KD to Philly w/Utah and Brooklyn

[jredsaz]

I also don’t want to be paying 50 million for a contract with a guy at the ago of 35-39 for the duration of his contract.

What team is being lead by an old guy making 50 million that’s successful in the new CBA? The new CBA is so restrictive that younger deep teams are better off. Hence the only way I’d take PG on is if Utah could keep both #3 and #5 and have a lot of young players on rookie scale contracts and we can have PG sit out the whole year and rehab and hopefully get back in shape and a better spot so he can come back and be successful. But I doubt it. I think his good years are all behind him.

If Philly says no they say no. But it’s an easy pass for me. Maybe Utah does it. Who knows with a new GM, but if Ainge Jr’s first move is to take on PG for two spots Utah is screwed for the next 4-6 years. Would destroy or at minimum push Utah back 2-3 years.

Why is that salary an issue for you? The Jazz have zero direction or true young building blocks. This allows them to a) go get Edgecombe, a legit young building block and b) roll out a decent lineup to start competing - something the Jazz have said they are interested in doing next season. At worst he is an often injured player who turns into a salary ballast in two years when the Jazz might actually be ready to make a run.

[babyjax13]

This is obviously dependent on that assessment and since Utah is in these discussions they must have a target at 3. I think it is too good for Phoenix. Utah definitely should not need to add Filipowski and I do not think they are owed that 2028 1st, instead they should be getting a lower value asset on top of 19/Claxton/Sexton.

I’d assume the target is Edgecombe at three. Isn’t it pretty obvious that Ainge has a player in mind he’d like to move up for?

I do not think it is obvious we are trying to move up. Andy Larsen said that there have been discussions with Philadelphia but they have not gotten serious. I also don't not think it is obvious that it would be VJ.

[jredsaz]

I would actually do the deal in OP, even though I'm unconvinced with the reliability of Embiid's health going forward.

With Durant's elite shooting being added to Edwards/Maxey/McCain/Grimes, it'd allow the Sixers to target a big gritty forward that brings high-levels of defending, cutting, connectivity and playfinishing at #8, looking at Murray-Boyles or Essengue.

He left the LAC 1st out of the outgoing from PHI but has that going to the Suns.

Sorry. Fixed

[Daddy 801]

I also don’t want to be paying 50 million for a contract with a guy at the ago of 35-39 for the duration of his contract.

What team is being lead by an old guy making 50 million that’s successful in the new CBA? The new CBA is so restrictive that younger deep teams are better off. Hence the only way I’d take PG on is if Utah could keep both #3 and #5 and have a lot of young players on rookie scale contracts and we can have PG sit out the whole year and rehab and hopefully get back in shape and a better spot so he can come back and be successful. But I doubt it. I think his good years are all behind him.

If Philly says no they say no. But it’s an easy pass for me. Maybe Utah does it. Who knows with a new GM, but if Ainge Jr’s first move is to take on PG for two spots Utah is screwed for the next 4-6 years. Would destroy or at minimum push Utah back 2-3 years.

Why is that salary an issue for you? The Jazz have zero direction or true young building blocks. This allows them to a) go get Edgecombe, a legit young building block and b) roll out a decent lineup to start competing - something the Jazz have said they are interested in doing next season. At worst he is an often injured player who turns into a salary ballast in two years when the Jazz might actually be ready to make a run.

Because we can use that salary to take back something worth a lot more than moving up two spots. Rather take back Dames contract for Collins and Sexton for the 31st pick. Then in 2-3 years when Utah is ready to compete we have an asset we can package to go get a player to help the young guys.

Taking on contracts like Dame or PG is worth an unprotected first round draft pick. Yes, present value is worth more than later value. So Philly thinks the present value of two spots now is worth more. I don’t for Utah in this situation. Much rather have an asset that has a lot of value for years to come. And people keep saying Utah can get Edge….which may not even be the guy Utah wants and he may easily fall to 5. I don’t see a ton of value difference between 3 and 5 this year. Definitely not worth taking on PG’s contract if we lose 5.

[jredsaz]

This is obviously dependent on that assessment and since Utah is in these discussions they must have a target at 3. I think it is too good for Phoenix. Utah definitely should not need to add Filipowski and I do not think they are owed that 2028 1st, instead they should be getting a lower value asset on top of 19/Claxton/Sexton.

I’d assume the target is Edgecombe at three. Isn’t it pretty obvious that Ainge has a player in mind he’d like to move up for?

I do not think it is obvious we are trying to move up. Andy Larsen said that there have been discussions with Philadelphia but they have not gotten serious. I also don't not think it is obvious that it would be VJ.

Really? I remember reports after the lottery about the disappointment of falling and a determination to move up.

[HotelVitale]

This is a bad deal for Utah. I’d do #21, Collins, and Sexton for PG and #3. Not interested in sending out the #5 pick. Taking on PG’s contract is not worth just moving up two spots.

It depends on how you feel about the players available. In this draft I think the difference between Edgecombe and the the next guys is decent. PGs contract is rough but when healthy he will help the Jazz compete and like he’s done before, Angie might be able to buy low here and flip PG for a decent asset or two down the line. Honestly, I don’t see the value in standing pat and drafting at five.

Also, another sliding door from this trade, can Lauri and #3 get you #2+ from the Spurs? Haven’t been able to get up to Harper as of yet, maybe this can.

I’m fine taking whoever is left of Bailey, Edgecomb, Johnson, etc versus taking on PG’s huge contract. With this new CBA taking on that contract is extra punitive. I have no faith PG returns to form and is a good asset teams are looking to go after. So it would have to come with the #3 pick and we keep the #5 so Utah has a better chance at one of them panning out to be a cheap good piece while Utah has PG’s contract. t.

I agree it’s not realistic for Utah but you’re obviously taking a pretty extreme read of the deal. PG had one of his best seasons year before last and he was both injured and playing on a train wreck team last year—having ‘no faith’ that he will ever be anything be useless from now seems like just vibes. Remember dozens of teams wanted him like 9 months ago and his season wasn’t anything more than just an injury ridden blah.

Also in any trade Utah’s presumably going to get off matching $ that aren’t part of their long term plan. At worst you’re probably still unloading at least 2/3 of the $ on PG’s contract, so it’s not really taking on a gigantic mess of money like it’s sometimes portrayed.

That said I don’t think Utah has much to gain by the gamble on PG’s health. Might make more sense for some other team, unless Utah is looking to make a foolish PO push (which they shouldn’t do).

[jredsaz]

It depends on how you feel about the players available. In this draft I think the difference between Edgecombe and the the next guys is decent. PGs contract is rough but when healthy he will help the Jazz compete and like he’s done before, Angie might be able to buy low here and flip PG for a decent asset or two down the line. Honestly, I don’t see the value in standing pat and drafting at five.

Also, another sliding door from this trade, can Lauri and #3 get you #2+ from the Spurs? Haven’t been able to get up to Harper as of yet, maybe this can.

I’m fine taking whoever is left of Bailey, Edgecomb, Johnson, etc versus taking on PG’s huge contract. With this new CBA taking on that contract is extra punitive. I have no faith PG returns to form and is a good asset teams are looking to go after. So it would have to come with the #3 pick and we keep the #5 so Utah has a better chance at one of them panning out to be a cheap good piece while Utah has PG’s contract. t.

I agree it’s not realistic for Utah but you’re obviously taking a pretty extreme read of the deal. PG had one of his best seasons year before last and he was both injured and playing on a train wreck team last year—having ‘no faith’ that he will ever be anything be useless from now seems like just vibes. Remember dozens of times wanted him like 9 months ago and his season wasn’t anything more than just an injury ridden blah.

Also in any trade Utah’s presumably going to get off matching $ that aren’t part of their long term plan. At worst you’re probably still unloading at least 2/3 of the $ on PG’s contract, so it’s not really taking on a gigantic mess of money like it’s sometimes portrayed.

That said I don’t think Utah has much to gain by the gamble on PG’s health. Might make more sense for some other team, unless Utah is looking to make a foolish PO push (which they shouldn’t do).

Am I the only one that read the reports that Utah was done tanking?

[SkyHook]

I’d assume the target is Edgecombe at three. Isn’t it pretty obvious that Ainge has a player in mind he’d like to move up for?

I do not think it is obvious we are trying to move up. Andy Larsen said that there have been discussions with Philadelphia but they have not gotten serious. I also don't not think it is obvious that it would be VJ.

Really? I remember reports after the lottery about the disappointment of falling and a determination to move up.

Disappointment? Certainly. Determination to move up? I follow things fairly closely and I haven't seen any Jazz sources reporting this, but maybe I missed one. Happy to read whatever link you have.

Are they having conversations about moving up? Sure. (And moving down.)

[jredsaz]

I do not think it is obvious we are trying to move up. Andy Larsen said that there have been discussions with Philadelphia but they have not gotten serious. I also don't not think it is obvious that it would be VJ.

Really? I remember reports after the lottery about the disappointment of falling and a determination to move up.

Disappointment? Certainly. Determination to move up? I follow things fairly closely and I haven't seen any Jazz sources reporting this, but maybe I missed one. Happy to read whatever link you have.

Are they having conversations about moving up? Sure. (And moving down.)

Fair. I’m not digging through the crates for that report that I kanda remember I just think getting a young FOF in the draft is a priority. Feel like Edgecombe could be that.

[SkyHook]

Really? I remember reports after the lottery about the disappointment of falling and a determination to move up.

Disappointment? Certainly. Determination to move up? I follow things fairly closely and I haven't seen any Jazz sources reporting this, but maybe I missed one. Happy to read whatever link you have.

Are they having conversations about moving up? Sure. (And moving down.)

Fair. I’m not digging through the crates for that report that I kanda remember I just think getting a young FOF in the draft is a priority. Feel like Edgecombe could be that.

I have Johnson higher on my board than VJ and Ace and I expect that he'll be available at #5.

[SkyHook]

I’m fine taking whoever is left of Bailey, Edgecomb, Johnson, etc versus taking on PG’s huge contract. With this new CBA taking on that contract is extra punitive. I have no faith PG returns to form and is a good asset teams are looking to go after. So it would have to come with the #3 pick and we keep the #5 so Utah has a better chance at one of them panning out to be a cheap good piece while Utah has PG’s contract. t.

I agree it’s not realistic for Utah but you’re obviously taking a pretty extreme read of the deal. PG had one of his best seasons year before last and he was both injured and playing on a train wreck team last year—having ‘no faith’ that he will ever be anything be useless from now seems like just vibes. Remember dozens of times wanted him like 9 months ago and his season wasn’t anything more than just an injury ridden blah.

Also in any trade Utah’s presumably going to get off matching $ that aren’t part of their long term plan. At worst you’re probably still unloading at least 2/3 of the $ on PG’s contract, so it’s not really taking on a gigantic mess of money like it’s sometimes portrayed.

That said I don’t think Utah has much to gain by the gamble on PG’s health. Might make more sense for some other team, unless Utah is looking to make a foolish PO push (which they shouldn’t do).

Am I the only one that read the reports that Utah was done tanking?

There has been clarification in the days following the younger Ainge's press conference that the Jazz are done overtly tanking, ie. resting healthy players, creative injury reports, etc.; how much of that was directed at the league office is uncertain. It doesn't necessarily mean a push to compete now. I expect them to be opportunistic as players become available trades, but to continue to prioritize the top of the 2026 draft and to move some of the current roster for more future draft assets.

[babyjax13]

Really? I remember reports after the lottery about the disappointment of falling and a determination to move up.

Disappointment? Certainly. Determination to move up? I follow things fairly closely and I haven't seen any Jazz sources reporting this, but maybe I missed one. Happy to read whatever link you have.

Are they having conversations about moving up? Sure. (And moving down.)

Fair. I’m not digging through the crates for that report that I kanda remember I just think getting a young FOF in the draft is a priority. Feel like Edgecombe could be that.

I think there is a pretty wide range of opinions on that, tbh.

[HotelVitale]

I’m fine taking whoever is left of Bailey, Edgecomb, Johnson, etc versus taking on PG’s huge contract. With this new CBA taking on that contract is extra punitive. I have no faith PG returns to form and is a good asset teams are looking to go after. So it would have to come with the #3 pick and we keep the #5 so Utah has a better chance at one of them panning out to be a cheap good piece while Utah has PG’s contract. t.

I agree it’s not realistic for Utah but you’re obviously taking a pretty extreme read of the deal. PG had one of his best seasons year before last and he was both injured and playing on a train wreck team last year—having ‘no faith’ that he will ever be anything be useless from now seems like just vibes. Remember dozens of times wanted him like 9 months ago and his season wasn’t anything more than just an injury ridden blah.

Also in any trade Utah’s presumably going to get off matching $ that aren’t part of their long term plan. At worst you’re probably still unloading at least 2/3 of the $ on PG’s contract, so it’s not really taking on a gigantic mess of money like it’s sometimes portrayed.

That said I don’t think Utah has much to gain by the gamble on PG’s health. Might make more sense for some other team, unless Utah is looking to make a foolish PO push (which they shouldn’t do).

Am I the only one that read the reports that Utah was done tanking?

I saw that too but I don’t think that should be confused for them making kinda foolish moves. The Sixers could’ve realistically hoped to be a contender-ish team with a healthy Embiid, PG, Maxey, and supporting cast. The Jazz with a healthy PG instead of like Collins and Sexton aren’t doing anything special, even if they’re a little better.

[HotelVitale]

I have Johnson higher on my board than VJ and Ace and I expect that he'll be available at #5.

Very good chance Ace won’t sniff top 4 with the way he’s been acting. I wouldn’t count on Johnson being there, he’s one of the only guys with a clear elite key skill (maybe the most valuable one) who also has no concerns or question marks about keeping up athletically etc. Plus plenty of upside.

I think he’s consensus top 5 for sure at this point, probably #3-4 on many boards. Possible he’s there at 5 but definitely risky.

[jredsaz]

I have Johnson higher on my board than VJ and Ace and I expect that he'll be available at #5.

Very good chance Ace won’t sniff top 4 with the way he’s been acting. I wouldn’t count on Johnson being there, he’s one of the only guys with a clear elite key skill (maybe the most valuable one) who also has no concerns or question marks about keeping up athletically etc. Plus plenty of upside.

I think he’s consensus top 5 for sure at this point, probably #3-4 on many boards. Possible he’s there at 5 but definitely risky.

I agree. Ace is actively tanking his own value.

[Daddy 801]

It depends on how you feel about the players available. In this draft I think the difference between Edgecombe and the the next guys is decent. PGs contract is rough but when healthy he will help the Jazz compete and like he’s done before, Angie might be able to buy low here and flip PG for a decent asset or two down the line. Honestly, I don’t see the value in standing pat and drafting at five.

Also, another sliding door from this trade, can Lauri and #3 get you #2+ from the Spurs? Haven’t been able to get up to Harper as of yet, maybe this can.

I’m fine taking whoever is left of Bailey, Edgecomb, Johnson, etc versus taking on PG’s huge contract. With this new CBA taking on that contract is extra punitive. I have no faith PG returns to form and is a good asset teams are looking to go after. So it would have to come with the #3 pick and we keep the #5 so Utah has a better chance at one of them panning out to be a cheap good piece while Utah has PG’s contract. t.

I agree it’s not realistic for Utah but you’re obviously taking a pretty extreme read of the deal. PG had one of his best seasons year before last and he was both injured and playing on a train wreck team last year—having ‘no faith’ that he will ever be anything be useless from now seems like just vibes. Remember dozens of teams wanted him like 9 months ago and his season wasn’t anything more than just an injury ridden blah.

Also in any trade Utah’s presumably going to get off matching $ that aren’t part of their long term plan. At worst you’re probably still unloading at least 2/3 of the $ on PG’s contract, so it’s not really taking on a gigantic mess of money like it’s sometimes portrayed.

That said I don’t think Utah has much to gain by the gamble on PG’s health. Might make more sense for some other team, unless Utah is looking to make a foolish PO push (which they shouldn’t do).

I didn’t want anything to do with PG’s contract before he singed with Philly. And I sure as hell don’t now. Never been all that impressed with him and his contract is an albatross contract. He’s an easy pass. The new CBA makes it even worse.

[jredsaz]

I’m fine taking whoever is left of Bailey, Edgecomb, Johnson, etc versus taking on PG’s huge contract. With this new CBA taking on that contract is extra punitive. I have no faith PG returns to form and is a good asset teams are looking to go after. So it would have to come with the #3 pick and we keep the #5 so Utah has a better chance at one of them panning out to be a cheap good piece while Utah has PG’s contract. t.

I agree it’s not realistic for Utah but you’re obviously taking a pretty extreme read of the deal. PG had one of his best seasons year before last and he was both injured and playing on a train wreck team last year—having ‘no faith’ that he will ever be anything be useless from now seems like just vibes. Remember dozens of teams wanted him like 9 months ago and his season wasn’t anything more than just an injury ridden blah.

Also in any trade Utah’s presumably going to get off matching $ that aren’t part of their long term plan. At worst you’re probably still unloading at least 2/3 of the $ on PG’s contract, so it’s not really taking on a gigantic mess of money like it’s sometimes portrayed.

That said I don’t think Utah has much to gain by the gamble on PG’s health. Might make more sense for some other team, unless Utah is looking to make a foolish PO push (which they shouldn’t do).

I didn’t want anything to do with PG’s contract before he singed with Philly. And I sure as hell don’t now. Never been all that impressed with him and his contract is an albatross contract. He’s an easy pass. The new CBA makes it even worse.

Even with PGs contract, the Jazz will have zero issues with the apron rules over the next three seasons.