2025 Draft prospects - thread 2

[Jvaughn]

Here is who went after WCJ in 2018:

#8: Collin Sexton

#10: Mikal Bridges

#11: Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

#12: Miles Bridges

#14: Michael Porter Jr.

Was it a good pick by Chicago because he's still mostly starting in the NBA? Would AK get a win for getting a player like that? Or would you be upset because of the players he passed on.

I don't even know if it was an option(probably not), but on draft night my hope was that we traded down with LA for their two picks so we could get Shai and MPJ.

[Jvaughn]

Here is who went after WCJ in 2018:

#8: Collin Sexton

#10: Mikal Bridges

#11: Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

#12: Miles Bridges

#14: Michael Porter Jr.

Was it a good pick by Chicago because he's still mostly starting in the NBA? Would AK get a win for getting a player like that? Or would you be upset because of the players he passed on.

Bad pick still where Mikal was the “safe/boring” pick at a position of need and would have worked wonderfully, Porter was the swing for the fences pick and would have been better than WCJ, and SGA was there and some of us (cough) were talking him up as a sleeper pick. After there were also Jalen Brunson and Anfernee Simons and Mitch Robinson - all better than WCJ (Brunson a lot better).

Yeah, that safe pick thing has always PMO. And it seems the Bulls didn't learn their lesson as they then drafted PAW over safe pick Haliburton. Stop overthinking the simple things Bulls FO.

[DuckIII]

Asa Newell really claims that his college team did not use him right. One of his favorite players is Kyle Korver. He also models his game after Chris Bosh. He really sounds like Matas when talks about his shooting when he came in.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Even though I do not want Newell, the following is not about Asa Newell: every big man prospect who doesn’t like their draft position says their college coaches wouldn’t let them show what they can do, play their preferred way, show all their skills, blah, blah, blah.

It’s one of the most common draft cliches out there.

[Chi town]

At this point point it looks like my top 3 of KJ Noa and Coward will all be gone by 12.

I’ve resolved AK will take Demin at 12.

Don’t like the pick but at least it’s not Queen and my hopes would be Demin grows into an elite sharpshooter and starts out as our 6th man.

[nomorezorro]

Asa Newell really claims that his college team did not use him right. One of his favorite players is Kyle Korver. He also models his game after Chris Bosh. He really sounds like Matas when talks about his shooting when he came in.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

i dunno man, "i'm not a center" and "i'm actually really good at 3pt shooting despite sucking at it in college" are not exactly things i want my big man prospect to be saying during the pre-draft process

[jump]

WJC didn’t want to be a C either. He even got his mom to back him up publically.

[boozapalooza]

Here is who went after WCJ in 2018:

#8: Collin Sexton

#10: Mikal Bridges

#11: Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

#12: Miles Bridges

#14: Michael Porter Jr.

Was it a good pick by Chicago because he's still mostly starting in the NBA? Would AK get a win for getting a player like that? Or would you be upset because of the players he passed on.

I’ll die on the hill that WCJ at 7 was a worse draft pick than Pat at 4. No doubt about it. The ceiling for WCJ as an undersized 6’9 center was always being a league average player. No upside for more than that. I remember being stunned we didnt take MPJ, knowing we passed on Shai and both Bridges as well really stings. WCJ’s career has played out exactly as expected, he will be an average/decent bench big the rest of his career.

At least with Pat, that 2020 draft class sucked and there was peak COVID era which greatly messed with the regular predraft process. I can live with taking a swing on the upside we all bought on with Pat. In that position I’d rather swing for the fences than for a single.

[drosestruts]

Yes Kalkbrenner at 22 years old is better than Maluach at 18, but we have Kalkbrenner's stats from when he was younger.

He became the starting center his Sophmore year:

Kalkbrenner as a Sophmore: 13/ 7.7/1 with 3 stocks per game. 67% TS%. 11 BPM. 96.2 DRTG and 133 ORTG

Maluach as a freshman: 9/6.5/0.5 with 1.5 stocks per game. 73% TS%. 9.9 BPM. 94.3 DRtg and 147 ORtg

Kalkbrenners is better now, and he was better when they were a more comparable age.

And he's going to be better in the NBA their rookie year.

And if you're looking to get value out of a player while they're on their rookie contract and not just have a player you're developing who isn't impacting winning - Kalkbrenner will be better for that too.

[jump]

Yes Kalkbrenner at 22 years old is better than Maluach at 18, but we have Kalkbrenner's stats from when he was younger.

He became the starting center his Sophmore year:

Kalkbrenner as a Sophmore: 13/ 7.7/1 with 3 stocks per game. 67% TS%. 11 BPM. 96.2 DRTG and 133 ORTG

Maluach as a freshman: 9/6.5/0.5 with 1.5 stocks per game. 73% TS%. 9.9 BPM. 94.3 DRtg and 147 ORtg

Kalkbrenners is better now, and he was better when they were a more comparable age.

And he's going to be better in the NBA their rookie year.

And if you're looking to get value out of a player while they're on their rookie contract and not just have a player you're developing who isn't impacting winning - Kalkbrenner will be better for that too.

100%. I’m always baffled by the thinking that you don’t draft an upper class man cuz they’re already developed instead of young with “potential.” You get much better productivity on the rookie contract. And often, a better career. Example: Taj Gibson.

[Red Larrivee]

Here is who went after WCJ in 2018:

#8: Collin Sexton

#10: Mikal Bridges

#11: Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

#12: Miles Bridges

#14: Michael Porter Jr.

Was it a good pick by Chicago because he's still mostly starting in the NBA? Would AK get a win for getting a player like that? Or would you be upset because of the players he passed on.

Picking at 6 is very different than picking at 12.

Carter was a very good prospect and extremely productive as a freshman. His upside was an Al Horford type of player, which could've resulted in a few all-star appearances, but wouldn't be a player you build a team around.

It's just not reasonable to have the 12th pick and set your bar at "all-star".

[Jvaughn]

Asa Newell really claims that his college team did not use him right. One of his favorite players is Kyle Korver. He also models his game after Chris Bosh. He really sounds like Matas when talks about his shooting when he came in.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

i dunno man, "i'm not a center" and "i'm actually really good at 3pt shooting despite sucking at it in college" are not exactly things i want my big man prospect to be saying during the pre-draft process

*cough* Tyrus*cough cough*

[Jcool0]

Here is who went after WCJ in 2018:

#8: Collin Sexton

#10: Mikal Bridges

#11: Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

#12: Miles Bridges

#14: Michael Porter Jr.

Was it a good pick by Chicago because he's still mostly starting in the NBA? Would AK get a win for getting a player like that? Or would you be upset because of the players he passed on.

Bad pick still where Mikal was the “safe/boring” pick at a position of need and would have worked wonderfully, Porter was the swing for the fences pick and would have been better than WCJ, and SGA was there and some of us (cough) were talking him up as a sleeper pick. After there were also Jalen Brunson and Anfernee Simons and Mitch Robinson - all better than WCJ (Brunson a lot better).

Yeah, that safe pick thing has always PMO. And it seems the Bulls didn't learn their lesson as they then drafted PAW over safe pick Haliburton. Stop overthinking the simple things Bulls FO.

Deni Avdija was the right pick at 4. I cant 100% fault the Bulls for Haliburton. He went 12th, yeah it sucks he with how it turned out. But he fell out of the top 10 for a reason. It would be like passing on V.J. Edgecombe for the 1 in a million hit with Carter Bryant.

[Jcool0]

Here is who went after WCJ in 2018:

#8: Collin Sexton

#10: Mikal Bridges

#11: Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

#12: Miles Bridges

#14: Michael Porter Jr.

Was it a good pick by Chicago because he's still mostly starting in the NBA? Would AK get a win for getting a player like that? Or would you be upset because of the players he passed on.

Picking at 6 is very different than picking at 12.

Carter was a very good prospect and extremely productive as a freshman. His upside was an Al Horford type of player, which could've resulted in a few all-star appearances, but wouldn't be a player you build a team around.

It's just not reasonable to have the 12th pick and set your bar at "all-star".

It is 100% reasonable to set your expectations higher then fringe starter at 12. WCJ was a classic Pax player. High floor low ceiling "winner". They got so burned by Thomas that they played it safe the rest of the time here.

[Almost Retired]

Sorber would be the team's best rim protector on day one. He'll be the second best rebounder and inside scorer next to Vucevic. I'm not even talking about long term upside. Sorber is that the second he steps on the court, and he will arguably be our best young prospect.

If w're staying with #12 and not trying to move down then we have to consider Sorber if he's still on the board. I see the love for Essengue on the thread. But I think he's too physically similar to Matas. Maybe Matas and Essengue could share the front court interchangeably and cause problems with their length. But we need a front court player with some bulk, either at the "4" or the "5". One that can defend the rim, rebound, and offer something offensively to keep defenses honest. I like Rasheer Fleming. But not at #12. I think Maluach goes top 10. I don't want Queen. I also like Kalkbrenner, but again, not at #12. Which is why I continue to hope AKME can do a deal with Brooklyn to get us their #19 and #26. I've run dozens of simulations. I have been able to land Essengue and Kalkbrenner given the two Brooklyn picks. Or Kalbrenner and Fleming. Two potential starters at positions of need. Whereas sticking with #12 and #45 we'd only land one probable starter and some guy to fill a spot on the Windy City Bulls.

Essengue isn't lasting till 19. I say 5% chance you are getting at starting player at #26.

I disagree. I think there are players all the way into the top of the second round that could develop into starters, or at least important rotation guys. From pick #19 and down guys that could still be available: Will Riley, Rasheer Fleming, Maxine Raynaud, Joan Beringer, Walter Clayton Jr, Nolan Traore, Drake Powell, Danny Wolf, Ben Saraf, Noah Penda, Ryan Kalkbrenner, and Yanic Niederhauser. Now they are not all going to make it. But every one of them could develop in the right system. Fit can sometimes be as important as talent.

[Almost Retired]

Yes Kalkbrenner at 22 years old is better than Maluach at 18, but we have Kalkbrenner's stats from when he was younger.

He became the starting center his Sophmore year:

Kalkbrenner as a Sophmore: 13/ 7.7/1 with 3 stocks per game. 67% TS%. 11 BPM. 96.2 DRTG and 133 ORTG

Maluach as a freshman: 9/6.5/0.5 with 1.5 stocks per game. 73% TS%. 9.9 BPM. 94.3 DRtg and 147 ORtg

Kalkbrenners is better now, and he was better when they were a more comparable age.

And he's going to be better in the NBA their rookie year.

And if you're looking to get value out of a player while they're on their rookie contract and not just have a player you're developing who isn't impacting winning - Kalkbrenner will be better for that too.

100%. I’m always baffled by the thinking that you don’t draft an upper class man cuz they’re already developed instead of young with “potential.” You get much better productivity on the rookie contract. And often, a better career. Example: Taj Gibson.

I think with the NIL money a lot more players will opt to stay in College for 2 or 3 years. Maybe not at the same school. Guys are transferring like crazy. When you realize Cooper Flagg is going to be taking a pay cut to go from Duke to Dallas it's going to have an impact on the number of one and done players. https://www.totalprosports.com/nba/report-shocking-amount-of-money-cooper-flagg-made-in-nil-deals-duke/

[DuckIII]

Asa Newell really claims that his college team did not use him right. One of his favorite players is Kyle Korver. He also models his game after Chris Bosh. He really sounds like Matas when talks about his shooting when he came in.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

i dunno man, "i'm not a center" and "i'm actually really good at 3pt shooting despite sucking at it in college" are not exactly things i want my big man prospect to be saying during the pre-draft process

And yet you’ll hear it said every year. The first guy I ever heard say it was our very own Elton Brand (and later another of our Duke bigs, WCJ), and I’ve been hearing it pretty much every year from someone ever since.

[pipfan]

Asa Newell really claims that his college team did not use him right. One of his favorite players is Kyle Korver. He also models his game after Chris Bosh. He really sounds like Matas when talks about his shooting when he came in.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

i dunno man, "i'm not a center" and "i'm actually really good at 3pt shooting despite sucking at it in college" are not exactly things i want my big man prospect to be saying during the pre-draft process

And yet you’ll hear it said every year. The first guy I ever heard say it was our very own Elton Brand (and later another of our Duke bigs, WCJ), and I’ve been hearing it pretty much every year from someone ever since.

Newell is my first choice-I like the idea of Matas/Newell moving forward as two-way forwards. I want us to play big. See if we can trade White and get a LBall type 3D guy to start with Giddey

[2weekswithpay]

Yes Kalkbrenner at 22 years old is better than Maluach at 18, but we have Kalkbrenner's stats from when he was younger.

He became the starting center his Sophmore year:

Kalkbrenner as a Sophmore: 13/ 7.7/1 with 3 stocks per game. 67% TS%. 11 BPM. 96.2 DRTG and 133 ORTG

Maluach as a freshman: 9/6.5/0.5 with 1.5 stocks per game. 73% TS%. 9.9 BPM. 94.3 DRtg and 147 ORtg

Kalkbrenners is better now, and he was better when they were a more comparable age.

And he's going to be better in the NBA their rookie year.

And if you're looking to get value out of a player while they're on their rookie contract and not just have a player you're developing who isn't impacting winning - Kalkbrenner will be better for that too.

100%. I’m always baffled by the thinking that you don’t draft an upper class man cuz they’re already developed instead of young with “potential.” You get much better productivity on the rookie contract. And often, a better career. Example: Taj Gibson.

Teams want high impact star players, and the majority of those are the 19-20 year olds. Knowing when and who to take the gamble on is important.

[Red Larrivee]

It is 100% reasonable to set your expectations higher then fringe starter at 12. WCJ was a classic Pax player. High floor low ceiling "winner". They got so burned by Thomas that they played it safe the rest of the time here.

That's not the same thing as setting your bar at 12 for "all-star."

[Jcool0]

It is 100% reasonable to set your expectations higher then fringe starter at 12. WCJ was a classic Pax player. High floor low ceiling "winner". They got so burned by Thomas that they played it safe the rest of the time here.

That's not the same thing as setting your bar at 12 for "all-star."

As Wayne Gretzky once said, "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take".