Haynes: Giannis, Bucks Meeting Next Week to Discuss the Direction of the Team

[Profound23]

BTW, this underscores your bias in curating trades as the T&T board moderator, when you'd be like "only this fleecing of the Bucks is realistic & we're also doing you a favor".

But I do think the Bucks are going to have a really tough time being competitive with the dead dame money, how bad Kuzma was, and limited resources to build around Giannis.

This is true for sure. Horst has his work cut out for him. Thankfully he has Doc to bail him out.

[Karate Diop]

Even if they can convince him to stay, by mid season when the Bucks are middling he'll likely ask out...

This is pathetic to keep moving the goal post to suit your agenda. If you can’t admit you’re wrong about a completely neutral issue like sports then you’re probably insufferable on critical issues

Listen I think it'd be great if he stays, but the moves he's forced the organization to make recently have backfired spectacularly, there's certainly growing frustration all around, and if we're being honest the Bucks don't have much of an avenue for improvement.

Nobody is taking Dame off them, there's no young prospects of note, they're not going to get a Celtics / Lakers trade discount... One player can't win it on his own, and that's all the Bucks have right now. One player.

I'm basing my opinion of what will happen on what we've seen happen with other stars in a similar predicament... No hate here.

[Castle Black]

Read on Twitter

[Bernman]

BTW, this underscores your bias in curating trades as the T&T board moderator, when you'd be like "only this fleecing of the Bucks is realistic & we're also doing you a favor".

This is one of the funniest attempts to accuse me of bias I have ever read.

But also its clear you haven't actually read my posts about Giannis on the trade board if this is your takeaway.

Maybe try reading what I've actually said? I mean I haven't been shy about my opinion that:

1. Bucks should try everything else first before resorting to trading Giannis and that only if he demands out and I don't think he's demanding out.
2. I have repeatedly said basically every offer save a couple presented on the trade board were light and many of theme laughably so.

You are so ready to play victim you don't even realize I've been basically on your side lol.

But I do think the Bucks are going to have a really tough time being competitive with the dead dame money, how bad Kuzma was, and limited resources to build around Giannis.

Giannis is awesome. Another take someone who pretends to be so familiar with my thinking and motivation would know. Not just on the trade board, go read how much I;ve defended him for years on the PC Board as well.

Nobody's purporting to be a victim. It's anyone's choice to wade into those waters.

Rather it's an observation on principle. You doubled down on inaccuracies. Sure, you're not at the extreme of the "the Raptors don't even have to give up Scottie Barnes" contingent cuz some bases felt entitled from the corporate media propaganda. But that's a low bar.

[Texas Chuck]

You doubled down on inaccuracies..

Oh I gotta ask. This should be fun. First I'm biased because I want board traffic lol even though you assigned me the exact opposite position I've taken. And I tried hard to talk the board into sticking all Giannis talk into one thread, or the opposite of trying to increase traffic...

Super curious now what inaccuracies I've doubled down on now that you are confronted and having to deal with the realities of my actual position and noT one you just made up for reasons nobody knows lol.

[Matches Malone]

Even if they can convince him to stay, by mid season when the Bucks are middling he'll likely ask out...

This is pathetic to keep moving the goal post to suit your agenda. If you can’t admit you’re wrong about a completely neutral issue like sports then you’re probably insufferable on critical issues

and if we're being honest the Bucks don't have much of an avenue for improvement.

Have to push back on this a bit. Some of the Bucks bigger contracts are coming off the books. That coupled with the new CBA making it harder to keep teams together, they can absolutely capitalize on other teams that need to shed salary to avoid the 2nd apron penalties and could re-tool around Giannis. In a year, their roster could look very different.

[Profound23]

Read on Twitter

OMG, you can hear the disappointment in his voice. Spent months saying Giannis is leaving. He was praying for Giannis to be traded for KAT or to a team in Texas/Cali. Now it's "Giannis isn't demanding a trade and KAT is a star in his prime anyways NY."

[NCHeels2008]

BTW, this underscores your bias in curating trades as the T&T board moderator, when you'd be like "only this fleecing of the Bucks is realistic & we're also doing you a favor".

But I do think the Bucks are going to have a really tough time being competitive with the dead dame money, how bad Kuzma was, and limited resources to build around Giannis.

This is true for sure. Horst has his work cut out for him. Thankfully he has Doc to bail him out.

Unironically Doc is a good coach when its average teams, he's the Leroy Hoard of coaches he is good at getting 45-50 wins no matter the roster quality. You aren't contending with Dame out anyways so I think Doc will be fine with this years Giannis + the miracles roster

[Duffman100]

Nice, happy for Milwaukee.

[tsherkin]

Nice, happy for Milwaukee.

I mean, I think we all knew that this wasn't gonna work when the rumors started to center around him coming to Toronto, heh.

I hope Milwaukee is able to do something to help him feel better about sticking around, though.

[FreeBird23]

As expected

[bisme37]

There are two great teams that got there,” Antetokounmpo said, referring to the Oklahoma City Thunder and the Indiana Pacers reaching the 2025 Finals presented by YouTube TV, “Indiana, with my friend Pascal Siakam, is reaping the rewards, and OKC simply has the MVP [Shai Gilgeous-Alexander]. I’m rooting for good basketball.”

“The Finals are different, I hope to be back soon with the Bucks."

https://sports.yahoo.com/article/giannis-antetokounmpo-quashes-bucks-trade-155650795.html

[Snakebites]

I always figured there was a decent chance of this.

Players don’t always see things the way fans do. From his point of view he loves Milwaukee and the organization and he rightly believes the east is still wide open.

I also really didn’t want to see an already asset-wealthy team like Houston, OKC, or San Antonio to land Giannis either.

[NoBias]

The bucks have no future, and are a crap city. Very surprised he’d want to stay there, but I respect the loyalty. Rare in todays NBA.

[ConSarnit]

This is pathetic to keep moving the goal post to suit your agenda. If you can’t admit you’re wrong about a completely neutral issue like sports then you’re probably insufferable on critical issues

and if we're being honest the Bucks don't have much of an avenue for improvement.

Have to push back on this a bit. Some of the Bucks bigger contracts are coming off the books. That coupled with the new CBA making it harder to keep teams together, they can absolutely capitalize on other teams that need to shed salary to avoid the 2nd apron penalties and could re-tool around Giannis. In a year, their roster could look very different.

How? The Bucks aren’t a free agent destination so they’re not going to get stars. If 2nd apron teams are looking to shed salary they aren’t going to be trading their good players.

Look at the Bucks title team:

Jrue (all-star)
Middleton (all-star)
Lopez (DPOY)

In order to contend they need to replace all of those guys. How are they getting an all-star and a DPOY center with their lack of assets? I’m even giving them the benefit of the doubt here that maybe Dame comes back and can be a Jrue level player in 2026. That still leaves them needing a Middleton level replacement and a Lopez level replacement.

They’ve effectively traded all of their draft assets. Dame is taking up $55m in cap space. They have no youth who project to be all-stars.

How are the Bucks re-tooling? They don’t have cap space (Portis and Connaughton are opting in). Dame is $55m in dead salary. The only draft assets they can trade are swaps on top of already owed swaps. The Bucks have one of the worst asset bases in the entire league.

[ConSarnit]

There are two great teams that got there,” Antetokounmpo said, referring to the Oklahoma City Thunder and the Indiana Pacers reaching the 2025 Finals presented by YouTube TV, “Indiana, with my friend Pascal Siakam, is reaping the rewards, and OKC simply has the MVP [Shai Gilgeous-Alexander]. I’m rooting for good basketball.”

“The Finals are different, I hope to be back soon with the Bucks."

https://sports.yahoo.com/article/giannis-antetokounmpo-quashes-bucks-trade-155650795.html

This quote by Giannis is not what people are making it out to be. Saying “I hope to be back soon with the Bucks” is different than saying “I’m not leaving the Bucks”

Giannis might want to stay but this quote is no firm confirmation of that.

[Matches Malone]

and if we're being honest the Bucks don't have much of an avenue for improvement.

Have to push back on this a bit. Some of the Bucks bigger contracts are coming off the books. That coupled with the new CBA making it harder to keep teams together, they can absolutely capitalize on other teams that need to shed salary to avoid the 2nd apron penalties and could re-tool around Giannis. In a year, their roster could look very different.

How? The Bucks aren’t a free agent destination so they’re not going to get stars. If 2nd apron teams are looking to shed salary they aren’t going to be trading their good players.

Look at the Bucks title team:

Jrue (all-star)
Middleton (all-star)
Lopez (DPOY)

In order to contend they need to replace all of those guys. How are they getting an all-star and a DPOY center with their lack of assets? I’m even giving them the benefit of the doubt here that maybe Dame comes back and can be a Jrue level player in 2026. That still leaves them needing a Middleton level replacement and a Lopez level replacement.

They’ve effectively traded all of their draft assets. Dame is taking up $55m in cap space. They have no youth who project to be all-stars.

How are the Bucks re-tooling? They don’t have cap space (Portis and Connaughton are opting in). Dame is $55m in dead salary. The only draft assets they can trade are swaps on top of already owed swaps. The Bucks have one of the worst asset bases in the entire league.

lol most of the players that made up the bucks championship roster were cast offs or players in slumps. Portis and Connaughton were journeys men. Holiday and Lopez were on a down swing in their careers and only after they joined the bucks were they back in contention for season awards. There’s plenty of examples of players getting a better opportunity somewhere else and developing into a good player or players that were good and need a change of scenery. . Just because the Bucks aren’t a free agent destination doesn’t mean they can’t capitalize on good role players getting cut or finding a distressed asset, absorbing them into their cap and turning it into a positive. They also still have a 2031 1st they can break into multiple 1sts like the jazz did. They have swaps every other year. They aren’t as barren as you’re proclaiming.

[ConSarnit]

Have to push back on this a bit. Some of the Bucks bigger contracts are coming off the books. That coupled with the new CBA making it harder to keep teams together, they can absolutely capitalize on other teams that need to shed salary to avoid the 2nd apron penalties and could re-tool around Giannis. In a year, their roster could look very different.

How? The Bucks aren’t a free agent destination so they’re not going to get stars. If 2nd apron teams are looking to shed salary they aren’t going to be trading their good players.

Look at the Bucks title team:

Jrue (all-star)
Middleton (all-star)
Lopez (DPOY)

In order to contend they need to replace all of those guys. How are they getting an all-star and a DPOY center with their lack of assets? I’m even giving them the benefit of the doubt here that maybe Dame comes back and can be a Jrue level player in 2026. That still leaves them needing a Middleton level replacement and a Lopez level replacement.

They’ve effectively traded all of their draft assets. Dame is taking up $55m in cap space. They have no youth who project to be all-stars.

How are the Bucks re-tooling? They don’t have cap space (Portis and Connaughton are opting in). Dame is $55m in dead salary. The only draft assets they can trade are swaps on top of already owed swaps. The Bucks have one of the worst asset bases in the entire league.

lol most of the players that made up the bucks championship roster were cast offs or players in slumps. Portis and Connaughton were journeys men. Holiday and Lopez were on a down swing in their careers and only after they joined the bucks were they back in contention for season awards. There’s plenty of examples of players getting a better opportunity somewhere else and developing into a good player or players that were good and need a change of scenery. . Just because the Bucks aren’t a free agent destination doesn’t mean they can’t capitalize on good role players getting cut or finding a distressed asset, absorbing them into their cap and turning it into a positive. They also still have a 2031 1st they can break into multiple 1sts like the jazz did. They have swaps every other year. They aren’t as barren as you’re proclaiming.

The Bucks traded 3 1sts and 2 swaps for Holiday. How are they getting the assets to pull that off again?

Look at the return the Suns got for their ‘31 1st: 3 1sts, all of which are the worst of 3 swaps. Those are not the type of picks that return you all-stars.

Putting together a title team took the Bucks 2-3 years. The Bucks are in a much worse spot asset-wise to do so than they were prior to their title. The odds of them pulling it off again are extremely low.

[Matches Malone]

How? The Bucks aren’t a free agent destination so they’re not going to get stars. If 2nd apron teams are looking to shed salary they aren’t going to be trading their good players.

Look at the Bucks title team:

Jrue (all-star)
Middleton (all-star)
Lopez (DPOY)

In order to contend they need to replace all of those guys. How are they getting an all-star and a DPOY center with their lack of assets? I’m even giving them the benefit of the doubt here that maybe Dame comes back and can be a Jrue level player in 2026. That still leaves them needing a Middleton level replacement and a Lopez level replacement.

They’ve effectively traded all of their draft assets. Dame is taking up $55m in cap space. They have no youth who project to be all-stars.

How are the Bucks re-tooling? They don’t have cap space (Portis and Connaughton are opting in). Dame is $55m in dead salary. The only draft assets they can trade are swaps on top of already owed swaps. The Bucks have one of the worst asset bases in the entire league.

lol most of the players that made up the bucks championship roster were cast offs or players in slumps. Portis and Connaughton were journeys men. Holiday and Lopez were on a down swing in their careers and only after they joined the bucks were they back in contention for season awards. There’s plenty of examples of players getting a better opportunity somewhere else and developing into a good player or players that were good and need a change of scenery. . Just because the Bucks aren’t a free agent destination doesn’t mean they can’t capitalize on good role players getting cut or finding a distressed asset, absorbing them into their cap and turning it into a positive. They also still have a 2031 1st they can break into multiple 1sts like the jazz did. They have swaps every other year. They aren’t as barren as you’re proclaiming.

The Bucks traded 3 1sts and 2 swaps for Holiday. How are they getting the assets to pull that off again?

Look at the return the Suns got for their ‘31 1st: 3 1sts, all of which are the worst of 3 swaps. Those are not the type of picks that return you all-stars.

Putting together a title team took the Bucks 2-3 years. The Bucks are in a much worse spot asset-wise to do so than they were prior to their title. The odds of them pulling it off again are extremely low.

Who said they need the exact same blueprint to compete though? That Holiday deal was a big move for the franchise in an old CBA landscape. Plus they’d be using those broken up picks to use in other deals, not develop players. If you don’t think the 2nd apron will continue to ravish teams of fringe starter talent, you’re kidding yourself. Owners pockets will start to get tight and you’re going to see head scratching moves that make no sense on court but financially saves the owner millions. Look no further than that awful Middleton trade where we had to give up our 1st just to ditch the salary and get under the 2nd apron. Now they can maneuver more freely. That’s coming for other teams too.

Never said it would be easy to do it but when you have one of the best players in the world, half the battle is already won. What the bucks really need to do is drop Doc.

[Raps in 4]

There is no chance the Bucks are going to be contenders again with Giannis. They have no assets, and Horst has shown time and time again that he has no ability to identify talent in the draft, not that the Bucks have time to develop any talent at this point anyway given Giannis' age.

If OKC loses in the Finals, I'd do Giannis for Chet or JDub + multiple FRPs.

Otherwise, I call up the Spurs and ask for #2, Castle, and picks.

If neither of those teams want him, I'd send him to Houston. Try to get Sengun or Thompson + FRPs.

Sticking with Giannis would be a mistake. The Bucks have a chance to fast track their inevitable rebuild by trading him now.