Does Robinson's metrics make him top 15 at least

[migya]

I am not even sure he is all that much ahead of draymond green

Because of titles?

I'd struggle to see how Robinson on those Warriors teams doesn't win 6+ titles.

Are you kidding? Replace Draymond with DRob and those teams win five straight minimum! Talk about opening up the shooters..... Two top 5 alltime shooters!

[migya]

I am not even sure he is all that much ahead of draymond green

Because of titles?

I'd struggle to see how Robinson on those Warriors teams doesn't win 6+ titles.

No, i didnt say anythingh about titles

I dont have draymond above robinson but probably have robinson in the high 20's to low 30's and draymond as fringe top 50 player contender, somewhere in a 51-70 range

Draymond is a worse offensive player at any role (first, second, third, fourth option) and a worse regular season lifter

But robinson is a extremely flawed lead option that struggled against playoffs defense and had a knack for underperforming relative to his admiteddly elite regular seasons, his defense was great but not otherwordly against good competition either

Draymond is a surprisingly resilient playoffs player and has been the 2nd mpst important player in 2 different title teams like robinson

Someone like anthony davis is probably functionally closer to the admiral

Robinson's defense is top 5 alltime. Again, Robinson had bad talent on his pre Duncan teams and on the Warriors, he has two guards that open things massively. Add Iguodala and that's a team that could win rivaling Russell's Celtics.

[migya]

Jordan
James
Kareem
Duncan
Russell
Shaq
Bird
Johnson
Hakeem
Wilt
Curry
Jokic
Kobe
Oscar
West

That's 15 right there. Then there's Giannis, Erving, Garnett, Dirk which I'm comfortable putting DROB around there also Mikan. So yeah top 15 isn't a guaranteed lock but not far of it. I just don't like flawed players at the top when starting the thing rolling. Pretty big anti Garnett advocate for the very same reason as well though DROBs playoff resume isn't all that bad all things considered for his skillet.

I have Giannis and Dirk ahead because they just have a higher standing when it comes down to it. Don't know why people refuse to acknowledge that the hill you stand on isn't a number one option no matter what you do. And that holds most value in championship equity. Crunch whatever you want you'll always fall short.

It's like Dirk plus all nba def anchor
Or DROB with elite wing/guard guy

... I can do the exact same thing with Dirk but regardless your going to need someone better at putting ball in hoop to get the job done but not in Dirks case. It's literally the same analogous argument with Ewing. Great RS play but you'll be short which happened. The exact same with Garnett into Pierce

If I'm closer objectively to champ equity with an individual I'm taking that said individual over one whose further away.

On a purely statistical or metric scale he definitely has an argument to be top 15 but so does Harden, Embiid but we aren't stupid enough to buy it.

That list is mostly accurately, except for Curry, Jokic (at the moment) and possibly Kobe. In overall impact, Robinson can also be slightly ahead of guards and wings, particularly Bird, Magic, Oscar and West, but ofcourse these are alltime giants of the nba who played well in playoffs and had iconic moments. Don't think the others you listed outside your top 15 have any case ahead of Robinson. Longevity definitely is not great for Robinson BUT he did perform well 99-01 not as #1 option.

[migya]

His RS numbers '90-'96 put him up for discussion with anyone (his run with Duncan is very good but also clearly a step down), but there's just nothing to hang his hat on playoffs wise in his best years. The best team they beat in that 7 year run was a +2, 51 win Blazers with Clyde Drexler injured.

Even KG in Minnesota at least has the '04 Kings on his resume.

He barely lost against finals strong team Blazers in 1990 as a rookie, finals Suns in 1993 with mvp Barkley, who barely lost to Bulls in finals, barely lost in 95 to champion Rockets who swept in finals. That's stiff competition. He was close to having a much better looking playoff resume but again, his teams were not good and less than his opponents.

[migya]

Because of titles?

I'd struggle to see how Robinson on those Warriors teams doesn't win 6+ titles.

Eh. Nowhere near the distributor and arguably not as good a spacer (unless you think Robinson's middy will translate seamlessly into a decent 3).

Way better slasher ofc and at the very least his equal as defender (and given reduced offensive responsibilities, probably way better). Worlds apart better shotblocker, although at least part of the numbers are down to the post-heavy era.

Globally, I don't think there's any argument The Admiral is a better player, but on that Warriors squad there's a situational argument that Dray is more useful.

I'll grant that Green is a much better distributor (although, distributing to Curry and Klay and sometimes KD is a dream job) and as a smaller player, he's a better ball-handler. I do think Robinson had the requisite skills to occasionally bring up the ball and distribute some. I like his passing a lot, despite being in a poor system to showcase it, and the rules today would open up his movement with the ball. I think he'd shoot a serviceable three, but obviously the main role you want him in is the finisher at the rim.

I guess the question is, if you swap Green for Robinson, is the tradeoff in playmaking for everything else worth it? I would say it is. The gravity of Robinson at the rim contrasted with the Splash shooters would be just about impossible to defend. If you look at free throw rates, Robinson was fouled on 58% of his shots, the same as Shaq, despite shooting way more middies than Shaq. And he usually made 3/4 of his FTs. Now, Shaq was better at getting to the rim, but if Robinson got there, he was even more likely to be fouled.

Again, with the shooting, spacing, less double teams (he was always doubled teamed), and freedom of movement (I think Robinson would do a fair number of Gianni-step drives too), not to mention the lack of bruisers at the rim in this modern era...I think it would have been game-over for the rest of the league.

And as a bonus, Robinson wouldn't drive KD away like Green did, lol.

Robinson would've got multiple mvps and Curry would be secondary to hi, like the #2 option guard that allowed Robinson enough freedom to dominate. He'd be the best player of the 2000s.

[One_and_Done]

He has a top 15 peak, but might not quite be top 15 all-time.

Lebron

Kareem
Duncan

Shaq/Jordan/Magic
Curry
Bird
Hakeem
KG

That's 10 already. Then there are guys like KD, Jokic & Giannis. I don't think D.Rob has much of a case over them.

D.Rob is in that next group, with K.Malone, Dirk, CP3, Nash, Dr J, etc. He's got a tough argument for being better than all but 1 of those guys.