltl with the 9th pick in the draft in 2016, that was a pretty good pick. Taking Maluach at 9 in this draft is a similar type move, you can't assume there is a perennial All-Star available at 9 and even if there is you can't assume you will pick whoever it winds up being.

He is not even half of Lively. His block rate and assist rate are half of Lively, not even comparing to those with skills.
It is clearly a big risk with someone who can't jump (bottom 5 in leaping) and show he is not a good rebounder and show blocker at his standing reach and wingspan.

If his block rate is closer to 7% within the average of other C at his size, I would have him higher, but the fact that he is not with both stats and measurement, you got to see why on that.

[Indeed]

Watch on YouTube

So the premise of this guys valuation is that Maluach is African and since Masia covets
Africans then we should trade 9, 39 and Shead to move up two spots to select Maluach.

It's quite comical! I have seen better thought out reasoning from many posters on here.

Indeed, pretty bad assumption even taking Maluach at 9, he is in my do not watch list.
I guess there is no real taker for Maluach in the top 10, but these people are ranking him in the top 10, unsure if this is related to his agent trying to hype him.

[Indeed]

You guys are still crazy with the Cedric Coward hype lol. He's going to be available in the 20s. If we really want him, we can just trade back into the back half of the first round.

Interesting that Givony now has Noa Essengue at #9 on his big board. I guess NBA front offices must really like him. He looks like a Chris Boucher energy forward to me but he's still so young so I get the intrigue. Demin and Carter Bryant seem to be holding their ground with NBA scouts. The latter seems like a much more likely target than Coward if we want to go with a 3+D guy @ 9. I still like Jak or Demin for us.

Noa feels like a tweener to me. He is a skinny 6'8/6'9 who want to play more as a wing rather than a frontcourt player. He has to really figure out his handle and develop more skill because he is almost only scoring on cuts and a couple catch and shoot jumpers.

Watch on YouTube

He has some good moments here scoring, but some wild misses, bad rotations, and lost balls. He reminds me a bit of Jalen (not Jaden) McDaniels.

Indeed, his 3 point shooting isn't that good, his only best consecutive 3s was only in a 4 game streak.
I believe he was playing some C as well, but that would not be his role in the NBA (hint, less scoring skills will be transferable)