Utah-Suns-??? :: who gets Durant?

[zimpy27]

Suns get Lauri, Kessler
Suns give Durant

Jazz get ?????
Jazz give Lauri, Kessler

3rd team get Durant
3rd team give ?????


Lauri+Kessler is a perfect fit return for a Durant trade. Suns build around Booker-Dunn-Lauri-Kessler, both fit in the Durant money meaning Suns can operate above 2nd apron still if they choose.

Jazz want picks package or potential players back for Lauri+Kessler

3rd team acquiring Durant doesn't need to give up players that would help contend, just need to give up picks or players with potential.



Which 3rd team can offer best package to Jazz for Durant?

[babyjax13]

I think Phoenix owes a non-trivial amount here. I have Lauri as slightly less valuable than Durant but Kessler as significant addition whose value exceeds that gap. I think all of the picks we sent to Phoenix should be returned here (or, at least 2). San Antonio feels like the natural third team.

[wemby]

Suns get Lauri, Kessler
Suns give Durant

Jazz get ?????
Jazz give Lauri, Kessler

3rd team get Durant
3rd team give ?????

This is bound to be awful for the Jazz, as this is basically 2 separate trades:
1) Jazz buy Durant for Lauri + Kessler
2) Jazz sell Durant for something else

So basically you'd be getting whatever any team is currently willing to give up for Durant, which you can get a sense of in multiple trades. I don't think Jazz fans will be pleased wih the alternatives.

[zimpy27]

I think Phoenix owes a non-trivial amount here. I have Lauri as slightly less valuable than Durant but Kessler as significant addition whose value exceeds that gap. I think all of the picks we sent to Phoenix should be returned here (or, at least 2). San Antonio feels like the natural third team.

I don't entirely agree but Suns can give up #29, so maybe this:

Suns get Lauri, Kessler, #38
Suns give Durant, #29

Jazz get Vassell, Barnes, #2
Jazz give Lauri, Kessler, #5

Spurs get Durant, #5, #29
Spurs give Vassell, Barnes, #2, #38

[wemby]

So maybe this:

Suns get Lauri, Kessler, #38
Suns give Durant, #29

Jazz get Vassell, Barnes, #2
Jazz give Lauri, Kessler, #5

Spurs get Durant, #5, #29
Spurs give Vassell, Barnes, #2, #38

If Spurs want Durant, they can easily get him without parting with 2. This is a trend that is popping up in multiple threads, but it's just a gimmick used to needlessly rip Harper from the Spurs in order to pump up some third team.

[zimpy27]

So maybe this:

Suns get Lauri, Kessler, #38
Suns give Durant, #29

Jazz get Vassell, Barnes, #2
Jazz give Lauri, Kessler, #5

Spurs get Durant, #5, #29
Spurs give Vassell, Barnes, #2, #38

If Spurs want Durant, they can easily get him without parting with 2. This is a trend that is popping up in multiple threads, but it's just a gimmick used to needlessly rip Harper from the Spurs in order to pump up some third team.

Sure, Spurs could give #14, #38 and 1-2x future FRPs

I just like the idea of Spurs trading out of top 2-4 since you're looking at all guards that mirror Fox-Castle abilities. At #5 you're getting either Ace or Kon. You end up with a great fitting lineup

Fox, Castle, Kon/Ace, Durant, Wemby

[Apz]

I just dont think KD is that valuable for a team like spurs that isnt really there yet. I can see NY as third team maybe, or clippers. I cant really see any team pay 3 1sts, not to even talk about that #2 pick

[babyjax13]

I think Phoenix owes a non-trivial amount here. I have Lauri as slightly less valuable than Durant but Kessler as significant addition whose value exceeds that gap. I think all of the picks we sent to Phoenix should be returned here (or, at least 2). San Antonio feels like the natural third team.

So maybe this:

Suns get Lauri, Kessler, #38
Suns give Durant, #29

Jazz get Vassell, Barnes, #2
Jazz give Lauri, Kessler, #5

Spurs get Durant, #5, #29
Spurs give Vassell, Barnes, #2, #38

I don't see the Spurs putting the second pick on offer, they have enough assets to do it without. I also don't really value Vassell, but I think the Spurs do. My guess would be Johnson + Barnes + 14 + 2027 ATL 1st. I also think this is way too good for Phoenix.

[zimpy27]

I think Phoenix owes a non-trivial amount here. I have Lauri as slightly less valuable than Durant but Kessler as significant addition whose value exceeds that gap. I think all of the picks we sent to Phoenix should be returned here (or, at least 2). San Antonio feels like the natural third team.

So maybe this:

Suns get Lauri, Kessler, #38
Suns give Durant, #29

Jazz get Vassell, Barnes, #2
Jazz give Lauri, Kessler, #5

Spurs get Durant, #5, #29
Spurs give Vassell, Barnes, #2, #38

I don't see the Spurs putting the second pick on offer, they have enough assets to do it without. I also don't really value Vassell, but I think the Spurs do. My guess would be Johnson + Barnes + 14 + 2027 ATL 1st. I also think this is way too good for Phoenix.

Ok so maybe close to this? You don't love it but it's workable

Suns get Lauri, Kessler, #43
Suns give Durant, #29

Jazz get Keldon, Barnes, #14, #29, ATL27FRP
Jazz give Lauri, Kessler, #43

Spurs get Durant
Spurs give Keldon, Barnes, #14, ATL27FRP

[wemby]

Spurs get Durant
Spurs give Keldon, Barnes, #14, #38, ATL27FRP[/b]

14 + Hawks 27 for Durant feels like an overpay, but at least it's not as crazy as throwing in #2

[zimpy27]

I do remember that Ainge wanted Keldon and Vassell and 2x FRPs for Lauri last offseason.

I think we are close with this trade.

[babyjax13]

So maybe this:

Suns get Lauri, Kessler, #38
Suns give Durant, #29

Jazz get Vassell, Barnes, #2
Jazz give Lauri, Kessler, #5

Spurs get Durant, #5, #29
Spurs give Vassell, Barnes, #2, #38

I don't see the Spurs putting the second pick on offer, they have enough assets to do it without. I also don't really value Vassell, but I think the Spurs do. My guess would be Johnson + Barnes + 14 + 2027 ATL 1st. I also think this is way too good for Phoenix.

Ok so maybe close to this? You don't love it but it's workable

Suns get Lauri, Kessler, #43
Suns give Durant, #29

Jazz get Keldon, Barnes, #14, #29, ATL27FRP
Jazz give Lauri, Kessler, #43

Spurs get Durant
Spurs give Keldon, Barnes, #14, ATL27FRP

I would not be thrilled with that return, I'd rather just keep Kessler out of the deal.

[SkyHook]

The Jazz should pass on every iteration here.

[bkohler]

I think if you remove Kessler this makes way more sense.

[zimpy27]

I don't see the Spurs putting the second pick on offer, they have enough assets to do it without. I also don't really value Vassell, but I think the Spurs do. My guess would be Johnson + Barnes + 14 + 2027 ATL 1st. I also think this is way too good for Phoenix.

Ok so maybe close to this? You don't love it but it's workable

Suns get Lauri, Kessler, #43
Suns give Durant, #29

Jazz get Keldon, Barnes, #14, #29, ATL27FRP
Jazz give Lauri, Kessler, #43

Spurs get Durant
Spurs give Keldon, Barnes, #14, ATL27FRP

I would not be thrilled with that return, I'd rather just keep Kessler out of the deal.

Well Spurs can also give their 2029 FRP to Jazz. Does that make it happen?

[Tim Lehrbach]

Sure, Spurs could give #14, #38 and 1-2x future FRPs

I just like the idea of Spurs trading out of top 2-4 since you're looking at all guards that mirror Fox-Castle abilities. At #5 you're getting either Ace or Kon. You end up with a great fitting lineup

Fox, Castle, Kon/Ace, Durant, Wemby

FWIW, and it may not be much because I carry a pro-Harper bias, I don't see Harper as much like Fox or Castle. I can see some overlap with Fox, perhaps, in the basic sense that both present as primary offensive engines, but their play styles are not identical, so they shouldn't be duplicative unless both guys are intent on the "taking turns" approach instead of leaning into being a secondary creator at times. Even if that occurs and the fit is off, I think the Spurs should bet on Harper's rookie year and ship him only after he shows out. This is not a case where his value is highest as a draft pick, IMO, because a lot of people (and thus probably front offices) believe Harper has a lot to prove. (Of course, if the Spurs also question his upside, then they don't draft him, and a move down as you suggest has merit. Maybe there is implied doubt of Harper baked into your thinking here?)

Also, I know you said Kon or Ace, but I have Ace Bailey as a seriously suspect pick for the Spurs or anybody in the top five-ish. He'll experience terrible growing pains and probably find himself trying out a dozen roles before finding his NBA groove (if he does at all), and San Antonio ain't got time for that. I may be unduly harsh, but I can only see Ace thriving where he is the featured prospect who can make tons of mistakes and learn from them, but this in turn could stifle others' development. To teams in the high lottery, I would say walk away in favor of somebody fitting a clearer NBA archetype or possessing skills already displayed against good competition. Maybe he works in Washington or Charlotte if they favor the big swing over immediate returns, but I'll just admit I am not a fan.

If San Antonio doesn't like Harper for whatever reason, Knueppel could be a reasonable target, but as much as I may like him, that's a disappointing pull from their starting position of second in the draft. I'd sooner pivot to veteran help than trade down, which is probably an unpopular idea with Spurs fans. Also, fit be darned, they can just pick Edgecombe. He certainly improves their athleticism and defensive energy and arguably has upside equal to Harper's on account of the physical gifts and apparent competitive drive.

I probably post too much about San Antonio's draft situation. I just find it a fascination position to be in.