BREAKING: Magic acquire Desmond Bane (KCP, Cole + 4 1st Round Picks + 1 1st Round Pick Swap)

[yoyojw17]

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1 for 1 on practice shots.

Will he shoot 100% this season?

Man..... That Dap sent shivers down my spine with excitement!! Like we out here forming "The Avengers" or something!

Is it training camp yet?

[magickingdom]

Nothing this front office does will ever make sense to you until you accept that the North Star for this team is a wing-hub offense built around Paolo and Franz. Everything every personnel move, every spacing bet, every ballhandling delegation stems from that vision. If you’re holding out for some traditional point guard to come in and reroute the offense, you’re misreading the entire blueprint. The bet is on jumbo creators. That’s the foundation, not a flaw.

No, it actually does make sense to me.

I just fundamentally disagree with it. The skillset isn’t there for it to be valid outside of some hyper idealized theory. If Paolo was LeBron James or Magic Johnson I’d be able to squint and see it probably. He’s not. Franz Wagner is a 6’10 Ginobli, which is an amazing player, but that doesn’t mean he’s Rubio or Nash out there running an offense.

This is all theoretical at this point. YOU buy this idea. I don’t. You believe that what you have seen from Paolo up to this point, 3 full years now +1 at Duke, says that he’s a “jumbo playmaker” that doesn’t need a point guard to get better shots offensively.Yeah, maybe if you think being a playmaker comes down to isolation crossovers in the paint or exceedingly difficult fadeaway jumpers over shorter defenders.

Tatum is the more modernized ideal version of Paolo and HE has had Kyrie Irving, Kemba, Brogdon, and Jrue Holiday next to him his entire career. Paolo is a player archetype from the early 00’s like a better, bigger, more fluid version of Carlos Boozer but without Deron Williams getting him easy looks for a decade. Cool, I think? Let’s build an entire system around that guy for 10-12 years I guess. Even a bigger bulkier Carmelo Anthony isn’t really a “jumbo playmaker” in any other way outside of getting himself shots on offense.

I’ve come to accept this is just what it is after this trade. I’m still a Magic fan. I just don’t believe Paolo or Franz are “playmakers” enough to mitigate what I’ve seen with my eyes on offense here. They are great scorers but not capable of “running” an offense without a pace setting guard. That’s just reality. Now if you want to believe the secret ingredient to this is adding more shooting I can buy that and Bane absolutely does that. Shooting isn’t what I saw was the entire problem though. Because I have eyes and I’m not just looking at box scores to make these determinations.

You're assuming Paolo and Franz are finished products, but they've been developing in some of the worst spacing in the league. The offense looked clunky not because jumbo creators can’t work, but because the spacing was poor and playmaking takes time to develop.

Adding Bane isn’t just about shooting. It’s about creating the right conditions for young stars to become better decision-makers. We’re not building around what they are now. We’re investing in what they’re becoming.

Nicely said!

[VFX]

Nothing this front office does will ever make sense to you until you accept that the North Star for this team is a wing-hub offense built around Paolo and Franz. Everything every personnel move, every spacing bet, every ballhandling delegation stems from that vision. If you’re holding out for some traditional point guard to come in and reroute the offense, you’re misreading the entire blueprint. The bet is on jumbo creators. That’s the foundation, not a flaw.

No, it actually does make sense to me.

I just fundamentally disagree with it. The skillset isn’t there for it to be valid outside of some hyper idealized theory. If Paolo was LeBron James or Magic Johnson I’d be able to squint and see it probably. He’s not. Franz Wagner is a 6’10 Ginobli, which is an amazing player, but that doesn’t mean he’s Rubio or Nash out there running an offense.

This is all theoretical at this point. YOU buy this idea. I don’t. You believe that what you have seen from Paolo up to this point, 3 full years now +1 at Duke, says that he’s a “jumbo playmaker” that doesn’t need a point guard to get better shots offensively.Yeah, maybe if you think being a playmaker comes down to isolation crossovers in the paint or exceedingly difficult fadeaway jumpers over shorter defenders.

Tatum is the more modernized ideal version of Paolo and HE has had Kyrie Irving, Kemba, Brogdon, and Jrue Holiday next to him his entire career. Paolo is a player archetype from the early 00’s like a better, bigger, more fluid version of Carlos Boozer but without Deron Williams getting him easy looks for a decade. Cool, I think? Let’s build an entire system around that guy for 10-12 years I guess. Even a bigger bulkier Carmelo Anthony isn’t really a “jumbo playmaker” in any other way outside of getting himself shots on offense.

I’ve come to accept this is just what it is after this trade. I’m still a Magic fan. I just don’t believe Paolo or Franz are “playmakers” enough to mitigate what I’ve seen with my eyes on offense here. They are great scorers but not capable of “running” an offense without a pace setting guard. That’s just reality. Now if you want to believe the secret ingredient to this is adding more shooting I can buy that and Bane absolutely does that. Shooting isn’t what I saw was the entire problem though. Because I have eyes and I’m not just looking at box scores to make these determinations.

You're assuming Paolo and Franz are finished products, but they've been developing in some of the worst spacing in the league. The offense looked clunky not because jumbo creators can’t work, but because the spacing was poor and playmaking takes time to develop.

Adding Bane isn’t just about shooting. It’s about creating the right conditions for young stars to become better decision-makers. We’re not building around what they are now. We’re investing in what they’re becoming.

Ah yes.

The entire problem with this plan so far is because they haven’t had shooters. It isn’t because the system in place makes shooting more difficult than absolutely necessary at all.

Gary Harris and KCP went from great shooters in a good system to posting career low numbers here. Can’t be a coincidence can it? We will see how Bane does going from the quickest paced offense in the league to the slowest.

Didn’t Suggs shoot .400 two seasons ago and it didn’t matter at all? Still bottom 5 offense. But the response to this will undoubtedly be that Paolo and Franz are still developing. Just like AB is developing into SGA or Chris Paul levels of playmaking despite direct evidence that is not his skillset.

Actually your entire premise is flawed because you view AB as integral to the foundation of this blueprint, as a lead playmaking PG, but you will concede that Paolo and Franz are the facilitators that need the ball in their hands for this offense to work. So which is it?

This argument comes down to fiction vs reality. I choose to live in reality.

[fendilim]

Nothing this front office does will ever make sense to you until you accept that the North Star for this team is a wing-hub offense built around Paolo and Franz. Everything every personnel move, every spacing bet, every ballhandling delegation stems from that vision. If you’re holding out for some traditional point guard to come in and reroute the offense, you’re misreading the entire blueprint. The bet is on jumbo creators. That’s the foundation, not a flaw.

No, it actually does make sense to me.

I just fundamentally disagree with it. The skillset isn’t there for it to be valid outside of some hyper idealized theory. If Paolo was LeBron James or Magic Johnson I’d be able to squint and see it probably. He’s not. Franz Wagner is a 6’10 Ginobli, which is an amazing player, but that doesn’t mean he’s Rubio or Nash out there running an offense.

This is all theoretical at this point. YOU buy this idea. I don’t. You believe that what you have seen from Paolo up to this point, 3 full years now +1 at Duke, says that he’s a “jumbo playmaker” that doesn’t need a point guard to get better shots offensively.Yeah, maybe if you think being a playmaker comes down to isolation crossovers in the paint or exceedingly difficult fadeaway jumpers over shorter defenders.

Tatum is the more modernized ideal version of Paolo and HE has had Kyrie Irving, Kemba, Brogdon, and Jrue Holiday next to him his entire career. Paolo is a player archetype from the early 00’s like a better, bigger, more fluid version of Carlos Boozer but without Deron Williams getting him easy looks for a decade. Cool, I think? Let’s build an entire system around that guy for 10-12 years I guess. Even a bigger bulkier Carmelo Anthony isn’t really a “jumbo playmaker” in any other way outside of getting himself shots on offense.

I’ve come to accept this is just what it is after this trade. I’m still a Magic fan. I just don’t believe Paolo or Franz are “playmakers” enough to mitigate what I’ve seen with my eyes on offense here. They are great scorers but not capable of “running” an offense without a pace setting guard. That’s just reality. Now if you want to believe the secret ingredient to this is adding more shooting I can buy that and Bane absolutely does that. Shooting isn’t what I saw was the entire problem though. Because I have eyes and I’m not just looking at box scores to make these determinations.

You're assuming Paolo and Franz are finished products, but they've been developing in some of the worst spacing in the league. The offense looked clunky not because jumbo creators can’t work, but because the spacing was poor and playmaking takes time to develop.

Adding Bane isn’t just about shooting. It’s about creating the right conditions for young stars to become better decision-makers. We’re not building around what they are now. We’re investing in what they’re becoming.

I agree to both of your sentiments.

Even Paolo himself doesn’t believe he should be a playmaker but more of an offensive hub on offense. Someone that connects two players, like Chris Webber, etc. similar to how he was used in team USA.

However, I think Bane’s ability to bring down the ball, set plays and space the floor is something we should give a shot. I’m not a fan of Paolo’s game, but I expect his game to elevate to the next level with Bane spacing the floor and lifting the weight of playing off Paolo’s shoulder.

This is the first time Paolo will be playing with an elite floor spacer in the NBA.

[eyriq]

No, it actually does make sense to me.

I just fundamentally disagree with it. The skillset isn’t there for it to be valid outside of some hyper idealized theory. If Paolo was LeBron James or Magic Johnson I’d be able to squint and see it probably. He’s not. Franz Wagner is a 6’10 Ginobli, which is an amazing player, but that doesn’t mean he’s Rubio or Nash out there running an offense.

This is all theoretical at this point. YOU buy this idea. I don’t. You believe that what you have seen from Paolo up to this point, 3 full years now +1 at Duke, says that he’s a “jumbo playmaker” that doesn’t need a point guard to get better shots offensively.Yeah, maybe if you think being a playmaker comes down to isolation crossovers in the paint or exceedingly difficult fadeaway jumpers over shorter defenders.

Tatum is the more modernized ideal version of Paolo and HE has had Kyrie Irving, Kemba, Brogdon, and Jrue Holiday next to him his entire career. Paolo is a player archetype from the early 00’s like a better, bigger, more fluid version of Carlos Boozer but without Deron Williams getting him easy looks for a decade. Cool, I think? Let’s build an entire system around that guy for 10-12 years I guess. Even a bigger bulkier Carmelo Anthony isn’t really a “jumbo playmaker” in any other way outside of getting himself shots on offense.

I’ve come to accept this is just what it is after this trade. I’m still a Magic fan. I just don’t believe Paolo or Franz are “playmakers” enough to mitigate what I’ve seen with my eyes on offense here. They are great scorers but not capable of “running” an offense without a pace setting guard. That’s just reality. Now if you want to believe the secret ingredient to this is adding more shooting I can buy that and Bane absolutely does that. Shooting isn’t what I saw was the entire problem though. Because I have eyes and I’m not just looking at box scores to make these determinations.

You're assuming Paolo and Franz are finished products, but they've been developing in some of the worst spacing in the league. The offense looked clunky not because jumbo creators can’t work, but because the spacing was poor and playmaking takes time to develop.

Adding Bane isn’t just about shooting. It’s about creating the right conditions for young stars to become better decision-makers. We’re not building around what they are now. We’re investing in what they’re becoming.

Ah yes.

The entire problem with this plan so far is because they haven’t had shooters. It isn’t because the system in place makes shooting more difficult than absolutely necessary at all.

Gary Harris and KCP went from great shooters in a good system to posting career low numbers here. Can’t be a coincidence can it? We will see how Bane does going from the quickest paced offense in the league to the slowest.

Didn’t Suggs shoot .400 two seasons ago and it didn’t matter at all? Still bottom 5 offense. But the response to this will undoubtedly be that Paolo and Franz are still developing. Just like AB is developing into SGA or Chris Paul levels of playmaking despite direct evidence that is not his skillset.

Actually your entire premise is flawed because you view AB as integral to the foundation of this blueprint, as a lead playmaking PG, but you will concede that Paolo and Franz are the facilitators that need the ball in their hands for this offense to work. So which is it?

This argument comes down to fiction vs reality. I choose to live in reality.

You're calling it fiction, but ignoring age, spacing, and usage is just denial. Paolo and Franz are 22 and 23. The front office bet on jumbo creators. Bane gives them room to grow. That's the plan.

[basketballRob]

Hey guys I think I found the stupidest guy on the planet!

Read on Twitter

Wow


The only difference…and better D….

It sounds like a NY fan trying to poo poo on our deal. Cole's TS was 531, and Bane's was 600. Bane's defensive numbers will improve on a better defensive team.

Sent from my SM-G998U1 using RealGM mobile app

[VFX]

You're assuming Paolo and Franz are finished products, but they've been developing in some of the worst spacing in the league. The offense looked clunky not because jumbo creators can’t work, but because the spacing was poor and playmaking takes time to develop.

Adding Bane isn’t just about shooting. It’s about creating the right conditions for young stars to become better decision-makers. We’re not building around what they are now. We’re investing in what they’re becoming.

Ah yes.

The entire problem with this plan so far is because they haven’t had shooters. It isn’t because the system in place makes shooting more difficult than absolutely necessary at all.

Gary Harris and KCP went from great shooters in a good system to posting career low numbers here. Can’t be a coincidence can it? We will see how Bane does going from the quickest paced offense in the league to the slowest.

Didn’t Suggs shoot .400 two seasons ago and it didn’t matter at all? Still bottom 5 offense. But the response to this will undoubtedly be that Paolo and Franz are still developing. Just like AB is developing into SGA or Chris Paul levels of playmaking despite direct evidence that is not his skillset.

Actually your entire premise is flawed because you view AB as integral to the foundation of this blueprint, as a lead playmaking PG, but you will concede that Paolo and Franz are the facilitators that need the ball in their hands for this offense to work. So which is it?

This argument comes down to fiction vs reality. I choose to live in reality.

You're calling it fiction, but ignoring age, spacing, and usage is just denial. Paolo and Franz are 22 and 23. The front office bet on jumbo creators. Bane gives them room to grow. That's the plan.

So players 3-4 seasons into the league develop unforeseen skillsets that happen to fit the exact blueprint of skills necessary at an elite level to conveniently make an entire system work? Thats certainly an interesting take.

So how does AB fit into that plan? Is he a floor spacing shooter in the back court too? I thought he was a starting playmaker to fit next to Paolo and Franz also. Is that not the case anymore since yesterday?

You see how this is a stupid argument right?

Anyway I’m out on this conversation. You are either delusional or gullible.

[eyriq]

Ah yes.

The entire problem with this plan so far is because they haven’t had shooters. It isn’t because the system in place makes shooting more difficult than absolutely necessary at all.

Gary Harris and KCP went from great shooters in a good system to posting career low numbers here. Can’t be a coincidence can it? We will see how Bane does going from the quickest paced offense in the league to the slowest.

Didn’t Suggs shoot .400 two seasons ago and it didn’t matter at all? Still bottom 5 offense. But the response to this will undoubtedly be that Paolo and Franz are still developing. Just like AB is developing into SGA or Chris Paul levels of playmaking despite direct evidence that is not his skillset.

Actually your entire premise is flawed because you view AB as integral to the foundation of this blueprint, as a lead playmaking PG, but you will concede that Paolo and Franz are the facilitators that need the ball in their hands for this offense to work. So which is it?

This argument comes down to fiction vs reality. I choose to live in reality.

You're calling it fiction, but ignoring age, spacing, and usage is just denial. Paolo and Franz are 22 and 23. The front office bet on jumbo creators. Bane gives them room to grow. That's the plan.

So players 3-4 seasons into the league develop unforeseen skillsets that happen to fit the exact blueprint of skills necessary at an elite level to conveniently make an entire system work? Thats certainly an interesting take.

So how does AB fit into that plan? Is he a floor spacing shooter in the back court too? I thought he was a starting playmaker to fit next to Paolo and Franz also. Is that not the case anymore since yesterday?

You see how this is a stupid argument right?

Anyway I’m out on this conversation. You are either delusional or gullible.

You keep calling it fiction, but what’s actually unrealistic is expecting 22-year-olds to run a modern offense without spacing, then using that outcome to dismiss the blueprint entirely. This isn’t about Paolo turning into Magic or AB into CP3, it’s about building a scalable offense around what they already do well. The front office didn’t get duped. They committed to a model, and they’re executing it. You just don’t like what they chose.

[JoshuaPotter]

Ah yes.

The entire problem with this plan so far is because they haven’t had shooters. It isn’t because the system in place makes shooting more difficult than absolutely necessary at all.

Gary Harris and KCP went from great shooters in a good system to posting career low numbers here. Can’t be a coincidence can it? We will see how Bane does going from the quickest paced offense in the league to the slowest.

Didn’t Suggs shoot .400 two seasons ago and it didn’t matter at all? Still bottom 5 offense. But the response to this will undoubtedly be that Paolo and Franz are still developing. Just like AB is developing into SGA or Chris Paul levels of playmaking despite direct evidence that is not his skillset.

Actually your entire premise is flawed because you view AB as integral to the foundation of this blueprint, as a lead playmaking PG, but you will concede that Paolo and Franz are the facilitators that need the ball in their hands for this offense to work. So which is it?

This argument comes down to fiction vs reality. I choose to live in reality.

You're calling it fiction, but ignoring age, spacing, and usage is just denial. Paolo and Franz are 22 and 23. The front office bet on jumbo creators. Bane gives them room to grow. That's the plan.

So players 3-4 seasons into the league develop unforeseen skillsets that happen to fit the exact blueprint of skills necessary at an elite level to conveniently make an entire system work? Thats certainly an interesting take.

So how does AB fit into that plan? Is he a floor spacing shooter in the back court too? I thought he was a starting playmaker to fit next to Paolo and Franz also. Is that not the case anymore since yesterday?

You see how this is a stupid argument right?

Anyway I’m out on this conversation. You are either delusional or gullible.

I'm calling it, I have said it again and again.

This team is going to go as far as Franz + Paolo 3pt%. You simply cannot have 2 players this equally bad at the 1 thing the modern NBA gives you. (the ability to travel into an open 3-ball shot)

Anyway, we still lack a true PG and offensive system. We shall see if there are any remaining moves with the 25th pick. Lord knows, I am concerned that the only PG on the team is Suggs followed by a "can barely shoot the 3-ball" AB who disguises himself as a PG because his skillset most closely resembles that but his game is more of a SF / SG.

[JoshuaPotter]

It's a day later and I am more and more OK with the trade.

[VFX]

You're calling it fiction, but ignoring age, spacing, and usage is just denial. Paolo and Franz are 22 and 23. The front office bet on jumbo creators. Bane gives them room to grow. That's the plan.

So players 3-4 seasons into the league develop unforeseen skillsets that happen to fit the exact blueprint of skills necessary at an elite level to conveniently make an entire system work? Thats certainly an interesting take.

So how does AB fit into that plan? Is he a floor spacing shooter in the back court too? I thought he was a starting playmaker to fit next to Paolo and Franz also. Is that not the case anymore since yesterday?

You see how this is a stupid argument right?

Anyway I’m out on this conversation. You are either delusional or gullible.

You keep calling it fiction, but what’s actually unrealistic is expecting 22-year-olds to run a modern offense without spacing, then using that outcome to dismiss the blueprint entirely. This isn’t about Paolo turning into Magic or AB into CP3, it’s about building a scalable offense around what they already do well. The front office didn’t get duped. They committed to a model, and they’re executing it. You just don’t like what they chose.

Josh Giddey is 22. Is it not obvious that he’s a capable playmaker for his size and age? Hes actually a jumbo playmaker averaging 7.5-8 assists per game.

Actually, don’t answer that. I don’t want more back and forth of apologist nonsense.

[Skybox]

You're calling it fiction, but ignoring age, spacing, and usage is just denial. Paolo and Franz are 22 and 23. The front office bet on jumbo creators. Bane gives them room to grow. That's the plan.

So players 3-4 seasons into the league develop unforeseen skillsets that happen to fit the exact blueprint of skills necessary at an elite level to conveniently make an entire system work? Thats certainly an interesting take.

So how does AB fit into that plan? Is he a floor spacing shooter in the back court too? I thought he was a starting playmaker to fit next to Paolo and Franz also. Is that not the case anymore since yesterday?

You see how this is a stupid argument right?

Anyway I’m out on this conversation. You are either delusional or gullible.

You keep calling it fiction, but what’s actually unrealistic is expecting 22-year-olds to run a modern offense without spacing, then using that outcome to dismiss the blueprint entirely. This isn’t about Paolo turning into Magic or AB into CP3, it’s about building a scalable offense around what they already do well. The front office didn’t get duped. They committed to a model, and they’re executing it. You just don’t like what they chose.

I'm kind of worried that NONE of our players are up for such a seemingly complex assignment...and even more concerned that our Coach isn't.

Having 4 or 5 guys averaging 5 assists sounds great, but how does that all work and who knows what they're supposed to be doing? Who teaches the cutting, the perimeter ball movement, who decides who brings the ball up...my biggest fear of this being a fail is scheme, more than talent...what fundamental change will prevent Bane from standing in the corner like KCP?

This roster's core now has a LOT of firepower and versatility...but they have to learn how to work together. It's a pretty big deal, imo. Bane comes from a very fast-paced offense while our guys are used to this garbage where someone fights across half-court, gives it to Paolo or Franz, watches them dribble out the clock and force a tough shot or a kickout for a hurried shot at the buzzer...putting a better shooter (2 if you count on Suggs) into that mess is better, but still garbage.

I'm really anxious about the coaching/scheme/possibility of an Asst Coach, etc much more than I am about the talent.

It's been pretty obvious that we "need better shooting" but it's not like we didn't have shooters...great shooters certainly make it better, but it's still swimming upstream.

[89Magicfan]

So players 3-4 seasons into the league develop unforeseen skillsets that happen to fit the exact blueprint of skills necessary at an elite level to conveniently make an entire system work? Thats certainly an interesting take.

So how does AB fit into that plan? Is he a floor spacing shooter in the back court too? I thought he was a starting playmaker to fit next to Paolo and Franz also. Is that not the case anymore since yesterday?

You see how this is a stupid argument right?

Anyway I’m out on this conversation. You are either delusional or gullible.

You keep calling it fiction, but what’s actually unrealistic is expecting 22-year-olds to run a modern offense without spacing, then using that outcome to dismiss the blueprint entirely. This isn’t about Paolo turning into Magic or AB into CP3, it’s about building a scalable offense around what they already do well. The front office didn’t get duped. They committed to a model, and they’re executing it. You just don’t like what they chose.

I'm kind of worried that NONE of our players are up for such a seemingly complex assignment...and even more concerned that our Coach isn't.

Having 4 or 5 guys averaging 5 assists sounds great, but how does that all work and who knows what they're supposed to be doing? Who teaches the cutting, the perimeter ball movement, who decides who brings the ball up...my biggest fear of this being a fail is scheme, more than talent...what fundamental change will prevent Bane from standing in the corner like KCP?

This roster's core now has a LOT of firepower and versatility...but they have to learn how to work together. It's a pretty big deal, imo. Bane comes from a very fast-paced offense while our guys are used to this garbage where someone fights across half-court, gives it to Paolo or Franz, watches them dribble out the clock and force a tough shot or a kickout for a hurried shot at the buzzer...putting a better shooter (2 if you count on Suggs) into that mess is better, but still garbage.

I'm really anxious about the coaching/scheme/possibility of an Asst Coach, etc much more than I am about the talent.

It's been pretty obvious that we "need better shooting" but it's not like we didn't have shooters...great shooters certainly make it better, but it's still swimming upstream.

I feel the same. I like getting Bane but I’m still concerned with leaning onto Paolo/Franz and even Suggs to develop a skill that is usually developed way before the NBA, a very cerebral specific skill, such as playmaking.

[eyriq]

So players 3-4 seasons into the league develop unforeseen skillsets that happen to fit the exact blueprint of skills necessary at an elite level to conveniently make an entire system work? Thats certainly an interesting take.

So how does AB fit into that plan? Is he a floor spacing shooter in the back court too? I thought he was a starting playmaker to fit next to Paolo and Franz also. Is that not the case anymore since yesterday?

You see how this is a stupid argument right?

Anyway I’m out on this conversation. You are either delusional or gullible.

You keep calling it fiction, but what’s actually unrealistic is expecting 22-year-olds to run a modern offense without spacing, then using that outcome to dismiss the blueprint entirely. This isn’t about Paolo turning into Magic or AB into CP3, it’s about building a scalable offense around what they already do well. The front office didn’t get duped. They committed to a model, and they’re executing it. You just don’t like what they chose.

I'm kind of worried that NONE of our players are up for such a seemingly complex assignment...and even more concerned that our Coach isn't.

Having 4 or 5 guys averaging 5 assists sounds great, but how does that all work and who knows what they're supposed to be doing? Who teaches the cutting, the perimeter ball movement, who decides who brings the ball up...my biggest fear of this being a fail is scheme, more than talent...what fundamental change will prevent Bane from standing in the corner like KCP?

This roster's core now has a LOT of firepower and versatility...but they have to learn how to work together. It's a pretty big deal, imo. Bane comes from a very fast-paced offense while our guys are used to this garbage where someone fights across half-court, gives it to Paolo or Franz, watches them dribble out the clock and force a tough shot or a kickout for a hurried shot at the buzzer...putting a better shooter (2 if you count on Suggs) into that mess is better, but still garbage.

I'm really anxious about the coaching/scheme/possibility of an Asst Coach, etc much more than I am about the talent.

It's been pretty obvious that we "need better shooting" but it's not like we didn't have shooters...great shooters certainly make it better, but it's still swimming upstream.

Totally fair take. The pressure’s on the coaches now. Bane gives them the tools, but if the offense still sticks and the movement’s not there, that’s on scheme, not talent. We’ve got the pieces. Time to see if Mosley can actually run a modern offense.

[Fortune Teller]

You're assuming Paolo and Franz are finished products, but they've been developing in some of the worst spacing in the league. The offense looked clunky not because jumbo creators can’t work, but because the spacing was poor and playmaking takes time to develop.

Adding Bane isn’t just about shooting. It’s about creating the right conditions for young stars to become better decision-makers. We’re not building around what they are now. We’re investing in what they’re becoming.

Ah yes.

The entire problem with this plan so far is because they haven’t had shooters. It isn’t because the system in place makes shooting more difficult than absolutely necessary at all.

Gary Harris and KCP went from great shooters in a good system to posting career low numbers here. Can’t be a coincidence can it? We will see how Bane does going from the quickest paced offense in the league to the slowest.

Didn’t Suggs shoot .400 two seasons ago and it didn’t matter at all? Still bottom 5 offense. But the response to this will undoubtedly be that Paolo and Franz are still developing. Just like AB is developing into SGA or Chris Paul levels of playmaking despite direct evidence that is not his skillset.

Actually your entire premise is flawed because you view AB as integral to the foundation of this blueprint, as a lead playmaking PG, but you will concede that Paolo and Franz are the facilitators that need the ball in their hands for this offense to work. So which is it?

This argument comes down to fiction vs reality. I choose to live in reality.

You're calling it fiction, but ignoring age, spacing, and usage is just denial. Paolo and Franz are 22 and 23. The front office bet on jumbo creators. Bane gives them room to grow. That's the plan.

Did the front office really "bet on jumbo creators" or have they just been unable to acquire or develop a real point guard? Revisionist history aside, Suggs and Black were both drafted as point guards -- or at the very least facilitators -- but neither really seems to be cut out for the role. You might be confusing "blueprint" with "circumstance".

[eyriq]

No, it actually does make sense to me.

I just fundamentally disagree with it. The skillset isn’t there for it to be valid outside of some hyper idealized theory. If Paolo was LeBron James or Magic Johnson I’d be able to squint and see it probably. He’s not. Franz Wagner is a 6’10 Ginobli, which is an amazing player, but that doesn’t mean he’s Rubio or Nash out there running an offense.

This is all theoretical at this point. YOU buy this idea. I don’t. You believe that what you have seen from Paolo up to this point, 3 full years now +1 at Duke, says that he’s a “jumbo playmaker” that doesn’t need a point guard to get better shots offensively.Yeah, maybe if you think being a playmaker comes down to isolation crossovers in the paint or exceedingly difficult fadeaway jumpers over shorter defenders.

Tatum is the more modernized ideal version of Paolo and HE has had Kyrie Irving, Kemba, Brogdon, and Jrue Holiday next to him his entire career. Paolo is a player archetype from the early 00’s like a better, bigger, more fluid version of Carlos Boozer but without Deron Williams getting him easy looks for a decade. Cool, I think? Let’s build an entire system around that guy for 10-12 years I guess. Even a bigger bulkier Carmelo Anthony isn’t really a “jumbo playmaker” in any other way outside of getting himself shots on offense.

I’ve come to accept this is just what it is after this trade. I’m still a Magic fan. I just don’t believe Paolo or Franz are “playmakers” enough to mitigate what I’ve seen with my eyes on offense here. They are great scorers but not capable of “running” an offense without a pace setting guard. That’s just reality. Now if you want to believe the secret ingredient to this is adding more shooting I can buy that and Bane absolutely does that. Shooting isn’t what I saw was the entire problem though. Because I have eyes and I’m not just looking at box scores to make these determinations.

You're assuming Paolo and Franz are finished products, but they've been developing in some of the worst spacing in the league. The offense looked clunky not because jumbo creators can’t work, but because the spacing was poor and playmaking takes time to develop.

Adding Bane isn’t just about shooting. It’s about creating the right conditions for young stars to become better decision-makers. We’re not building around what they are now. We’re investing in what they’re becoming.

I agree to both of your sentiments.

Even Paolo himself doesn’t believe he should be a playmaker but more of an offensive hub on offense. Someone that connects two players, like Chris Webber, etc. similar to how he was used in team USA.

However, I think Bane’s ability to bring down the ball, set plays and space the floor is something we should give a shot. I’m not a fan of Paolo’s game, but I expect his game to elevate to the next level with Bane spacing the floor and lifting the weight of playing off Paolo’s shoulder.

This is the first time Paolo will be playing with an elite floor spacer in the NBA.

Exactly. Paolo’s not trying to be a heliocentric point-forward, he’s a scoring hub who can read the floor when the spacing’s right. Franz shares a big chunk of the primary playmaking duties, which lets Paolo focus on what he does best. Bane adds the spacing and gravity to make that whole setup finally work.

[eyriq]

Ah yes.

The entire problem with this plan so far is because they haven’t had shooters. It isn’t because the system in place makes shooting more difficult than absolutely necessary at all.

Gary Harris and KCP went from great shooters in a good system to posting career low numbers here. Can’t be a coincidence can it? We will see how Bane does going from the quickest paced offense in the league to the slowest.

Didn’t Suggs shoot .400 two seasons ago and it didn’t matter at all? Still bottom 5 offense. But the response to this will undoubtedly be that Paolo and Franz are still developing. Just like AB is developing into SGA or Chris Paul levels of playmaking despite direct evidence that is not his skillset.

Actually your entire premise is flawed because you view AB as integral to the foundation of this blueprint, as a lead playmaking PG, but you will concede that Paolo and Franz are the facilitators that need the ball in their hands for this offense to work. So which is it?

This argument comes down to fiction vs reality. I choose to live in reality.

You're calling it fiction, but ignoring age, spacing, and usage is just denial. Paolo and Franz are 22 and 23. The front office bet on jumbo creators. Bane gives them room to grow. That's the plan.

Did the front office really "bet on jumbo creators" or have they just been unable to acquire or develop a real point guard? Revisionist history aside, Suggs and Black were both drafted as point guards -- or at the very least facilitators -- but neither really seems to be cut out for the role. You might be confusing "blueprint" with "circumstance".

If it were just circumstance, they’d be chasing a true point guard by now, but they aren’t. They’re building around Paolo and Franz on purpose. In a wing-hub offense, your guards don’t need to run the show. They need to defend, connect, and shoot. That’s the plan.

[Fortune Teller]

You're calling it fiction, but ignoring age, spacing, and usage is just denial. Paolo and Franz are 22 and 23. The front office bet on jumbo creators. Bane gives them room to grow. That's the plan.

Did the front office really "bet on jumbo creators" or have they just been unable to acquire or develop a real point guard? Revisionist history aside, Suggs and Black were both drafted as point guards -- or at the very least facilitators -- but neither really seems to be cut out for the role. You might be confusing "blueprint" with "circumstance".

If it were just circumstance, they’d be chasing a true point guard by now, but they aren’t. They’re building around Paolo and Franz on purpose. In a wing-hub offense, your guards don’t need to run the show. They need to defend, connect, and shoot. That’s the plan.

So under your theory, the plan has always been a wing-hub offense reliant on guards who can shoot, and Jeff waited 4 years to add a guard who can actually shoot? I think the Magic offense has been bottom-10 in the league all 8 years Jeff has been in charge and it's gotten significantly worse the past few years with this "wing-hub" offense, so if you're right, and it's all part of the plan, it's a really awful plan and it's taking a seriously long time to develop.

[OrlandoDream]

We can argue the Bane and Suggs backcourt fit with Paolo and Franz all day. One big aspect we are severely forgetting is....Mosley. I have little to no trust that he and his staff is going to be capable of getting the most out of these four. The bane trade puts us on the next phase of the rebuild. We are now in win-now mode and hopefully contention in 2-3 years. We have upgraded players; we now need to upgrade the coaching staff. And no, a better offensive coordinator asst coach isn't the answer. Too many good coaches on the market to continue sticking to Mosley and his pretender coaching staff.

[bigdogdylan5]

Anyone else in pain watching these grizzlies people like Verno talk themselves into KCP and Cole Anthony? I try to be a compassionate person but damn after watching them they are going to be extremely disappointed. I do think KCP has a better year then next year but no chance it gets anywhere close to tradable value with that contract.