GelbeWand09 wrote:VFX wrote:The Magic didn’t need to spend 4 firsts on Ja, Trae, or LaMelo. None of those guys are actual facilitators. They are ball dominant engines and Orlando already has two of those guys that need the ball in their hands to do absolutely anything on the court.
Orlando needed a Fox, J.Murray, C.White, Quickley kind of guy. Didn’t happen.
They clearly have an agenda as to how they want this team to operate on offense. It remains to be seen if it will be possible at an extremely high level. It’s a serious gamble “playing moneyball with the point guard spot” as PRR puts it.
My fear is that IF this gamble doesn’t pay off (the system Weltman is enamored with), then his next objective is to trade Jalen Suggs to save his ass.
It’s really the only card he has left to play if he doesn’t throw Mosely under the bus. I don’t want to see Suggs be pilloried because Weltman lacked common sense in acquiring a point guard for the last 5 seasons up to now with this decision.
I have a lot of the same concerns as you and I have the same feeling about Paolo since Duke but about your alternatives I have a different opinion.
For me those guys are worse players or worse fit than Banes.
White is just not a good passer or playmaker. Murray is overpayed, injury prone and is not really reliable because he is only good every 3rd game since a few years. He isnt really that much of a playmaking upgrade to Banes too, if any.
Fox is a bad fit with suspect outside shooting.
Quickly is just a guy but probably a solid fit for us for maybe much lower cost but despite being a "PG" , he is probably worse at everything basketball related than Banes, including passing and playmaking and just a PG because of his height but not skills.
It was a overpay for us and I fear we still gonna see tons of bad iso ball and i still don't see how we gonna score efficient against half court playoff defenses with our current system but I think Banes still gives you more solutions in case he is used in the right way than most of those names, because all those guys are scoring combo guards or sg too.
Except Fox who is a bad fit shooting wise.
In the end our success hinge on Franz and Paolos development like before. If they doesn't become better shooters and playmakers we won't win anything but this would be the case with those guys too. I don't see them getting easier shots or having less isos with Murray or White or IQ next to them.
About Suggs, I can see that too but.. It's the logical thing to do because compared to the Caruso's of the world he just gets way too much money for the things he does so far in his career.
Personally I would trade Paolo before Suggs of 2 years a go because this player fits a lot of winning systems and I have big concerns that Paolos the roleplayer and tempo killing iso style, in combination with drive first offense but mediocre finishing will never be a winning formula. But we both know they will never trade him.
Where and how idea of Bane' playmaking being good started? And why? Because it's not grounded in reality or based on evidence. Whole bunch of his playmaking is them running like fools, trading buckets in open court without half court decision making , pick&roll or any set action.
Career 3,8 apg, 1,8 TO guy, who averaged 5,5 apg on 2,7 TO last year, but in year when Grizzlies ran literally worst offense in nba . Offensive rating of Grizzlies with Bane on the court (42 games - as PG ) = 108,9.
Magic offensive rating this year = 108,9
One of biggest issues with Grizzlies, with their Ja-Bane pairing was incredible inability to protect ball and not turn the ball over so much. Especially in playoffs.
Their 56 wins season happened in year when Bane was strict shooting guard with almost no on ball reps. Tyus Jones was doing lot of bench ball handling and playmaking and ball protection and apg/TO rate is his special.
After that year, each and every year Grizzlies were popping out as team that can't take care of ball and isn't generating good shots (but masks it with transition basketball and sky high pace).
Just some numbers
2022-23: 17# in assist percentage, 6th lowest TS
2023-24: 29# assist to TO rate, 30# offense, 29# TS, 28# TO%
2024-25: 15# Assist %, 17# assist to TO rate, 24# TO %
So how they had "three 20 ppg players" ? Well...pace. In past 5 years they had top 8 pace - 4 times. Led all nba in pace this year.
LIke, this season, without OTs, they scored 130 points- 20 times. Matter of fact they scored 155 points in 48 min
Magic scored 130 points or more 8 times.... In past 3 years. Combined.
I really don't think Bane is any better playmaker than some Simons. Maybe better rounded due better defense, but also costed like x500 more.
Truth is, between season when Grizzlies were excellent and Bane played as decoy and off ball guard, to last year when Grizzlies ran offense without many ( often any) picks, perdicated on cuts and drives off ball, often with 3 guards or 5 shooters, it is very hard to find any evidence of Bane being capable creating offense for others, in context of addition to a team where Banchero refuses to play off ball, Franz, Carter shooting issues and Suggs being TO waiting to happen on ball.
It's one of strangest trades, fit vise , in nba i could recall since Howard was paired with Gasol.
And that price tag makes me sick, in context of new CBA, 3 max contracts, future flexibility, non existing C depth, all with bonus kickers ESPECIALLY when you have maxed out guy who isn't even top 30 player. ( Ringer has him 47th lol)
I'm terrified that this trade will age like milk, as imo, Bane will improve roster but still not solve any of issues ( decision making, ball handling, pace control). LIke, guy went from team who had 8 players shooting +37% for 3 to a team where he is only shooter , but now he is asked to both: playmake and make shots and make right decisions, coming off playoffs where Caruso stole his soul.
Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans. -John Lennon
