2025 Draft & College Hoops

[Ryu]

Tweener big man scorer with no jumper and poor defense....

Zimmerman said he had some Boogie in him and thought that was interesting

I mean....Cousins pre-draft was already 6'11, 290lbs with a 7'6 wingspan while putting up 23/15/3blks in 23.5mpg. CMB is just under 6'8 240lbs and put up respectable 20/10 in 30mpg. I'm not sure what Zimmerman was looking at.

I am pretty sure he was talking about Derik Queen, not Collin Murray-Boyles.

[Ryu]

I was just watching video clips of Derik Queen and that kid can play basketball. I can see him get 20-10 on regular basis in the NBA but as I said concern is a lack of rim protection.

[Ghost of Kleine]

The thing about Queen is that he's not elite athletically ( 28 inch vertical), not fast or fluid laterally (in combine testing) with and only 6'9 with a 7 ft wingspan. He's also relatively slow footed with a 3.27 shuttle time and 3.25 sprint time while also only shooting around 20% from three.

His defense and lateral mobility, fluidity and switchability overall are going to be huge concerns. And he'll probably land outside of the top 10 of the lottery more in the 13- 17 range possibly. Not at all a prospect that I'd consider in the top 14.

[Saberestar]

The thing about Queen is that he's not elite athletically ( 28 inch vertical), not fast or fluid laterally (in combine testing) with and only 6'9 with a 7 ft wingspan. He's also relatively slow footed with a 3.27 shuttle time and 3.25 sprint time while also only shooting around 20% from three.

His defense and lateral mobility, fluidity and switchability overall are going to be huge concerns. And he'll probably land outside of the top 10 of the lottery more in the 13- 17 range possibly. Not at all a prospect that I'd consider in the top 14.

Queen is 6’9 ¼ barefoot, 247.8 lbs with a 7’0 ½" wingspan and 9’1 ½" standing reach.

That's enough size for any PF/C. He is 6'10 (some would even say 6'11) by NBA standards and his wingspan/standing reach are fine. Not great but enough.

Yeah, he is an offensive minded player but he doesn't look a potential liability on defense to me.

I would draft him at #10 over more limited players (3&D) like Carter Bryant.

Another positive about Queen is his production for a freshman. You just need to compare his numbers with Bryant to understand that Queen's floor is already much higher than Bryant who couldn't average 20 minutes per game.

[Ghost of Kleine]

If I'm being very honest and upfront about this draft, our top picks ( big board at 10 and 29) should be:

1- Danny Wolf.
Has to not be so reckless, but is bvb extremely skilled, fun to watch, makes all the players around him better, plays very hard, and is fights defensively too. He has high end starter/ star potential if he makes some readonable developmental adjustments

2- Maxime Raynaud.
At 7'1 has a Pau Gasol versatile skillset and shows flashes of Sengun physicality and post dominance.

3- Egor Demin.
A 6'9 point guard that has solid potential to become our PGOTF that we desperately need.

4- Khaman Muluach.
** Won't reach 10 though!! Any of Washington, New Orleans, Brooklyn ( most likely) or Toronto will take him.

5- Colin Murray Boyles.
** I know that he's only 6'7, but he's very strong, very defensively versatile and has fringe star potential!

And at 29,

1- Adou Thiero.
Adou has all the underlying traits/ attributes of a future star wing and absolutely projects along the lines of a OG Anunoby and/ or Jimmy Butler. He's the ultimate " DOG" with explosive athleticism motor and physicality in this draft.

2- Ryan Kalkbrenner.
Kalkbrenner at 7'1 a really good shotblocer and floor spacing capable big with a high IQ and good mobility is about as close to Brook Lopez as we could hope for! And would shore up our backup center position for years to come.

3- Ben Saraf.
Saraf, another Jewish connection for Ishbia has alot of Dragic andTeosodic traits that could play out well for us as a future guard with size at 6'5. He's a bargain alternative to Jakucionis for Fishi!

4- Jo'an Beringer.
At 7'0 with a 7'6 wingspan and elite mobility/ switchability, Beringer shows alot of very similar defensive traits to Jarrett Allen and Kel el Ware. Only he's not anywhere as far along as Ware is offensively. But is developing a faceup game.

5- Walter Clayton ( ** IF HE FALLS).
Clayton is a bit undersized and unathletic at 6'4 but shares alot of archetype parallels to Jamal Murray. And due to his shooting and scoring creation a abilities, he has star potential. But will most likely be a Fred Van Vleet type rotation player/ starter.

[Ryu]

The thing about Queen is that he's not elite athletically ( 28 inch vertical), not fast or fluid laterally (in combine testing) with and only 6'9 with a 7 ft wingspan. He's also relatively slow footed with a 3.27 shuttle time and 3.25 sprint time while also only shooting around 20% from three.

His defense and lateral mobility, fluidity and switchability overall are going to be huge concerns. And he'll probably land outside of the top 10 of the lottery more in the 13- 17 range possibly. Not at all a prospect that I'd consider in the top 14.

Yep, those are real concerns but I can compare him with players like KAT, Sengun, Cousins... great offensively with questionable defence.

[Ghost of Kleine]

The thing about Queen is that he's not elite athletically ( 28 inch vertical), not fast or fluid laterally (in combine testing) with and only 6'9 with a 7 ft wingspan. He's also relatively slow footed with a 3.27 shuttle time and 3.25 sprint time while also only shooting around 20% from three.

His defense and lateral mobility, fluidity and switchability overall are going to be huge concerns. And he'll probably land outside of the top 10 of the lottery more in the 13- 17 range possibly. Not at all a prospect that I'd consider in the top 14.

Queen is 6’9 ¼ barefoot, 247.8 lbs with a 7’0 ½" wingspan and 9’1 ½" standing reach.

That's enough size for any PF/C. He is 6'10 (some would even say 6'11) by NBA standards and his wingspan/standing reach are fine. Not great but enough.

Yeah, he is an offensive minded player but he doesn't look a potential liability on defense to me.

I would draft him at #10 over more limited players (3&D) like Carter Bryant.

Another positive about Queen is his production for a freshman. You just need to compare his numbers with Bryant to understand that Queen's floor is already much higher than Bryant who couldn't average 20 minutes per game.

IMO there's a reason why Queen is likely to fall out of the top 10 of the lottery if not farther man. I'll repeat, he's 6'9 NOT 7 ft. And his wingspan being only 7'0 at 6'9 is average to mediocre.

The bigger problem is his athletic deficiencies, which will severely limit him at the next level as will his shooting and lateral mobility concerns. There's also concerns about his conditioning and effort too.

Sure he's skilled as a ballhandler and playmaker. But again, he can't shoot well, is very fluid or fast. Doesn't have any elite athleticism or outlier measurements. So essentially your banking mostly on girth and skill to offset his multiple other concerns man. Again, I wouldn't take him at all in the top 10-13 ranges of the lottery.

He's going to he serviceable to solid, maybe a quicker but smaller version of Nurkic or a poor man's unathletic version of WCJr perhaps. But taking him at 10 would basically be a Jalen Smith scenario all over again!!

[BurningHeart]

Who has the strongest heart, character, motor and work ethic?

Take the most talented guy that exhibits those qualities the most. Always.

This team needs a complete enema. Start by getting guys who give a **** about something more than themselves.

[Saberestar]

IMO there's a reason why Queen is likely to fall out of the top 10bof the lottery if not farther man. I'll repeat, he's 6'9 NOT 7 ft. And his wingspan being only 7'0 at 6'9 is average to mediocre.

Probably you didn't see it, but in the post above a showed you that Queen is 6’9 ¼ barefoot, so that's automatically a legit 6'10 player by league standards.

And his 7’0 ½" is enough for a PF/C.

Do you think that Sengun is bigger, faster or more agile than Queen? I think he can be similar to Sengun becasue his feel for the game and awareness are really high for a freshman C.

I would expect him to be gone before #10 but we will see.

[Saberestar]

Brian Kalbrosky:

Some intel about the Suns, who now own the No. 10 overall pick, after the Kevin Durant trade:

Cedric Coward worked out with Phoenix during the pre-draft process.

French PG Nolan Traroré also headlined a PHX workout earlier today.

[RaisingArizona]

If I'm being very honest and upfront about this draft, our top picks ( big board at 10 and 29) should be:

1- Danny Wolf.
Has to not be so reckless, but is bvb extremely skilled, fun to watch, makes all the players around him better, plays very hard, and is fights defensively too. He has high end starter/ star potential if he makes some readonable developmental adjustments

2- Maxime Raynaud.
At 7'1 has a Pau Gasol versatile skillset and shows flashes of Sengun physicality and post dominance.

3- Egor Demin.
A 6'9 point guard that has solid potential to become our PGOTF that we desperately need.

4- Khaman Muluach.
** Won't reach 10 though!! Any of Washington, New Orleans, Brooklyn ( most likely) or Toronto will take him.

5- Colin Murray Boyles.
** I know that he's only 6'7, but he's very strong, very defensively versatile and has fringe star potential!

And at 29,

1- Adou Thiero.
Adou has all the underlying traits/ attributes of a future star wing and absolutely projects along the lines of a OG Anunoby and/ or Jimmy Butler. He's the ultimate " DOG" with explosive athleticism motor and physicality in this draft.

2- Ryan Kalkbrenner.
Kalkbrenner at 7'1 a really good shotblocer and floor spacing capable big with a high IQ and good mobility is about as close to Brook Lopez as we could hope for! And would shore up our backup center position for years to come.

3- Ben Saraf.
Saraf, another Jewish connection for Ishbia has alot of Dragic andTeosodic traits that could play out well for us as a future guard with size at 6'5. He's a bargain alternative to Jakucionis for Fishi!

4- Jo'an Beringer.
At 7'0 with a 7'6 wingspan and elite mobility/ switchability, Beringer shows alot of very similar defensive traits to Jarrett Allen and Kel el Ware. Only he's not anywhere as far along as Ware is offensively. But is developing a faceup game.

5- Walter Clayton ( ** IF HE FALLS).
Clayton is a bit undersized and unathletic at 6'4 but shares alot of archetype parallels to Jamal Murray. And due to his shooting and scoring creation a abilities, he has star potential. But will most likely be a Fred Van Vleet type rotation player/ starter.

Son, I am disappoint

[Ghost of Kleine]

The thing about Queen is that he's not elite athletically ( 28 inch vertical), not fast or fluid laterally (in combine testing) with and only 6'9 with a 7 ft wingspan. He's also relatively slow footed with a 3.27 shuttle time and 3.25 sprint time while also only shooting around 20% from three.

His defense and lateral mobility, fluidity and switchability overall are going to be huge concerns. And he'll probably land outside of the top 10 of the lottery more in the 13- 17 range possibly. Not at all a prospect that I'd consider in the top 14.

Yep, those are real concerns but I can compare him with players like KAT, Sengun, Cousins... great offensively with questionable defence.

KAT is 7 ft with a 7'4 wingspan and was/ is a significantly better of a shooter than Queen, So better size, bigger wingspan better shooter. Not a great comparison.

Sengun is 6'11 with a 7 ft wingspan, is fairly similar in archetype and playstyle. So this comparison isn't terrible.

He didn't really participate in combine measurements, so there's not really a reference for vertical jump and speed/ lateral mobility and fluidity. But in using the eye test, Sengun is at least in appearance faster and more dynamic with a notable disparity in vertical pop.

Still, this is a pretty solid comparison to make, and Queen does have a chance to possibly hit it if he scales up in his conditioning and polish. Currently, he's smooth, but doesn't pop aw much as Sengun.

Also I would add that ye doesn't really play with as much ferocity and physicality. Although to his credit, he does use his body well.

Currently he's closer to a smaller Greg Monroe or smaller Jalil Okafor than a Sengun or KAT.

The Cousins comparison also isn't great as Cousins played with much more physicality, aggressiveness and tenacity and Queen is more of a smooth type borderline finesse skills dominant player that does use his frame well, but isn't physically dominant.


And Cousins had a 7'6 wingspan, played with an aggressive very physically dominant edge to his game. Whereas Queen is more skill based and smooth, but not dominant in style and approach.

So again, skilled but not imposing or physically dominant and at average size without outlier measurements or athleticism. Banking solely on skillset translation.

[Ghost of Kleine]

If I'm being very honest and upfront about this draft, our top picks ( big board at 10 and 29) should be:

1- Danny Wolf.
Has to not be so reckless, but is bvb extremely skilled, fun to watch, makes all the players around him better, plays very hard, and is fights defensively too. He has high end starter/ star potential if he makes some readonable developmental adjustments

2- Maxime Raynaud.
At 7'1 has a Pau Gasol versatile skillset and shows flashes of Sengun physicality and post dominance.

3- Egor Demin.
A 6'9 point guard that has solid potential to become our PGOTF that we desperately need.

4- Khaman Muluach.
** Won't reach 10 though!! Any of Washington, New Orleans, Brooklyn ( most likely) or Toronto will take him.

5- Colin Murray Boyles.
** I know that he's only 6'7, but he's very strong, very defensively versatile and has fringe star potential!

And at 29,

1- Adou Thiero.
Adou has all the underlying traits/ attributes of a future star wing and absolutely projects along the lines of a OG Anunoby and/ or Jimmy Butler. He's the ultimate " DOG" with explosive athleticism motor and physicality in this draft.

2- Ryan Kalkbrenner.
Kalkbrenner at 7'1 a really good shotblocer and floor spacing capable big with a high IQ and good mobility is about as close to Brook Lopez as we could hope for! And would shore up our backup center position for years to come.

3- Ben Saraf.
Saraf, another Jewish connection for Ishbia has alot of Dragic andTeosodic traits that could play out well for us as a future guard with size at 6'5. He's a bargain alternative to Jakucionis for Fishi!

4- Jo'an Beringer.
At 7'0 with a 7'6 wingspan and elite mobility/ switchability, Beringer shows alot of very similar defensive traits to Jarrett Allen and Kel el Ware. Only he's not anywhere as far along as Ware is offensively. But is developing a faceup game.

5- Walter Clayton ( ** IF HE FALLS).
Clayton is a bit undersized and unathletic at 6'4 but shares alot of archetype parallels to Jamal Murray. And due to his shooting and scoring creation a abilities, he has star potential. But will most likely be a Fred Van Vleet type rotation player/ starter.

Son, I am disappoint

Disappointmented how and why exactly???

[Ghost of Kleine]

IMO there's a reason why Queen is likely to fall out of the top 10bof the lottery if not farther man. I'll repeat, he's 6'9 NOT 7 ft. And his wingspan being only 7'0 at 6'9 is average to mediocre.

Probably you didn't see it, but in the post above a showed you that Queen is 6’9 ¼ barefoot, so that's automatically a legit 6'10 player by league standards.

And his 7’0 ½" is enough for a PF/C.

Do you think that Sengun is bigger, faster or more agile than Queen? I think he can be similar to Sengun becasue his feel for the game and awareness are really high for a freshman C.

I would expect him to be gone before #10 but we will see.

He's not a bad prospect, but let's be real here man. He's a 6'9- 6'10 tweener 4/5. That isn't quick, isn't athletic, isn't physically imposing, and can't really shoot well or space the floor. And his overall measurements are average for his size in the NBA.

Is he skilled and polished for a power forward/ small ball center? Sure! Does he use his frame well? Yes. Does he move well defensively?? Is he a solid rim.protector?? No. Will he likely get burned on switches and even in drop coverage unless he scales up in strength and athleticism?? Yes.

IN summary, he'll be a solid to high impact starter if everything breaks right for him. But he's got a lot to overcome! And isn't really elite at anything.

His whole selling point is his polish, but you don't think that'll be negated by the bigger, faster, longer, stronger, more athletic players in the NBA. He's fine as a a draft prospect if he can scale up athletically and adapt. Otherwise he'll get shutdown with what he does and become a solid 5-9 rotation Jalil Okafor/ Greg Monroe rotation big.

Someone who tou can draft and expect to contribute. But not really a high level impact option at the next level man.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Who has the strongest heart, character, motor and work ethic?

Take the most talented guy that exhibits those qualities the most. Always.

This team needs a complete enema. Start by getting guys who give a **** about something more than themselves.

These traits you're looking at in the Top 10 are Colin Murray Boyles and maybe Maluach. And at 29, EASILY you target:

1- Adou Thiero.
2- Drake Powell.
3- Johnni Broome.

[RaisingArizona]

If I'm being very honest and upfront about this draft, our top picks ( big board at 10 and 29) should be:

1- Danny Wolf.
Has to not be so reckless, but is bvb extremely skilled, fun to watch, makes all the players around him better, plays very hard, and is fights defensively too. He has high end starter/ star potential if he makes some readonable developmental adjustments

2- Maxime Raynaud.
At 7'1 has a Pau Gasol versatile skillset and shows flashes of Sengun physicality and post dominance.

3- Egor Demin.
A 6'9 point guard that has solid potential to become our PGOTF that we desperately need.

4- Khaman Muluach.
** Won't reach 10 though!! Any of Washington, New Orleans, Brooklyn ( most likely) or Toronto will take him.

5- Colin Murray Boyles.
** I know that he's only 6'7, but he's very strong, very defensively versatile and has fringe star potential!

And at 29,

1- Adou Thiero.
Adou has all the underlying traits/ attributes of a future star wing and absolutely projects along the lines of a OG Anunoby and/ or Jimmy Butler. He's the ultimate " DOG" with explosive athleticism motor and physicality in this draft.

2- Ryan Kalkbrenner.
Kalkbrenner at 7'1 a really good shotblocer and floor spacing capable big with a high IQ and good mobility is about as close to Brook Lopez as we could hope for! And would shore up our backup center position for years to come.

3- Ben Saraf.
Saraf, another Jewish connection for Ishbia has alot of Dragic andTeosodic traits that could play out well for us as a future guard with size at 6'5. He's a bargain alternative to Jakucionis for Fishi!

4- Jo'an Beringer.
At 7'0 with a 7'6 wingspan and elite mobility/ switchability, Beringer shows alot of very similar defensive traits to Jarrett Allen and Kel el Ware. Only he's not anywhere as far along as Ware is offensively. But is developing a faceup game.

5- Walter Clayton ( ** IF HE FALLS).
Clayton is a bit undersized and unathletic at 6'4 but shares alot of archetype parallels to Jamal Murray. And due to his shooting and scoring creation a abilities, he has star potential. But will most likely be a Fred Van Vleet type rotation player/ starter.

Son, I am disappoint

Disappointmented how and why exactly???

Hahah I just don't like your top 5 that much. I'd like to be in agreement with you going into the war room tonight!

[RaisingArizona]

What do we know about Nolan Traore?

[RaisingArizona]

alright I'll give you Demin

[dremill24]

Brian Kalbrosky:

Some intel about the Suns, who now own the No. 10 overall pick, after the Kevin Durant trade:

Cedric Coward worked out with Phoenix during the pre-draft process.

French PG Nolan Traroré also headlined a PHX workout earlier today.

There are other more desirable permutations but I wouldn't be totally upset if this is the pair we came away with.

[NavLDO]

The ringer has Traore at #28, I'd love to take a flyer on him as a high upside PG at #29. Speedy floor general with question marks on shooting, defense and physical built, but with lots of upside. He was projected to be a lottery pick at the start of this past season.

He's a flyer I'm pretty high on. I don't think he'll be there at #28 and may be a trade up candidate.

I'd be fine with Traore at 28, if we target a PG, but my druthers would be any 2 of these 5 with our first 2 picks...

1 Collin Murray-Boyles - South Carolina - PF
2 Asa Newell - Georgia - PF
3 Thomas Sorber - Georgetown - PF/C
4 Rasheer Fleming - Saint Joseph's PF/C
5 Johni Broome - Auburn - PF/C

Any one of these 4 can play the 4, but also, fill in at the 5, with the right lineups. Asa Newell would need to bulk up some, if bringing in minutes at the 5, and CMB is a bit short, but long and stout enough to not be completely outmatched, IMO.

Anyway, I'd prefer we not both looking at PG until the late 2nd. I think, if we keep Green, he'd best fit at PG, and have read some analyses on-line that also believe Green's best future prospects are at PG; he's already demonstrated that he's not efficient enough to succeed at SG.