BREAKING: Magic acquire Desmond Bane (KCP, Cole + 4 1st Round Picks + 1 1st Round Pick Swap)

[Knightro]

It is not to say that faster is better.

It's asking the question as to whether Desmond Bane is the same player in the complete opposite system with the complete opposite roster around him.

Those 3 systems you listed are good on offense because they are efficient in a slow pace and can score rather easily in a half court in a variety of ways. Orlando is not only slow, but inefficient up to this point.

I do agree though that it will prioritize the defense further and games will be physical grindfests.

From a raw stats perspective, I think Bane's numbers are certainly going to decrease due to the slower pace and the fact he's going from being the No. 2 option in Memphis to the No. 3 option here on most nights. But I don't think that matters all that much provided he stays as efficient as he's been the rest of his career.

If Bane can give the Magic just like 16-17 points a night on .600 TS%, which doesn't seem like an unreasonable expectation, the Magic's offense will absolutely be significantly better than it was.

If they can just bump their offense up to dead middle of the pack 15th, given how well they project to be defensively still, you're talking about somewhere around a +5.0 to +5.5 NET rating which is equivalent of like the 4th best team in the NBA.

[VFX]

It is not to say that faster is better.

It's asking the question as to whether Desmond Bane is the same player in the complete opposite system with the complete opposite roster around him.

Those 3 systems you listed are good on offense because they are efficient in a slow pace and can score rather easily in a half court in a variety of ways. Orlando is not only slow, but inefficient up to this point.

I do agree though that it will prioritize the defense further and games will be physical grindfests.

If Bane can give the Magic just like 16-17 points a night on .600 TS%, which doesn't seem like an unreasonable expectation, the Magic's offense will absolutely be significantly better than it was.

If they can just bump their offense up to dead middle of the pack 15th, given how well they project to be defensively still, you're talking about somewhere around a +5.0 to +5.5 NET rating which is equivalent of like the 4th best team in the NBA.

The offense will undoubtedly be better. To what degree is the question.

This ultimately boils down to how exactly he is used and how effective he is within a much much slower half court setting. Unless we are expecting the system to be more run and gun than we have seen in the last 3-4 seasons here.

[RichCollab]

It is not to say that faster is better.

It's asking the question as to whether Desmond Bane is the same player in the complete opposite system with the complete opposite roster around him.

Those 3 systems you listed are good on offense because they are efficient in a slow pace and can score rather easily in a half court in a variety of ways. Orlando is not only slow, but inefficient up to this point.

I do agree though that it will prioritize the defense further and games will be physical grindfests.

From a raw stats perspective, I think Bane's numbers are certainly going to decrease due to the slower pace and the fact he's going from being the No. 2 option in Memphis to the No. 3 option here on most nights. But I don't think that matters all that much provided he stays as efficient as he's been the rest of his career.

If Bane can give the Magic just like 16-17 points a night on .600 TS%, which doesn't seem like an unreasonable expectation, the Magic's offense will absolutely be significantly better than it was.

If they can just bump their offense up to dead middle of the pack 15th, given how well they project to be defensively still, you're talking about somewhere around a +5.0 to +5.5 NET rating which is equivalent of like the 4th best team in the NBA.

Need health.

[VFX]

Back of my mind, negative thought…. What if KCP regains his 40% shooting next to Ja and Bane slips to sub 36% this upcoming season?

Does Weltman get fired for not bringing in a PG or is he allowed the opportunity to fix the issue?

Well..

Memphis' system is currently built to be more conducive to shooters, or at least the numbers tell us that from last years statistics.

I wouldn't be surprised if he posts better numbers than he did in Orlando.

The real issue would be if we see Bane’s efficiency dip after being a career 41% shooter. Mosley gets fired for sure in this scenario but what about Weltman? Does he get to skate by while ignoring the PG position his entire tenure here?

To me, the sword should fall on Weltman bc a system without a true point guard running an offense, or lacking a player with 5.5-7+ assists per game, in 2025 is just antithetical to how things are currently operating effectively league-wide.

Now who will the sword fall on? Mosely will be fired and Suggs will be traded for a playmaking point guard. I would put a $1,000 bet on that if things do not work out.

[Knightro]

To me, the sword should fall on Weltman bc a system without a true point guard running an offense, or lacking a player with 5.5-7+ assists per game, in 2025 is just antithetical to how things are currently operating effectively league-wide.

Now who will the sword fall on? Mosely will be fired and Suggs will be traded for a playmaking point guard. I would put a $1,000 bet on that.

A better question to me is what would be considered a failure this upcoming season beyond the very obvious (no playoffs or first round exit)?

Is winning one series enough? Is winning two series enough?

Where is the line where this season would flip from "people are getting fired and we're trading guys away to better balance the roster" to "it was a successful season and we're still excited to come back in 26-27"?

[zaymon]

i think any assistant coach who comes here and improves our offense has fair chance to become head coach. Thats worth something.
I think Bane will be fine in slower offense. He can create his shot. Also our transition will be far more deadlier with him

[VFX]

To me, the sword should fall on Weltman bc a system without a true point guard running an offense, or lacking a player with 5.5-7+ assists per game, in 2025 is just antithetical to how things are currently operating effectively league-wide.

Now who will the sword fall on? Mosely will be fired and Suggs will be traded for a playmaking point guard. I would put a $1,000 bet on that.

A better question to me is what would be considered a failure this upcoming season beyond the very obvious (no playoffs or first round exit)?

Is winning one series enough? Is winning two series enough?

Where is the line where this season would flip from "people are getting fired and we're trading guys away to better balance the roster" to "it was a successful season and we're still excited to come back in 26-27"?

Personally it would be winning a playoff series or two AND getting out of the bottom 10 of the worst offenses league wide. Anything short of that is just a monumental failure IMO.

You cannot give up your entire future warchest of picks and land in the same category as “bad offense good defense team” with a first round exit.

This is actually a good poll question tbh.

[eyriq]

I'm predicting a top 15 offense, +52 wins, top 2 seed.

Prediction is based on pure hype. LFG

This is the Rashard Lewis moment for this build.

[thelead]

To be clear, I don’t expect this deal to go sideways but weirder things have happened

[basketballRob]

I'm not expecting the pace to increase all that much for whatever that's worth.

That feels very much a strategic decision so the Magic can maximize their effort defensively and on the defensive glass.

I also don't think a slow pace is death knell for offensive success either.

Boston was 29th in pace and 2nd on offense.
New York was 26th in pace and 5th on offense.
Minnesota was 25th in pace and 8th on offense.

Hopefully, we will try to fast break more. Bane was 3rd in the league at 48.5% on transition 3s out of 63 players who shot more than 50. Bane likes to shoot them from the top of the arc.

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[jezzerinho]

My main point in disputing the “Boston blueprint” is that the comparison between the two stops at “two Forwards to build around as Batman and Robin”. That’s really where the similarities end to be honest.

They don’t have the same tendencies. Paolo and Franz are less efficient, even if you extrapolate their ages. They have different games and profiles. Their games are both iso heavy and getting to the line. (Tatum does too but he also is just a more efficient shot maker from outside, I’ll let that slide though).

BUT I will say that they haven’t had the same caliber of supporting cast in their defense. Tatum was a rookie with Kyrie Irving. Paolo had Fultz. So maybe if you want to be rosier about the comparison you could say “we haven’t seen it yet for reason X”. I’ll politely disagree but what does it matter.

One system works because it has a lot of shot making everywhere on the court. It also has competent guard playmakers. It’s not an either or situation. Tatum can hit shots and so can his back court.

That's what excites me - the major gap between the Magic and the Celtics is 3pt shooting, and the team has acknowledged as much and just went out and got a volume shooter before the season is over. I think more is coming. And positive signs from the last 2 post seasons is that Paolo has averaged 40% and 44% from 3 in each post season, shooting over 5 attempts per game.

I'd like to see another PG added to the team, though, because Indy is showing you can't have too many ball handlers and passers as long as they're all on the same page, and it opens up 3pt shooting as well as anything. I hear your concerns about the Magic and our pieces in general, I just feel confident and optimistic that management will address that this summer and the team will address it throughout next season. Bane is a good start. The team sees their window and they're shooting their shot, and I'm all aboard.

I'm really hoping one of two things happens this offseason...

1) They hire a coordinator on offense that knows what they are doing.
2) Mosely completely changes how he has run things on offense if #1 doesn't happen. Maybe he reads a "Good NBA offense for dummies" book in the summer.

A few things are true about last season and how Bane operated in previous seasons.

Orlando has one of the slowest paced offenses in the NBA. Memphis had the fastest. Orlando ranked #30, Memphis ranked #1.
This isn't to suggest that "faster is better", but you can't be slow AND bad. That just tells me there isnt really a system at all. We know for sure that there weren't a huge variation of plays being called here.

Orlando was bottom 5 in these categories (Assist%, Assist/TO ratio, EG%, and TS%)
Ultimately, this means Orlando had the least amount of possessions (ranked last), while also being the least efficient league-wide as the worst offense. Then they decided that shooting was a larger issue than ball movement. Thats a pretty impressive task to be honest with two players on exceedingly high usage and you are handing max contract to both. It tells me the system is broken in more ways than adding one shooter.

Sure, Bane helps with ball movement more than KCP or Gary Harris did. He can get a shot without absolutely needing to be wide open. However, Bane in Orlando without the aforementioned system is what player exactly? Is he still putting up the same numbers in the slowest offense in the league, on the lowest amount of possessions, shared with two guys needing the ball in their hands to be effective, with bottom ranked assist numbers and percentage? Color me slightly skeptical.

I'm not saying it wont work, but I haven't seen a flourishing system yet where offense is easily replicated with the players you expect it to come from. It's not like we have been watching Giannis, Jokic, or SGA here and we are adding a missing ingredient to put Orlando over the edge offensively. We haven't seen a real system at all yet.

The argument here from people on this trade is that we haven't seen a real system yet, due to shooting, and adding Bane is somehow foundational to this all working. Its a bigger risk than people actually can conceive of yet because it required a lot of assets and it implies the current system isn't inherently flawed on principle as the actual numbers suggest.. We will see.

V interesting stuff

[Knightro]

To be clear, I don’t expect this deal to go sideways but weirder things have happened

I'm hard pressed to see things going really sideways unless they just get bombarded with injuries again.

Like if Paolo, Franz, Suggs, Bane all play a reasonable amount of games, they're gonna win a lot.

[basketballRob]

I guarantee our 3-pt shooting averages will increase by at least 50 pts. That's for the players who were on the Magic roster last year.

Sent from my SM-G998U1 using RealGM mobile app

[SOUL]

Bane is going to help a lot, but one of Franz or Paolo will have to be able to stretch the floor and Suggs has to get back to 35%.

[SOUL]

Watch on YouTube

[cedric76]

I'm predicting a top 15 offense, +52 wins, top 2 seed.

Prediction is based on pure hype. LFG

This is the Rashard Lewis moment for this build.

Fair

[rcklsscognition]

I feel like this is the most hyped I’ve been since we signed Rashard. The more I see the more I like. I can’t miss on picks if we don’t have any.

[Idiosyncratic]

Haven't really had the time to fully comment on this and probably don't really have anything to say that hasn't been said, but will share some of my thoughts anyway.

I think I am mostly leaning to thinking the deal is fine. I get the overpay complaints and Bane not being a PG complaints, but I think overall the price is pretty fine and Bane is very good.

IMO the main way it could really end up hurting is if the Suns end up top 3 or so. And I think that is possible because that organization is in such bad shape that I wouldn't doubt something that depressing happening to them. I think if that pick could have been top 2 protected or something small even like that this would have been a clear win, but as it stands I still think it is fine. And we also have the opportunity to win a title and not care if that pick ends up #2 as well.

Many called for a Donovan Mitchell type move for this team and I always thought it would make more sense to just combine picks and acquire someone really good under control for several years instead of paying a pick or 2 here or there for OK players and that is what they did. They have 4 years to make strong runs and then will still own their picks after that so not too worried. Of course it does make adding future talent very very hard without draft luck. Time for Weltman to find a gem at 25 this year or with a 2nd going forward.

In summary, I get questioning the fit, but I think value and timeline make a ton of sense. I think this team may still need to find a way to add one more really solid player to truly be a title contender, but it should at least be exciting and that is what it is all about at the end of the day.

[SOUL]

In summary, I get questioning the fit, but I think value and timeline make a ton of sense. I think this team may still need to find a way to add one more really solid player to truly be a title contender, but it should at least be exciting and that is what it is all about at the end of the day.

I don't, lol. He's exactly what we need. The ideals of the point guards people want on our team only actually make sense in a backup role or if we started this rebuild with a blue chipper at PG. Otherwise, the options are people that are unattainable, don't play defense, have major off-court/personality issues, or would cost Suggs/AB/etc in return. I think that specific trade only happens with Suggs/others in it and has always been like that, TBH.

[Idiosyncratic]

In summary, I get questioning the fit, but I think value and timeline make a ton of sense. I think this team may still need to find a way to add one more really solid player to truly be a title contender, but it should at least be exciting and that is what it is all about at the end of the day.

I don't, lol. He's exactly what we need. The ideals of the point guards people want on our team only actually make sense in a backup role or if we started this rebuild with a blue chipper at PG. Otherwise, the options are people that are unattainable, don't play defense, have major off-court/personality issues, or would cost Suggs/AB/etc in return. I think that specific trade only happens with Suggs/others in it and has always been like that, TBH.

Yeah I agree. I think given who was available he made a ton of sense. Basically the guys who are perfect fits are super stars and unobtainable. A lot of them are probably already on super max contracts or are going to require it very soon. Like even if Trae or Fox were your guys they are going to need an extension next year that is not fittable with Suggs on the roster.

I think Maxey and Garland are probably the guys you could argue make the most sense at their salary slots that fill our need, but again, not sure either of those guys were obtainable for rebuilding type packages. Then you have the options we always discuss and keeping the Suns pick hoping for luck which would have been fine IMO, but I honestly don't dislike this path. Gives us a strong 4 year timeline with our guys entering their primes and no clear super team in the East.

There's also just the reality that this is how the front office wants to do it. They want to have a team of all strong defensive links and they want to playmake by committee. Right or wrong, we will have to see how it works out. Always is the option of trading one of the core 4 next year if it doesn't work out, but I think they are going to be pretty good and I am very excited.