Why don't stars want to play with Jokic in Denver?

[dhsilv2]

And how exactly would KD have gotten to Denver?

MPJ + picks.

No different than Green + picks

Does denver have picks? I thought they were short on those too.

[dhsilv2]

It's not Jokic

Most NBA players don't want to play in Denver

What's wrong with Denver?

It's kind of cold, it's smallish, and it's perceived as a boring town.

It's a really quick flight to LA/Vegas. But yeah it's a place you go for hiking and skiing and that's not exactly nba player's focus. Still 19th largest metro. It's not that small...the counter...it's also not cheap at all. At least if you go to OKC it's cheap to live. Denver is somewhat expensive.

[dhsilv2]

I am Aussie and never been to the USA so maybe nor qualified to comment, but the altitude of Denver and its supposed unhealthy effects to some pro athletes and its effects on delivering oxygen to the brain. Joel Embiid had dodged playing the Nugz in Denver for the past 5 or 6 years which is ironic as he has no brain

It's the opposite. It's really good for athletes which is why guys have gone there to train in the off season. It's harder to play there if you're not used to it.

[Bucks4005]

They paid their players and didn’t have cap space.

I mean, as much as people criticize Murray and MPJ contacts, keeping them and developing them did get them a championship. So I don’t think Denver’s complaining. Sure, was Jokic the key part? Yea, but there are 5 people on the court at a time, it doesn’t completely dismiss their roles in it.

I mean, I can factually say that happened, because the ring showed it. Sure, people can speculate they could have used that money elsewhere, gotten better players, but in the end, it’s just speculation that they could be better or worse moving off those guys for other options. The one ring shows that it was worth it to keep them, both signed their extensions years before they won the championship.

[Chuck Everett]

Even if Denver had capspace or the assets to pull off a blockbluster trade, I'd imagine it's because they don't want to play second fiddle to Jokic. His fanbase is becoming a lot like Lebron's where they belittle everyone he plays with to prop up their guy.

[jkvonny]

Denver and Utah are mid/small markets in the Rocky Mountains that rarely attract big time FAs.

They'll get the occasional "pity" visits from them. Example. LeBron 2018, visited Denver at the very end while being courted by numerous teams. Most folks knew he wouldn't pick Denver.
Example. Utah had Carlos Boozer visit them (former Cav) and signed with them, 2004.

But, that was mainly the older generation players. The younger players now are more open minded where to play. Lot has changed. They can also go the international/foreign player route. Many of them aren't as picky with market size/location.

I don’t think Denver is on Utah’s level. Denver is the 15th biggest market; Utah is 23rd. Denver has a NFL team, MLB team, and NHL team; Utah doesn’t. Denver has legal weed and tons of breweries; Utah has laws about how strong beer can be and when it can be served. Denver has a ton of black people; Utah doesn’t. I know most NBA players aren’t big into skiing and hiking, but Denver has them beat there also, and is the most fit city in America.

I guess Houston has really good strip clubs, but I went into a Walmart in Houston once and it felt like an episode of the twilight zone; hundreds of crows were circling in the air, none of the shopping carts were put away in the parking lot, and everyone in the Walmart was high, including the employee who was trying to open a glass case so I could buy a phone charger. Then when I got out a massive rainstorm hit us.

Ok.
Also, read my edited comments.
Carlos Boozer signing with Utah in 2004 from Cleveland. As well generational changes and foreign players.
Utah is also very fit. Ppl are fit in most of that Rocky Mountain region is with the outdoors, fishing, hiking, skiing, running/walking, etc. Denver, Salt Lake City, etc.
Yes, I know about Denver market and the multiple sport teams in that city. It's mid/small market with multiple sports teams like Pittsburgh, Milwaukee/Green Bay, Minnesota , Cleveland, Charlotte, Indiana/Indianopolis. etc .
Utah only has 2 major sport teams (NBA and expansion NHL team Utah Mammoth) like New Orleans, etc or 1 major sport team towns like Sacramento, Orlando, San Antonio , Portland, Memphis, OKC, etc.
Also not all big time free agents are black, smoke weed, drink alchohol, go clubbing, go to strip clubs, etc. FWIW. Lol

As for Houston, they never really had issues with attracting big FAs. It's a huge market , no state taxes (Texas), very diverse city, busy city many things stay open after hours, huge city and metro, etc.

[tmorgan]

Because stars won’t play for the minimum? They have self-inflicted payroll issues. That, along with infighting with Malone, is what got Booth fired.

No one is taking Murray or MPJ without either receiving picks (which Denver mostly doesn’t have to give) or returning bad contracts (which then doesn’t solve the problem). They’re mostly stuck.

[jkvonny]

KD would have been the best fit for a superstar to pair with Jokic

I think so.
It's an older veteran team. Already won championship, etc.

Not sure Denver would've been able to pull a trade tho. Kinda cashed out on assets, contracts, salary issues/capspace, etc.

[jkvonny]

Actually, I'm pretty convinced A LOT of NBA players (specially young ones) are willing to play alongside a dude who elevates your game by A LOT, so you can get a beefy contract elsewhere later.

Denver doesn't have salary space and no one is biting on Murray/MPJ.

I made a similar comment about this with the younger players compared to older generation players.
More open to it.

[bkkrh]

MPJ + picks.

No different than Green + picks

Just that MPJ is still about 15 Million in salary difference, so you would need to throw in at least 2 more additional players from the Nuggets side, for example Saric and Nnaji. And now the question, why should Phoenix be interested in taking on one of the worst contracts and 2 additional players that aren´t part of their long term plans? They would be better off just keeping him or buying him out.

And as already mentioned, Denver has 0 picks to trade. They don´t own any 2nd rounders and can´t trade any 1sts until 2031.

Didn’t know their pick situation was that bad. When/ for which player did they trade all of their picks away? All Of their core guys besides Gordon came in the draft

Generally I can recommend this page, while it doesn´t show the trades, it provides IMO the best overview of the picks a team has and where their own picks are:

https://fanspo.com/nba/teams/Nuggets/8/draft-picks

As you see the issue in Denver´s case is more that they still have 1st rounders, just no back to back 1st rounders, so they just can´t trade any of them.

Their 2025 pick was part of the Gordon trade and is with Orlando.

The 2027 one was part of a trade where they sent the pick and Jamychal Green to OKC for Peyton Watson and 2nd rounders that both turned into players that aren´t on their roster any more (Maxwell Lewis and Tyler Kolek).

The 2029 one was also traded to OKC, as part of a multiple team draft day trade for Strawther and Pickett.

So they turned 2 1st rounders that kind of block now the option to trade their other 1sts into 3 bench players on their roster and 2 end of bench guys that are on other teams. Somehow that sounds exactly what you´d expect from Denver in this situation .

[hauntedcomputer]

Based on RealGM the last couple of years, it's because everyone will always blame you instead of Jokic.

Suddenly you're the "overpaid guy who is keeping Denver from making any moves and wasting Jokic's prime."

[mtron929]

Most likely because Jokic doesn't network with other players around the league. I suspect that throughout their careers, many NBA players form friendships outside of the players from their teams and form a certain bond. And then, they probably always tell each other that they should play together and try to recruit one another. Jokic doesn't play that game. And as such, he has no relationships with guys like KD, Butler, Paul George, etc. to make them add Denver to their wishlist.

[GeorgeSears]

Probably a few reasons.

If you're talking Denver the city, one of the main drawbacks it has is that its airport is basically in Wyoming. It was built in the middle of a prairie, and once you land, it takes about 30-40 minutes to get to the city depending on the traffic. That's not a big deal if you only visit now and then, but if you're making repeated business trips that can be an inconvenience. It's also not considered a warm weather city, and since the NBA is a winter sport, that is an automatic turnoff for a lot of players.

With regards to the Nuggets specifically, any player that joins the team is automatically a cog in a system that's powered by Jokic. So all that iso basketball they played in their old team, that goes away. The team is expecting them to cut to the basket, set screens, take a few dribbles and shoot the ball. That's probably unappealing to a lot of players.

With someone like Durant, I think it mostly has to do with his personal insecurity. The fact is that he would be a clear no.2 and a system player as opposed to being the guy if he joined the Nuggets. It's no surprise that the three teams on his short list (Miami, San Antonio, and Houston) all had one thing in common: He would be the no.1 option on all of those teams. Despite having two titles and two FMVP, there's insecurity there because he was on a loaded team with Steph Curry Klay Thompson.

[Tracymcgoaty]

Stars dont want to play with Joker? More like stars probably dont want to play in denver.

Who the **** wouldn't want to play with Jokic? Dude is literally the most unselfish superstar in the game to the point it becomes a damn near criticism. Which star wouldn't want to play with a dude who's going to ping wide open shots towars you? But how many stars even have Denver as destination they'd ever want to play?

[VFX]

Durant isn't going anywhere where he isn't the clear #1 option at this point in his career.

[bkkrh]

Stars dont want to play with Joker? More like stars probably dont want to play in denver.

Who the **** wouldn't want to play with Jokic? Dude is literally the most unselfish superstar in the game to the point it becomes a damn near criticism. Which star wouldn't want to play with a dude who's going to ping wide open shots towars you? But how many stars even have Denver as destination they'd ever want to play?

Yeah and besides that, I assume there will be some players that really care about how much they like another player, but generally I expect that most of them care more about winning and success chances. I don't believe there will be many that think "well he won a title already and is a 3 time MVP, but he never tries to hang out with me when we visit, so I won't be going to Denver."

[Lala870]

Even if Denver had capspace or the assets to pull off a blockbluster trade, I'd imagine it's because they don't want to play second fiddle to Jokic. His fanbase is becoming a lot like Lebron's where they belittle everyone he plays with to prop up their guy.

LMAO this is way off-base

MPJ and Murray are the epitome of overpaid players. At this point the only excuse left for MPJ is "hes tall"and they respect his "shot making ability"

I would take Kyle Kuzma over MPJ

[BigGargamel]

I think plenty of great players would want to play with Jokic, but thanks to Calvin Booth, he maxed out two untradeable players and moved all his draft picks, so there's no way to get those guys to Denver.

As for Durant, he also didn't want to go to Minnesota, Los Angeles, New York, Boston, Indiana, Golden State, Oklahoma City, Orlando, Chicago, Detroit, etc....he only picked three teams.

[Clemenza]

That NBA is over with. This latest KD move is his last. After Bron, KD, Curry, Harden, etc retire the team up-Big 3 era is over with. These new kids and Euro stars don't care about teaming up and ring chasing. Every star worth a damn is locked up on a max deal with their current team. The unrestricted superstar free agent is a thing of the past, a ghost and unicorn.

[Lala870]

Probably a few reasons.

If you're talking Denver the city, one of the main drawbacks it has is that its airport is basically in Wyoming. It was built in the middle of a prairie, and once you land, it takes about 30-40 minutes to get to the city depending on the traffic. That's not a big deal if you only visit now and then, but if you're making repeated business trips that can be an inconvenience. It's also not considered a warm weather city, and since the NBA is a winter sport, that is an automatic turnoff for a lot of players.

I have been through Denver a few times (many in DIA) and its a strange area.

From a basketball perspective I think Jokic is fine but the city and people are super weird.