Bucks News, Transactions, Trade Ideas

[M-C-G]

All the teams chasing Jrue makes me think Brook could similarly have a market.



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They are both old. That is where the similarities end. Jrue can still be a winning rotation player. Brook is situational now and not suited for today's nba

Lopez had a positive (sometimes hugely) net rating in 9 of the 10 most used Bucks lineups.

I love Lopez but for this team to thrive, we need to be fast paced, especially at the five. Sign and trade for TPE and some kind of assets. Trade for Grayson or some other useful shooter to absorb, especially if GTJ is priced out. That alone probably nets you a first and a couple seconds.

In my mind we need to transition to a fast paced team or we have plateaued. I also love Bobby but I’d be doing the same thing with a sign and trade if there is a market and see who else we could absorb for assets this year.

[ReasonablySober]

They are both old. That is where the similarities end. Jrue can still be a winning rotation player. Brook is situational now and not suited for today's nba

Lopez had a positive (sometimes hugely) net rating in 9 of the 10 most used Bucks lineups.

I love Lopez but for this team to thrive, we need to be fast paced, especially at the five. Sign and trade for TPE and some kind of assets. Trade for Grayson or some other useful shooter to absorb, especially if GTJ is priced out. That alone probably nets you a first and a couple seconds.

In my mind we need to transition to a fast paced team or we have plateaued. I also love Bobby but I’d be doing the same thing with a sign and trade if there is a market and see who else we could absorb for assets this year.

Does the idea that games in the Finals typically devolve into slow, half court games factor for you?

[M-C-G]

Lopez had a positive (sometimes hugely) net rating in 9 of the 10 most used Bucks lineups.

I love Lopez but for this team to thrive, we need to be fast paced, especially at the five. Sign and trade for TPE and some kind of assets. Trade for Grayson or some other useful shooter to absorb, especially if GTJ is priced out. That alone probably nets you a first and a couple seconds.

In my mind we need to transition to a fast paced team or we have plateaued. I also love Bobby but I’d be doing the same thing with a sign and trade if there is a market and see who else we could absorb for assets this year.

Does the idea that games in the Finals typically devolve into slow, half court games factor for you?

Not any longer. I 100% understand your argument though. I’m at the reinvent this roster in our ‘gap year’ and see what happens while restocking a bit of assets.

[ReasonablySober]

I love Lopez but for this team to thrive, we need to be fast paced, especially at the five. Sign and trade for TPE and some kind of assets. Trade for Grayson or some other useful shooter to absorb, especially if GTJ is priced out. That alone probably nets you a first and a couple seconds.

In my mind we need to transition to a fast paced team or we have plateaued. I also love Bobby but I’d be doing the same thing with a sign and trade if there is a market and see who else we could absorb for assets this year.

Does the idea that games in the Finals typically devolve into slow, half court games factor for you?

Not any longer. I 100% understand your argument though. I’m at the reinvent this roster in our ‘gap year’ and see what happens while restocking a bit of assets.

I agree with you and I'd like to see it too. I just always push back on the idea that Lopez is a dinosaur who can't be an effective player anymore on a contender.

[M-C-G]

Does the idea that games in the Finals typically devolve into slow, half court games factor for you?

Not any longer. I 100% understand your argument though. I’m at the reinvent this roster in our ‘gap year’ and see what happens while restocking a bit of assets.

I agree with you and I'd like to see it too. I just always push back on the idea that Lopez is a dinosaur who can't be an effective player anymore on a contender.

Also agree with you which is why I think there might even be a first of some kind on the table for Lopez. I’m casually following this draft class and I like some of the athletic 5s that are out there that I think justify the move. It’s funny because I despised Lopez as a net and he quickly became one of my favorite players once here. So I’m not in the trade him for nothing or let him walk but I also recognize that this team is now without identity since the championship and I’m not interested in maintaining the status quo even in a down year in the east. Take advantage of the teams desperately trying to duck the 2nd apron and let’s see what happens.

[jakecronus8]

Love Bobby but if we can pull off a S&T with both him and Lopez to get some assets as well as trying to unload Pat for a 2 year bad money deal + assets the offseason is a win. All the way in on a gap year especially considering how the dumb teams are kicking off the offseason.

[Dick Tate]

Wizards seem to love their future cap space, which makes me wonder how bad is Kispert's defence.. I guess Washington will happily flip him for an expiring Connaughton.

They might be looking to deal the 18th pick too.

[Ron Swanson]

You can also say that you'd simply prefer to move on from Brook rather than claiming this misguided and funny notion that "traditional bigs/frontcourts don't work in the playoffs anymore" despite like, all this evidence to the contrary. 5-man playoff lineup data from the Conference Finals teams:

Siakam/Turner with the starters: +13.4 net-rating
Chet/Hartenstein with the starters: +4.9 net-rating
Randle/Gobert with the starters: +17.0 net-rating

Ironically the worst was the Knicks "modern spacing" small ball starting lineup with OG at power forward (-6.2 net-rating). This idea that you need to always play small and switchable has become incredibly overrated. By all means, try and extract some value from Brook in a sign and trade, but the last time I checked, being tall and skilled is still pretty important in basketball.

[soxperry]

You can also say that you'd simply prefer to move on from Brook rather than claiming this misguided and funny notion that "traditional bigs/frontcourts don't work in the playoffs anymore" despite like, all this evidence to the contrary. 5-man playoff lineup data from the Conference Finals teams:

Siakam/Turner with the starters: +13.4 net-rating
Chet/Hartenstein with the starters: +4.9 net-rating
Randle/Gobert with the starters: +17.0 net-rating

Ironically the worst was the Knicks "modern spacing" small ball starting lineup with OG at power forward (-6.2 net-rating). This idea that you need to always play small and switchable has become incredibly overrated. By all means, try and extract some value from Brook in a sign and trade, but the last time I checked, being tall and skilled is still pretty important in basketball.

Lets compare apples to apples. How did Brook do against Indy?

[M-C-G]

Let’s Bobby and Lopez are both trade for 16M ish TPE. And that we get a first and some seconds for facilitating. Absorb Grayson and maybe get a future first. Absorb a guy like Payton Pritchard, Jevon Carter, or some other serviceable off ball PG.

Resign KPJ to whatever makes sense. Resign Sims to be your starter.

Draft
Late first Hugo Gonzalez or a similar high IQ guy that can give you some all around game
Early 2nd Maxime or some other 5 of choice like Amari Williams
47 Dink Pate
Buy a second and grab Trevor Brazille or some other high energy, high speed PF/C

PG KPJ, Rollins, Carter
SG Grayson, Green
SF AJJ?, Hugo, Dink
PF Giannis, Smith, Liv
C Sims, young Cs

Still leaves you Kuzma and Pat salary slots to make another splash to couple with some of the assets that came in or the 31 first if the right player is available. I’m not saying all these things are doable but that is a roster that can play high tempo, salary cap and assets improve and Giannis can carry to the playoffs. I think we will be held back by Doc but that roster gives me some hope for the future and a new identity.

[Ron Swanson]

You can also say that you'd simply prefer to move on from Brook rather than claiming this misguided and funny notion that "traditional bigs/frontcourts don't work in the playoffs anymore" despite like, all this evidence to the contrary. 5-man playoff lineup data from the Conference Finals teams:

Siakam/Turner with the starters: +13.4 net-rating
Chet/Hartenstein with the starters: +4.9 net-rating
Randle/Gobert with the starters: +17.0 net-rating

Ironically the worst was the Knicks "modern spacing" small ball starting lineup with OG at power forward (-6.2 net-rating). This idea that you need to always play small and switchable has become incredibly overrated. By all means, try and extract some value from Brook in a sign and trade, but the last time I checked, being tall and skilled is still pretty important in basketball.

Lets compare apples to apples. How did Brook do against Indy?

Ironically this is the "We need Brook in case we go up against Embiid in the playoffs argument", just in reverse. I don't view every player's inherent value or portability in the narrow lens of one specific playoff matchup. Bobby's been unplayable in just as many series, and yet I also think letting him "walk for nothing" is equally dumb.

[soxperry]

You can also say that you'd simply prefer to move on from Brook rather than claiming this misguided and funny notion that "traditional bigs/frontcourts don't work in the playoffs anymore" despite like, all this evidence to the contrary. 5-man playoff lineup data from the Conference Finals teams:

Siakam/Turner with the starters: +13.4 net-rating
Chet/Hartenstein with the starters: +4.9 net-rating
Randle/Gobert with the starters: +17.0 net-rating

Ironically the worst was the Knicks "modern spacing" small ball starting lineup with OG at power forward (-6.2 net-rating). This idea that you need to always play small and switchable has become incredibly overrated. By all means, try and extract some value from Brook in a sign and trade, but the last time I checked, being tall and skilled is still pretty important in basketball.

Lets compare apples to apples. How did Brook do against Indy?

Ironically this is the "We need Brook in case we go up against Embiid in the playoffs argument", just in reverse. I don't view every player's inherent value or portability in the narrow lens of one specific playoff matchup. Bobby's been unplayable in just as many series, and yet I also think letting him "walk for nothing" is equally dumb.

Letting brook walk for nothing wasnt part of my argument. And yes, Bobby has been played out of series before but my point about Brook was not unique to just Indy. I feel like its just going to be that way against more and more teams now. He just seems to be a step or two too slow to get to his spots defensively. Offensively, he has lost much of his ability to create his own shot and is limited to lobs and three pointers.

My main thing w Brook is i just doubt his market value amounts to much. However, even if hes worth a couple 2nds, there is a problem doing a sign and trade in that we most likely have to take salary back. Unless that player is a playoff rotation guy, its only going to hinder our ability to keep Bobby.

So its complicated. Its not just Brook's value in a vacuum. Its his value and what that 5-10M means to the rest of our roster.

[BUCKnation]

Brook is definitely more valuable to teams in the west. They have way less of those stretch 5's that give him problems. Probably why our record last year was actually good against western playoff teams.

[Bernman]

I'd like the Bucks to sign a leader for the locker room, and another on the court. There's a dearth of authoritative personalities on the team who can inspire and instruct. I was somewhat averse to Brogdon, but thinking about it more, I'd like him on a minimum in part for this reason.

This is why Jrue is not "overrated" and why Portland proactively went after him.

No, he's not worth his contract at this point since his physical skills are on the decline. But during the course of his career and his time with the Bucks he was not overrated (going to your comments in the other thread)

I'm talking about acquiring that guy on a minimum contract, not 34m/yr. And PJ Tucker fit the description more. We got him on the cheap.

Jrue was overrated cuz he didn't hit 50% ts any playoffs here as a 3rd/2nd option. That's awful. Now he's on the decline & PDX's going to take him for 3 more years on big $, while ceding picks to boot? That's from media hype. They circled the wagons cuz Boston's their prestige team after LAL.

[RRyder823]

If there's a SnT out there for even modest value for Brook i think you have do it.

Not because i dont think Brook is a liability that needs to get jettisoned into the sun like some but because im kinda chalking the comming season up to a lost year and next season hes just going to get a year older so with being limited on assets like we are even a few second rounder could help a lot more

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[BigO]

I don't have much interest in signing Bobby to a multi-year deal. I'd like to completely end watching this team trot out slower players who are defensive liabilities in many matchups. Give me athletes and let's put the ball in GA's hand and run and then be able to switch pretty much everything on defense.

Yes, let's sign a bunch of athletes and let go skilled basketball players.

That strategy has worked wonders the last few years in the draft and trades. We really need to hang on to Kuzma, AJJ and never should have let Marjon and AJ Johnson go.

And before you add the obligatory statement that we should sign athletes AND basketball players, those players are called all stars.

I'll stick with the Portis and AJ Green types. Letting Portis go would be a huge mistake, unless another skilled big replaced him.

Lol aj Johnson was all athlete no skill. Not sure what you mean

Portis should stay, Brook should go. This is very simple

The poster said let Ports go and bring in athletes. Merely pointing out that this is the exact strategy that Horst has followed the last few years and he has stated that publicly on numerous occasions.

Out of Kuzma, Jackson, Marjon and Johnson, none of them have great basketball skills, but all are athletes and it hasn't translated.

You can make a legitimate claim that it's too early to write Johnson off, but it's not to early to say that he is an elite athlete with no discernible basketball skill (Can't shoot, ballhandling is suspect, bbiq is uncertain). He is very young, but they drafted him based on athleticism and not skill, as opposed to going for skill.

[LUKE23]

Nobody is saying to add athletes with no skill. I am fine putting out smaller, more mobile lineups with many of the guys we had last year (Trent, KPJ, Rollins) and finding more mobile big men to help GA on D. I'm not fully out on Bobby, but I'd be very careful what we pay him. Lopez I would sign/trade.

[yb90]

The Bucks need to do some back channel work with the Wizards buyout candidates. Bring in all the old guys at as backups and playoff help. I'd take Middleton, McCollum, and Marcus on the minimum for 20-26 minutes.

The 3 Ms in Milwaukee.

[mcfromage]

My kingdom for a rumor or two

[Baddy Chuck]

What team can pay Bobby $100M besides the Nets? No one besides the Nets and maybe Pistons can’t go above the MLE for any free agents.

100 mill was a bit of an exaggeration but Gafford just went for $20 million a year, I could see Bobby pulling something similar, granted I'd be surprised to see too long of a deal at his age. Both those teams you listed I wouldn't be surprised to see an offer for Bobby thrown out as a veteran to help a young team and force the Bucks to make a decision. Also Bobby could just throw down an ultimatum and say finally pay me after all the team friendly deals he signed. He's basically said as much in that recent interview that he's done being the team guy and he wants to get paid what his peers are (specifically pointing out a 3/4 year deal) with this offseason being about Bobby Portis and not the Bucks and I doubt he's going to looking what guys like Gafford got or what someone like Naz Reid will get and be too happy if the Bucks just throw him some change over the MLE that most teams could give.

But on the other end as you state, the market isn't exactly brimming with opportunity and I could totally see the money just not being there. Again, I think all our free agents are such question marks right now and we just have to wait and see.

Please list the teams other than the Nets and Pistons that have the cap space to sign any free agent to more than the MLE.

Read what I wrote.