Shams: MEM Trades Bane to ORL for KCP, Anthony, 4 Unprotected 1sts, and 1 Swap

[ReggiesKnicks]

Desmond Bane isn't someone you can relentlessly attack in a post-season match-up, which is a plus for Orlando. They already have Paolo who guards are going to attempt to eat alive in the post-season. Whether he is neutral or slightly positive can be up for debate, but he has proven he can hold-up defensively in a competitive playoff series and not be a weak-link, which is a major plus given his shooting and creation profile offensively.

[BK_2020]

Don’t seem like you have any knowledge of his game if you calling him a good defender lol

Short arms. So so foot speed. Doesn’t do Much off ball. Even more noticeable playoff time

He's not great but he's also not someone you can easily exploit in a switch. There's bad on defense like Tyler Herro then there's bad on defense like Jaylen Brown. You can't just have someone back Jaylen Brown down for a bucket, same with Bane. Taking the simplest option away is quite valuable in the playoffs, IMO.

I wouldn’t call him bad defensively. But can’t be a two way player with so so defense.

His strength is great but how many guards posting up in the postseason? Such a unique build. Strength of a 3. Height of a 2. Wingspan of a PG. brown has much longer arms to help him defend.

It's not so much guards posting up guards, more like wings posting up guards after getting the switch.
Also strength > length > quickness in defending against ISO, postup or drive (provided important thresholds are met).

[oldncreaky]

Desmond Bane isn't someone you can relentlessly attack in a post-season match-up, which is a plus for Orlando. They already have Paolo who guards are going to attempt to eat alive in the post-season. Whether he is neutral or slightly positive can be up for debate, but he has proven he can hold-up defensively in a competitive playoff series and not be a weak-link, which is a major plus given his shooting and creation profile offensively.

Good point

In the ORL games I saw with Suggs, that's about all you need; the other guard doesn't need to be great on D, just adequate, because Suggs raises the defensive floor of the entire squad. I'd have preferred Suggs at SG with a legit PG beside him (but what do I know): Bane and Suggs as a pair of "combo guards" might work.

With Suggs' declining deal, the cost for Suggs+Bane is expected to decline to 35.8% of the cap in 2027-28. That makes keeping a core of Paolo/Franz/Suggs/Bane very affordable over the next 4 years, even if Paolo ends up with a 30% max.

[Texas Chuck]

Defense is just so hard for some of these strong declarations. Of offensive superstars SGA is seen as a very good defender. Luka seen as a terrible one, particularly getting blown by on the perimeter.

Despite a much stronger defense around him, SGA has actually been blown by a higher % of times than Luka was last year. Does this mean SGA isn't a good defender and Luka is? Nope, I think its pretty obvious SGA is a superior defender. But its not as simplistic as we want it to be.

Do you have a good scheme? Is the player willing to compete? Does the player have some defensive strengths to help mitigate the weaknesses?

Bane feels nothing like a guy who would get played off the court defensively for any team and he's going to a team that has played high level defense without many high level defenders so I trust Moseley and his staff to still put a playoff caliber defense on the court with Bane.

And thats what really matters. It would be sweet defensively to have a team of Bill Russell, KG, young Kawhi, Pippen, and Gary Payton starting with Caruso, Deke, Battier, and Tony Allen off the bench. But you don't have to.

[tiderulz]

Desmond Bane isn't someone you can relentlessly attack in a post-season match-up, which is a plus for Orlando. They already have Paolo who guards are going to attempt to eat alive in the post-season. Whether he is neutral or slightly positive can be up for debate, but he has proven he can hold-up defensively in a competitive playoff series and not be a weak-link, which is a major plus given his shooting and creation profile offensively.

Good point

In the ORL games I saw with Suggs, that's about all you need; the other guard doesn't need to be great on D, just adequate, because Suggs raises the defensive floor of the entire squad. I'd have preferred Suggs at SG with a legit PG beside him (but what do I know): Bane and Suggs as a pair of "combo guards" might work.

With Suggs' declining deal, the cost for Suggs+Bane is expected to decline to 35.8% of the cap in 2027-28. That makes keeping a core of Paolo/Franz/Suggs/Bane very affordable over the next 4 years, even if Paolo ends up with a 30% max.

most Magic fans felt the same, i just dont think a PG was out there available.

[ReggiesKnicks]

Desmond Bane isn't someone you can relentlessly attack in a post-season match-up, which is a plus for Orlando. They already have Paolo who guards are going to attempt to eat alive in the post-season. Whether he is neutral or slightly positive can be up for debate, but he has proven he can hold-up defensively in a competitive playoff series and not be a weak-link, which is a major plus given his shooting and creation profile offensively.

Good point

In the ORL games I saw with Suggs, that's about all you need; the other guard doesn't need to be great on D, just adequate, because Suggs raises the defensive floor of the entire squad. I'd have preferred Suggs at SG with a legit PG beside him (but what do I know): Bane and Suggs as a pair of "combo guards" might work.

With Suggs' declining deal, the cost for Suggs+Bane is expected to decline to 35.8% of the cap in 2027-28. That makes keeping a core of Paolo/Franz/Suggs/Bane very affordable over the next 4 years, even if Paolo ends up with a 30% max.

most Magic fans felt the same, i just dont think a PG was out there available.

A true point-guard also creates two weaknesses defensively in Paolo/PG.

[oldncreaky]

Defense is just so hard for some of these strong declarations. Of offensive superstars SGA is seen as a very good defender. Luka seen as a terrible one, particularly getting blown by on the perimeter.

Despite a much stronger defense around him, SGA has actually been blown by a higher % of times than Luka was last year. Does this mean SGA isn't a good defender and Luka is? Nope, I think its pretty obvious SGA is a superior defender. But its not as simplistic as we want it to be.

Do you have a good scheme? Is the player willing to compete? Does the player have some defensive strengths to help mitigate the weaknesses?

Bane feels nothing like a guy who would get played off the court defensively for any team and he's going to a team that has played high level defense without many high level defenders so I trust Moseley and his staff to still put a playoff caliber defense on the court with Bane.

And thats what really matters. It would be sweet defensively to have a team of Bill Russell, KG, young Kawhi, Pippen, and Gary Payton starting with Caruso, Deke, Battier, and Tony Allen off the bench. But you don't have to.

Strongly agree, with one exception: I think Suggs is a high-level defender. ORL has looked like a great defensive squad when he's been healthy.

[Tim Lehrbach]

Sometimes, you do what you have to do, even if you wish you could do otherwise. The Magic are all-in on their core, which means making big investments in needed upgrades. If you don't make a move like this (and there are no bigger fish to land or bargains to steal), what do you do about this core needing help?

The price hurts, majorly, but if the alternative was treading water and never knowing what adding a top perimeter scorer could unlock for this team, I accept the calculated risk Orlando has taken here and appreciate the urgency they felt to take it. It's winning time.

[BK_2020]

Luka played damn near 42 minutes a game in the playoffs. SGA plays 37. Let's compare Luka and SGA defense after Luka gets to play 37 minutes per game on good knees with a 68 win team backing him up.

[Texas Chuck]

Luka played damn near 42 minutes a game in the playoffs. SGA plays 37. Let's compare Luka and SGA defense after Luka gets to play 37 minutes per game on good knees with a 68 win team backing him up.

Are you saying this because you truly believe Luka is a better defender?

Or are you saying taht we cannnot possibly compare players who aren't in exact circumstances?

Or are you nitpicking one part of a post that was mostly about Bane and Orlando?

Or is this just another non sequitor in a series of them lately?

[BK_2020]

Luka played damn near 42 minutes a game in the playoffs. SGA plays 37. Let's compare Luka and SGA defense after Luka gets to play 37 minutes per game on good knees with a 68 win team backing him up.

Are you saying this because you truly believe Luka is a better defender?

Or are you saying taht we cannnot possibly compare players who aren't in exact circumstances?

Or are you nitpicking one part of a post that was mostly about Bane and Orlando?

Or is this just another non sequitor in a series of them lately?

I think Luka is the better defender of the two because of the thing I've been saying in this very thread--he's strong and won't get bullied.
You don't understand what a non sequitur is. You can't even spell it.

[Texas Chuck]

ooh semantics and spelling today. Fun.

[DNP-Old]

Luka played damn near 42 minutes a game in the playoffs. SGA plays 37. Let's compare Luka and SGA defense after Luka gets to play 37 minutes per game on good knees with a 68 win team backing him up.

Are you saying this because you truly believe Luka is a better defender?

Or are you saying taht we cannnot possibly compare players who aren't in exact circumstances?

Or are you nitpicking one part of a post was mostly about Bane and Orlando?

Or is this just another non sequitor in a series of them lately?

This is rich coming from you TC.

[kobe_vs_jordan]

He's not great but he's also not someone you can easily exploit in a switch. There's bad on defense like Tyler Herro then there's bad on defense like Jaylen Brown. You can't just have someone back Jaylen Brown down for a bucket, same with Bane. Taking the simplest option away is quite valuable in the playoffs, IMO.

I wouldn’t call him bad defensively. But can’t be a two way player with so so defense.

His strength is great but how many guards posting up in the postseason? Such a unique build. Strength of a 3. Height of a 2. Wingspan of a PG. brown has much longer arms to help him defend.

It's not so much guards posting up guards, more like wings posting up guards after getting the switch.
Also strength > length > quickness in defending against ISO, postup or drive (provided important thresholds are met).

Eh, not convinced strength matters without length. NBA players are good. They will shoot over you with ease. The bigger player already had the height advantage. Quickness would be my number one defending trait on the perimeter.

KCP a better defensive player and all he has is quickness and IQ

[Texas Chuck]

Interesting nugget about Grizz being interested in Franz. Makes me think this deal might have started by them trying to offer a deal based around Bane for Franz and Orlando having no interest, but saying hey if there is another way to get Bane, let us know because we're very interested in him.

All just speculation on my part of course.

[psman2]

Interesting nugget about Grizz being interested in Franz. Makes me think this deal might have started by them trying to offer a deal based around Bane for Franz and Orlando having no interest, but saying hey if there is another way to get Bane, let us know because we're very interested in him.

All just speculation on my part of course.

If true points to more of a retool ahead versus a tear down.

[Texas Chuck]

Harris and Joseph had their team options declined.

[Nyce_1]

Sometimes, you do what you have to do, even if you wish you could do otherwise. The Magic are all-in on their core, which means making big investments in needed upgrades. If you don't make a move like this (and there are no bigger fish to land or bargains to steal), what do you do about this core needing help?

The price hurts, majorly, but if the alternative was treading water and never knowing what adding a top perimeter scorer could unlock for this team, I accept the calculated risk Orlando has taken here and appreciate the urgency they felt to take it. It's winning time.

Well said.

[NYG]

My biggest takeaway is... if Giannis doesn't ask out (it seems he will not), then it's KD and not really another big name being dealt. I'm sure Orlando searched the market hard and Bane was probably the best realistic option.

[basketballwacko2]

There’s probably some other moves for both Memphis and Orlando (other than just drafting) can’t wait to see it .

I've got to think if I was Memphis I'd be looking for a trade for Morant and rebuild around JJJ and Eddy.

I would want see how much is JJJ extension first but yea trading morant is on the table but not a certainty.

JJJ is gonna be getting a max deal. He's not a great rebounder but I've got to think he's a max player.

IF they want to be under the cap they could give him a Renegotiated Extension. I don't care for Ja because of his antics of the last couple years and his injury issues. I'd trade him for a haul and start over.