2025 Draft prospects - thread 2

[Red Larrivee]

Pat info was very close to the draft. Really Hutch is the only example I can think of.

The Ball thing goes in a different category. Free agency plans are often reported in advance.

Yeah, bad news is that each of AK's lottery picks were telegraphed and leaked at some point.

KC dropping Powell is way too surprising to not have some credibility. It reminds me of when he was persistent with the Bulls interest in Jaxson Hayes in 2019. They took Coby, but Hayes was the next pick. I don't think Powell is the guy at 12, but maybe they have a trade down scenario in mind that involves him.

Good news is that this draft after 3 is very unpredictable. There's a chance Demin goes higher, or a player they like more, but didn't expect to be there (Matas) is available.

[Guru]

I truly can't believe we would take Demin, He's a terrible prospect and redundant.

I see him like Franz and Chicago wants two playmakers on the floor.

But his defense isn't great, and his shooting isn't great, and his scoring isn't great and his rebounding isn't great.

[sco]

So let’s say rumors come true…

Demin at 12.

Late 1st for Vuc and we get Drake.

Where are the mins???

Zo/Ayo/Demin
Coby/Huerter
Giddey/Buz/Drake
Buz/Pat
Collins/Smith

I look at it this way, they'll get spot minutes in the first half of the year. If they show any promise, I could easily see some combo of Ayo/Zo/Huerter traded at the deadline. Also, Pat isn't assured minutes...he'd be the playing-time hurdle, and I'd be happy if Pat decided to make it a high hurdle this season.

[sco]

I truly can't believe we would take Demin, He's a terrible prospect and redundant.

I see him like Franz and Chicago wants two playmakers on the floor.

I get what you're saying, but the comparison seems flawed from the perspective that Franz came into the league with very good defense, where Demin seems lacking. I don't care about the redundant (with Giddey) issue, given their size and positional flexibility, but Giddey or no Giddey, I don't want a guy who can't shoot 3's or defend, even if he is a passing savant. We complained about Giddey's limitations when he got here and their impact on building a winning roster...this would be worse. Of course Demin could develop, but why get a guy who could develop favorable attributes when you could draft one that already has them?

[DuckIII]

That's easy to say. The reality is that if a guy isn't productive in his 1st year and doesn't have a clear development plan they can easily get lost in the shuffle. You have to have a vision of how a guy gets on the court and what productive thing he does when he gets there or yiu literally end up with Terry. If he shoots 27% from 3, can't defend and is like the 5th best point guard on the team, how does he get on the court?

Terry is irrelevant because he sucks. That’s the only reason he’s not good. Obviously the key to getting on the court is to not suck like Terry. Who still plays by the way.

There is not a single player being discussed at 12 who won’t later start on the Bulls if he develops well. We aren’t good.

Of course there are. We have Giddey and Coby, who panned out as #6 and #7 picks and play point. If a reasonable #12 pick who is also a point (like Demin or several others) develops well (say they become the 8th best player in this draft), they could still easily be inferior to those two forever, and due to lack of complementary skills, never start alongside them.

To be perfectly honest there is no obvious path to be a starter for almost any draftee at 12 - they'll really have to stand out. Obviously they'd have to do so to unseat Coby, Giddey or Matas, but even to unseat Smith (a #10 pick who has developed IMO), Ball (#2 pick who developed), Ayo, Huerter it won't be an easy task. Most of the time a guy has to be near a top 5 player in a draft to be an eventual fixture as a starter, and that's not projected from the 12 spot.

We have, at the absolute most, 3 core players. And all 3 of them play multiple positions. There is not a single player being discussed at 12 that would not start for the Bulls if they reach their potential. Zero.

We do not have a roster that is even remotely fixed.

[drosestruts]

I have a lot of the same feelings about Demin as I do Ace Bailey.

They both look good if they completley change the way they play and grow to do anything actually well, because they don't really do anything well today.

Which again you could say about any prospect.

[League Circles]

Terry is irrelevant because he sucks. That’s the only reason he’s not good. Obviously the key to getting on the court is to not suck like Terry. Who still plays by the way.

There is not a single player being discussed at 12 who won’t later start on the Bulls if he develops well. We aren’t good.

Of course there are. We have Giddey and Coby, who panned out as #6 and #7 picks and play point. If a reasonable #12 pick who is also a point (like Demin or several others) develops well (say they become the 8th best player in this draft), they could still easily be inferior to those two forever, and due to lack of complementary skills, never start alongside them.

To be perfectly honest there is no obvious path to be a starter for almost any draftee at 12 - they'll really have to stand out. Obviously they'd have to do so to unseat Coby, Giddey or Matas, but even to unseat Smith (a #10 pick who has developed IMO), Ball (#2 pick who developed), Ayo, Huerter it won't be an easy task. Most of the time a guy has to be near a top 5 player in a draft to be an eventual fixture as a starter, and that's not projected from the 12 spot.

We have, at the absolute most, 3 core players. And all 3 of them play multiple positions. There is not a single player being discussed at 12 that would not start for the Bulls if they reach their potential. Zero.

We do not have a roster that is even remotely fixed.

Fair enough. I think many players have the potential to be the best player in a draft, including this one (despite how good Flagg projects), so yes, if a guy does that, he'd start for us regardless. But to me, "developing well" just means ending up being the 12th best or better player in the draft, and at that level (say the 8th-11th best player) the player should by no means be assumed to start for us indefinitely. He certainly might, but success at #12 doesn't necessarily imply core piece IMO. I've never seen 12 core guys in a draft. Can't remember ever seeing more than like 5-7 guys.

[Guru]

Do we have a blueprint of what we want to draft in Pwill and Terry. Potential 2 way players with upside?

Thats CMB, Newell, Fleming, Carter Bryant, Essengue, Clifford. Thiero

Still young, 1-2 years in school

By Clifford and Thiero

Can you run the floor and fit in the system?

Thats everyone else I think

So maube the list is CMB, Newell, Fleming, Bryant and Essengue....and I guess Demin who sucks and is terrible.

[Hangtime84]

I truly can't believe we would take Demin, He's a terrible prospect and redundant.

I see him like Franz and Chicago wants two playmakers on the floor.

But his defense isn't great, and his shooting isn't great, and his scoring isn't great and his rebounding isn't great.

Shot well in the combine that made scouts rethink things and his form isn’t terrible.

That same combine that supposedly dropping CMB and Queen in mocks. I haven’t watched full BYU games to know what his role was on the floor or responsibilities.

[Hangtime84]

I have a lot of the same feelings about Demin as I do Ace Bailey.

They both look good if they completley change the way they play and grow to do anything actually well, because they don't really do anything well today.

Which again you could say about any prospect.

Exactly where I am

[Guru]

I see him like Franz and Chicago wants two playmakers on the floor.

But his defense isn't great, and his shooting isn't great, and his scoring isn't great and his rebounding isn't great.

Shot well in the combine that made scouts rethink things and his form isn’t terrible.

That same combine that supposedly dropping CMB and Queen in mocks. I haven’t watched full BYU games to know what his role was on the floor or responsibilities.

in the BYU games I watched I had trouble figuring out who he was because he doesn't stand out.

[Chi town]

Round 1: Essengue/Fleming
Round 2: Raynaud/Kalk/Rocco

Acquire Coward somehow.

Giddey/Ayo
Coby/Coward
Buzelis/Terry
Essengue or Flem/Smith
Collins/C Pick

No way AK selects 3 rookies.

[Chi town]

I have a lot of the same feelings about Demin as I do Ace Bailey.

They both look good if they completley change the way they play and grow to do anything actually well, because they don't really do anything well today.

Which again you could say about any prospect.

Exactly where I am

Agreed!

I do think Demin in our pace offense as a secondary handler could bring out the best in him at this stage in his development. Tons of pass aheads open 3s and dunks.

[Guru]

My guess on the draft

1-4
Flagg-Harper-Edgecombe-Bailey

Next 4 are the potential offensive stars. They won't be drafted in this order but all will be gone by 12
Queen-Johnson-KJ-Fears

2 players that will be gone that I dont want Maluach and Kon

1 player I hope is gone but might still be there Demin

That leaves us with a pool of CMB, Fleming, Bryant, Essengue, Newell, Clifford, Thiero, Wolf, Sorber, Coward.

In that instance I think we take Newell and Id want us to take CMB

[Chi town]

I truly can't believe we would take Demin, He's a terrible prospect and redundant.

I see him like Franz and Chicago wants two playmakers on the floor.

But his defense isn't great, and his shooting isn't great, and his scoring isn't great and his rebounding isn't great.

Franz didn’t look that great after his freshman year. 11ppg and 31% from 3. He still hasn’t developed the 3 ball.

I agree with this analysis. Still haven’t seen Demin’s CS numbers.

https://holybackboard.com/2025/05/18/egor-demin-deep-dive/

[Guru]

I don't think its bad logic to get another passer. But why not Danny Wolf then? He has more strengths than Demin and they share weaknesses.

[Jcool0]

I don't think its bad logic to get another passer. But why not Danny Wolf then? He has more strengths than Demin and they share weaknesses.

His passing is only a "strength" because he is a center not because he is that good at it. He is a turnover machine. While his 3PT% is okay for a 7fter his FT% is bad. He is also a bad defender and not particularly athletic.

[Jvaughn]

I don't think its bad logic to get another passer. But why not Danny Wolf then? He has more strengths than Demin and they share weaknesses.

His passing is only a "strength" because he is a center not because he is that good at it. He is a turnover machine. While his 3PT% is okay for a 7fter his FT% is bad. He is also a bad defender and not particularly athletic.

Yeah I do not understand the allure of Danny Wolf. He's got 2nd rounder that will be overseas in 2 years written all over him.

[Jcool0]

I don't think its bad logic to get another passer. But why not Danny Wolf then? He has more strengths than Demin and they share weaknesses.

His passing is only a "strength" because he is a center not because he is that good at it. He is a turnover machine. While his 3PT% is okay for a 7fter his FT% is bad. He is also a bad defender and not particularly athletic.

Yeah I do not understand the allure of Danny Wolf. He's got 2nd rounder that will be overseas in 2 years written all over him.

If they squint really really really hard...

[Jvaughn]

His passing is only a "strength" because he is a center not because he is that good at it. He is a turnover machine. While his 3PT% is okay for a 7fter his FT% is bad. He is also a bad defender and not particularly athletic.

Yeah I do not understand the allure of Danny Wolf. He's got 2nd rounder that will be overseas in 2 years written all over him.

If they squint really really really hard...

I'd have to be legally blind to see that comparison. Jokic is such a dangerous passer, because he's elite offensively in 1 on 1 situations. You have to either send the double and hope his teammates miss open shots or live with getting beat by Jokic on the block as he puts up 40. Danny Wolf scores on average efficiency while sporting a 1:1 AST/TO ratio. I'll take my chances letting my big guard him 1 on 1. No competent coach would run a system through him.