Trade Talk (Part 17): Early Offseason Planning

[Guest84]

I have a couple questions about Fox.

1. Fox is best when he is using his immense speed in the open court. That’s something we want Ant to do as well, but will he start to run if Fox is running? I could see that encouraging someone like Jaden McDaniels, and we know Finch has wanted to play faster for a long time.

2. Contract. Fox is a $37 mil expiring. Does he want to stay in MIN? We moved Towns for financial freedom - does replacing that salary spot with the lesser Fox still work?

3. Uniqueness. Fox may be a top 50 NBA player, but only a top 15 NBA point guard. The point guard position is loaded with talent right now, and more on the way - the Spurs may have three potential stars at the position. With fewer buyers, and more sellers, economics should mean we shouldn’t pay a ton to get him.

Another way to look at position scarcity .. is Randle a more highly rated PF than Fox is a PG? What percent of nights would the Wolves have an advantage over the other team at each of those positions?

1. If Ant can play the finisher on the break, I think he would run more. Especially if Finch and the team stress it going into next year. Does anyone know how often Ant scored in transition while Rubio, DLo, etc were here before Conley?

2. Can you expand on the bolded part? Is Fox really a lesser player than Towns (not sure if that's what you meant) or is it just more competitive at the guard position? There's a lot of "legacy" guards that ppl wouldn't allow Fox to jump even if he had stats/success to back it.

3. What pg would be ranked ahead of Fox in your opinion? Or even according to the stats/other metrics? His play style seems similar to Shai in that he can get to his spots fairly easy in the midrange, score in bunches, and has at one time been the best clutch player in the league. He's only 27 and could/should replicate those past performances.

I think it's a long shot to get/keep him but I do have that interest when you're talking about guard play.

1. Maybe. He has always been impressionable. But he doesn’t start breaks now, or run with breaks that others start.

2. I meant lesser in salary, and lesser in NBA player value. He certainly won’t get a supermax, but KAT’s size and skill make him less easy to replace than one of the many guards in the league. In addition, PG value is waning, as more and more teams put playmaking responsibilities in the hands of other positions.

3. Making me work here! Playmaking guards that I think are better than, or equal to Fox

SGA, Luka, Haliburton, Brunson, Curry, Lillard (out), Case, Garland, Kyrie (out), Herro these days, Maxey, Ja, LaMelo, Trae Young, Jamal Murray, Derek White, Jrue? .. that’s 15 active, so half the league has an “equal or sometimes vastly superior” matchup to Fox. And that’s not including players that are better at his function, like a Jokic.

1. I think he's trying to conserve energy due to being so ball dominant right now (more required than choice due to lack of ballhandlers)

2. Appreciate the clarification. Although, the responsibilities thing does depend a lot on roster construction. If you have capable players, then definitely better to spread it around. Wolves...not so much right now.

3. When you include playmaking guards, then the list def opens up. Do you include affect on winning or a combination of that plus their skill level, stats, play style? Does availability play a factor in that?

I could def see his cost playing the biggest factor in trying to obtain him though.

[Wolves21]

I've seen this this thrown around a little bit but maybe to solve our PG issue we don't break the back but go in a 2nd tier route and go after Derrick White. Think the cost to get him would be a lot less then Fox,Garland,Young,Morant and others throw about. While he'll be 31 next season would be a great veteran in his prime that is one of the better defenders in the league and someone that can create offense.

I think the Celtics could be inclined to move him to cut cost with there new owners and the fact that Tatum will likely be out for the full season, so taken a step back this season and getting payroll in order and taken a step forward in '26 once he returns.

I was think a trade of White for Divincenzo,Conley,Garza,Miller and if need be 31st this year.This would be basically giving up Dante & Conley for White which I think would be well worth it. As far as the Celtics go Dante is a great 6th or 7th man and given them a much cheaper option as a ball handler over White and could then slide Pirchard into the starting rotation if they think he's ready,while cutting salary as well long term as Conley,Garza and Miller are all on one year deals and again if need be the 31st pick gives them a young asset to add or trade moving forward.

[Guest84]

I've seen this this thrown around a little bit but maybe to solve our PG issue we don't break the back but go in a 2nd tier route and go after Derrick White. Think the cost to get him would be a lot less then Fox,Garland,Young,Morant and others throw about. While he'll be 31 next season would be a great veteran in his prime that is one of the better defenders in the league and someone that can create offense.

I think the Celtics could be inclined to move him to cut cost with there new owners and the fact that Tatum will likely be out for the full season, so taken a step back this season and getting payroll in order and taken a step forward in '26 once he returns.

I was think a trade of White for Divincenzo,Conley,Garza,Miller and if need be 31st this year.This would be basically giving up Dante & Conley for White which I think would be well worth it. As far as the Celtics go Dante is a great 6th or 7th man and given them a much cheaper option as a ball handler over White and could then slide Pirchard into the starting rotation if they think he's ready,while cutting salary as well long term as Conley,Garza and Miller are all on one year deals and again if need be the 31st pick gives them a young asset to add or trade moving forward.

I mentioned White in a previous post. Idk he was 30 though. I think he'd be a solid addition but how much of his play is based on his actual skill/growth vs being in Bos system w/ JB,, Tatum, etc? A lot of guys to take the pressure off of him.

I'd still prefer someone a bit younger that can grow long-term w/ Ant. It doesn't have to be the top guys previously named though.

[BlacJacMac]

I've seen this this thrown around a little bit but maybe to solve our PG issue we don't break the back but go in a 2nd tier route and go after Derrick White. Think the cost to get him would be a lot less then Fox,Garland,Young,Morant and others throw about. While he'll be 31 next season would be a great veteran in his prime that is one of the better defenders in the league and someone that can create offense.

I think the Celtics could be inclined to move him to cut cost with there new owners and the fact that Tatum will likely be out for the full season, so taken a step back this season and getting payroll in order and taken a step forward in '26 once he returns.

I was think a trade of White for Divincenzo,Conley,Garza,Miller and if need be 31st this year.This would be basically giving up Dante & Conley for White which I think would be well worth it. As far as the Celtics go Dante is a great 6th or 7th man and given them a much cheaper option as a ball handler over White and could then slide Pirchard into the starting rotation if they think he's ready,while cutting salary as well long term as Conley,Garza and Miller are all on one year deals and again if need be the 31st pick gives them a young asset to add or trade moving forward.

I'd love to add White, but I think he fetches way more than DDV and #31 if they decide to move on from him - which I don't think they will.

My guess is they look to move Jrue and Porzingis.

[shrink]

I was reading the general fans assessment of the Wolves season on the General Board, and they see Terrence Shannon Jr (Connelly drafted #27) as a key prospect for MIN’s future. Yes, he had some key moments in a couple playoff games, and one regular season game against the Lakers, but do you think actual GMs feel he has value? He has a man’s body and can bruise people on his way to the rim, but he played four years of college ball, and will turn 25 at the end of June.

If Connelly asked for offers, could he get a late 1st back (even future 1st) and a 2nd or two, or no 1st and an armful of seconds, now or in the future? It feels like since he is good at finding talent in the draft, trading rookies for more picks later could be an engine to increase team assets?

And the simultaneous engine could be to trade current players to get those picks, and open up minutes for the youth. It’s dangerous for a win now team, but both methods can generate draft capital for Connelly to profit with.

[Slim Tubby]

I've seen this this thrown around a little bit but maybe to solve our PG issue we don't break the back but go in a 2nd tier route and go after Derrick White. Think the cost to get him would be a lot less then Fox,Garland,Young,Morant and others throw about. While he'll be 31 next season would be a great veteran in his prime that is one of the better defenders in the league and someone that can create offense.

I think the Celtics could be inclined to move him to cut cost with there new owners and the fact that Tatum will likely be out for the full season, so taken a step back this season and getting payroll in order and taken a step forward in '26 once he returns.

I was think a trade of White for Divincenzo,Conley,Garza,Miller and if need be 31st this year.This would be basically giving up Dante & Conley for White which I think would be well worth it. As far as the Celtics go Dante is a great 6th or 7th man and given them a much cheaper option as a ball handler over White and could then slide Pirchard into the starting rotation if they think he's ready,while cutting salary as well long term as Conley,Garza and Miller are all on one year deals and again if need be the 31st pick gives them a young asset to add or trade moving forward.

White is a terrific target but his value is far greater than what you proposed. Holiday is much more likely to get moved and with his recent regression, I want nothing to do with that contract.

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[shrink]

Would you trade?

MIN GETS: Walker Kessler, worst of (CLE, UTA, MIN) 2026 1st
UTA GETS: #17, Leonard Miller, Josh Minott

Kessler could learn from Gobert and eventually replace him. MIN would have 48 minutes of excellent center defense that Naz and Randle need. Kessler only has one more cheap year, then needs to be extended as an RFA for decent money, and he may be frustrated by a bench roll as an apprenticeship. However, he is already a solid defender, and learning from Gobert would really help his career. This trade might also encourage Ant to put time in with Mike to learn the nuances of the pick-and-roll.

[Norseman79]

Would you trade?

MIN GETS: Walker Kessler, worst of (CLE, UTA, MIN) 2026 1st
UTA GETS: #17, Leonard Miller, Josh Minott

Kessler could learn from Gobert and eventually replace him. MIN would have 48 minutes of excellent center defense that Naz and Randle need. Kessler only has one more cheap year, then needs to be extended as an RFA for decent money, and he may be frustrated by a bench roll as an apprenticeship. However, he is already a solid defender, and learning from Gobert would really help his career. This trade might also encourage Ant to put time in with Mike to learn the nuances of the pick-and-roll.

Like the idea, not the draft pick. Also feel like Kalkbrenner can give you what Kessler does already maybe more

[shrink]

Would you trade?

MIN GETS: Walker Kessler, worst of (CLE, UTA, MIN) 2026 1st
UTA GETS: #17, Leonard Miller, Josh Minott

Like the idea, not the draft pick. Also feel like Kalkbrenner can give you what Kessler does already maybe more

And starting rookie scale, versus coming off of it.

Don’t think we can get Kessler without the #17. Other teams would pay more, and use him as a young starter.

[Norseman79]

Would you trade?

MIN GETS: Walker Kessler, worst of (CLE, UTA, MIN) 2026 1st
UTA GETS: #17, Leonard Miller, Josh Minott

Like the idea, not the draft pick. Also feel like Kalkbrenner can give you what Kessler does already maybe more

And starting rookie scale, versus coming off of it.

Don’t think we can get Kessler without the #17. Other teams would pay more, and use him as a young starter.

If they do then someone else drops. We can always make the trade for Kessler after the draft.

[Norseman79]

I am all about getting a young big (Newell, Esingue, Maluach) @ 17 or even moving up some

[jpatrick]

Like the idea, not the draft pick. Also feel like Kalkbrenner can give you what Kessler does already maybe more

And starting rookie scale, versus coming off of it.

Don’t think we can get Kessler without the #17. Other teams would pay more, and use him as a young starter.

If they do then someone else drops. We can always make the trade for Kessler after the draft.

I only make this trade if it is the precursor to Rudy being moved. I’m not trading for Kessler to sit. And I’m doing everything I could to include 31 instead of 17, which I realize would not be enough.

[Domejandro]

Would you trade?

MIN GETS: Walker Kessler, worst of (CLE, UTA, MIN) 2026 1st
UTA GETS: #17, Leonard Miller, Josh Minott

Kessler could learn from Gobert and eventually replace him. MIN would have 48 minutes of excellent center defense that Naz and Randle need. Kessler only has one more cheap year, then needs to be extended as an RFA for decent money, and he may be frustrated by a bench roll as an apprenticeship. However, he is already a solid defender, and learning from Gobert would really help his career. This trade might also encourage Ant to put time in with Mike to learn the nuances of the pick-and-roll.

If Minnesota is forced to trade Rudy Gobert in a Kevin Durant deal, I think that this would be an ideal follow-up.

That said, I think that Utah would balk at the 2026 First Round Draft Pick being included, that would likely have to be removed.

[shrink]

That said, I think that Utah would balk at the 2026 First Round Draft Pick being included, that would likely have to be removed.

You might be right on value, but a smart Jazz poster was offering this package for #13.

One of the advantages to doing more deals with UTA is that we have fungible picks already traded between us. If a KD trade required whoever we draft at #17, we could add more value by removing some or all of the top 5 protections they already own on the 2029 pick we owe them. This might appeal to Danny Ainge’s style, who recently traded several “worst of multiple picks” to get one with the chance for higher upside.

[moss_is_1]

I am all about getting a young big (Newell, Esingue, Maluach) @ 17 or even moving up some

I don't think any rookie we pick at 17 has a chance to start and replace Rudy if he's gone. We could do this to get a starting level center in Kessler in that case. I actually like trying to get a big at 31, Kalkbrenner, Yang, Berringer, Raynaud, etc all could potentially be there.

[Norseman79]

I am all about getting a young big (Newell, Esingue, Maluach) @ 17 or even moving up some

I don't think any rookie we pick at 17 has a chance to start and replace Rudy if he's gone. We could do this to get a starting level center in Kessler in that case. I actually like trying to get a big at 31, Kalkbrenner, Yang, Berringer, Raynaud, etc all could potentially be there.

Newell and Esingue (spelling?) are PFs, Maluach is a c and I would let him learn behind Rudy for a year.

[TimberKat]

Do we own some type of bird rights to Randle and Naz? Like sign them to over the cap? As an example, I am wondering if we have to trade Gobert to get KD, after that, sign Randle and Naz.

[moss_is_1]

I am all about getting a young big (Newell, Esingue, Maluach) @ 17 or even moving up some

I don't think any rookie we pick at 17 has a chance to start and replace Rudy if he's gone. We could do this to get a starting level center in Kessler in that case. I actually like trying to get a big at 31, Kalkbrenner, Yang, Berringer, Raynaud, etc all could potentially be there.

Newell and Esingue (spelling?) are PFs, Maluach is a c and I would let him learn behind Rudy for a year.

Oh I understand that, I just don't think we'll be in a position to be able to grab Maluach or Sorber or any other center at 17 they are likely gone. and if we have Reid/Randle still then Newell and Esingue seem moot. I think Esingue will be gone by then as well.

[moss_is_1]

Do we own some type of bird rights to Randle and Naz? Like sign them to over the cap? As an example, I am wondering if we have to trade Gobert to get KD, after that, sign Randle and Naz.

Yes we have bird rights to both of them if they were to opt out.

Trading Rudy for KD would still leave us roughly $19m short of matching KD's salary. We are about 12.8m under that 2nd apron so any deal for KD will take some finesse. Do we trade Rudy+, do we trade both Naz and Randle?


Now heres a name I wanna float out unrelated. What if we could trade for PJ Washington to replace Naz? PJ is a great offball player and a much better and more versatile defender than Naz. Just doesn't have as much size or shot-creation ability as Naz. Might be cheaper as well.

[Norseman79]

I don't think any rookie we pick at 17 has a chance to start and replace Rudy if he's gone. We could do this to get a starting level center in Kessler in that case. I actually like trying to get a big at 31, Kalkbrenner, Yang, Berringer, Raynaud, etc all could potentially be there.

Newell and Esingue (spelling?) are PFs, Maluach is a c and I would let him learn behind Rudy for a year.

Oh I understand that, I just don't think we'll be in a position to be able to grab Maluach or Sorber or any other center at 17 they are likely gone. and if we have Reid/Randle still then Newell and Esingue seem moot. I think Esingue will be gone by then as well.

If we have Reid/Randle still it's a failure by T.C.