2025 Offseason Trade and Free Agency Thread (Wow this is fun!)

[redslastlaugh]

Witnessing worst trade for White & Jaylen brown. Some of y’all I think, don’t even watch nba and just throwing random names. Everyone needs to realize, we are not rebuilding..

It's not that we're "rebuilding" it's that we have 12 guys signed to $224 million and that's $224 million not including Luke Kornet and Al Horford. We need a 14 man roster and the budget is perhaps $189 million, perhaps $200 million, perhaps $207.8 million. We don't know the budget. We just know it's not $240 or $225 million.

We also assume Brad wants to bring back Luke, Al or both Luke and Al or just some other starting quality center, and this is gonna take another sum maybe - (?) $25 million, $15 million, $10 million, $5 million? Again, we don't know.

The many varieties of trades we've been seeing are just all the different ideas or steps or permutations towards the goal: lopping $20-$40 million off the books to get back to championship-level once Tatum comes back from injury.

[Celts17Pride]

I keep telling people the Celtics are going to try to get below the 2nd apron this year but it’s going to be tough. It’s mandatory they are below the 2nd apron for 2026/2027 ie moving Jrue Holiday

[FlyBono]

Brown to Spurs for Castle and #2 overall, I’ll drive him to airport

[Fierce1]

I keep telling people the Celtics are going to try to get below the 2nd apron this year but it’s going to be tough. It’s mandatory they are below the 2nd apron for 2026/2027 ie moving Jrue Holiday

To avoid repeater the Cs have to be below the aprons in 2026 and 2027.

Hard but doable in 2026.

Cap in 2026 is 155m.

Cs only need to stay at 188m and 2027 will be automatic.

[GrandTheftRondo]

Can we stop saying trading for a talented Rookie "isn't a Sure thing".. Of course it isn't. It would be a gamble. But some gambles are worth the risk. Some are not. That is where GM's have to make the Difficult decision. That's what can separate good-bad-great ones.

If this was a Brown for Cooper Flag proposal, would anyone say no? ( well I guess there is always someone) But point is, is it a sure thing Cooper (who I love) is a sure thing to end up better than Harper?

And this is more than just trading Brown the player. It is also trading Brown and his contract. THAT is totally being forgotten for some reason. Trading Brown gets Boston quite a few other players besides a talented rookie.

Can't prove it, but I would bet Stevens trades Brown if the possibility for #2 + plus players actually became possible. The ball is in SAS court.

It’s not just the gamble, it’s about the market for a finals MVP and multiple time all star.

Just look at the haul Memphis got for Desmond Bane.

Trading away Jaylen with the main piece being pick 2 in a draft with no sure thing is crazy work.

At minimum the core of Brown and Tatum in a weak East has you in the top 3-4. This has been proven virtually every season of their career.

To break it up on a gamble like that is crazy in my eyes and I believe strongly that Brad would agree.

You make it seem like we'd be trading JB for the 27th pick in the draft.

Massive difference between that and the 2nd pick.

Harper is a Cade/Paolo level prospect..both of them were the 1st pick.

Also, Bane is 36th, JB is 30th on the trade value rankings so not a big difference there:
https://nbarankings.theringer.com/trade-value

While that was a good haul Memphis got for Bane, Harper has a higher odds of becoming a star than any of those assets Memphis got..they got KCP (washed), Cole Anthony (decent guard off the bench) and picks which will likely be outside of the lottery since they're orlando's picks and Orlando will likely be near the top of the eastern conference standings for the foreseeable future with Paolo/Franz/Bane/Suggs. So those picks won't be that good..

Are you seriously quoting Bill Simmons?

[165bows]

After the sale Celtics get a free $400M Christmas bonus let’s see if they put their money where their mouth is.

[cl2117]

You got me! I left Brown out of the T&T board one cuz people lose their mind if you ask for even a top 55 protected 2nd for him. I knew Spurs fans would hate trading 2, and there's some validity there. I might put Maluach in your 2nd tier too, but that still leaves 7 out in the cold with KJ or any number of choices. But, I like Trey more than anything you could get from the 4-6 teams. If the draft is the main focus of the deal, you probably just keep #2.

Was more of a fun exercise than anything. I ultimately probably don't trade JB. Just wanted to see if there was a version I could come up with that I liked.

Yeah Malauch is a really good shout, I think he could squeeze into that to 5 and make it a top 6 but sitting at #7 means we're not masters of our own destiny. Wizards just drafted Sarr and Jazz have Kessler/Lauri/Flip so I could see him still being there are #7 or one of the aforementioned teams taking #28 or #32 off our hands to swap knowing that they'd likely still get their guy at #7.

And if you're keeping #14 you could double dip at the big man position and hope between the two we come away with someone who can hold it down on the cheap for a few years. Derik Queen seems like he might fly up closer to Malauch than being there at #14 but he would be a great get if he was still there. Any of the other project bigs though would do: Beringer, Wolf, Sorber, Newall as a PF.

Depending on what we do with KP/Jrue we could put together a scrappy team that features the guys we are trying to develop plus a bunch of pieces that potentially could get sold off for value by the deadline if we're looking more like a lotto team than a play-in.

Here's a Jrue/KP trade I'm trying to kick around with CHI/LAC:

BOS in: Vucevic, Dunn, Carter, Eubanks
BOS out: Jrue, KP, Tillman

CHI: KP, Bogdan
CHI out: Vucevic, Carter

LAC: Jrue, Tillman
LAC out: Bogdon, Eubanks, Dunn

Bulls eat an extra $18m to upgrade from Vuc to KP. LAC take on Jrue's long-term money for expiring parts.

C's basically get the poor man's version of both KP (Vuc) and Jrue (Dunn) but we also shave $24m off our cap hit. You combine that with the savings from the SAS/NOP Brown deal and they're like $2m under the tax having filled an extra 2 roster spots with guys who shouldn't be overly expensive to dump if we want to go further (KO, Dunn, Eubanks, Carter are all expiring money).

Again I'm not in favor of trading JB but if we did the above and then at #7 and #14 take say Malauch and Newell we're looking at this next year:

Pritchard/ Davison/ Carter
White/ Dunn/ Scheierman
Murphy/ Hauser/
Olynyk/ Newell/ Walsh
Vucevic/ Maluach/ Queta/ Eubanks

HUGE step back absolutely but scrappy young team plus a couple of expiring vets that could be trade deadline targets (Vuc, KO, Hauser, Dunn) for Brad to stack even more assets going into the summer. Either it goes really well and we're a playoff team with a cornerstone player coming back or we're terrible and add a lotto pick to the warchest.

I know people hate taking a step back but this is the type of re-tooling that I'd aim for. Take a step back but still poised to jump back ahead when the time is right.

[chrisab123]

You got me! I left Brown out of the T&T board one cuz people lose their mind if you ask for even a top 55 protected 2nd for him. I knew Spurs fans would hate trading 2, and there's some validity there. I might put Maluach in your 2nd tier too, but that still leaves 7 out in the cold with KJ or any number of choices. But, I like Trey more than anything you could get from the 4-6 teams. If the draft is the main focus of the deal, you probably just keep #2.

Was more of a fun exercise than anything. I ultimately probably don't trade JB. Just wanted to see if there was a version I could come up with that I liked.

Yeah Malauch is a really good shout, I think he could squeeze into that to 5 and make it a top 6 but sitting at #7 means we're not masters of our own destiny. Wizards just drafted Sarr and Jazz have Kessler/Lauri/Flip so I could see him still being there are #7 or one of the aforementioned teams taking #28 or #32 off our hands to swap knowing that they'd likely still get their guy at #7.

And if you're keeping #14 you could double dip at the big man position and hope between the two we come away with someone who can hold it down on the cheap for a few years. Derik Queen seems like he might fly up closer to Malauch than being there at #14 but he would be a great get if he was still there. Any of the other project bigs though would do: Beringer, Wolf, Sorber, Newall as a PF.

Depending on what we do with KP/Jrue we could put together a scrappy team that features the guys we are trying to develop plus a bunch of pieces that potentially could get sold off for value by the deadline if we're looking more like a lotto team than a play-in.

Here's a Jrue/KP trade I'm trying to kick around with CHI/LAC:

BOS in: Vucevic, Dunn, Carter, Eubanks
BOS out: Jrue, KP, Tillman

CHI: KP, Bogdan
CHI out: Vucevic, Carter

LAC: Jrue, Tillman
LAC out: Bogdon, Eubanks, Dunn

Bulls eat an extra $18m to upgrade from Vuc to KP. LAC take on Jrue's long-term money for expiring parts.

C's basically get the poor man's version of both KP (Vuc) and Jrue (Dunn) but we also shave $24m off our cap hit. You combine that with the savings from the SAS/NOP Brown deal and they're like $2m under the tax having filled an extra 2 roster spots with guys who shouldn't be overly expensive to dump if we want to go further (KO, Dunn, Eubanks, Carter are all expiring money).

Again I'm not in favor of trading JB but if we did the above and then at #7 and #14 take say Malauch and Newell we're looking at this next year:

Pritchard/ Davison/ Carter
White/ Dunn/ Scheierman
Murphy/ Hauser/
Olynyk/ Newell/ Walsh
Vucevic/ Maluach/ Queta/ Eubanks

HUGE step back absolutely but scrappy young team plus a couple of expiring vets that could be trade deadline targets (Vuc, KO, Hauser, Dunn) for Brad to stack even more assets going into the summer. Either it goes really well and we're a playoff team with a cornerstone player coming back or we're terrible and add a lotto pick to the warchest.

I know people hate taking a step back but this is the type of re-tooling that I'd aim for. Take a step back but still poised to jump back ahead when the time is right.

Even with Tatum that’s the “scrappy roster” people on this board love more than title teams. They’ll never make it past the 2nd round again, but they’ll play hard. It’s kind of like the IT playoff teams being more popular than the one that one the title last year. Vuc is also nowhere near KP. KP is injury prone but is good when healthy, Vuc is a stiff. Dunn is a JAG. Etc…

[cl2117]

Even with Tatum that’s the “scrappy roster” people on this board love more than title teams. They’ll never make it past the 2nd round again, but they’ll play hard. It’s kind of like the IT playoff teams being more popular than the one that one the title last year. Vuc is also nowhere near KP. KP is injury prone but is good when healthy, Vuc is a stiff. Dunn is a JAG. Etc…

Isn't that kind of perfect for what is shaping up to be a bit of a lost year?

If it blows up in your face, you get rewarded with a top draft pick. If it weirdly works, you've got a fun underdog team to root for.The following summer you can go back to taking big swings to try to upgrade from scrappy to stacked with the ability to aggregate contracts and effectively a full contingent of picks to trade plus some recent lotto picks.

Under the new CBA I think superstars and all-stars are going to be constantly moving teams (not that they don't already) as teams ebb and flow around the aprons. You'll have your normal disgruntled stars but also have guys in line for the supermax that aren't worth it that are going to get traded rather than extended, guys who have to get dumped at a discount because teams need to duck an apron etc etc.. There's going to be opportunities to get right back into contention by finding the next KP/Jrue or even JB, we just need enough assets to be able to stay in the mix. And that's where the risk is in getting change for a dollar, if #7 or #14 don't work out you're eroding value, but at the same time us getting an improved '26 pick and getting out of the tax bring their own value as well, so it's a balancing act.

I still hope we keep JB but I'm certainly a sucker for a "scrappy underdog" team, especially when there's a clear light at the end of the tunnel to return to proper contention.

[phincsfan]

You got me! I left Brown out of the T&T board one cuz people lose their mind if you ask for even a top 55 protected 2nd for him. I knew Spurs fans would hate trading 2, and there's some validity there. I might put Maluach in your 2nd tier too, but that still leaves 7 out in the cold with KJ or any number of choices. But, I like Trey more than anything you could get from the 4-6 teams. If the draft is the main focus of the deal, you probably just keep #2.

Was more of a fun exercise than anything. I ultimately probably don't trade JB. Just wanted to see if there was a version I could come up with that I liked.

Yeah Malauch is a really good shout, I think he could squeeze into that to 5 and make it a top 6 but sitting at #7 means we're not masters of our own destiny. Wizards just drafted Sarr and Jazz have Kessler/Lauri/Flip so I could see him still being there are #7 or one of the aforementioned teams taking #28 or #32 off our hands to swap knowing that they'd likely still get their guy at #7.

And if you're keeping #14 you could double dip at the big man position and hope between the two we come away with someone who can hold it down on the cheap for a few years. Derik Queen seems like he might fly up closer to Malauch than being there at #14 but he would be a great get if he was still there. Any of the other project bigs though would do: Beringer, Wolf, Sorber, Newall as a PF.

Depending on what we do with KP/Jrue we could put together a scrappy team that features the guys we are trying to develop plus a bunch of pieces that potentially could get sold off for value by the deadline if we're looking more like a lotto team than a play-in.

Here's a Jrue/KP trade I'm trying to kick around with CHI/LAC:

BOS in: Vucevic, Dunn, Carter, Eubanks
BOS out: Jrue, KP, Tillman

CHI: KP, Bogdan
CHI out: Vucevic, Carter

LAC: Jrue, Tillman
LAC out: Bogdon, Eubanks, Dunn

Bulls eat an extra $18m to upgrade from Vuc to KP. LAC take on Jrue's long-term money for expiring parts.

C's basically get the poor man's version of both KP (Vuc) and Jrue (Dunn) but we also shave $24m off our cap hit. You combine that with the savings from the SAS/NOP Brown deal and they're like $2m under the tax having filled an extra 2 roster spots with guys who shouldn't be overly expensive to dump if we want to go further (KO, Dunn, Eubanks, Carter are all expiring money).

Again I'm not in favor of trading JB but if we did the above and then at #7 and #14 take say Malauch and Newell we're looking at this next year:

Pritchard/ Davison/ Carter
White/ Dunn/ Scheierman
Murphy/ Hauser/
Olynyk/ Newell/ Walsh
Vucevic/ Maluach/ Queta/ Eubanks

HUGE step back absolutely but scrappy young team plus a couple of expiring vets that could be trade deadline targets (Vuc, KO, Hauser, Dunn) for Brad to stack even more assets going into the summer. Either it goes really well and we're a playoff team with a cornerstone player coming back or we're terrible and add a lotto pick to the warchest.

I know people hate taking a step back but this is the type of re-tooling that I'd aim for. Take a step back but still poised to jump back ahead when the time is right.

Why would Chicago want to eat 18mil?

Vucevic plays 70+ games and gives 19 and 10 each season. KP is lucky to play 40 games.

[GoCeltics123]

You got me! I left Brown out of the T&T board one cuz people lose their mind if you ask for even a top 55 protected 2nd for him. I knew Spurs fans would hate trading 2, and there's some validity there. I might put Maluach in your 2nd tier too, but that still leaves 7 out in the cold with KJ or any number of choices. But, I like Trey more than anything you could get from the 4-6 teams. If the draft is the main focus of the deal, you probably just keep #2.

Was more of a fun exercise than anything. I ultimately probably don't trade JB. Just wanted to see if there was a version I could come up with that I liked.

Yeah Malauch is a really good shout, I think he could squeeze into that to 5 and make it a top 6 but sitting at #7 means we're not masters of our own destiny. Wizards just drafted Sarr and Jazz have Kessler/Lauri/Flip so I could see him still being there are #7 or one of the aforementioned teams taking #28 or #32 off our hands to swap knowing that they'd likely still get their guy at #7.

And if you're keeping #14 you could double dip at the big man position and hope between the two we come away with someone who can hold it down on the cheap for a few years. Derik Queen seems like he might fly up closer to Malauch than being there at #14 but he would be a great get if he was still there. Any of the other project bigs though would do: Beringer, Wolf, Sorber, Newall as a PF.

Depending on what we do with KP/Jrue we could put together a scrappy team that features the guys we are trying to develop plus a bunch of pieces that potentially could get sold off for value by the deadline if we're looking more like a lotto team than a play-in.

Here's a Jrue/KP trade I'm trying to kick around with CHI/LAC:

BOS in: Vucevic, Dunn, Carter, Eubanks
BOS out: Jrue, KP, Tillman

CHI: KP, Bogdan
CHI out: Vucevic, Carter

LAC: Jrue, Tillman
LAC out: Bogdon, Eubanks, Dunn

Bulls eat an extra $18m to upgrade from Vuc to KP. LAC take on Jrue's long-term money for expiring parts.

C's basically get the poor man's version of both KP (Vuc) and Jrue (Dunn) but we also shave $24m off our cap hit. You combine that with the savings from the SAS/NOP Brown deal and they're like $2m under the tax having filled an extra 2 roster spots with guys who shouldn't be overly expensive to dump if we want to go further (KO, Dunn, Eubanks, Carter are all expiring money).

Again I'm not in favor of trading JB but if we did the above and then at #7 and #14 take say Malauch and Newell we're looking at this next year:

Pritchard/ Davison/ Carter
White/ Dunn/ Scheierman
Murphy/ Hauser/
Olynyk/ Newell/ Walsh
Vucevic/ Maluach/ Queta/ Eubanks

HUGE step back absolutely but scrappy young team plus a couple of expiring vets that could be trade deadline targets (Vuc, KO, Hauser, Dunn) for Brad to stack even more assets going into the summer. Either it goes really well and we're a playoff team with a cornerstone player coming back or we're terrible and add a lotto pick to the warchest.

I know people hate taking a step back but this is the type of re-tooling that I'd aim for. Take a step back but still poised to jump back ahead when the time is right.

Why would Chicago want to eat 18mil?

Vucevic plays 70+ games and gives 19 and 10 each season. KP is lucky to play 40 games.

Because Vooch sucks and no one has traded for him for years for a reason

(we'd probably have to include second rounders for them to take KP)

[cl2117]

Why would Chicago want to eat 18mil?

Vucevic plays 70+ games and gives 19 and 10 each season. KP is lucky to play 40 games.

The Bulls are $53m below the tax line so they've got plenty of room to spend and they've continuously tried to not bottom out. KP would effectively be a "free" upgrade for them in terms of assets.

If it works out you get a massive upgrade and potentially bring back KP longer-term. If it doesn't, they'll end up with a higher lottery pick than if they just kept Vuc and he's expiring so there's no long-term commitment. It's a boom/bust play where even if it doesn't work out, there is an upside.

[Curmudgeon]

If Stevens could trade everyone for Vucevic, Kuzma and Poole we could have a 60 loss team next year and have a real shot at AJ Dybantsa.

[jeremym480]

Brown to Spurs for Castle and #2 overall, I’ll drive him to airport

I assume that if we trade Brown in a deal like this, and then move Jrue in a package similar to the Dallas proposal (bringing back Washington/Gafford, and Naji), that could help resolve our cap issues. Then we’d have a chance to evaluate KP’s form—if he returns to his old self, maybe we could lock him into a more team-friendly contract going forward.

Once Tatum is back, we’d have a strong blend of veteran leadership and young talent—something similar to what the “Two Timelines” Warriors had.

Projected rotation:

Dylan Harper, Pritchard
White, Scheierman
Castle, Naji
Washington, Hauser, (Tatum)
KP, Kornet/Horford

Trading Brown isn’t my first choice, but if that Spurs deal is on the table, I’d be on board.

I asked Microsoft Co-Pilot what this would look like because Chat GPT is blocked at my work:

Spoiler:

Question: Would trade Jaylen Brown to the Spurs for the #2 pick and Castle, then Jrue Holiday to Dallas for Gafford and Naji Marshall help the Celtics with their cap issues?

Answer:
Yes, trading Jaylen Brown and Jrue Holiday could significantly help the Boston Celtics with their cap issues, especially under the constraints of the NBA's new second apron rules.

Here's how:
1. Current Cap Situation
The Celtics are projected to be $105 million over the cap and $42.6 million over the luxury tax threshold1.
They are about $25 million over the second apron, which severely limits their flexibility (e.g., no mid-level exception, no aggregating salaries in trades, no sign-and-trades, etc.) 1.
2. Jaylen Brown's Contract
Brown is owed $53.1 million next season 2.
Trading him for a rookie-scale contract (like the #2 pick and Stephon Castle) would drastically reduce salary commitments and provide cost-controlled talent.
3. Jrue Holiday's Contract
Holiday is owed $34.8 million next season 2.
Moving him for players like Daniel Gafford and Naji Marshall, who are on more modest deals, would further reduce the payroll.
4. Cap Relief Impact
Offloading both Brown and Holiday could clear nearly $88 million in salary.
Even if the incoming contracts total around $20–25 million, the Celtics would still save $60+ million, potentially bringing them under the second apron or at least much closer to it.
5. Strategic Benefits
Getting under the second apron would:
Unfreeze their 2032 first-round pick.
Restore trade flexibility.
Allow use of trade exceptions and mid-level exceptions in future seasons 1.
6. Roster Outlook
With Tatum out for the season, this could be a strategic "reset" year.
A young core built around Castle, Gafford, White, and others could develop while maintaining competitiveness.
So yes, your proposed trades would not only help the Celtics financially but also align with a longer-term vision while Tatum recovers.

Here's the visual breakdown of the Celtics' projected cap savings if they trade Jaylen Brown and Jrue Holiday:

Cap Savings Breakdown
Jaylen Brown: $53.1M

Jrue Holiday: $34.8M
→ Total Outgoing: $87.9M

Incoming Contracts:

Stephon Castle: $3.0M (rookie scale)
#2 Pick: $9.0M (rookie scale)
Daniel Gafford: $13.0M
Naji Marshall: $1.9M
→ Total Incoming: $26.9M
Net Cap Savings: $61M

[Hal14]

#2 pick in a crappy draft? Yeah it is

All of this tanking talk has really messed with people. Just because you have the 2nd pick does not mean you’re going to pick anyone close to the level of talent that Jaylen Brown has. This is a very mid draft. You have guys who will be solid rotation players but other than Flagg you have no projected stars.

From The Athletic's Sam Vecenie draft guide:



Harper is as good a prospect (or better) than guys like Paolo, Cade, Tatum, Brown, Mobley, Scottie Barnes, Holmgren, Anthony Edwards, SGA, etc. were when they were pre-draft prospects.

It's funny to you that a top 3 pick is comparable to other top 3 picks before they were drafted?

That's weird.

Especially since Sam Vecenie (who just put out the most comprehensive nba draft guide possibly ever that shows more knowledge on these prospects than anybody) says Harper is a future all-star.

[Memokerobi]

Brown to Spurs for Castle and #2 overall, I’ll drive him to airport

You’ll have to because the Celtics wont do that

[JR Hawks]

"Scrappy underdog" team = treadmill team. No, thanks.

[Celts17Pride]

Seems to be a very logical trade for both teams would be Porzingis to Orlando for M Wagner, Carter, Howard and #25 pick. Magic would have a center that can shoot to go with Suggs, F Wagner, Bane, and Banchero. Celtics would have a long term cheap center in Carter, the #25 pick and after cutting M Wagner, $14.3 in reduced salary. In my opinion this makes so much sense that it will never happen.

[Celts17Pride]

"Scrappy underdog" team = treadmill team. No, thanks.

Celtics will be a "Scrappy underdog" team next year no matter what they do.

[cl2117]

"Scrappy underdog" team = treadmill team. No, thanks.

Scrappy underdog team... without Tatum. With Tatum it's a playoff team. With Tatum and a trade the following summer for another star to add to Tatum, White, Murphy, Pritchard et. al. it's a contender. Possibly even a front runner if you strike gold with a draft pick or manage to get a surprisingly big star via trade.

There's no way this team isn't "scrappy" next year without Tatum and a few other cap casualties as well. Regardless of which path we take, we just need to be ready to make moves next summer when we can start looking to add big pieces rather than taking them away. As long as we have assets, we shouldn't be afraid to take a step back. This off-season KD is getting traded, Bane just got dealt, Giannis seems like a genuine trade candidate, there's probably 2-3 guys getting dealt that no one's even talking about. We'll have opportunities to bring in the next KP/Jrue or even JB.