Post Mortem #27 - Minnesota Timberwolves

[moss_is_1]

I agree. Once you're boxed in like Bucks / Giannis the move is to just trade the superstar and restart. Especially if your picks / prospects cupboard is bare.

The only other option is, let the other big contracts run off and try to get Ant to recruit a star free agent?

Difference is the Wolves have a great gm to be able to find talent in the late 1st and 2nd rounds. Also in Minnesota has shown an ability to make deals to get extra picks. Wolves still have a 1st round pick every other season.

[shrink]

I know it might sound crazy to sme, but what if the Wolves decide to sell high, I mean very high on Edwards and Gobert? I think they could get a real big package, though it might not happen just to think about what would be possible is a good food for thought

Think about the haul the Spurs could get if they sold Wemby. All I hope for all of you on this board is to find someone who loves you as much as this place loves rebuilding.

Best line I’ve read this year. Bravo.

[shrink]

Keep GM - he's doing his job as well as can be expected. Good drafts and good trade that was likely a cost-cutting demand by owners

Fire HC - He's completely failed to use this season to develop Dillingham and Shannon so they'd be contributing come playoff time. It's nuts that they essentially wasted two first round picks for essentially nothing because Finch is a buffoon.

One of the things that many people, including some Wolves fans, forget is that teams can only operate on the knowledge they have at the time. At the draft on June 26, Connelly selected Dillingham and Shannon, and told anyone that would listen that he and Finch would throw them into the fire immediately. MIN went through July free agency letting both of their vet back up PGs walk (Monte Morris and MacLaughlin). They also knew anytime Gobert was off the court, Towns would eat all those back up center minutes, so Naz could find playing time at PF, so they didn’t draft or sign a true back up center, just sveldt Luka Garza.

What Connelly couldn’t have known that, right before training camp, the Knicks would make a new Randle offer that included Dontae DiVincenzo on a cheap, three year deal, and a 1st round pick! When Connelly accepted that trade, (which worked out for both teams), suddenly Finch had to solve new problems, losing the key KAT, integrating the two new Knicks, and not having a vet back up at center. One change meant feeding those extra guard minutes to DDV, not Dillingham or Shannon, since MIN was thick with good guards (Conley starts, NAW, DDV and Ant of course). The development of the rookies would need to be done off the court.

And for the record, I understand that people that don’t follow the Wolves think Terrence Shannon Jr is a key prospect, because he had a couple moments in the playoffs, and one good regular season game against the Lakers. However, when injuries opened up guard minutes during the regular season, it was Jaylen Clark that got the bulk of them. Shannon was older after multiple years at the U of Illinois, but Clark is the defender that doesn’t make a lot of mistakes that Finch played. Both have had some immediate impact when they got minutes, so both were being developed without game time minutes.

[schnakenpopanz]

I know it might sound crazy to sme, but what if the Wolves decide to sell high, I mean very high on Edwards and Gobert? I think they could get a real big package, though it might not happen just to think about what would be possible is a good food for thought

Think about the haul the Spurs could get if they sold Wemby. All I hope for all of you on this board is to find someone who loves you as much as this place loves rebuilding.

Best line I’ve read this year. Bravo.

Rebuilding is fun, because you can sound crative. We aren't paid the big bucks to do so.

[ShootersShoot]

I won’t pretend to have watched Minnesota much outside the playoffs this year but from what I did see, they don’t strike me as a very high IQ team. I’m not sure if it’s the players, coaching, or just inexperience but that’s where the gains need to come IMO.

One of the things I would sort of blame Ant for. They get very relaxed/careless with the ball at times. One of those things I feel like the main ballhandler/leader has to set the tone with. Preach ball security. The Thunder do have a way of turning routine passes into highly difficult ones, and they made Denver look careless as well, to be fair.

Conley is supposed to be the high iq vet but unfortunately he is beyond cooked.

[shrink]

Difference is the Wolves have a great gm to be able to find talent in the late 1st and 2nd rounds. Also in Minnesota has shown an ability to make deals to get extra picks. Wolves still have a 1st round pick every other season.

That’s an excellent point, and I would love to see what kind of late picks Connelly could get for Shannon.

[shrink]

I won’t pretend to have watched Minnesota much outside the playoffs this year but from what I did see, they don’t strike me as a very high IQ team. I’m not sure if it’s the players, coaching, or just inexperience but that’s where the gains need to come IMO.

One of the things I would sort of blame Ant for. They get very relaxed/careless with the ball at times. One of those things I feel like the main ballhandler/leader has to set the tone with. Preach ball security. The Thunder do have a way of turning routine passes into highly difficult ones, and they made Denver look careless as well, to be fair.

Conley is supposed to be the high iq vet but unfortunately he is beyond cooked.

Conley is still smart, but he is becoming limited physically defensively, and some teams seek him out.

Here’s a few things the general public doesn’t know about Mike Conley.

1. He’s unlikely to be traded. My source in the Wolves front office said that when Mike negotiated for a contract last year (after being a critical upgrade over DLo), he took less to get a handshake guarantee that Connelly wouldn’t trade him without his approval. Mike and his family love the Twin Cities, and he doesn’t want to have to move again. He has said he wants to play two more years.

2. Mike was a big part of a Wolves team that shot 3-pointers well. Mike finished at 41%.

3. Back when Mike was in Utah, he said it took him a year to maximize Gobert on the pick and roll. Mike had plenty of experience running PnR with Gasols, but he said Rudy’s 7-1 frame and long limbs changes the equation radically. Mike says Finch would like to run actions off their pick-and-roll all day. However, Mike is getting older, and he needs to teach these unique skills to Ant. Ant is a willing pupil, but he has yet to focus on utilizing Gobert and his massive screens - a leap that could make room for Ant to get to the rim.

4. Mike is a good guy, respected on the team and everywhere he goes. The ex-team leader may be destined to become a back up PG as he ages, but the four time Sportsmanship Award winner is a valuable voice and role model for the young team.

[Mamba81p]

Think about the haul the Spurs could get if they sold Wemby. All I hope for all of you on this board is to find someone who loves you as much as this place loves rebuilding.

Best line I’ve read this year. Bravo.

Rebuilding is fun, because you can sound crative. We aren't paid the big bucks to do so.

I don think there is anything creative in trading your best players for a lot of picks/prospects. Maybe in 2010 before that nets/celtics trade when trading 5-6 picks for a players wasn’t a thing.

[ShootersShoot]

One of the things I would sort of blame Ant for. They get very relaxed/careless with the ball at times. One of those things I feel like the main ballhandler/leader has to set the tone with. Preach ball security. The Thunder do have a way of turning routine passes into highly difficult ones, and they made Denver look careless as well, to be fair.

Conley is supposed to be the high iq vet but unfortunately he is beyond cooked.

Conley is still smart, but he is becoming limited physically defensively, and some teams seek him out.

Here’s a few things the general public doesn’t know about Mike Conley.

1. He’s unlikely to be traded. My source in the Wolves front office said that when Mike negotiated for a contract last year (after being a critical upgrade over DLo), he took less to get a handshake guarantee that Connelly wouldn’t trade him without his approval. Mike and his family love the Twin Cities, and he doesn’t want to have to move again. He has said he wants to play two more years.

2. Mike was a big part of a Wolves team that shot 3-pointers well. Mike finished at 41%.

3. Back when Mike was in Utah, he said it took him a year to maximize Gobert on the pick and roll. Mike had plenty of experience running PnR with Gasols, but he said Rudy’s 7-1 frame and long limbs changes the equation radically. Mike says Finch would like to run actions off their pick-and-roll all day. However, Mike is getting older, and he needs to teach these unique skills to Ant. Ant is a willing pupil, but he has yet to focus on utilizing Gobert and his massive screens - a leap that could make room for Ant to get to the rim.

4. Mike is a good guy, respected on the team and everywhere he goes. The ex-team leader may be destined to become a back up PG as he ages, but the four time Sportsmanship Award winner is a valuable voice and role model for the young team.

I dont doubt he is well loved and respected plus still valuable in the locker room and such. In terms of helping the team on the court to stabilize them, hes not that guy anymore. If he was in his prime, guys wouldnt be making as many bone headed type moves because they would have a very good pg to help with playmaking. Mike shouldnt be the starter next season as much as I like the guy.

[Mamba81p]

There are some reports that reid will opt out and explore free agency. I don think Brooklyn will go after him but Detroit can and they are probably the only team that can offer him more than full MLE. That would be bad news for wolves. Depending how much cap space Detroit will create I think they can offer him more than 20m, even 25 if they renounce everyone. At that range wolves might have to choose between him and Randle.
With Ivey back , I think they can renounce Schroeder but I don’t what their plans are for Beasley and thj

[Godymas]

Imo there are two ways the Wolves can go this off season

1. Sign and trade Julius Randle in a deal to acquire Kevin Durant. This happens because KD asks to be traded to Minny. If this happens I don’t see any major roster shake-up anywhere else

2. Trade Gobert and retain Randle. Gobert’s defense isn’t outweighed by his complete unplayability on offense. His defensive impact in the playoffs goes from elite to good at best. He’s also up there in years. I’d look to acquire maybe Jarrett Allen, DeAndre Ayton, or Bam Adebayo in exchange. All 3 should be reasonably available this off season.

They cannot run it back though. They need an upgrade to beat OKC

[nikster]

Imo there are two ways the Wolves can go this off season

1. Sign and trade Julius Randle in a deal to acquire Kevin Durant. This happens because KD asks to be traded to Minny. If this happens I don’t see any major roster shake-up anywhere else

2. Trade Gobert and retain Randle. Gobert’s defense isn’t outweighed by his complete unplayability on offense. His defensive impact in the playoffs goes from elite to good at best. He’s also up there in years. I’d look to acquire maybe Jarrett Allen, DeAndre Ayton, or Bam Adebayo in exchange. All 3 should be reasonably available this off season.

They cannot run it back though. They need an upgrade to beat OKC

Yeah that hasn't at all been true at all this year. They had a defensive rating for 106 him on the floor, would be best in the playoffs, and 119 with him off which would be one of the worst. Absolutely massive difference.

[Mamba81p]

Imo there are two ways the Wolves can go this off season

1. Sign and trade Julius Randle in a deal to acquire Kevin Durant. This happens because KD asks to be traded to Minny. If this happens I don’t see any major roster shake-up anywhere else

2. Trade Gobert and retain Randle. Gobert’s defense isn’t outweighed by his complete unplayability on offense. His defensive impact in the playoffs goes from elite to good at best. He’s also up there in years. I’d look to acquire maybe Jarrett Allen, DeAndre Ayton, or Bam Adebayo in exchange. All 3 should be reasonably available this off season.

They cannot run it back though. They need an upgrade to beat OKC

They can’t sign and trade Randle for KD, not directly anyway. After that trade suns need to stop being an apron team, and then getting Randle back pretty much guarantees they are still an apron team.
Because wolves are a second apron team, they cannot get more salaries in return, and they cannot combine salaries
I would say this trade is pretty much impossible even if you find willing 3rd teams

[thinktank]

Imo there are two ways the Wolves can go this off season

1. Sign and trade Julius Randle in a deal to acquire Kevin Durant. This happens because KD asks to be traded to Minny. If this happens I don’t see any major roster shake-up anywhere else

2. Trade Gobert and retain Randle. Gobert’s defense isn’t outweighed by his complete unplayability on offense. His defensive impact in the playoffs goes from elite to good at best. He’s also up there in years. I’d look to acquire maybe Jarrett Allen, DeAndre Ayton, or Bam Adebayo in exchange. All 3 should be reasonably available this off season.

They cannot run it back though. They need an upgrade to beat OKC

They can’t sign and trade Randle for KD, not directly anyway. After that trade suns need to stop being an apron team, and then getting Randle back pretty much guarantees they are still an apron team.
Because wolves are a second apron team, they cannot get more salaries in return, and they cannot combine salaries
I would say this trade is pretty much impossible even if you find willing 3rd teams

That’s not what I’ve heard.

[Mamba81p]

Imo there are two ways the Wolves can go this off season

1. Sign and trade Julius Randle in a deal to acquire Kevin Durant. This happens because KD asks to be traded to Minny. If this happens I don’t see any major roster shake-up anywhere else

2. Trade Gobert and retain Randle. Gobert’s defense isn’t outweighed by his complete unplayability on offense. His defensive impact in the playoffs goes from elite to good at best. He’s also up there in years. I’d look to acquire maybe Jarrett Allen, DeAndre Ayton, or Bam Adebayo in exchange. All 3 should be reasonably available this off season.

They cannot run it back though. They need an upgrade to beat OKC

They can’t sign and trade Randle for KD, not directly anyway. After that trade suns need to stop being an apron team, and then getting Randle back pretty much guarantees they are still an apron team.
Because wolves are a second apron team, they cannot get more salaries in return, and they cannot combine salaries
I would say this trade is pretty much impossible even if you find willing 3rd teams

That’s not what I’ve heard.

Which part?

[thinktank]

They can’t sign and trade Randle for KD, not directly anyway. After that trade suns need to stop being an apron team, and then getting Randle back pretty much guarantees they are still an apron team.
Because wolves are a second apron team, they cannot get more salaries in return, and they cannot combine salaries
I would say this trade is pretty much impossible even if you find willing 3rd teams

That’s not what I’ve heard.

Which part?

"The point is, this wasn't just like 'well, we're not doing anything on trade deadline day.' They made some sort of progress," Windhorst continued on a potential Durant-to-Minnesota trade. "Getting it done was impossible because they are two second apron teams. But after both of [Randle and Naz Reid] opt out, the Wolves will not be a second apron team."

https://www.si.com/nba/brian-windhorst-makes-major-reveal-timberwolves-kevin-durant-trade-aspirations

Better get your facts straight before you opine on a Durant to Wolves trade!

My guess is it happens.

[Mamba81p]

That’s not what I’ve heard.

Which part?

"The point is, this wasn't just like 'well, we're not doing anything on trade deadline day.' They made some sort of progress," Windhorst continued on a potential Durant-to-Minnesota trade. "Getting it done was impossible because they are two second apron teams. But after both of [Randle and Naz Reid] opt out, the Wolves will not be a second apron team."

https://www.si.com/nba/brian-windhorst-makes-major-reveal-timberwolves-kevin-durant-trade-aspirations

Better get your facts straight before you opine on a Durant to Wolves trade!

My guess is it happens.

You better learn to read. KD to wolves is possible, just not for a Randle sign and trade
Randle can be easily part of the trade if he opts in and if he wants to he can sign an extension with the suns but that is not a sign and trade.

[thinktank]

Which part?

"The point is, this wasn't just like 'well, we're not doing anything on trade deadline day.' They made some sort of progress," Windhorst continued on a potential Durant-to-Minnesota trade. "Getting it done was impossible because they are two second apron teams. But after both of [Randle and Naz Reid] opt out, the Wolves will not be a second apron team."

https://www.si.com/nba/brian-windhorst-makes-major-reveal-timberwolves-kevin-durant-trade-aspirations

Better get your facts straight before you opine on a Durant to Wolves trade!

My guess is it happens.

You better learn to read. KD to wolves is possible, just not for a Randle sign and trade

False. YOU better learn to read. Randle and Naz opting out means Wolves aren’t a second apron team and can sign and trade Randle to Suns for Durant, and they can combine salaries too. Connelly knew this during the season and knew that Durant trade option would be easier to execute in the offseason.

Thanks for exposing your ignorance and over-confidence here. Truly. Windhorst and I are right and you are simply wrong.

[Mamba81p]

"The point is, this wasn't just like 'well, we're not doing anything on trade deadline day.' They made some sort of progress," Windhorst continued on a potential Durant-to-Minnesota trade. "Getting it done was impossible because they are two second apron teams. But after both of [Randle and Naz Reid] opt out, the Wolves will not be a second apron team."

https://www.si.com/nba/brian-windhorst-makes-major-reveal-timberwolves-kevin-durant-trade-aspirations

Better get your facts straight before you opine on a Durant to Wolves trade!

My guess is it happens.

You better learn to read. KD to wolves is possible, just not for a Randle sign and trade

False. YOU better learn to read. Randle and Naz opting out means Wolves aren’t a second apron team and can sign and trade Randle to Suns for Durant, and they can combine salaries too. Connelly knew this during the season and knew that Durant trade option would be easier to execute in the offseason.

Thanks for exposing your ignorance and over-confidence here. Truly. Windhorst and I are right and you are simply wrong.

Suns cannot accept players in a sign and trade while they are still a 1st apron team, regardless whether wolves stop being a second apron team.

Windy is right , you are wrong. He doesn’t say Randle will be signed and traded to the suns.

[Ugly0598]

I’m not sure if they can make many changes this off-season. Minnesota is a fun team to watch against Denver. Conley & DiVincenzo might be able to be traded.

You would think they hold on to Gobert, Randle, McDaniels, Edwards, & Reid.

People want to trade Julius Randle, but who realistically can you get? Kevin Durant isn’t as good anymore like people think he is IMO.