Rumors, Random Thoughts, and non-Threadworthy Posts 18.0 Dave Cowens drove a taxi

[Texas Chuck]

Garland needed surgery to fix the toe injury he had in the playoffs. Out 4-5 months.

https://www.espn.com/contributor/shams-charania/a77cd55900b6e

He'll get no credit for trying to gut it out and play on it either - which is precisely why agents tell their clients not to bother trying.

Credit from who? Fans? Oh I think most Cavs fans will trumpet his toughness. Casual fans? Who cares? Cleveland organization? Oh I'm sure they give him credit. Doesn't mean they might not trade him if they thought it helped them have a better chance at a a title, but they definitely would have known he was playing hurt and would definitely have appreciated him gutting it out.

[Bornstellar]

“I wouldn't be surprised if KD to the Spurs is done already and they just haven't announced it,” Simmons said on “The Bill Simmons Podcast.” “Basically, they've agreed on specifics, just announce it on the week of the draft. This goes back to the Giannis thing. I think they trade for KD because it just costs less. They'll be able to be real competitive and maybe go a couple of rounds in the playoffs, but they're also going to keep the No. 2 pick and do it that way, which is my prediction.”

Hmm...

[ACMFFL]

Cleveland out: Garland
Cleveland in: Jrue, 6

Boston out: Jrue
Boston in: Klay

Dallas out: Klay, Martin, Hardy
Dallas in: Poole

Washington out: Poole, 6
Washington in: Garland, Hardy (into TPE)

Sacramento out: fake 2nd
Sacramento in: Martin

Why for Cleveland: placeholder starting PG who fits well next to mitchell and a lotto pick to groom a replacement
Why for Boston: save money
Why for Dallas: add a PG
Why for Washington: get PG of future
Why for Sacramento: add a forward

Poole has 3.75M in ULTBE, so after this trade Mavs are barely below the 2nd apron with only 11 players under contract. Not enough room to fill the roster.

[Texas Chuck]

“I wouldn't be surprised if KD to the Spurs is done already and they just haven't announced it,” Simmons said on “The Bill Simmons Podcast.” “Basically, they've agreed on specifics, just announce it on the week of the draft. This goes back to the Giannis thing. I think they trade for KD because it just costs less. They'll be able to be real competitive and maybe go a couple of rounds in the playoffs, but they're also going to keep the No. 2 pick and do it that way, which is my prediction.”

Hmm...

He's speculating not reporting just so its clear.

And yeah we already know KD doesn't cost the 2nd pick in this draft. He's not really telling us anything.

But I don't want to temper your excitement at potentially getting KD. I've thought all along the Spurs make the most sense for him. He's a great bridge along with Fox to help Wemby get playoff experience while waiting on Harper/Castle to be ready to have major roles.

[daoneandonly]

Cleveland out: Garland
Cleveland in: Jrue, 6

Boston out: Jrue
Boston in: Klay

Dallas out: Klay, Martin, Hardy
Dallas in: Poole

Washington out: Poole, 6
Washington in: Garland, Hardy (into TPE)

Sacramento out: fake 2nd
Sacramento in: Martin

Why for Cleveland: placeholder starting PG who fits well next to mitchell and a lotto pick to groom a replacement
Why for Boston: save money
Why for Dallas: add a PG
Why for Washington: get PG of future
Why for Sacramento: add a forward

Poole has 3.75M in ULTBE, so after this trade Mavs are barely below the 2nd apron with only 11 players under contract. Not enough room to fill the roster.

Not to mention Poole isn't a PG by any stretch

[Texas Chuck]

Cleveland out: Garland
Cleveland in: Jrue, 6

Boston out: Jrue
Boston in: Klay

Dallas out: Klay, Martin, Hardy
Dallas in: Poole

Washington out: Poole, 6
Washington in: Garland, Hardy (into TPE)

Sacramento out: fake 2nd
Sacramento in: Martin

Why for Cleveland: placeholder starting PG who fits well next to mitchell and a lotto pick to groom a replacement
Why for Boston: save money
Why for Dallas: add a PG
Why for Washington: get PG of future
Why for Sacramento: add a forward

Poole has 3.75M in ULTBE, so after this trade Mavs are barely below the 2nd apron with only 11 players under contract. Not enough room to fill the roster.

But Dallas has avenues to clear more salary still. If Dallas liked this deal, they could make it work. I think they would prefer someone cheaper than Poole with a more consistent game, but with minimal assets and maybe not wanting to spend any of them now that they have Flagg, this kind of deal has some logic.

[Bornstellar]

“I wouldn't be surprised if KD to the Spurs is done already and they just haven't announced it,” Simmons said on “The Bill Simmons Podcast.” “Basically, they've agreed on specifics, just announce it on the week of the draft. This goes back to the Giannis thing. I think they trade for KD because it just costs less. They'll be able to be real competitive and maybe go a couple of rounds in the playoffs, but they're also going to keep the No. 2 pick and do it that way, which is my prediction.”

Hmm...

He's speculating not reporting just so its clear.

And yeah we already know KD doesn't cost the 2nd pick in this draft. He's not really telling us anything.

But I don't want to temper your excitement at potentially getting KD. I've thought all along the Spurs make the most sense for him. He's a great bridge along with Fox to help Wemby get playoff experience while waiting on Harper/Castle to be ready to have major roles.

Yeah I'm taking it with a grain of salt. But there's been a lot of smoke about KD to SA lately so I'm starting to believe it's real

[Texas Chuck]

Yeah I'm taking it with a grain of salt. But there's been a lot of smoke about KD to SA lately so I'm starting to believe it's real

I think the mutual interest is real too. Not sure I believe a deal is essentially already agreed to. I don't think we'd be hearing some of the other KD stuff floating around if that were true.

But Spurs have always made the most sense for him just as their Texas mates the Rockets have always made the most sense for Giannis if he pops free.

[HadAnEffectHere]

The Rockets make no sense whatsoever for Giannis, what are you talking about.

The Rockets' two best players (Amen and Sengun) are arguably the worst star complements for Giannis in the entire league. Obviously both guys would be traded for Giannis, but then the Rockets have to rebuild their entire roster around Giannis. They would probably end up trading their entire team other than Tari Eason. It's an abysmal fit that requires like 6 different trades.

[ACMFFL]

Cleveland out: Garland
Cleveland in: Jrue, 6

Boston out: Jrue
Boston in: Klay

Dallas out: Klay, Martin, Hardy
Dallas in: Poole

Washington out: Poole, 6
Washington in: Garland, Hardy (into TPE)

Sacramento out: fake 2nd
Sacramento in: Martin

Why for Cleveland: placeholder starting PG who fits well next to mitchell and a lotto pick to groom a replacement
Why for Boston: save money
Why for Dallas: add a PG
Why for Washington: get PG of future
Why for Sacramento: add a forward

Poole has 3.75M in ULTBE, so after this trade Mavs are barely below the 2nd apron with only 11 players under contract. Not enough room to fill the roster.

But Dallas has avenues to clear more salary still. If Dallas liked this deal, they could make it work. I think they would prefer someone cheaper than Poole with a more consistent game, but with minimal assets and maybe not wanting to spend any of them now that they have Flagg, this kind of deal has some logic.

Yeah I get the logic and it's nice to clear Caleb last year off the book but I think Poole money limits their flexibility, they have to trade Naji into capspace or Gaff for a cheaper contract to clear enough space.

[LarsV8]

The Rockets make no sense whatsoever for Giannis, what are you talking about.

The Rockets' two best players (Amen and Sengun) are arguably the worst star complements for Giannis in the entire league. Obviously both guys would be traded for Giannis, but then the Rockets have to rebuild their entire roster around Giannis. They would probably end up trading their entire team other than Tari Eason. It's an abysmal fit that requires like 6 different trades.

Amen wouldn't be traded, it would be Sengun, contract filler and draft picks.

So essentially, the second seed in the west last season, swaps Sengun for Giannis, which is an upgrade both offensively and defensively, and then you would also have organic development, because all the younglings will have one more year of experience. That is probably hits 60 wins next year, with runway for further improvement for 3 to 4 years after.

The limiting factor would be salary.

[Astaluego]

Clarke/GG Jackson to HAWKS

The Hawks get a good PnR center as a replacement for Capela (Clarke is 3 years younger), but the prize here for helping the GRIZZLIES would be GG Jackson, who gives them a young 3/4 with potential.

Konchar+2 SRP'S to SUNS

The Suns save a few million and eliminate Royce's final year, while getting some SRP

Capela(ST)/Royce to GRIZZLIES

The Grizzlies plug some of their most glaring holes with a pair of proven veterans.

[HadAnEffectHere]

The Rockets make no sense whatsoever for Giannis, what are you talking about.

The Rockets' two best players (Amen and Sengun) are arguably the worst star complements for Giannis in the entire league. Obviously both guys would be traded for Giannis, but then the Rockets have to rebuild their entire roster around Giannis. They would probably end up trading their entire team other than Tari Eason. It's an abysmal fit that requires like 6 different trades.

Amen wouldn't be traded, it would be Sengun, contract filler and draft picks.

So essentially, the second seed in the west last season, swaps Sengun for Giannis, which is an upgrade both offensively and defensively, and then you would also have organic development, because all the younglings will have one more year of experience. That is probably hits 60 wins next year, with runway for further improvement for 3 to 4 years after.

The limiting factor would be salary.

Amen Giannis is the singular worst possible fit in the entire NBA outside of like Amen and Ausar. Do you know how basketball works. You try not to have your star PF that needs shooting around him complemented by a PF who is the era and position adjusted worst shooter in NBA history.

You have to build the entire team around Giannis and guess what, none of the Rockets work at all around Giannis, they're such terrible fits to make the roster barely functional in the playoffs.

This is why your roster flamed out in the postseason, because none of it fits together at all in any coherent way. It's like all these bad Ja Grizzlies teams that make noise in the regular season only to start playing good teams, and oh no, there's no spacing so playoff teams are good enough defensively to suffocate them. Adding Giannis would make this problem a billion times worse.

[psman2]

Clarke/GG Jackson to HAWKS

The Hawks get a good PnR center as a replacement for Capela (Clarke is 3 years younger), but the prize here for helping the GRIZZLIES would be GG Jackson, who gives them a young 3/4 with potential.

Konchar+2 SRP'S to SUNS

The Suns save a few million and eliminate Royce's final year, while getting some SRP

Capela(ST)/Royce to GRIZZLIES

The Grizzlies plug some of their most glaring holes with a pair of proven veterans.

None of this makes any sense for Memphis. We want to clear Clarke/konchar contracts not trade them for other salary. And if we don’t renegotiate JJJ and operate over the cap then rather keep our players than swap them for this return. Capela can be signed with either the room exception or MLE if we really want him regardless.

[Texas Chuck]

Do you know how basketball works. .

No, but I'm sure you'll tell us. That basketball can only be done one way. We can't have a Finals right now featuring a team built on a smothering defense and another around brilliant offense execution.

That GSW couldn't be a dynasty playing non-shooting bigs next to non-shooting Draymond.

Luka and Kyrie could never hold up defensively yet this is the very reason why they were in the Finals a year ago and the issue against even the champs wasn't defense but rather offense.

Games aren't played on paper. So if that's how basketball works, I'd re-check your manual.

[toooskies]

Garland needed surgery to fix the toe injury he had in the playoffs. Out 4-5 months.

https://www.espn.com/contributor/shams-charania/a77cd55900b6e

He'll get no credit for trying to gut it out and play on it either - which is precisely why agents tell their clients not to bother trying.

It's possible this is an "optional" surgery that Garland is using to quiet external offers and keep himself in Cleveland.

[HadAnEffectHere]

Do you know how basketball works. .

No, but I'm sure you'll tell us. That basketball can only be done one way. We can't have a Finals right now featuring a team built on a smothering defense and another around brilliant offense execution.

That GSW couldn't be a dynasty playing non-shooting bigs next to non-shooting Draymond.

Luka and Kyrie could never hold up defensively yet this is the very reason why they were in the Finals a year ago and the issue against even the champs wasn't defense but rather offense.

Games aren't played on paper. So if that's how basketball works, I'd re-check your manual.

Dallas made it to the Finals with Luka-Kyrie because they funneled everything to the center (the classic Gobert Jazz strategy to make up for terrible defense that works until you play a team that can play 4 40% three point shooters) and then managed to blind luck past OKC. When they faced a good team with average luck, they were so outclassed that they had to be scraped off the pavement.

The Warriors also won their titles in

2015 (back when no one could shoot very well and they had Steph and Klay)
2017 (they had literally Steph, KD, and Klay)
2018 (they had literally Steph, KD, and Klay)
2022 (played two bigs not a ton and also literally still had Steph and Klay)

The 2022 Warriors' 2nd and 3rd most played lineups had Andrew Wiggins at PF and Draymond at C ffs.

[Texas Chuck]

Do you know how basketball works. .

No, but I'm sure you'll tell us. That basketball can only be done one way. We can't have a Finals right now featuring a team built on a smothering defense and another around brilliant offense execution.

That GSW couldn't be a dynasty playing non-shooting bigs next to non-shooting Draymond.

Luka and Kyrie could never hold up defensively yet this is the very reason why they were in the Finals a year ago and the issue against even the champs wasn't defense but rather offense.

Games aren't played on paper. So if that's how basketball works, I'd re-check your manual.

Dallas made it to the Finals with Luka-Kyrie because they funneled everything to the center (the classic Gobert Jazz strategy to make up for terrible defense that works until you play a team that can play 4 40% three point shooters) and then managed to blind luck past OKC. When they faced a good team with average luck, they were so outclassed that they had to be scraped off the pavement.

Oh Boston beat them soundly. But Dallas defended them just fine. Dallas lost because of their offense. Nor did they blind luck past OKC, but of course you have to call it that because otherwise your rigid worldview falls apart so you invent a narrative.

Which is the point, you think you can look at a sheet of paper and know exactly what's going to happen then you lecture everyone else that they don't understand basketball.

When history is littered with examples(I just gave you a few recent ones) of teams succeeding when your rigid belief system insists they couldn't.

[shrink]

I've thought all along the Spurs make the most sense for him. He's a great bridge along with Fox to help Wemby get playoff experience while waiting on Harper/Castle to be ready to have major roles.

I also like the deal for them financially. While Wemby, Castle, and Harper are all on rookie deals, the Spurs can afford Durant for a few years, raise their ceiling, and KD can demonstrate where commitment to the game can take the youngins.

[HadAnEffectHere]

No, but I'm sure you'll tell us. That basketball can only be done one way. We can't have a Finals right now featuring a team built on a smothering defense and another around brilliant offense execution.

That GSW couldn't be a dynasty playing non-shooting bigs next to non-shooting Draymond.

Luka and Kyrie could never hold up defensively yet this is the very reason why they were in the Finals a year ago and the issue against even the champs wasn't defense but rather offense.

Games aren't played on paper. So if that's how basketball works, I'd re-check your manual.

Dallas made it to the Finals with Luka-Kyrie because they funneled everything to the center (the classic Gobert Jazz strategy to make up for terrible defense that works until you play a team that can play 4 40% three point shooters) and then managed to blind luck past OKC. When they faced a good team with average luck, they were so outclassed that they had to be scraped off the pavement.

Oh Boston beat them soundly. But Dallas defended them just fine. Dallas lost because of their offense. Nor did they blind luck past OKC, but of course you have to call it that because otherwise your rigid worldview falls apart so you invent a narrative.

Which is the point, you think you can look at a sheet of paper and know exactly what's going to happen then you lecture everyone else that they don't understand basketball.

When history is littered with examples(I just gave you a few recent ones) of teams succeeding when your rigid belief system insists they couldn't.

Yes, you can go back to pre 2015 to give examples of non-shooting teams winning titles because teams were terrible at shooting pre Curry/Harden and didn't understand that you needed a three point shooting PF.

If you go to recent history, you instead get examples of title teams with these guys at PF

Pascal Siakam/Chet Holmgren
Jayson Tatum
Aaron Gordon (but had literally Jokic at center to make up for the shooting)
Andrew Wiggins
Giannis (but had Bropez at center to make up for the shooting)
AD (The Bubble was the first and last time in his career that he shot well)
Pascal Siakam (Marc Gasol was also at center, giving them tons of five out options)
Kevin Durant
Kevin Durant
Kevin Love
Draymond Green (the only non-shooting PF in the last 15 years to win a ring)
Kawhi Leonard (They did have Tiago Splitter play SOME with Duncan as this was kind of PF by committee as they had so many forwards to do tons of lineup options. Other than Splitter, all of their guys were elite shooters)
LeBron
LeBron
Dirk