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Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0

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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#781 » by Tripod » Sat Jun 7, 2025 2:19 am

sidsid wrote:
deck wrote:
ForeverTFC wrote:
What I find hilarious with some of the tanking logic is that they don't want to treadmill for 5+ years in the hopes that they can make that 1 important trade, but they are more than happy to lose and throw away seasons for 5+ years in the hopes that they can draft that 1 important prospect.


Tanking logic also tends to ignore the fact that loosing devalues assets on your team, while winning, or even tread-milling, can help build asset value. Does Sabonis get you Haliburton if he had been playing for a 15-67 team rather than being a perennial first round exit? Perhaps not.


Eh, that depends on the talent. Ainge was looking for 5 picks and a player in exchange for Lauri. By all accounts he could have gotten at least 3 and a player from the Warriors. That's about as good a haul as you're going to get for a fringe star, and Utah was deliberately sabotaging their own team.

On the flip side, showing your flaws in the playoffs can easily kill your value. I'm sure the Rockets were hoping Sengun would ball out, but he looked awfully Sabonis-like out there, and that's just what they really wanted to avoid.

What's more likely to happen in a tank environment is that a bad org with bad development and tanking may not get that potential out of the players at all, and they either disappear or bloom on another team. And other times you have SGA who becomes an MVP out of that environment.

"By all accounts he could have gotten at least 3 and a player from the Warriors. That's about as good a haul as you're going to get for a fringe star,"

Yet we got 3 1st +Brown for an expiring Siakam and Mgt haters can't stop bitching about the return.

Huh.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#782 » by ATLTimekeeper » Sat Jun 7, 2025 12:05 pm

MiamiSPX wrote:
Raps in 4 wrote:
Siakam, OG, and Norm were all expiring when we traded them. He only moved on from them when his hand was forced, and when they were at their lowest value.


Norm still had another year on his deal. I don't mind that trade. He identified a guy he didn't want to pay, and moved him for a younger player that was trending in the right direction. He just got it wrong, but you can't nail every single trade. I still give him kudos for the intent.


I remember hearing Gary Trent Sr on the radio criticize Coach K for misusing his son. I think Gary Jr was always going to be a mercenary. Norm legit thought he was a part of the next wave and was never made to believe otherwise. He was an ambassador for the culture of the team, and close with Pascal and Fred. I think there's a lot of meat in this one trade that shows why Masai got it wrong, and why he has continued to make bad deals and bad bets since.

Anyway, good intentions don't get you much. I supported a lot of moves that didn't actually help the team. And I opposed many that did help the team. You get paid to win.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#783 » by HiJiNX » Sat Jun 7, 2025 12:56 pm

djsunyc wrote:there is no way for a gm/coach to know which guys will hit shots in the clutch and which won't. this is the type of luck and randomness that goes unappreciated. you just get good players and hope they perform. this is the same indy team that kept choking vs the celtics last ecf's.

It’s funny you bring up last year’s ECF. I’ve referenced that series many times this playoffs to say that Indiana is better than folks think. They got swept by Boston but had effectively won 3 out of those 4 games before choking down the stretch. Nembhard turnovers, Haliburton dribbling off his leg, Siakam rushing shots. When that happens it’s easy to walk away and say they’re not built for the moment. But they were young and it was their first time going that far. Often teams that lose like that come back more composed if they get that far again. And that appears to be what’s happening with the Pacers now.

Furthermore, the Pacers have been a strong comeback team since around the all-star break. They’re doing this to everybody. They’ve been this incredibly mentally tough team that’s deep with effective role players, an ability to just turn up the D late, filled with guys like Nembhard and Turner and Nesmith (especially Nesmith) who have been making big shots late in games all season. Siakam is better than ever. And Haliburton bounced back from a subpar season last year. Oh and Carlisle has been magical at making half time adjustments this year.

The Pacers are better than people think. They’ve been showing signs for awhile, I just think the lack of a big name player prior to Hali becoming one this offseason, really had people betting against them. But man do they ever get contributions from everybody and they just keep coming at you. They tire you out. And by the 4th Q they’ve got you on the ropes. This is how they have been stealing games. All season.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#784 » by Los_29 » Sat Jun 7, 2025 1:50 pm

HiJiNX wrote:
djsunyc wrote:there is no way for a gm/coach to know which guys will hit shots in the clutch and which won't. this is the type of luck and randomness that goes unappreciated. you just get good players and hope they perform. this is the same indy team that kept choking vs the celtics last ecf's.

It’s funny you bring up last year’s ECF. I’ve referenced that series many times this playoffs to say that Indiana is better than folks think. They got swept by Boston but had effectively won 3 out of those 4 games before choking down the stretch. Nembhard turnovers, Haliburton dribbling off his leg, Siakam rushing shots. When that happens it’s easy to walk away and say they’re not built for the moment. But they were young and it was their first time going that far. Often teams that lose like that come back more composed if they get that far again. And that appears to be what’s happening with the Pacers now.

Furthermore, the Pacers have been a strong comeback team since around the all-star break. They’re doing this to everybody. They’ve been this incredibly mentally tough team that’s deep with effective role players, an ability to just turn up the D late, filled with guys like Nembhard and Turner and Nesmith (especially Nesmith) who have been making big shots late in games all season. Siakam is better than ever. And Haliburton bounced back from a subpar season last year. Oh and Carlisle has been magical at making half time adjustments this year.

The Pacers are better than people think. They’ve been showing signs for awhile, I just think the lack of a big name player prior to Hali becoming one this offseason, really had people betting against them. But man do they ever get contributions from everybody and they just keep coming at you. They tire you out. And by the 4th Q they’ve got you on the ropes. This is how they have been stealing games. All season.


Exactly, even though the Pacers got swept, they were the Celtics toughest opponent. They choked leads in crunch time due to mistakes from everyone (Nesmith, Nembhard, Pascal, Turner, Hali and more). But it was a learning experience because they’ve all been delivering in these playoffs.

This is why I don’t think you can discount this team in the finals. The Celtics were a powerhouse last year with great defensive players and elite offensive talent. Pacers were in every game.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#785 » by tsherkin » Sat Jun 7, 2025 3:57 pm

HiJiNX wrote:
djsunyc wrote:there is no way for a gm/coach to know which guys will hit shots in the clutch and which won't. this is the type of luck and randomness that goes unappreciated. you just get good players and hope they perform. this is the same indy team that kept choking vs the celtics last ecf's.

It’s funny you bring up last year’s ECF. I’ve referenced that series many times this playoffs to say that Indiana is better than folks think. They got swept by Boston but had effectively won 3 out of those 4 games before choking down the stretch. Nembhard turnovers, Haliburton dribbling off his leg, Siakam rushing shots. When that happens it’s easy to walk away and say they’re not built for the moment. But they were young and it was their first time going that far. Often teams that lose like that come back more composed if they get that far again. And that appears to be what’s happening with the Pacers now.

Furthermore, the Pacers have been a strong comeback team since around the all-star break. They’re doing this to everybody. They’ve been this incredibly mentally tough team that’s deep with effective role players, an ability to just turn up the D late, filled with guys like Nembhard and Turner and Nesmith (especially Nesmith) who have been making big shots late in games all season. Siakam is better than ever. And Haliburton bounced back from a subpar season last year. Oh and Carlisle has been magical at making half time adjustments this year.

The Pacers are better than people think. They’ve been showing signs for awhile, I just think the lack of a big name player prior to Hali becoming one this offseason, really had people betting against them. But man do they ever get contributions from everybody and they just keep coming at you. They tire you out. And by the 4th Q they’ve got you on the ropes. This is how they have been stealing games. All season.


They're certainly a pile of fun to watch.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#786 » by WaltFrazier » Sat Jun 7, 2025 4:28 pm

HiJiNX wrote:
djsunyc wrote:there is no way for a gm/coach to know which guys will hit shots in the clutch and which won't. this is the type of luck and randomness that goes unappreciated. you just get good players and hope they perform. this is the same indy team that kept choking vs the celtics last ecf's.

It’s funny you bring up last year’s ECF. I’ve referenced that series many times this playoffs to say that Indiana is better than folks think. They got swept by Boston but had effectively won 3 out of those 4 games before choking down the stretch. Nembhard turnovers, Haliburton dribbling off his leg, Siakam rushing shots. When that happens it’s easy to walk away and say they’re not built for the moment. But they were young and it was their first time going that far. Often teams that lose like that come back more composed if they get that far again. And that appears to be what’s happening with the Pacers now.

Furthermore, the Pacers have been a strong comeback team since around the all-star break. They’re doing this to everybody. They’ve been this incredibly mentally tough team that’s deep with effective role players, an ability to just turn up the D late, filled with guys like Nembhard and Turner and Nesmith (especially Nesmith) who have been making big shots late in games all season. Siakam is better than ever. And Haliburton bounced back from a subpar season last year. Oh and Carlisle has been magical at making half time adjustments this year.

The Pacers are better than people think. They’ve been showing signs for awhile, I just think the lack of a big name player prior to Hali becoming one this offseason, really had people betting against them. But man do they ever get contributions from everybody and they just keep coming at you. They tire you out. And by the 4th Q they’ve got you on the ropes. This is how they have been stealing games. All season.


Or, they could lose the next four straight if Chet and Williams shoot better.

The Thunder have all the same qualities of depth, pace, wearing you down, only better. But we'll see.

This is why I never bet. :D
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#787 » by Los_29 » Sat Jun 7, 2025 5:09 pm

WaltFrazier wrote:
HiJiNX wrote:
djsunyc wrote:there is no way for a gm/coach to know which guys will hit shots in the clutch and which won't. this is the type of luck and randomness that goes unappreciated. you just get good players and hope they perform. this is the same indy team that kept choking vs the celtics last ecf's.

It’s funny you bring up last year’s ECF. I’ve referenced that series many times this playoffs to say that Indiana is better than folks think. They got swept by Boston but had effectively won 3 out of those 4 games before choking down the stretch. Nembhard turnovers, Haliburton dribbling off his leg, Siakam rushing shots. When that happens it’s easy to walk away and say they’re not built for the moment. But they were young and it was their first time going that far. Often teams that lose like that come back more composed if they get that far again. And that appears to be what’s happening with the Pacers now.

Furthermore, the Pacers have been a strong comeback team since around the all-star break. They’re doing this to everybody. They’ve been this incredibly mentally tough team that’s deep with effective role players, an ability to just turn up the D late, filled with guys like Nembhard and Turner and Nesmith (especially Nesmith) who have been making big shots late in games all season. Siakam is better than ever. And Haliburton bounced back from a subpar season last year. Oh and Carlisle has been magical at making half time adjustments this year.

The Pacers are better than people think. They’ve been showing signs for awhile, I just think the lack of a big name player prior to Hali becoming one this offseason, really had people betting against them. But man do they ever get contributions from everybody and they just keep coming at you. They tire you out. And by the 4th Q they’ve got you on the ropes. This is how they have been stealing games. All season.


Or, they could lose the next four straight if Chet and Williams shoot better.

The Thunder have all the same qualities of depth, pace, wearing you down, only better. But we'll see.

This is why I never bet. :D


Both of them have shown to be incredibly inconsistent though. Not to mention the Pacers won game 1 despite turning the ball over 25 times. Pacers likely won’t commit that number of turnovers again in the series.

What’s bizarre is Daigneault having no faith in having two bigs out there. They won 68 games this year and are making adjustments to match up better with the Pacers. Chet and Hartenstein played 24 and 17 minutes respectively. I was blown away by that.

I think Thunder take game 2 but it’s risky blowing games you should win against a team like the Pacers.

Thunder had 6 turnovers last game and forced 25 turnovers. They also got a very efficient 38 points from Shai. And they lost. They didn’t even shoot poorly from three. I’d imagine right around their averages for the year.

Pacers need to take care of the ball and try to target Chet and Hartenstein. They also need to try and turn the Thunder over a bit more.

Thunder need to limit corner threes. They were willing to give up that shot all year but I’m not sure if that’s a good strategy against this Pacers team. All of these guys can shoot. They also need to score more off turnovers. Pacers had great transition defense, all of them hustled back. But OKC still blew a couple of easy shots.

Can’t wait for game 2.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#788 » by RaptorLakerJay » Sat Jun 7, 2025 7:22 pm

Read on Twitter


Cris Davis put this out WAY before anyone had intel about Fox asking out. The Kings started looking for trades end of January 2025.

He also put the news about Ingram regarding Miami as well which came out to be true.

Read on Twitter
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#789 » by HiJiNX » Sat Jun 7, 2025 10:31 pm

tsherkin wrote:
HiJiNX wrote:
djsunyc wrote:there is no way for a gm/coach to know which guys will hit shots in the clutch and which won't. this is the type of luck and randomness that goes unappreciated. you just get good players and hope they perform. this is the same indy team that kept choking vs the celtics last ecf's.

It’s funny you bring up last year’s ECF. I’ve referenced that series many times this playoffs to say that Indiana is better than folks think. They got swept by Boston but had effectively won 3 out of those 4 games before choking down the stretch. Nembhard turnovers, Haliburton dribbling off his leg, Siakam rushing shots. When that happens it’s easy to walk away and say they’re not built for the moment. But they were young and it was their first time going that far. Often teams that lose like that come back more composed if they get that far again. And that appears to be what’s happening with the Pacers now.

Furthermore, the Pacers have been a strong comeback team since around the all-star break. They’re doing this to everybody. They’ve been this incredibly mentally tough team that’s deep with effective role players, an ability to just turn up the D late, filled with guys like Nembhard and Turner and Nesmith (especially Nesmith) who have been making big shots late in games all season. Siakam is better than ever. And Haliburton bounced back from a subpar season last year. Oh and Carlisle has been magical at making half time adjustments this year.

The Pacers are better than people think. They’ve been showing signs for awhile, I just think the lack of a big name player prior to Hali becoming one this offseason, really had people betting against them. But man do they ever get contributions from everybody and they just keep coming at you. They tire you out. And by the 4th Q they’ve got you on the ropes. This is how they have been stealing games. All season.


They're certainly a pile of fun to watch.

My favourite team to watch all season. Every game they play is exciting.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#790 » by HiJiNX » Sat Jun 7, 2025 10:41 pm

WaltFrazier wrote:
HiJiNX wrote:
djsunyc wrote:there is no way for a gm/coach to know which guys will hit shots in the clutch and which won't. this is the type of luck and randomness that goes unappreciated. you just get good players and hope they perform. this is the same indy team that kept choking vs the celtics last ecf's.

It’s funny you bring up last year’s ECF. I’ve referenced that series many times this playoffs to say that Indiana is better than folks think. They got swept by Boston but had effectively won 3 out of those 4 games before choking down the stretch. Nembhard turnovers, Haliburton dribbling off his leg, Siakam rushing shots. When that happens it’s easy to walk away and say they’re not built for the moment. But they were young and it was their first time going that far. Often teams that lose like that come back more composed if they get that far again. And that appears to be what’s happening with the Pacers now.

Furthermore, the Pacers have been a strong comeback team since around the all-star break. They’re doing this to everybody. They’ve been this incredibly mentally tough team that’s deep with effective role players, an ability to just turn up the D late, filled with guys like Nembhard and Turner and Nesmith (especially Nesmith) who have been making big shots late in games all season. Siakam is better than ever. And Haliburton bounced back from a subpar season last year. Oh and Carlisle has been magical at making half time adjustments this year.

The Pacers are better than people think. They’ve been showing signs for awhile, I just think the lack of a big name player prior to Hali becoming one this offseason, really had people betting against them. But man do they ever get contributions from everybody and they just keep coming at you. They tire you out. And by the 4th Q they’ve got you on the ropes. This is how they have been stealing games. All season.


Or, they could lose the next four straight if Chet and Williams shoot better.

The Thunder have all the same qualities of depth, pace, wearing you down, only better. But we'll see.

This is why I never bet. :D

The thing is that the Thunder outside of SGA looked bad because the Pacers made them look bad. OKC had trouble generating good looks. The weakside was shutdown. And the Pacers kept them off the free throw line for the most part. The thing about Chet and JDubb is neither guy can do much against a set defence and the Pacers have been getting back in transition.

OKC has a tough road ahead of them and Carlisle has proven to be good at making adjustments throughout a series whereas Daignault has not.

The more I think about it the more confidence I have in the Pacers having a real shot at taking it.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#791 » by tsherkin » Sun Jun 8, 2025 1:39 am

HiJiNX wrote:My favourite team to watch all season. Every game they play is exciting.


Yeah, they're right up there for me as well. I was digging on Denver a lot, but Indy just is a ton of fun to watch. It's nice to have a team like that in the league.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#792 » by YogurtProducer » Sun Jun 8, 2025 1:47 am

RaptorLakerJay wrote:
Read on Twitter


Cris Davis put this out WAY before anyone had intel about Fox asking out. The Kings started looking for trades end of January 2025.

He also put the news about Ingram regarding Miami as well which came out to be true.

Read on Twitter

Did I miss something? Why does this matter? What did he say recently that’s relevant?
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#793 » by tsherkin » Sun Jun 8, 2025 2:03 am

YogurtProducer wrote:
RaptorLakerJay wrote:
Read on Twitter


Cris Davis put this out WAY before anyone had intel about Fox asking out. The Kings started looking for trades end of January 2025.

He also put the news about Ingram regarding Miami as well which came out to be true.

Read on Twitter

Did I miss something? Why does this matter? What did he say recently that’s relevant?


He reported like 2 days ago that Milwaukee wants to trade Giannis, if that matters.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#794 » by djsunyc » Sun Jun 8, 2025 3:13 am

tsherkin wrote:
YogurtProducer wrote:
RaptorLakerJay wrote:
Read on Twitter


Cris Davis put this out WAY before anyone had intel about Fox asking out. The Kings started looking for trades end of January 2025.

He also put the news about Ingram regarding Miami as well which came out to be true.

Read on Twitter

Did I miss something? Why does this matter? What did he say recently that’s relevant?


He reported like 2 days ago that Milwaukee wants to trade Giannis, if that matters.


didnt folks determine that it's a AI bot?
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#795 » by bballsparkin » Sun Jun 8, 2025 3:20 am

WaltFrazier wrote:
Or, they could lose the next four straight if Chet and Williams shoot better.

The Thunder have all the same qualities of depth, pace, wearing you down, only better. But we'll see.

This is why I never bet. :D


Me too. I would have bet on the both the Panthers and OKC winning game 1.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#796 » by Godaddycurse » Sun Jun 8, 2025 4:21 am

Edey w/ Ankle injury out for 6 months or more... kinda glad we didnt draft him
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#797 » by Los_29 » Sun Jun 8, 2025 4:27 am

Godaddycurse wrote:Edey w/ Ankle injury out for 6 months or more... kinda glad we didnt draft him


Hopefully he makes a speedy recovery. He had a solid rookie season. Always worry with guys that size though.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#798 » by bballsparkin » Sun Jun 8, 2025 4:31 am

Tripod wrote:"By all accounts he could have gotten at least 3 and a player from the Warriors. That's about as good a haul as you're going to get for a fringe star,"

Yet we got 3 1st +Brown for an expiring Siakam and Mgt haters can't stop bitching about the return.

Huh.


What I always found funny about the critique of the Pascal trade was that Masai took the patient route. No bad salary plus picks. The FO could have gone full on treadmill and done so much worse in my opinion. I was satisfied from day 1 because I'm in favour of a retool/rebuild. Sure it could/should have been sooner; otherwise it's better than most Rap fans give it credit for. The Jak trade was weird timing. It was strange times but hopefully back on track lol.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#799 » by Tripod » Sun Jun 8, 2025 10:08 am

Godaddycurse wrote:Edey w/ Ankle injury out for 6 months or more... kinda glad we didnt draft him

That sucks for him.
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Re: Official NBA General Discussion 2025-26 V1.0 

Post#800 » by tsherkin » Sun Jun 8, 2025 10:10 am

djsunyc wrote:
tsherkin wrote:
YogurtProducer wrote:Did I miss something? Why does this matter? What did he say recently that’s relevant?


He reported like 2 days ago that Milwaukee wants to trade Giannis, if that matters.


didnt folks determine that it's a AI bot?


I think that may be the discussion, but I jumped in late.

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