Picks 33 and 34 Prospect Discussion

[Bassman]

I like Proctor, agree his projected range is lower than our picks. But if we do not trade our seconds to move into the first, and we use the 33rd pick to secure a quality big like Raynaud, I could be persuaded to consider Proctor next. He fits that “character and hard work” culture, while having some good skills to utilize at the 2 or the 1. But I’m also desiring another big man there, just to pile up strong cordwood to see who is worth keeping.

[EmpireFalls]

I think we should at all costs not be making both picks 33 AND 34. Either trade them both to move up, or trade out of one for a later pick.

It makes no sense to take multiple seconds in such a weak second round now. We could get a lot of value for pick 34.

[JMAC3]

I think we should at all costs not be making both picks 33 AND 34. Either trade them both to move up, or trade out of one for a later pick.

It makes no sense to take multiple seconds in such a weak second round now. We could get a lot of value for pick 34.

I mean the 2nd round is still pretty good in the early 30s even after players withdrew, it gets weak once you get past 40.

[Bassman]

I still want to trade up into round 1 for Rasheer Fleming. I see him as a quality PF off the bench even if he never sees starter minutes. So much better than Tiddy or any big slipping into the second round.

[JMAC3]

Two international guys that should be in our draft range.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[fatlever]

plow had penda in his top 12, i think. he was super high on him. would obv be great value at 33

[Diop]

yeah i was excited over Penda before but he seems destined for the first round. (he has that Diaw, Batum offense passivity though)

Bravor has warned us

[bravor]

I already said he should not be drafted here since his shooting efficiency (and ft shooting) still something to fix.

He had good play offs run (we were eliminated vy Monaco, EL finalist, in a 3 games serie), but he did not have godly performance.
He's still a strong swiss army knife with great court vision on both ends. Great pnr skills as well. Lack of touch is killing his efficiency but his motor (and his power)

I am also against drafting either Traore or Beringer. The first because he is probably not good enough (not saying he is bad, he has the tools to succeed here) for a team like Charlotte and the latter because it will take time to get ready (but his potential is huge).

Raynaud would be a nice option here though. Even though i have my doubts about his ability to remain on the court because of his lack of foot speed, we never had a big with so good fundamentals since Moiso i would think (and Weis). With a strong defensive forward(s), it could work
He's an immediate threat on pick n pop and his passing would help as well (as long as shooters dont brick their shots).

Another option as point forward is Mo Diawara. He would come cheap (he's nowhere in mock drafts) but i am high on him as 3D (he can shoot well from deep) and defensively he is really solid (and mobile). He can't put the ball on the floor though, his handle is really not good.
But this team needs quality players from the bench, hard to think he would not replace easily the impact of half of the current bench players

[JMAC3]

Have my big board built out really far now, here are a few fun names that I would look at for Summer League/2Way Contracts.

Kadary Richmond- defensive/playmaker point guard that can't shoot.
Ryan Nembhard- pass first point
Chucky Hepburn- defensive pg, that can't shoot.

Viktor Lakhin- Stretch 5
Vladislav Goldin- Rim Running 5
Clifford Omoruyi- Rim Running 5

Igor Milicic Jr- Athletic forward from Unc-Charlote/Tennessee
Jonathan Pierre- 3D prospect from Belmont
John Poulakidas - Knockdown shooting 4 man from Yale
Obinna Anochili Killen- Defensive Big from Marshall- similar to Jared Vanderbilt

Again, none of these guys probably get drafted but some fun names.

[JMAC3]

Kobe Sanders is a semi-interesting swing in the 2nd round, I do feel like his bust chances are relatively high.
6-8 guard/wing that weighs 203 lbs.
Averaged 16 pts, 4 reb, 4 assists on a bad Nevada team this year.
Gives some Cody Martin vibes as a master of none of type of prospect.

but he might be a Gordon Hayward type of playmaking wing that we have been missing since losing him.

[Rays Pompadour]

Wouldn't it be fun if the Hornets drafted Drake Powell and Tyrese Proctor back to back in the second round? Powell may go earlier and many believe Proctor should be drafted in the 40's, but I think practices would be just so juicy.

But I suspect Charlotte won't make either pick. I believe the NIL departures make the top five or so in the second round of this draft much more valuable than we'll see in the same tier the next few years. The drop-off in talent is significant after the first few picks in the second round, in my opinion.

I don't think Peterson can trade back into the first this year by packaging both seconds. But I do think 33 or 34 are valuable enough to pair with a future first to get into the mid-twenties. The remaining second will be traded for multiple future second rounders.

[Diop]

I already said he should not be drafted here since his shooting efficiency (and ft shooting) still something to fix.

He had good play offs run (we were eliminated vy Monaco, EL finalist, in a 3 games serie), but he did not have godly performance.
He's still a strong swiss army knife with great court vision on both ends. Great pnr skills as well. Lack of touch is killing his efficiency but his motor (and his power)

I am also against drafting either Traore or Beringer. The first because he is probably not good enough (not saying he is bad, he has the tools to succeed here) for a team like Charlotte and the latter because it will take time to get ready (but his potential is huge).

Raynaud would be a nice option here though. Even though i have my doubts about his ability to remain on the court because of his lack of foot speed, we never had a big with so good fundamentals since Moiso i would think (and Weis). With a strong defensive forward(s), it could work
He's an immediate threat on pick n pop and his passing would help as well (as long as shooters dont brick their shots).

Another option as point forward is Mo Diawara. He would come cheap (he's nowhere in mock drafts) but i am high on him as 3D (he can shoot well from deep) and defensively he is really solid (and mobile). He can't put the ball on the floor though, his handle is really not good.
But this team needs quality players from the bench, hard to think he would not replace easily the impact of half of the current bench players

i wasn't trying to fire a shot or stir, i was just pointing out that most people here hated Diaw and Batum's passivity and that Penda has a bit of that in him.

[Diop]

Ryan Nembhard- pass first point

I wouldn't mind bringing in a pass first point guard if it only costs a late second or something. would be good for the g league and we don't have floor general types. his physical attributes will probably mean he struggles to stay in the NBA, but for a late 2nd or undrafted who cares.

[wilson115]

Another option as point forward is Mo Diawara. He would come cheap (he's nowhere in mock drafts) but i am high on him as 3D (he can shoot well from deep) and defensively he is really solid (and mobile). He can't put the ball on the floor though, his handle is really not good.
But this team needs quality players from the bench, hard to think he would not replace easily the impact of half of the current bench players

Like Raynaud too, but didn't know Diawara's such a beast. Yikes.

Read on Twitter

Spoiler:

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[bravor]

I already said he should not be drafted here since his shooting efficiency (and ft shooting) still something to fix.

He had good play offs run (we were eliminated vy Monaco, EL finalist, in a 3 games serie), but he did not have godly performance.
He's still a strong swiss army knife with great court vision on both ends. Great pnr skills as well. Lack of touch is killing his efficiency but his motor (and his power)

Sure, you kinda misunderstood my post though. It was nothing against what you said, i just meant his profile really dont match what this team needs. Knowing i already said i would be really surprised if he's not taken in the 1st round around the #20 spot.
As for being passive though, he's way more agressive than Batum, the main issue is his (lack of) efficiency close to the rim.
Imo he provokes more shooting fouls (and ft's) than what Batum or even Diaw generated when they were young players here. Essentially because he run plays quite often (esp on the pnr) and his handle is good enough (not saying it is nba good) to run the point as a point forward).
Not saying he is Ingles's level in that area though unfortunately.

There are much better options for Charlotte to fill the roster with really playable rookies for cheap (or undrafted if that's Diawara's case), starting with wing depth.

Speaking of that, i am probably higher than some on Ben Saraf. Just not sure if he could handle the sf position, but his playmaking is legit and so is his leadership.

[JMAC3]

Read on Twitter

Intriguing measurements

[JMAC3]

Read on Twitter

Intriguing measurements

6-7 with 6-11 wingspan at 19 and elite international competition vs his peers. I might actually be okay trading up into the first to get him using the 2 seconds.

[Snidely FC]

Fans of Zach Edey/Donovan Clingan ought to want the Hornets to take Kalk:

Ryan Kalkbrenner was one of the best offensive and defensive players in the country last year, and he’s been elite on both ends ever since he stepped foot on the college basketball hardwood. He’s a paint-dominant seven-footer, dropped 49 in a game, and is the reigning Naismith Defensive Player of the Year. Kalkbrenner is an outstanding, two-way player, and he’s had one of the best college careers we’ve ever seen. Great. Now, let’s get to the fun stuff.

There’s a decent chance Mr. Kalkbrenner, proprietor of a 7’6 wingspan, shoots threes in the NBA. One of the craziest stats of this cycle is that Kalkbrenner is 6/21 on dribble jumper 3s in the last two seasons.

But coupled with his strong hook counter (12% frequency), huge sample of FT competency (70% on 600 attempts), and respectable 43% on non-rim 2s across his career, I’d wager there’s a pretty reasonable chance that Kalkbrenner becomes a legit stretch 5 in the NBA. While his volume is somewhat low (1.8 3PA/100 across his career), this far outpaces many current stretch 5’s shooting volume in prospecthood.

Kalkbrenner is an elite finisher. Absolutely elite. He made a whopping 77% of his close 2s across his career, but what’s even more compelling is that nearly half his rim makes were dunks. His elite finishing and hook conversion was good for a career 67% TS. You can’t teach that size and length, and it appears inevitable that Kalkbrenner will be a dominant finisher in the NBA.

What’s especially compelling about Kalkbrenner is his precocious production. This is not your typical college senior breakout; Kalkbrenner has been consistently elite since his sophomore year. Take box-score metrics: Kalkbrenner has put together 4 straight seasons of 5 PRPG + 9 BPM, and no one else has even had more than 2 such seasons. Along with Ayton, Edey, and Kaminsky, he’s the only 7-footer to eclipse 6 PRPG. And Kalkbrenner hasn’t just dominated college; he played a critical role on the Team USA national team that won gold at the 2021 FIBA U19 World Cup.

Kalkbrenner finished top 5 in Player Efficiency Rating at the tournament, behind a triumvirate of seven-footers: Edey, Wemby, and Chet. Some traits continuing over from Creighton: Kalkbrenner was a monster offensive rebounder but a tepid defensive rebounder. His steal rate was nonexistent; he drew just 0.24 FTA/FGA, and his assist rate was under 10%. On the bright side, he had a 10% block rate and just 1 TO in 7 games.

Kalkbrenner’s dominance even stemmed back to AAU. Playing for Mac Irvin Fire’s 17U team on the EYBL circuit, Kalkbrenner averaged a ridiculous 4.3 stocks per game while shooting 80% FT + 59% TS. He managed to block 2 shots per foul; this is the highest block-to-foul ratio I’ve ever seen, in any context. Somehow, he was ranked outside the t100 despite dizzying EYBL production. To this day, that remains the most baffling mismatch of EYBL production and recruit rank that I’ve ever seen.

Two qualms and one point of optimism:

First, Kalkbrenner is not as physically taxing on defenders. His career 40 FTR is weak, and he just doesn’t force contact in the post as much as prior seven-footers that I liked in the past. Furthermore, Kalkbrenner is a pretty mediocre rebounder for his size; while some may argue his defensive rebounding issues are schematic, I’d point to his 15% defensive rebound rate during the U19 World Cup. He’s also just a mediocre offensive rebounder for his size, and he doesn’t feast on putbacks very often.

Losing valuable second chance points and free throw attempts is a big deal! Edey and Clingan, for instance, spawned into the league as two of its best rebounders, which allowed them to contribute immediate value despite some scoring struggles. Kalkbrenner doesn’t have this same leeway.

Second, Kalkbrenner’s processing may limit his upside. His career 7.7% assist and 0.9% steal marks should be red flags, and they’re corroborated by his lack of passing and steal volume in AAU and FIBA. Zach Edey is a solid point of comparison here, but as someone who watched the tens of hours of Edey tape, I feel confident saying that Edey was a better processor. Edey had higher passing volume while commanding far more attention per post touch. Moreover, Edey was comfortable soaking up usage as the primary point of focus for defenses, while Kalkbrenner’s usage and scoring burden were much lower throughout his career.

As for a point of optimism: Edey went from mediocre Purdue block rate to 80th percentile block rate + 30th percentile steal rate (for position) in his rookie season. This was expected by many; he intentionally avoided fouling at Purdue because his team needed him to play the majority of the game. Similarly, what happens when an NBA team plays Kalkbrenner just 20-25 minutes a game and doesn’t place the same anti-foul constraints on him? If he’s already pushing 2 blocks per foul across AAU + college, and his primary objective shifts from avoiding fouls to grabbing blocks, what’s stopping Kalkbrenner from pushing a 90th percentile block rate for position? We actually got a glimpse of this reality at the U19 World Cup, where Kalkbrenner dropped to “just” 1.29 blocks per foul but hit 10% block rate.

Given his tools and the degree to which he generates blocks without fouls, I expect Kalk’s stock numbers to rise given his astounding discipline. His wingspan (7-foot-6), average agility testing, and great rim protection should make him a beast in drop coverage, but a lack of plus agility and poor changes of direction likely limits the coverage versatility he provides to essentially just drop for the time being.

Kalkbrenner is the last of the vaunted High School Class of 2021 center class, which included luminaries such as Evan Mobley, Zach Edey, Walker Kessler, Mark Williams, Johni Broome, Hunter Dickinson, and Adama Sanogo. A center class packed full with perennial double-digit BPMers. Following in the path of his drafted contemporaries, Kalkbrenner is going to dunk/finish everything, potentially shoot (not a gimmick), and anchor a legit defense. His lack of passing, foul drawing, and rebounding could hinder him, but Kalkbrenner is too big and impactful not to stick in the league for a long time. Every team could use a Kalk.

Avinash Chauhan

[Bassman]

HIGHLY DESIRE the Hornets to trade both picks to get into round 1. Has to be opportunities with several teams in the early to later 20’s.

[Diop]

Fans of Zach Edey/Donovan Clingan ought to want the Hornets to take Kalk:

Ryan Kalkbrenner was one of the best offensive and defensive players in the country last year, and he’s been elite on both ends ever since he stepped foot on the college basketball hardwood. He’s a paint-dominant seven-footer, dropped 49 in a game, and is the reigning Naismith Defensive Player of the Year. Kalkbrenner is an outstanding, two-way player, and he’s had one of the best college careers we’ve ever seen. Great. Now, let’s get to the fun stuff.

There’s a decent chance Mr. Kalkbrenner, proprietor of a 7’6 wingspan, shoots threes in the NBA. One of the craziest stats of this cycle is that Kalkbrenner is 6/21 on dribble jumper 3s in the last two seasons.

But coupled with his strong hook counter (12% frequency), huge sample of FT competency (70% on 600 attempts), and respectable 43% on non-rim 2s across his career, I’d wager there’s a pretty reasonable chance that Kalkbrenner becomes a legit stretch 5 in the NBA. While his volume is somewhat low (1.8 3PA/100 across his career), this far outpaces many current stretch 5’s shooting volume in prospecthood.

Kalkbrenner is an elite finisher. Absolutely elite. He made a whopping 77% of his close 2s across his career, but what’s even more compelling is that nearly half his rim makes were dunks. His elite finishing and hook conversion was good for a career 67% TS. You can’t teach that size and length, and it appears inevitable that Kalkbrenner will be a dominant finisher in the NBA.

What’s especially compelling about Kalkbrenner is his precocious production. This is not your typical college senior breakout; Kalkbrenner has been consistently elite since his sophomore year. Take box-score metrics: Kalkbrenner has put together 4 straight seasons of 5 PRPG + 9 BPM, and no one else has even had more than 2 such seasons. Along with Ayton, Edey, and Kaminsky, he’s the only 7-footer to eclipse 6 PRPG. And Kalkbrenner hasn’t just dominated college; he played a critical role on the Team USA national team that won gold at the 2021 FIBA U19 World Cup.

Kalkbrenner finished top 5 in Player Efficiency Rating at the tournament, behind a triumvirate of seven-footers: Edey, Wemby, and Chet. Some traits continuing over from Creighton: Kalkbrenner was a monster offensive rebounder but a tepid defensive rebounder. His steal rate was nonexistent; he drew just 0.24 FTA/FGA, and his assist rate was under 10%. On the bright side, he had a 10% block rate and just 1 TO in 7 games.

Kalkbrenner’s dominance even stemmed back to AAU. Playing for Mac Irvin Fire’s 17U team on the EYBL circuit, Kalkbrenner averaged a ridiculous 4.3 stocks per game while shooting 80% FT + 59% TS. He managed to block 2 shots per foul; this is the highest block-to-foul ratio I’ve ever seen, in any context. Somehow, he was ranked outside the t100 despite dizzying EYBL production. To this day, that remains the most baffling mismatch of EYBL production and recruit rank that I’ve ever seen.

Two qualms and one point of optimism:

First, Kalkbrenner is not as physically taxing on defenders. His career 40 FTR is weak, and he just doesn’t force contact in the post as much as prior seven-footers that I liked in the past. Furthermore, Kalkbrenner is a pretty mediocre rebounder for his size; while some may argue his defensive rebounding issues are schematic, I’d point to his 15% defensive rebound rate during the U19 World Cup. He’s also just a mediocre offensive rebounder for his size, and he doesn’t feast on putbacks very often.

Losing valuable second chance points and free throw attempts is a big deal! Edey and Clingan, for instance, spawned into the league as two of its best rebounders, which allowed them to contribute immediate value despite some scoring struggles. Kalkbrenner doesn’t have this same leeway.

Second, Kalkbrenner’s processing may limit his upside. His career 7.7% assist and 0.9% steal marks should be red flags, and they’re corroborated by his lack of passing and steal volume in AAU and FIBA. Zach Edey is a solid point of comparison here, but as someone who watched the tens of hours of Edey tape, I feel confident saying that Edey was a better processor. Edey had higher passing volume while commanding far more attention per post touch. Moreover, Edey was comfortable soaking up usage as the primary point of focus for defenses, while Kalkbrenner’s usage and scoring burden were much lower throughout his career.

As for a point of optimism: Edey went from mediocre Purdue block rate to 80th percentile block rate + 30th percentile steal rate (for position) in his rookie season. This was expected by many; he intentionally avoided fouling at Purdue because his team needed him to play the majority of the game. Similarly, what happens when an NBA team plays Kalkbrenner just 20-25 minutes a game and doesn’t place the same anti-foul constraints on him? If he’s already pushing 2 blocks per foul across AAU + college, and his primary objective shifts from avoiding fouls to grabbing blocks, what’s stopping Kalkbrenner from pushing a 90th percentile block rate for position? We actually got a glimpse of this reality at the U19 World Cup, where Kalkbrenner dropped to “just” 1.29 blocks per foul but hit 10% block rate.

Given his tools and the degree to which he generates blocks without fouls, I expect Kalk’s stock numbers to rise given his astounding discipline. His wingspan (7-foot-6), average agility testing, and great rim protection should make him a beast in drop coverage, but a lack of plus agility and poor changes of direction likely limits the coverage versatility he provides to essentially just drop for the time being.

Kalkbrenner is the last of the vaunted High School Class of 2021 center class, which included luminaries such as Evan Mobley, Zach Edey, Walker Kessler, Mark Williams, Johni Broome, Hunter Dickinson, and Adama Sanogo. A center class packed full with perennial double-digit BPMers. Following in the path of his drafted contemporaries, Kalkbrenner is going to dunk/finish everything, potentially shoot (not a gimmick), and anchor a legit defense. His lack of passing, foul drawing, and rebounding could hinder him, but Kalkbrenner is too big and impactful not to stick in the league for a long time. Every team could use a Kalk.

Avinash Chauhan

it always feels like you can find useable back up bigs in the second round. Would Kalk be good starter one day? probably not, but can he be plugged in to hold down the fort at centre? Most likely, and his size might change the game occasionally.