Is Siakam a top 20 player?

[Raps in 4]

Yes and has been for the past 5 years.

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

1.5 years ago, I was told that Jonathan Kuminga and Keegan Murray were better players, and now hes a top 20 player.

No one has ever been high on Kuminga, periodt. Lies.

https://www.nbcsports.com/nba/news/warriors-reportedly-dont-want-to-trade-kuminga-for-siakam-or-anyone-torontos-options-limited

The Golden State Warriors are rumored to be interested in acquiring former All-NBA forward Pascal Siakam via trade. The Toronto Raptors veteran is in the final year of his deal and will become an unrestricted free agent in the summer. The Raptors are expected to part ways with Siakam following their recent decision to send OG Anunoby to the New York Knicks.

According to multiple sources, the Warriors are loathe to trade Kuminga, who is seen as a potential star who can help them win now and in the future, the rare piece on the roster who can help Golden State both support Steph Curry in the present and transition to a successful post-Curry future, should it ever come,” Grange reported.

Ok.

The Pacers would be interested in trading Johnny Furphy for Wemby.

That isn’t the same as saying Furphy is better than Wemby.

[dolphinatik]

He was top 20 when he was on the rise but I wouldn't consider him top 20. Could he do the heavy lifting? Probably.

[Raps in 4]

1.5 years ago, I was told that Jonathan Kuminga and Keegan Murray were better players, and now hes a top 20 player.

No one has ever been high on Kuminga, periodt. Lies.

Warriors fans were. Almost none of them wanted to trade Wiseman, Moody, and Kuminga for Siakam a few years ago. Not even after they wasted the picks on those busts.

[Childs]

No one has ever been high on Kuminga, periodt. Lies.

https://www.nbcsports.com/nba/news/warriors-reportedly-dont-want-to-trade-kuminga-for-siakam-or-anyone-torontos-options-limited

The Golden State Warriors are rumored to be interested in acquiring former All-NBA forward Pascal Siakam via trade. The Toronto Raptors veteran is in the final year of his deal and will become an unrestricted free agent in the summer. The Raptors are expected to part ways with Siakam following their recent decision to send OG Anunoby to the New York Knicks.

According to multiple sources, the Warriors are loathe to trade Kuminga, who is seen as a potential star who can help them win now and in the future, the rare piece on the roster who can help Golden State both support Steph Curry in the present and transition to a successful post-Curry future, should it ever come,” Grange reported.

Ok.

The Pacers would be interested in trading Johnny Furphy for Wemby.

That isn’t the same as saying Furphy is better than Wemby.

Look, all I know is that 1.5 years ago a 29 year Pascal Siakam wasn't worth Keegan Murray or Jonathan Kuminga. A guy at their age, had a 30 pt game in the Finals against Draymond Green, A DPOY, and 26 pts in game 6 in the Finals, and was probably the 2nd best player on a championship team. it tells me that people know jack all.

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2257915&hilit=siakam+overrated

2 years ago, he is touted as an empty stat guy, by some poster, on this general board.

And now there's a post about Siakam being a top 20 player in the league.

[witnessraps]

Yes and Jalen Williams probably on his way too, being a top 2 player on a finals team is no joke

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

https://www.nbcsports.com/nba/news/warriors-reportedly-dont-want-to-trade-kuminga-for-siakam-or-anyone-torontos-options-limited



Ok.

The Pacers would be interested in trading Johnny Furphy for Wemby.

That isn’t the same as saying Furphy is better than Wemby.

Look, all I know is that 1.5 years ago a 29 year Pascal Siakam wasn't worth Keegan Murray or Jonathan Kuminga. A guy at their age, had a 30 pt game in the Finals against Draymond Green, A DPOY, and 26 pts in game 6 in the Finals, and was probably the 2nd best player on a championship team. it tells me that people know jack all.

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2257915&hilit=siakam+overrated

2 years ago, he is touted as an empty stat guy, by some poster, on this general board.

And now there's a post about Siakam being a top 20 player in the league.

I still can’t figure out where you’re getting “he wasn’t worth Kuninga” though.

The article clearly states the Warriors are interested in trading Kuminga for him….but the trade didn’t happen, which to me, indicates he was worth more than Kuminga.

[Johnny Bball]

a) He sure is right now.

b) Few would say so.

Siakam wins conference finals MVP, and poster lists 22 guys, most of which are golfing, as better right now. You think you are going to get non-baised answers!!

That's a joke.

[Childs]

The Pacers would be interested in trading Johnny Furphy for Wemby.

That isn’t the same as saying Furphy is better than Wemby.

Look, all I know is that 1.5 years ago a 29 year Pascal Siakam wasn't worth Keegan Murray or Jonathan Kuminga. A guy at their age, had a 30 pt game in the Finals against Draymond Green, A DPOY, and 26 pts in game 6 in the Finals, and was probably the 2nd best player on a championship team. it tells me that people know jack all.

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2257915&hilit=siakam+overrated

2 years ago, he is touted as an empty stat guy, by some poster, on this general board.

And now there's a post about Siakam being a top 20 player in the league.

I still can’t figure out where you’re getting “he wasn’t worth Kuninga” though.

The article clearly states the Warriors are interested in trading Kuminga for him….but the trade didn’t happen, which to me, indicates he was worth more than Kuminga.

[url]However, the Raptors would want Jonathan Kuminga in any trade (Chris Paul is a given as salary ballast) and, despite recent frustrations, the Warriors have no plans to deal Kuminga to Toronto or anywhere else[/url]

the Warriors are loathe to trade Kuminga

Where did you get that from? It means the Warriors didn't think Siakam was worth a trade for Jonathan Kuminga

[xxSnEaKyPxx]

Look, all I know is that 1.5 years ago a 29 year Pascal Siakam wasn't worth Keegan Murray or Jonathan Kuminga. A guy at their age, had a 30 pt game in the Finals against Draymond Green, A DPOY, and 26 pts in game 6 in the Finals, and was probably the 2nd best player on a championship team. it tells me that people know jack all.

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2257915&hilit=siakam+overrated

2 years ago, he is touted as an empty stat guy, by some poster, on this general board.

And now there's a post about Siakam being a top 20 player in the league.

I still can’t figure out where you’re getting “he wasn’t worth Kuninga” though.

The article clearly states the Warriors are interested in trading Kuminga for him….but the trade didn’t happen, which to me, indicates he was worth more than Kuminga.

[url]However, the Raptors would want Jonathan Kuminga in any trade (Chris Paul is a given as salary ballast) and, despite recent frustrations, the Warriors have no plans to deal Kuminga to Toronto or anywhere else[/url]

the Warriors are loathe to trade Kuminga

Where did you get that from? It means the Warriors didn't think Siakam was worth a trade for Jonathan Kuminga

Ah my bad, I read they loathe as in “they hate the idea, but would do it for Siakam.” If they reached out to Toronto, I’m not sure what they’d be offering if they weren’t willing to trade anyone better than Kuminga.

[Godymas]

borderline

So if we look at the All NBA team. Everyone on 1st and 2nd team is 100% better than Siakam. On the third team I would not call Jalen Williams better than Siakam, but I would call everyone else better except KAT who you could put on a similar level to Siakam, they have different strengths and weaknesses ofc.

However, there are guys that were injured this year that 100% would be put above Siakam today that are not on the All NBA team. So, Anthony Davis, Kyrie Irving, Luka Doncic, Joel Embiid, in a vacuum all these guys are better than Siakam. Wembanyama, 100% better than Siakam. So now we have about 20 names on the list, but at this point I think the names became less impressive and more in the "room to prove" area. Like is Zion Williamson better than Siakam? Maybe, you could argue, a healthy Zion is a 27-8 guy on great efficiency, better than Siakam. Is Ja Morant better than Siakam? A healthy Ja can be a 25-9 guy on decent efficiency and can lead an offense to the top of the NBA, potentially. Is Siakam's former Batman, Kawhi Leonard, better today than Siakam, in a vacuum I'd say he still is. Is Trae Young better than Siakam, I think a lot of people would give the nod to Trae, despite the defense, just because the offense and true playmaking are harder to get. I would put Siakam on a similar level to an Alperen Sengun, a Domas Sabonis, great as your 2nd or 3rd best player, not the #1 option. That makes him top 30, imo, which seems about right.

[Doctor MJ]

At the start of next season: which players are you taking before Siakam in a fantasy draft? Since his Toronto days i always thought he is extremely versatile, underrated and undervalued by many fans. This playoff run has certainly confirmed my feelings.

So i am curious:

A) Is Siakam a top 20 player in the league?
B) Has he been a top 20 player the last 5 seasons?

Yes and generally yes, tho it’s not like I think those later Toronto seasons were a big success.

I think what we see generally is that offensively Pascal’s a #2 not a #1, so for him to shine, you need a legit alpha, which the Raptors didn’t have after Lowry aged out.

But his 2-way play is no small thing.

I’ll also say I see Pascal as the clear top career from the 2016 draft, and arguably better than any from the 2015 draft - I have him ahead of Towns, and so the debate is Booker.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Hoop Hunter]

He's solidly in my top 20, just like 34 other players.

That is SO funny and true.

So many good players in this league.

[ChumboChappati]

ANT
Luka
Bron
AD
Kawhi
Shai
Haliburton
KAT
Brunson
Giannis
Mitchell
Banchero
Butler
Franz
Jokic
Tatum
Brown
Curry
Cade
Wemby
Garland
Mobley

That's 22 right off the top of my head that I would take and I'm probably forgetting someone obvious. I wouldn't take him top 20 myself no.

I think in a single game situation it is debatable on Paolo, Franz, Garland, Mobley, Brown.

you are so delusional

Strike: Trolling

I got a strike for saying Siakam is not better than Paolo, Franz, Garland, Mobley, Brown?

[Chuck Everett]

Let's say Pascal isn't a top 20 player. Here's what I know: He can outplay your team's supposed top 20 player in any given game or situation come playoff time. He's also been a playoff riser in his career. Some of the names listed, that's not always the case. Franz Wagner in particular (who I am a fan of).

[othawhitemeat]

I think if you take intangibles, 2-way, toughness, etc.. I would take him over many. Below are my overblown thoughts

Tier 1 - Nikola, Shai, Giannis, Luka, Steph, Edwards, Victor - for sure superstars that can carry a team

Tier 1a - Tatum, Brunson, Lebron, Cade, Hali, Playoff Jimmy - can lead, but can't fully be the Batman.

Then you got the others that vie in the top 20 - J. Williams, Harden, Adebayo, Lillard (not the same since injured), Garland, Paolo, KAT, Jackson Jr., Morant, Jaylen Brown, Booker, Kawhi (only on this list as he can't stay healthy), Pascal, and a bevy of others. Literally, would take Pascal over all those during playoffs if he is the Robin. To me, if Pascal is off offensively, plays better d than most of these players, but it is the intangibles of being a winner. Would I take Pascal over KAT in a 1-to-1 game - generally no, but dude is way tougher and more consistent.

So in a vacuum, do I think Pascal individually is better than Paolo - no, but I do think in playoffs, he has shown more so far and shows up big time and time again.

So overall, I do think Pascal is in top 20 due to toughness, 2-way, and consistency, but truly speaking I think anyone after the top 13 are a bevy of could be top 20.

[Lalouie]

he makes a difference

[nate33]

16 guys are definitely above him:
Jokic
SGA
Giannis
Luka
Tatum
Wemby
Ant
Curry
Mitchell
Brunson
Haliburton
Cade
Mobley
Kawhi
Davis
Durant

I've got 13 who are arguably above him, and there may be a few more:
Booker
Banchero
Wagner
Sabonis
Chet
Butler
Jalen Williams
Harden
KAT
Bam
Jaylen Brown
Lebron
Jalen Johnson

So to be in the top 20, you would have to rank him ahead of almost everyone in that second group.

[flytimes11]

Yea I would say so, I also don't see how people think a 40 year old Lebron is better than Siakam?? He plays no defense and runs out of gas in the 4th. Siakam is heading to the NBA finals, how could anyone not consider him top 20?

[hugepatsfan]

I think he's good enough that you could rank him in top 20 and it be reasonable, but you honestly might be able to rank him as low as 40 and not be called crazy either. Top 20 is a nice, round number but in reality it's such a crazy arbitrary number in player rankings. There's not really an exact science for who's #20 vs. who's #40.

Outside of just player ranking, Id say his skill set at the PF position is VERY conducive to building a winning team. To be competent in team defense, individual shot creation and off ball shooting all from the PF spot is a pretty unique combo that enables a lot of different lineup possibilities the rest of the way. Usually you're sacrificing something at the PF spot that you have to make up for somewhere else, so not needing to make that up is big for team building.

Compare that to someone like KAT, for instance, who is probably a better individual player, but brings some lineup challenges. You play him at the 5 - weak defensively in the paint. You play him at the 4 - defense is still weak just on the perimeter now and the spacing gets compromised by needing a rim protecting 5 (usually they can't shoot) so now you can't play another non shooter. There's some team building challenges there.