Rumors, Random Thoughts, and non-Threadworthy Posts 18.0 Dave Cowens drove a taxi

[K_chile22]

Who do we think gets paid more, Sam Merrill or Luke Kennard? I think Kennard gets more but I don't think he should

[jbk1234]

Who do we think gets paid more, Sam Merrill or Luke Kennard? I think Kennard gets more but I don't think he should

Agreed. I have Merrill as the better all around player, and I think there's reason to believe he'd do better on a team like the Knicks, Pistons or Rockets who have the defensive personnel to offset his limitations on that end.

[K_chile22]

Who do we think gets paid more, Sam Merrill or Luke Kennard? I think Kennard gets more but I don't think he should

Agreed. I have Merrill as the better all around player, and I think there's reason to believe he'd do better on a team like the Knicks, Pistons or Rockets who have the defensive personnel to offset his limitations on that end.

Yeah if the rockets got him for the TP MLE I'd be over the moon. Merrill is actually the shooter people think Kennard is, Kennard is so conservative with his shot selection for a guy who shoots that well it's extremely frustrating and makes him less valuable when that's all he does. Merrill doesn't have that issue

[Texas Chuck]

Who do we think gets paid more, Sam Merrill or Luke Kennard? I think Kennard gets more but I don't think he should

Agreed. I have Merrill as the better all around player, and I think there's reason to believe he'd do better on a team like the Knicks, Pistons or Rockets who have the defensive personnel to offset his limitations on that end.

Yeah if the rockets got him for the TP MLE I'd be over the moon. Merrill is actually the shooter people think Kennard is, Kennard is so conservative with his shot selection for a guy who shoots that well it's extremely frustrating and makes him less valuable when that's all he does. Merrill doesn't have that issue

Kennard also offers secondary playmaking. Now I'm open to an argument he doesn't do enough in that regard to offset his reticence to shoot, but I think we put too much emphasis on the shots taken/made and not enough emphasis on how players are guarded. I haven't watched his career consistently enough to know for sure, but I've probably seen 40-50 Luke Kennard games over the years and to my memory teams guard him opening up space.

Its like Davis Bertans. He only had that one really big productive year, but he kept being a positive on courts for teams because teams were terrified of him getting shots. Luke Kennard is an elite 3-pt shooter. On now a 4 year+ run of making over 45% of his 3's and almost all of them above the break.

Merrill gets them off at a more frequent rate for sure, but with quite a bit less accuracy. Not quite as high a percentage above the break, but certainly not a corner specialist either.

I wouldn't have Merrill a more valuable spacer or player I don't think.

[jbk1234]

Agreed. I have Merrill as the better all around player, and I think there's reason to believe he'd do better on a team like the Knicks, Pistons or Rockets who have the defensive personnel to offset his limitations on that end.

Yeah if the rockets got him for the TP MLE I'd be over the moon. Merrill is actually the shooter people think Kennard is, Kennard is so conservative with his shot selection for a guy who shoots that well it's extremely frustrating and makes him less valuable when that's all he does. Merrill doesn't have that issue

Kennard also offers secondary playmaking. Now I'm open to an argument he doesn't do enough in that regard to offset his reticence to shoot, but I think we put too much emphasis on the shots taken/made and not enough emphasis on how players are guarded. I haven't watched his career consistently enough to know for sure, but I've probably seen 40-50 Luke Kennard games over the years and to my memory teams guard him opening up space.

Its like Davis Bertans. He only had that one really big productive year, but he kept being a positive on courts for teams because teams were terrified of him getting shots. Luke Kennard is an elite 3-pt shooter. On now a 4 year+ run of making over 45% of his 3's and almost all of them above the break.

Merrill gets them off at a more frequent rate for sure, but with quite a bit less accuracy. Not quite as high a percentage above the break, but certainly not a corner specialist either.

I wouldn't have Merrill a more valuable spacer or player I don't think.

Merrill punches above his weight class with respect to rebounding/defense due to technique and positioning. Too many Cavs fans confuse this with being a good defender (he's not), but he's very solid fundamentally and eager, which are two qualities I don't associate with Kennard. Theoretically, I think Kennard should have an easier time getting his shot off when defended, but if he's reluctant to pull, it doesn't do you any good.

[Klomp]

Mavs podcaster

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I do think it's interesting. With Tatum and Haliburton going down, a chance at home-court advantage in the East will be there for the taking. Orlando is already making its move, but will another team join them? Does Quin Snyder push to add his former all-NBA center? Does Miami or Detroit feel like they are one Julius Randle away from making a run? Any other big moves out there?

The Pistons are offensively starved enough to talk themselves into it, but neither the Heat nor the Hawks are a single player away from contending in the East.

I really don't understand why fans insist that the West is better. It's better 7-10, but those teams aren't really contenders so I don't see that as a particularly relevant consideration when you're talking about trading to give yourself a shot at contending. The Lakers, Clippers, and Warriors have critical players who are old so of course they're going to be less risk adverse when it comes to trades.

Like I said, I think the injuries to Tatum and Haliburton will change how some East teams approach the offseason. Now I do think both teams will still be good, but I would be surprised if they are Top 4 good. The Knicks have their own questions, as well. That means there are openings for teams to potentially take advantage of.

I think that's part of what Minnesota has done in the last 3-5 seasons. While they haven't gone all the way in, they've put themselves in the discussion to be at least one of the top teams for a number of seasons consecutively. That gives them a chance by just staying competitive. They are always in the picture.

[jbk1234]

I do think it's interesting. With Tatum and Haliburton going down, a chance at home-court advantage in the East will be there for the taking. Orlando is already making its move, but will another team join them? Does Quin Snyder push to add his former all-NBA center? Does Miami or Detroit feel like they are one Julius Randle away from making a run? Any other big moves out there?

The Pistons are offensively starved enough to talk themselves into it, but neither the Heat nor the Hawks are a single player away from contending in the East.

I really don't understand why fans insist that the West is better. It's better 7-10, but those teams aren't really contenders so I don't see that as a particularly relevant consideration when you're talking about trading to give yourself a shot at contending. The Lakers, Clippers, and Warriors have critical players who are old so of course they're going to be less risk adverse when it comes to trades.

Like I said, I think the injuries to Tatum and Haliburton will change how some East teams approach the offseason. Now I do think both teams will still be good, but I would be surprised if they are Top 4 good. The Knicks have their own questions, as well. That means there are openings for teams to potentially take advantage of.

I think that's part of what Minnesota has done in the last 3-5 seasons. While they haven't gone all the way in, they've put themselves in the discussion to be at least one of the top teams for a number of seasons consecutively. That gives them a chance by just staying competitive. They are always in the picture.

I mean no offense, but I've really never viewed the Wolves as contenders. Conley at PG is just too big an obstacle with Gobert at center and McDaniels at SF. It's very difficult for them to make teams pay for tilting towards Ant.

[Klomp]

I mean no offense, but I've really never viewed the Wolves as contenders. Conley at PG is just too big an obstacle with Gobert at center and McDaniels at SF. It's very difficult for them to make teams pay for tilting towards Ant.

No offense taken. I certainly believe that is the next iteration of where this team needs to go. But I don't think consecutive WCF appearances should be balked at. Each of the last three years, Minnesota lost to the team that won the title.

[Mavrelous]

Somebody tell Shams he's not competing with Woj anymore, no need for big declarations to tell us Khris pikhed up his khoption.

[Texas Chuck]

Somebody tell Shams he's not competing with Woj anymore, no need for big declarations to tell us Khris pikhed up his khoption.

Meh. Its his job to report news, even obvious ones like Dwight Powell doing the same. Not his fault ESPN makes him format it as a big deal.

[jbk1234]

I mean no offense, but I've really never viewed the Wolves as contenders. Conley at PG is just too big an obstacle with Gobert at center and McDaniels at SF. It's very difficult for them to make teams pay for tilting towards Ant.

No offense taken. I certainly believe that is the next iteration of where this team needs to go. But I don't think consecutive WCF appearances should be balked at. Each of the last three years, Minnesota lost to the team that won the title.

The Celtics beat the Mavs, and it wasn't particularly close.

[Consequence]

Somebody tell Shams he's not competing with Woj anymore, no need for big declarations to tell us Khris pikhed up his khoption.

Meh. Its his job to report news, even obvious ones like Dwight Powell doing the same. Not his fault ESPN makes him format it as a big deal.

I don't even think ESPN makes him format things like that, it's just fluffing so that agents tell him stuff. Gotta keep those relationships up with option announcements so that you can get the scoop for a signing or trade.

[Texas Chuck]

I mean no offense, but I've really never viewed the Wolves as contenders. Conley at PG is just too big an obstacle with Gobert at center and McDaniels at SF. It's very difficult for them to make teams pay for tilting towards Ant.

No offense taken. I certainly believe that is the next iteration of where this team needs to go. But I don't think consecutive WCF appearances should be balked at. Each of the last three years, Minnesota lost to the team that won the title.

The Celtics beat the Mavs, and it wasn't particularly close.

It wasn't. But I know you view the Cavs as contenders and the Mavs went 2 rounds further than the Cavs have managed post Lebron and they did so with injured pieces including their superstar since I know that is why you aren't concerned about the lack of progress about the Cavs. Wolves have gone further than this iteration of Cavs teams twice now.

At some point winning series has to account for something. And I say this not to say Cleveland isn't a contender, but to say if the Luka Mavs and current Wolves aren't contenders we are basically saying only the Thunder are now which may in fact be true. We could absolutely be looking at the start of a dynasty. But teams shouldn't have that mindset and just concede it. So yeah any broader scope of contenders should include the Wolves even if you wish they had a better PG.

[Klomp]

The Celtics beat the Mavs, and it wasn't particularly close.

Don't mind me over here....

[Texas Chuck]

Somebody tell Shams he's not competing with Woj anymore, no need for big declarations to tell us Khris pikhed up his khoption.

Meh. Its his job to report news, even obvious ones like Dwight Powell doing the same. Not his fault ESPN makes him format it as a big deal.

I don't even think ESPN makes him format things like that, it's just fluffing so that agents tell him stuff. Gotta keep those relationships up with option announcements so that you can get the scoop for a signing or trade.

The formatting is definitely from ESPN, but yes you make an excellent point. He absolutely glorifies players at the behest of agents to keep his access.

But I like getting the info so I just ignore his fawning or the Breaking News Banner and just read the meat of it.

[K_chile22]

Agreed. I have Merrill as the better all around player, and I think there's reason to believe he'd do better on a team like the Knicks, Pistons or Rockets who have the defensive personnel to offset his limitations on that end.

Yeah if the rockets got him for the TP MLE I'd be over the moon. Merrill is actually the shooter people think Kennard is, Kennard is so conservative with his shot selection for a guy who shoots that well it's extremely frustrating and makes him less valuable when that's all he does. Merrill doesn't have that issue

Kennard also offers secondary playmaking. Now I'm open to an argument he doesn't do enough in that regard to offset his reticence to shoot, but I think we put too much emphasis on the shots taken/made and not enough emphasis on how players are guarded. I haven't watched his career consistently enough to know for sure, but I've probably seen 40-50 Luke Kennard games over the years and to my memory teams guard him opening up space.

Its like Davis Bertans. He only had that one really big productive year, but he kept being a positive on courts for teams because teams were terrified of him getting shots. Luke Kennard is an elite 3-pt shooter. On now a 4 year+ run of making over 45% of his 3's and almost all of them above the break.

Merrill gets them off at a more frequent rate for sure, but with quite a bit less accuracy. Not quite as high a percentage above the break, but certainly not a corner specialist either.

I wouldn't have Merrill a more valuable spacer or player I don't think.

The way Merrill fires off motion forces teams to fundamentally guard them completely differently, it's as simple as that to me. His % is worse because he's shooting tougher shots but still shoots well enough that teams are scared of him getting them off. Kennard is not gonna shoot unless he's open and set most of the time so it's not a five alarm fire to know where he's at constantly, can always close out to him, but Merrill requires attention

[K_chile22]

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Someone immediately reaching out to correct Stein after he believed Kelly Iko is very funny to me

[jbk1234]

No offense taken. I certainly believe that is the next iteration of where this team needs to go. But I don't think consecutive WCF appearances should be balked at. Each of the last three years, Minnesota lost to the team that won the title.

The Celtics beat the Mavs, and it wasn't particularly close.

It wasn't. But I know you view the Cavs as contenders and the Mavs went 2 rounds further than the Cavs have managed post Lebron and they did so with injured pieces including their superstar since I know that is why you aren't concerned about the lack of progress about the Cavs. Wolves have gone further than this iteration of Cavs teams twice now.

At some point winning series has to account for something. And I say this not to say Cleveland isn't a contender, but to say if the Luka Mavs and current Wolves aren't contenders we are basically saying only the Thunder are now which may in fact be true. We could absolutely be looking at the start of a dynasty. But teams shouldn't have that mindset and just concede it. So yeah any broader scope of contenders should include the Wolves even if you wish they had a better PG.

That was in response to the comment about the Wolves losing to the team that won the Finals 3 years in a row.

For the record, after the Mavs drafted Lively and traded for Kyrie, PJ and Gafford, I had them as contenders. I said so before the playoffs started last year. I did not feel that way about the Mavs before they put all that together despite having Luka. They had some pretty significant holes.

As far as winning a series, the Cavs have won two series including a tough 4-5 series without Allen. Injuries have derailed a few would-be contenders. I think this core has one more shot, and if it doesn't happen next season (maybe even if it does), that'll be it regardless of the reason.

I had any of the Celtics, Knicks, or Cavs as contenders out of the East and the Thunder or Nuggets out of the West (with the Clippers having a puncher's chance if the stars aligned). Obviously, the surprise contender came out of the East with Carlisle devising a pretty brilliant strategy as far as taking on top-heavy teams (which was compounded in Cleveland's case due to injuries).

But I didn't believe for a second that the Warriors, Lakers, Rockets, Grizzlies, or even the Wolves, were getting out of the West. Those teams had serious issues with their rosters. If by some minor miracle they did, I suspect they would've gotten worked by whoever came out of the East.

[In-N-Out 247]

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Someone immediately reaching out to correct Stein after he believed Kelly Iko is very funny to me

Declining FVV's option and resigning him to a longer term deal seems like an absolute no brainer. Maybe do a descending value contract starting at like 30M-35M for like 3 or 4 years.

[K_chile22]

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Someone immediately reaching out to correct Stein after he believed Kelly Iko is very funny to me

Declining FVV's option and resigning him to a longer term deal seems like an absolute no brainer. Maybe do a descending value contract starting at like 30M-35M for like 3 or 4 years.

I think the decision point is the alternative is opting him in, just paying the tax hit this year in exchange for future cheaper years.

Like, if they agree to let's say $100M/3 as an example, Houston could say ok, let's structure it as an opt in at $44.9M next year then extend off that at $55.1M/2 years. It would hurt for this year but give them a lot more flexibility in the later years as young guys start getting paid, Fred gets the same money either way and $28ish million will still be enough for him to extend off of if it comes to that in two years.