Official 2024-2025 Magic Trade ideas thread continued

[tiderulz]

This. Simons alone doesn’t fix much and this board would turn on him quicker than they did KCP. You guys think KCP is useless when his shots aren’t falling? Lmao, oh boy you guys are in for a rude awakening.

Also, acquiring Simons only means committing to signing him to a 4 yr./80-100M deal.

I don’t want to sound like a Simons hater, because we obviously need shooting and he’s a hometown kid and I’m soft for things like that but thinking he’s going to come in here and revolutionize the offense is comical.

If the difference between acquiring him and someone like Monk cost Orlando an additional FRP, I think the latter would be a much much better investment and I’ll die on this hill (and proudly eat crow if I’m wrong).

I get it. though to be fair, Monk isnt a great 3 pt shooter (gone down the past 3 years) and his defense is pretty bad too. I could be on board for Monk, if only that he is under contract longer.

All true, not one single player is perfect. However, the main difference between Monk and Simons is playmaking and Monks ability to be a lead ball handler. Which imo should take precedence over one dimensional shooter.

You want shooting? Then just sign Trent/Exum/Burks/Merrill/Mann/Jones/Beasley/Jerome/NAW for a fraction of the price.

or my favorite target Quentin Grimes but he’ll probably command more than the MLE.

how do you measure that "playmaking" though? not apg, because they are about the same.

[bigdogdylan5]

I get it. though to be fair, Monk isnt a great 3 pt shooter (gone down the past 3 years) and his defense is pretty bad too. I could be on board for Monk, if only that he is under contract longer.

When you dig into the actual shooting numbers for monk they are better than they seem. Yea he is going down but his numbers from the corners are at 40% and open shots are high 30s to 40. I think it was on the Vecine Magic breakdown episode they talked about this. Sounds like if he takes more open shots and less bad shots playing off Paolo and Franz might not be an issue.

[tiderulz]

I get it. though to be fair, Monk isnt a great 3 pt shooter (gone down the past 3 years) and his defense is pretty bad too. I could be on board for Monk, if only that he is under contract longer.

When you dig into the actual shooting numbers for monk they are better than they seem. Yea he is going down but his numbers from the corners are at 40% and open shots are high 30s to 40. I think it was on the Vecine Magic breakdown episode they talked about this. Sounds like if he takes more open shots and less bad shots playing off Paolo and Franz might not be an issue.

but if you are getting Monk to be a playmaker, he isnt going to be camping in the corner.

[bigdogdylan5]

I think this Magic offseason is alot more confusing than people give it credit for. I know everyone wants to put the pedal to the metal and trade our picks for a difference maker. It’s just way more complicated than that because of our salary. I think moving Isaac Anthony and one of our picks for a bench scoring guard makes a lot of sense but even if it’s Monk or Simons I don’t think we plan on extending them unless we can get a good deal. So in that case it’s more of a rental than anything. I think Colby white is way out of bounds. He is going to want a massive contract extension probably higher than what Suggs got. I think Chicago will probably give it to him. The aprons are a huge consideration here. We still are small market team and I don’t want to mess to much around with the aprons or the tax till Paolo and Franz are 25-26. We aren’t OKC Cleveland or even the Pacers. Their stars are in their prime and ready to rock.

The continued improvement of this team will come with improvement leaps by our 3 guys. They will determine the ceiling for this team. Doesn’t mean we should be complacent this team does need some tweaks but I don’t expect massive overhauls or a lot of money to be spent.

[bigdogdylan5]

I get it. though to be fair, Monk isnt a great 3 pt shooter (gone down the past 3 years) and his defense is pretty bad too. I could be on board for Monk, if only that he is under contract longer.

When you dig into the actual shooting numbers for monk they are better than they seem. Yea he is going down but his numbers from the corners are at 40% and open shots are high 30s to 40. I think it was on the Vecine Magic breakdown episode they talked about this. Sounds like if he takes more open shots and less bad shots playing off Paolo and Franz might not be an issue.

but if you are getting Monk to be a playmaker, he isnt going to be camping in the corner.

I mean it’s yes and no right? You’re still going to want to stagger Paolo and Franz minutes and have them run majority of offense. You need a pressure relief valve someone who can take the burden for short bursts but can also play off Paolo and Franz the rest of the time. I think Simons is better fit for that. Monk is more of a risk I don’t want another Anthony situation who the guy can’t play off Paolo and Franz and just pounds the ball.

[YosemiteSam]

After hundreds of pages in this thread, here is where I am landing 2 weeks out from the draft/free agency. Just a long time fan's and poster's POV FWIW:

-> Keep Paolo (extend), Franz, Suggs as core (unless a top 10-15 player like Booker becomes truly available)
-> Decline Moe and Harris
-> Re-sign Moe to multi-year deal with Team options and/or injury outs
-> Re-sign Caleb
-> Explore a trade with #16 and a future 1st Top 10 protected plus Isaac and Cole for salary match for the best guard we can get - adjust picks, protections, and bench players depending on quality of the player and the contract situation
-> use #25 pick to draft BPA, either PF/center or playmaking guard - prefer an older player who can contribute now like Clayton, Coward or Clifford
-> Explore swapping Jett for another mid-round rookie contract bust like Cody Williams, Kobe Bufkin, or Jalen Hood-Schifino - hoping for a change of scenery boost for both sides
-> Keep Black, KCP, WCJ, TDS, and Goga unless needed for trade above (can't have too much turnover)
-> Fill out with minimum veterans
-> Force Mosley to hire an offensive coordinator and give him a one year deadline to improve offensive ranking to at least top 15 or he is replaced

2025 Opening Roster

PG: Suggs, Black, veteran PG (like CuJo, Schoder, Payne, Dinwiddie, etc.)
SG: Trade, KCP, Jett/other
SF: Franz, TDS, Caleb
PF: Paolo, Moe, Rookie
C: WCJ, Goga, free agent

[eyriq]

Here is my assessment of common scoring guards we've discussed and a grade for their fit along with why

1. Simons: A-, elite pull-up spacing and secondary playmaking that directly solve our offensive gaps

2a. Monk: B+, the best value-for-upside guard on the market (explosive scorer, elite catch-and-shoot threat, underrated passer) and unlikely to cost premium assets

2b. Coby: B+, two-way size, efficient volume shooting, and lineup flexibility without breaking the cap, though his moderate creation ceiling and trade cost keep him just behind Simons

3. Reaves: B, the most well-rounded guard on the board (spacing, passing, and defending) but his rising cost and limited shot creation relative to Simons limit his upside fit

4. Sexton: B-, brings rim pressure and efficient scoring at a low acquisition cost, but his limited 3P volume and poor defence make him an incomplete solution

5. Poole: C+, gives you nuclear pull-up range but at the highest financial and defensive cost, making him a risky fit for a Mosley team that wins with discipline and structure

[Magic_Johnny12]

I get it. though to be fair, Monk isnt a great 3 pt shooter (gone down the past 3 years) and his defense is pretty bad too. I could be on board for Monk, if only that he is under contract longer.

All true, not one single player is perfect. However, the main difference between Monk and Simons is playmaking and Monks ability to be a lead ball handler. Which imo should take precedence over one dimensional shooter.

You want shooting? Then just sign Trent/Exum/Burks/Merrill/Mann/Jones/Beasley/Jerome/NAW for a fraction of the price.

or my favorite target Quentin Grimes but he’ll probably command more than the MLE.

how do you measure that "playmaking" though? not apg, because they are about the same.

Roles primarily and watching a lot of film.

Portland primarily uses Simons strictly as a “shot creator” because Simons lacks the ball handling or skills to play make for others. Portland preferred Scoot to Simons at PG for this reason and prefers Sharpe to Simons at SG (hence why he’s on the block). Simons is your prototypical microwave scorer that is the same player that he was 4 seasons ago. Mediocre efficiency, piss poor defender, doesn’t play make and is a black hole when his shot isn’t falling.

Don’t believe me? Go to the Portland board and read a little or hopefully J Roy is sniffing around and he can provide a little more insight.

Monk is used as a “primary ball handler” and his stats aren’t gaudy because he was also playing with Derozan/Lavine who both play make and have the ball in their hands a lot. Before he was appointed a starter his offensive role was “secondary ball handler” so his entire tenure in Sacramento he has been asked to handle the ball and subsequently play make.

Lastly, per bball index the difference defensively between the two is more than people think. Monk for the past two seasons has almost been a neutral defender. I know that doesn’t seem like much, but it is for a small guard.

Simons has been the top-3 worst defender in the entire league his entire career (this is not me exaggerating, please check for yourself).

Trust me, I want to be wrong and want Simons to be the answer to all our problems but don’t think much people really take the time to dive deep into the details.

[tiderulz]

When you dig into the actual shooting numbers for monk they are better than they seem. Yea he is going down but his numbers from the corners are at 40% and open shots are high 30s to 40. I think it was on the Vecine Magic breakdown episode they talked about this. Sounds like if he takes more open shots and less bad shots playing off Paolo and Franz might not be an issue.

but if you are getting Monk to be a playmaker, he isnt going to be camping in the corner.

I mean it’s yes and no right? You’re still going to want to stagger Paolo and Franz minutes and have them run majority of offense. You need a pressure relief valve someone who can take the burden for short bursts but can also play off Paolo and Franz the rest of the time. I think Simons is better fit for that. Monk is more of a risk I don’t want another Anthony situation who the guy can’t play off Paolo and Franz and just pounds the ball.

but i dont. I dont want Paolo and Franz running the majority of the offense. Be a hub and facilitator sure, but they arent capable right now of doing that. Paolo didnt do it at Duke. 3 years into the NBA, he has shown skills, but not to be an efficient offensive initiator. same with Franz.

[basketballRob]

Poole with 14.8 3-pt attempts per 100. Simons 12.6, Coby White 11.1, Reaves 10.2, Haliburton 11.0, and Sexton 7.4.

Poole will pull a lot of gravity with that amount of attempts.

Sent from my SM-G781U using RealGM mobile app

[Magic_Johnny12]

Here is my assessment of common scoring guards we've discussed and a grade for their fit along with why

1. Simons: A-, elite pull-up spacing and secondary playmaking that directly solve our offensive gaps

2a. Monk: B+, the best value-for-upside guard on the market (explosive scorer, elite catch-and-shoot threat, underrated passer) and unlikely to cost premium assets

2b. Coby: B+, two-way size, efficient volume shooting, and lineup flexibility without breaking the cap, though his moderate creation ceiling and trade cost keep him just behind Simons

3. Reaves: B, the most well-rounded guard on the board (spacing, passing, and defending) but his rising cost and limited shot creation relative to Simons limit his upside fit

4. Sexton: B-, brings rim pressure and efficient scoring at a low acquisition cost, but his limited 3P volume and poor defence make him an incomplete solution

5. Poole: C+, gives you nuclear pull-up range but at the highest financial and defensive cost, making him a risky fit for a Mosley team that wins with discipline and structure

Not commenting on your assessment, but this is my preferred trade choices from best to last with ALL things considered.

1) Austin Reaves

2) Malik Monk

3) Coby White

4) Jordan Poole

5a) Anfernee Simons

5b) Collin Sexton

[eyriq]

Here is my assessment of common scoring guards we've discussed and a grade for their fit along with why

1. Simons: A-, elite pull-up spacing and secondary playmaking that directly solve our offensive gaps

2a. Monk: B+, the best value-for-upside guard on the market (explosive scorer, elite catch-and-shoot threat, underrated passer) and unlikely to cost premium assets

2b. Coby: B+, two-way size, efficient volume shooting, and lineup flexibility without breaking the cap, though his moderate creation ceiling and trade cost keep him just behind Simons

3. Reaves: B, the most well-rounded guard on the board (spacing, passing, and defending) but his rising cost and limited shot creation relative to Simons limit his upside fit

4. Sexton: B-, brings rim pressure and efficient scoring at a low acquisition cost, but his limited 3P volume and poor defence make him an incomplete solution

5. Poole: C+, gives you nuclear pull-up range but at the highest financial and defensive cost, making him a risky fit for a Mosley team that wins with discipline and structure

Not commenting on your assessment, but this is my preferred trade choices from best to last with ALL things considered.

1) Austin Reaves

2) Malik Monk

3) Coby White

4) Jordan Poole

5a) Anfernee Simons

5b) Collin Sexton

I've come a long way on Simons. I'm now a believer. That said, it's interesting that Monk would be our consensus pick.

[tiderulz]

All true, not one single player is perfect. However, the main difference between Monk and Simons is playmaking and Monks ability to be a lead ball handler. Which imo should take precedence over one dimensional shooter.

You want shooting? Then just sign Trent/Exum/Burks/Merrill/Mann/Jones/Beasley/Jerome/NAW for a fraction of the price.

or my favorite target Quentin Grimes but he’ll probably command more than the MLE.

how do you measure that "playmaking" though? not apg, because they are about the same.

Roles primarily and watching a lot of film.

Portland primarily uses Simons strictly as a “shot creator” because Simons lacks the ball handling or skills to play make for others. Portland preferred Scoot to Simons at PG for this reason and prefers Sharpe to Simons at SG (hence why he’s on the block). Simons is your prototypical microwave scorer that is the same player that he was 4 seasons ago. Mediocre efficiency, piss poor defender, doesn’t play make and is a black hole when his shot isn’t falling.

Don’t believe me? Go to the Portland board and read a little or hopefully J Roy is sniffing around and he can provide a little more insight.

Monk is used as a “primary ball handler” and his stats aren’t gaudy because he was also playing with Derozan/Lavine who both play make and have the ball in their hands a lot. Before he was appointed a starter his offensive role was “secondary ball handler” so his entire tenure in Sacramento he has been asked to handle the ball and subsequently play make.

Lastly, per bball index the difference defensively between the two is more than people think. Monk for the past two seasons has almost been a neutral defender. I know that doesn’t seem like much, but it is for a small guard.

Simons has been the top-3 worst defender in the entire league his entire career (this is not me exaggerating, please check for yourself).

Trust me, I want to be wrong and want Simons to be the answer to all our problems but don’t think much people really take the time to dive deep into the details.

I know Simons is a bad defender. But there seems to be something in the water in Portland. CJ wasnt a good defender, Dame really isnt a good defender. no one in Portland really seemed to be a good defender for a long time.

[Magic_Johnny12]

how do you measure that "playmaking" though? not apg, because they are about the same.

Roles primarily and watching a lot of film.

Portland primarily uses Simons strictly as a “shot creator” because Simons lacks the ball handling or skills to play make for others. Portland preferred Scoot to Simons at PG for this reason and prefers Sharpe to Simons at SG (hence why he’s on the block). Simons is your prototypical microwave scorer that is the same player that he was 4 seasons ago. Mediocre efficiency, piss poor defender, doesn’t play make and is a black hole when his shot isn’t falling.

Don’t believe me? Go to the Portland board and read a little or hopefully J Roy is sniffing around and he can provide a little more insight.

Monk is used as a “primary ball handler” and his stats aren’t gaudy because he was also playing with Derozan/Lavine who both play make and have the ball in their hands a lot. Before he was appointed a starter his offensive role was “secondary ball handler” so his entire tenure in Sacramento he has been asked to handle the ball and subsequently play make.

Lastly, per bball index the difference defensively between the two is more than people think. Monk for the past two seasons has almost been a neutral defender. I know that doesn’t seem like much, but it is for a small guard.

Simons has been the top-3 worst defender in the entire league his entire career (this is not me exaggerating, please check for yourself).

Trust me, I want to be wrong and want Simons to be the answer to all our problems but don’t think much people really take the time to dive deep into the details.

I know Simons is a bad defender. But there seems to be something in the water in Portland. CJ wasnt a good defender, Dame really isnt a good defender. no one in Portland really seemed to be a good defender for a long time.

I mean Dame and CJ are still very poor defenders haha.

Simons shows zero effort on that end. Despite having good WS and athleticism he avgs less than 1SPG.

He will undoubtedly be played off the court in a playoff setting, Monk I’m not so sure.

[RichCollab]

how do you measure that "playmaking" though? not apg, because they are about the same.

Roles primarily and watching a lot of film.

Portland primarily uses Simons strictly as a “shot creator” because Simons lacks the ball handling or skills to play make for others. Portland preferred Scoot to Simons at PG for this reason and prefers Sharpe to Simons at SG (hence why he’s on the block). Simons is your prototypical microwave scorer that is the same player that he was 4 seasons ago. Mediocre efficiency, piss poor defender, doesn’t play make and is a black hole when his shot isn’t falling.

Don’t believe me? Go to the Portland board and read a little or hopefully J Roy is sniffing around and he can provide a little more insight.

Monk is used as a “primary ball handler” and his stats aren’t gaudy because he was also playing with Derozan/Lavine who both play make and have the ball in their hands a lot. Before he was appointed a starter his offensive role was “secondary ball handler” so his entire tenure in Sacramento he has been asked to handle the ball and subsequently play make.

Lastly, per bball index the difference defensively between the two is more than people think. Monk for the past two seasons has almost been a neutral defender. I know that doesn’t seem like much, but it is for a small guard.

Simons has been the top-3 worst defender in the entire league his entire career (this is not me exaggerating, please check for yourself).

Trust me, I want to be wrong and want Simons to be the answer to all our problems but don’t think much people really take the time to dive deep into the details.

I know Simons is a bad defender. But there seems to be something in the water in Portland. CJ wasnt a good defender, Dame really isnt a good defender. no one in Portland really seemed to be a good defender for a long time.

Portland’s culture and who they targeted in the draft.

[JRoy]

All true, not one single player is perfect. However, the main difference between Monk and Simons is playmaking and Monks ability to be a lead ball handler. Which imo should take precedence over one dimensional shooter.

You want shooting? Then just sign Trent/Exum/Burks/Merrill/Mann/Jones/Beasley/Jerome/NAW for a fraction of the price.

or my favorite target Quentin Grimes but he’ll probably command more than the MLE.

how do you measure that "playmaking" though? not apg, because they are about the same.

Roles primarily and watching a lot of film.

Portland primarily uses Simons strictly as a “shot creator” because Simons lacks the ball handling or skills to play make for others. Portland preferred Scoot to Simons at PG for this reason and prefers Sharpe to Simons at SG (hence why he’s on the block). Simons is your prototypical microwave scorer that is the same player that he was 4 seasons ago. Mediocre efficiency, piss poor defender, doesn’t play make and is a black hole when his shot isn’t falling.

Don’t believe me? Go to the Portland board and read a little or hopefully J Roy is sniffing around and he can provide a little more insight.

Monk is used as a “primary ball handler” and his stats aren’t gaudy because he was also playing with Derozan/Lavine who both play make and have the ball in their hands a lot. Before he was appointed a starter his offensive role was “secondary ball handler” so his entire tenure in Sacramento he has been asked to handle the ball and subsequently play make.

Lastly, per bball index the difference defensively between the two is more than people think. Monk for the past two seasons has almost been a neutral defender. I know that doesn’t seem like much, but it is for a small guard.

Simons has been the top-3 worst defender in the entire league his entire career (this is not me exaggerating, please check for yourself).

Trust me, I want to be wrong and want Simons to be the answer to all our problems but don’t think much people really take the time to dive deep into the details.

Simons is a solution to one ORL issue; high volume three point shooting and shot creation.

He is a mediocre (at best) playmaker and terrible at everything else.

That said, he is affordable and local and if he doesn’t work out his contract expires and ORL can look elsewhere for solutions.

[Magic_Johnny12]

how do you measure that "playmaking" though? not apg, because they are about the same.

Roles primarily and watching a lot of film.

Portland primarily uses Simons strictly as a “shot creator” because Simons lacks the ball handling or skills to play make for others. Portland preferred Scoot to Simons at PG for this reason and prefers Sharpe to Simons at SG (hence why he’s on the block). Simons is your prototypical microwave scorer that is the same player that he was 4 seasons ago. Mediocre efficiency, piss poor defender, doesn’t play make and is a black hole when his shot isn’t falling.

Don’t believe me? Go to the Portland board and read a little or hopefully J Roy is sniffing around and he can provide a little more insight.

Monk is used as a “primary ball handler” and his stats aren’t gaudy because he was also playing with Derozan/Lavine who both play make and have the ball in their hands a lot. Before he was appointed a starter his offensive role was “secondary ball handler” so his entire tenure in Sacramento he has been asked to handle the ball and subsequently play make.

Lastly, per bball index the difference defensively between the two is more than people think. Monk for the past two seasons has almost been a neutral defender. I know that doesn’t seem like much, but it is for a small guard.

Simons has been the top-3 worst defender in the entire league his entire career (this is not me exaggerating, please check for yourself).

Trust me, I want to be wrong and want Simons to be the answer to all our problems but don’t think much people really take the time to dive deep into the details.

Simons is a solution to one ORL issue; high volume three point shooting and shot creation.

He is a mediocre (at best) playmaker and terrible at everything else.

That said, he is affordable and local and if he doesn’t work out his contract expires and ORL can look elsewhere for solutions.

Thanks dude.

People here will still believe the complete opposite, but I appreciate you chiming in.

[JRoy]

Roles primarily and watching a lot of film.

Portland primarily uses Simons strictly as a “shot creator” because Simons lacks the ball handling or skills to play make for others. Portland preferred Scoot to Simons at PG for this reason and prefers Sharpe to Simons at SG (hence why he’s on the block). Simons is your prototypical microwave scorer that is the same player that he was 4 seasons ago. Mediocre efficiency, piss poor defender, doesn’t play make and is a black hole when his shot isn’t falling.

Don’t believe me? Go to the Portland board and read a little or hopefully J Roy is sniffing around and he can provide a little more insight.

Monk is used as a “primary ball handler” and his stats aren’t gaudy because he was also playing with Derozan/Lavine who both play make and have the ball in their hands a lot. Before he was appointed a starter his offensive role was “secondary ball handler” so his entire tenure in Sacramento he has been asked to handle the ball and subsequently play make.

Lastly, per bball index the difference defensively between the two is more than people think. Monk for the past two seasons has almost been a neutral defender. I know that doesn’t seem like much, but it is for a small guard.

Simons has been the top-3 worst defender in the entire league his entire career (this is not me exaggerating, please check for yourself).

Trust me, I want to be wrong and want Simons to be the answer to all our problems but don’t think much people really take the time to dive deep into the details.

Simons is a solution to one ORL issue; high volume three point shooting and shot creation.

He is a mediocre (at best) playmaker and terrible at everything else.

That said, he is affordable and local and if he doesn’t work out his contract expires and ORL can look elsewhere for solutions.

Thanks dude.

People here will still believe the complete opposite, but I appreciate you chiming in.

I have tried to sell ORL on Simons being something he isn’t. What I have done is try to sell ORL fans on the idea that Simons addresses key ORL weaknesses and ORL strengths cover his well known weaknesses.

[Knightro]

I have tried to sell ORL on Simons being something he isn’t. What I have done is try to sell ORL fans on the idea that Simons addresses key ORL weaknesses and ORL strengths cover his well known weaknesses.

What's the minimum you think Portland would accept for him?

[JRoy]

I have tried to sell ORL on Simons being something he isn’t. What I have done is try to sell ORL fans on the idea that Simons addresses key ORL weaknesses and ORL strengths cover his well known weaknesses.

What's the minimum you think Portland would accept for him?

That’s a good question. Unfortunately I believe the FO values him more than I do, so their acceptable minimum might be higher than mine.