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The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3

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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1321 » by Calvin Klein » Tue Jun 24, 2025 2:36 pm

schnakenpopanz wrote:People talk a ling time for now that Drafting Ayton over Doncic was the mistake. However Drafting Ayton over SGA might be the bigger meistake long term. He would have fit so much better with Booker.
SGA/Booker/Mikal would have been a dynasty



maybe but nobody expected SGA to be this good. It's like not picking Giannis instead of Alex Len
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1322 » by Rebound Mound » Tue Jun 24, 2025 2:38 pm

We should not get rid of Allen. He is a solid player with a near to 50% 3point shooting percentage. Anyway, players are traded in good trades when their teams perform well, not when their GMs have relationships...

On the other hand, year after year, fans elucubrate, read, talk and hope that the draft night is going to change their franchise's future only to see that only a few young players, usually those less expected to do so, or that play for the worst teams, have a shot at showing some promising abilities during their first years. I doubt any other player than Flagg can draw much attention for his performances next season.

I prefer by a landslide to get a player like Vucevic, Porzingis, Sabonis, Lonzo or Markannen that spent 5 years to see how Maluach or any other kid developes into Brandon Knight, Jackson or Bender...
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1323 » by KdoubleDees23 » Tue Jun 24, 2025 2:42 pm

Do we have a trade today or tomorrow before the draft?
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1324 » by KdoubleDees23 » Tue Jun 24, 2025 2:43 pm

Rebound Mound wrote:We should not get rid of Allen. He is a solid player with a near to 50% 3point shooting percentage. Anyway, players are traded in good trades when their teams perform well, not when their GMs have relationships...

On the other hand, year after year, fans elucubrate, read, talk and hope that the draft night is going to change their franchise's future only to see that only a few young players, usually those less expected to do so, or that play for the worst teams, have a shot at showing some promising abilities during their first years. I doubt any other player than Flagg can draw much attention for his performances next season.

I prefer by a landslide to get a player like Vucevic, Porzingis, Sabonis, Lonzo or Markannen that spent 5 years to see how Maluach or any other kid developes into Brandon Knight, Jackson or Bender...


Agree, the Suns draft horribly. Give me Vucevic, Porzingis, Sabonis, Markannen. One of the great white hopes!!!
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1325 » by RaisingArizona » Tue Jun 24, 2025 2:44 pm

Reminder McD was going to move up to draft SGA and was vetoed
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1326 » by BobbieL » Tue Jun 24, 2025 2:51 pm

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


If I'm looking to trade Allen,  then I'm looking at trading him to one of 4 teams: 

1- Memphis
Allen/ Richards/ CLE 29' 1st/ BOS 32' 2nd for KCP/ Huff/ 16th pick.  Allen, would replace Bane whom they gave up! Has played for Memphis a few years back, is a much better shooter/ floor spacer /scorer than KCP, and is on a cheaper salary annually than KCP. 


Richards is a solid more established rotation level backup center option for them than Huff to backup Edey, And is on a cheap expiring contract.  And they get a future 1st and a premium 2nd to add to their haul of picks from Orlando,  for the 16th pick.  


For us, we'd get KCP who's on a large expiring contract after next season (the same time as Beal expires). We'd also get Jay Huff, a young, verybkong 7'1 very mobile 3 & D center that fits what Ott is trying to do here. And the prize for us would be the 16th pick. 


With that pick,  we can now add a 2nd premium young cost controlled talent to whomever we draft at 10! Strengthening our roster core positionally while upgrading talent and athleticism and also creating more cap flexibility.  


2- Utah
Allen/ CLE 29' 1st for K Mart Jr/ Svi Mikhaliuk/ Micah Potter (two-way big)/ 21st pick.  
** Allen has played for the Jazz in the past, was a fan favorite, and gives Utah a legitimate solid floor spacing SG that's reliable and familiar with their franchise.

Ainge also gets a future 1st for his pick fix. K Mart is a strong, quick, uber athletic, fast defensive wing/ forward that fits what Ott is trying to do rather ideally and on a 7 million expiring contract.

Mikhaliuk is a cheap shooting specialist on a low contract (filler)/ Potter is a 6'10 physical 3 & D power forward/ center very much in the Maxi Kleber archetype that'd give us size, frontcourt physicality and floor spacing ability.
The prize for us is the 21st pick that'll allow us to add a 2nd high end cost controlled talent to whomever we draft at 10.


3- Charlotte
Allen/ CLE 29' 1st/ BOS 32' 2nd for Okogie/ Williams/ 33rd pick.  
** Allen would give Charlotte a legitimate quality high IQ floor spacing wing that is a strong floor spacing SG. And because the Hornets have a really difficult time even attracting any quality players there, this is a very solid trade for them.

We're also taking back Okogie for salary matching to help them maintain their cap space while reducing the redundancy between him and Josh Green. And for Mark Williams, they're getting a future 1st, a premium future 2nd and a high level rotation player/ floor spacer in Allen.

For us, we're getting a very solid fringe starting caliber, although very injury prone long center in Mark Williams who would either give us another asset that can be moved later, or would allow us to move Richards in a package with O'neale and Martin (Perhaps to Washington for Smart/ 40th pick or future 2nds)??

We'd also be getting back Okogie on a 7 million expiring contract for cap reduction. And the 33rd pick (early 2nd) so we can target Thiero or Kalkbrenner. Then we could consolidate our 2nds easier into future assets?

4- Milwaukee
Allen/ CLE 29' 1st/ BOS 32' 2nd for Connaughton (9 million expiring)/ Tyler Smith Jr/ 47th pick.  

Allen has played for the Bucks before, they need all the depth pieces they could get to tryband be competitive and convince Giannis to stay! Allen is great there playing off if Giannis too. And for us, we'd be getting Connaughtons' 9 million expiring contract for cap reduction.

We'd also be getting Tyler Smith Jr who is a 6'11 very mobile, smooth young floor spacing big 4/5 in the mold/ archetype of Jabari Smith Jr (except just jot as strong yet defensively). Lastly, we get the 47th pick to target another quality young cost controlled prospect to add to our core.

But the centerpiece value for us here is Tyler Smith Jr AND getting 9 million in cap reduction from Comnaughtons' expiring contract giving us cap flexibility as soon as next summer.


I think for O"neale and Allen - - I think its one of two ways
1) you actually get a player that fits the team better like the Orlando center - Biatzde-- I mean, he would be really good
or
2) expirings in the summer of 2026 or maybe 2027 - which is a year ahead of when both expire

Like Grant Williams, hurt this year - expires in 2027 -- so would he be a fit for Allen. Granted he is hurt so not much value this year
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1327 » by SkyBill40 » Tue Jun 24, 2025 3:56 pm

BobbieL wrote:
SkyBill40 wrote:I can't believe - wait... yes I can - that people seriously want Beal's dead money on our cap for five more years rather than just letting him finish out his current deal. One move hurts us more than it helps, and we shouldn't have to argue about which one that is.

Look, I'm not saying I like Beal being here but it is what it is at this point and moving off of him is a worse proposition than having him stay. It's hugely unlikely he's taking a buy out. I mean.. why would he when he's openly said he likes it here?



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I see moving on from Beal from the fans point of view, maybe not this board but twitter and podcasts like PHNX_SUNS for two reasons

1) they are Booker &/or Durant stans so its easier to blame Beal for everything than admit maybe Booker and KD were part of why the team won 36 games. And if Durant did indeed turn down trades - proves the point for many of us why I am least am glad he is gone.

2) its the Flex and Gambo breaking stories that if you stretch and waive Beal - you now have the MLE to "sign a player!!!" Wow - thats fun signing a player. But its more activity over accomplishment


I like Booker and I like Durant; however, that was an awful pairing and we witnessed just how bad for two seasons. You can't force two ball dominant scorers to work together and expect good results. Well, maybe sometimes, but not for these two. Acquiring Durant in the first place was the real problem but Ishbia had stars in his eyes and couldn't be convinced otherwise. Guess this is what we get when the owner has a concussion and picks up the phone. :crazy:

And neither of Flex or Gambo have any sense about them as evidenced by your statement. Gambo is a moron and always has been.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1328 » by thamadkant » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:03 pm

handsome salary wrote:
mkot wrote:Portland trying to make the next step to see what they have.

As for the Celtics, can't believe they don't have to attach picks to "dump" Holiday. Just shows how crucial it is to have a GM that has relationships or respect around the league. Simon is the odd man out in Portland who has a surplus of SGs on their roster, he is 26 so he is who he is, and he shots 10 3s a game, he will fit right in.


When you spend month after month after month desperately telegraphing moves like "we need to get rid of Beal", "Ayton is a mistake" or "KD is on the block" other teams get out their knives to start carving. Throw in a brand new obnoxious/impulsive owner with the old guard and they really want blood.

It's not just the players competing in the league. I could see phone call after phone call between rival GMs laughing about how they made the Suns their toy.

Remember when Booker was the most punchable face in the league...he's got an owner to match.



The pattern is there is someone in the Suns FO that absolutely bends over backwards to appease Booker.


Got rid of Mikal and Cam and Suns future to bring in KD.

Pissed off Ayton then got rid of him to appease Booker and his buddy KD, even sent out Toumani who was a much needed energy player.... all because Booker and KD didn't like the pouting and Ayton not accepting the lob finisher role.

Then backstabbing CP3 who was his buddy before KD. Booker and KD didn't like CP3 breaking down and not being a threat to shoot 3s and score so they Green lighted the Beal trade.

Now Suns FO got told by Booker he wants to stay so Suns FO traded KD so they could try to build around Booker.

Let's not mention Suns wanted to make Booker their Kobe so they skipped Luka and went for Ayton. Which was an understandable decision given the Suns wanted Booker to be the main option.

All these fans here blaming Ayton should really be blaming someone in Suns FO being obsessed with Booker. Should have traded him for Pick 2 and drafted two of Ayton, Jackson Jr, SGA or Luka. I wanted to pair Ayton and Luka back then.


So lesson here is, any Suns FO decision regarding favouring Booker has FAILED and led to catastrophe. Booker is cursed.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1329 » by thamadkant » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:09 pm

RaisingArizona wrote:Reminder McD was going to move up to draft SGA and was vetoed



Yeah there's a lot of twisted opinions now but back there, McD made logical choices. Even picking Ayton over Luka because Ayton was unanimous pick 1 in many mocks and he was an Arizona product.... and the fact that the Suns saw Booker as Suns main star to build around. Luka would not have been a good pair with Booker, they need the ball and shots to thrive.

SGA was the rumor to be the second player they wanted to draft, I recall it and he would been good all rounder but again, someone in the Suns FO didn't want Booker's growth to be hampered so they avoided ball handling wings. Instead got Mikal who was a 3D wing instead... someone to catch and shoot.

Ultimately McD did very well with Ayton and Mikal around Booker.... 2021 Finals appearance and winning the first 2 games. But CP3 signing was so important.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1330 » by BobbieL » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:17 pm

SkyBill40"][quote="BobbieL wrote:
SkyBill40 wrote:I can't believe - wait... yes I can - that people seriously want Beal's dead money on our cap for five more years rather than just letting him finish out his current deal. One move hurts us more than it helps, and we shouldn't have to argue about which one that is.

Look, I'm not saying I like Beal being here but it is what it is at this point and moving off of him is a worse proposition than having him stay. It's hugely unlikely he's taking a buy out. I mean.. why would he when he's openly said he likes it here?



Sent from my SM-F936U using RealGM mobile app


I see moving on from Beal from the fans point of view, maybe not this board but twitter and podcasts like PHNX_SUNS for two reasons

1) they are Booker &/or Durant stans so its easier to blame Beal for everything than admit maybe Booker and KD were part of why the team won 36 games. And if Durant did indeed turn down trades - proves the point for many of us why I am least am glad he is gone.

2) its the Flex and Gambo breaking stories that if you stretch and waive Beal - you now have the MLE to "sign a player!!!" Wow - thats fun signing a player. But its more activity over accomplishment


I like Booker and I like Durant; however, that was an awful pairing and we witnessed just how bad for two seasons. You can't force two ball dominant scorers to work together and expect good results. Well, maybe sometimes, but not for these two. Acquiring Durant in the first place was the real problem but Ishbia had stars in his eyes and couldn't be convinced otherwise. Guess this is what we get when the owner has a concussion and picks up the phone. :crazy:

And neither of Flex or Gambo have any sense about them as evidenced by your statement. Gambo is a moron and always has been.[/quote]

I just do the math
if Beal decides he wants to be stretched - I think its 90 m figure or 18m
use the MLE for 14 - fans get excited, Flex is saying the front office is great

So in reality, you are paying $32m for that player who might not even be a better player, when healthy, than Beal. I get they might play a different position but is that player really worth $32m!
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1331 » by SkyBill40 » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:29 pm

thamadkant wrote:
RaisingArizona wrote:Reminder McD was going to move up to draft SGA and was vetoed



Yeah there's a lot of twisted opinions now but back there, McD made logical choices. Even picking Ayton over Luka because Ayton was unanimous pick 1 in many mocks and he was an Arizona product.... and the fact that the Suns saw Booker as Suns main star to build around. Luka would not have been a good pair with Booker, they need the ball and shots to thrive.

SGA was the rumor to be the second player they wanted to draft, I recall it and he would been good all rounder but again, someone in the Suns FO didn't want Booker's growth to be hampered so they avoided ball handling wings. Instead got Mikal who was a 3D wing instead... someone to catch and shoot.

Ultimately McD did very well with Ayton and Mikal around Booker.... 2021 Finals appearance and winning the first 2 games. But CP3 signing was so important.


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Let's be open and honest here, shall we? Ayton was picked because he went to UA and so did Sarver. That's it. Picking Doncic would have been a great move for us and especially so seeing we had his national coach in place at the time. And there's no guarantee the pairing wouldn't have worked. That's a cop out excuse from those who still make it to this day.

Sarver controlled the draft and got what HE wanted, just as we knew he would. He never had that much consideration as to what was best for the team because if he had... we'd have Doncic right now.

Bah... who am I kidding. Ishbia would have probably traded Luka anyway.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1332 » by Saberestar » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:34 pm

Marc Stein:
We first reported last week that
Phoenix has been conducting background
work on the Latvian big man. The Suns,
for the record, do still technically have
some trade avenues to reach Porzingis'
number now that their Durant business
has concluded.


Porzingis would be a nice upgrade at C.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1333 » by Sunlight » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:37 pm

Gortat was the Suns' best truly center in decades so it was obvious that Ayton would be drafted. Shaq was already an old man so I don't count.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1334 » by bwgood77 » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:40 pm

Revived wrote:
Read on Twitter


If this is true, it’s organizational malpractice.


No way that happened. KD and Kyrie forced Kenny Atkinson out in Brooklyn.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1335 » by bwgood77 » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:42 pm

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


So if this is true and happens, they basically gave up a first to dump Bradley Beal...so a Sarver like move.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1336 » by bwgood77 » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:43 pm

Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


Such wrecklessness. Reminds me of Kurt Thomas.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1337 » by Saberestar » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:46 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:
Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


So if this is true and happens, they basically gave up a first to dump Bradley Beal...so a Sarver like move.

Gambo answered about that rumor of 2nds over a first.

No truth they tried but couldn’t get another first, they would have taken that over the seconds.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1338 » by bwgood77 » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:47 pm

BobbieL wrote:Who knows how good DCOldest is - but he mentions Chicago and Boston.

Chicago would be something like Vucevic, Jalen Smith (expires next y ear) or Jevon CArter (expires this year ) and PWill

Celtics - -well some dude came up with the three team I posted earlier

Celtics get Beal:
Nets: get Porz, Grayson and Hausman plus a pick from Phx and Celtics

Suns get: Clax, Jrue and other filler

I think both are about the best the Suns could do depending on draft picks involved


Read on Twitter


Who are these random people that have inside info from Boston and Chicago. Why would Boston be interested in Beal? Seriously. Why would Chicago?

Unless we are trading one of our future firsts and they just want to trade bad contracts and pick up a first by taking the bigger contract.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1339 » by Calvin Klein » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:47 pm

thamadkant wrote:
RaisingArizona wrote:Reminder McD was going to move up to draft SGA and was vetoed
Luka would not have been a good pair with Booker, they need the ball and shots to thrive.



This is crazy. Luka reached the Finals next to Kyrie, who you could argue is even more ball dominant than Booker.

Booker is a pure SG and worked the best next to CP who dominated the ball as well. He would have been amazing next to Luka, ego permitting.
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Re: The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 3 

Post#1340 » by bwgood77 » Tue Jun 24, 2025 4:51 pm

Qwigglez wrote:
Read on Twitter


Can't skimp on height.


Yeah, I think if they are healthy, they could be 2nd in the west next season and with their size, could give OKC real trouble. They already knocked OKC out a year ago (though I know OKC is a lot better) and this past year they beat them 3 out of 4 times, without Luka in any of their wins (he played in the loss).
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