With the 9th Pick, the Raptors select Collin Murray-Boyles!

[tsherkin]

Like I said, I have the same concerns. CMB on their board must have been far and away the best prospect and maybe they view his potential as even higher than Scottie's and they couldn't pass that up or they actually think these guys are interchangeable and will be able to play together. I have my doubts.

I mean, if he can set a screen, his potential relative to Barnes has to be higher already, no?

I'd like to think our FO/coaches aren't daft enough to think these guys will play well together, though. If it was 20 or 30 years ago, I'd be more open to the notion but not now. I still remember what those 05 Sonics were doing with Reggie Evans and Danny Fortson, heh.

[Godaddycurse]

I think CMB's floor is achiuwa with (much) higher IQ.

[tsherkin]

They must be extremely confident they can fix CMB’s shooting.

Which terrifies me...

[Mattatron]

Obviously I’m ignoring the Suggs stuff. That wasn’t really my point.

You’re acting like CMB is some 90/100 level prospect and every guy taken below him is 78/100. There’s just no way the gap between CMB and some of the guys taken after him is that big. If we’re committed to Barnes doesn’t it make sense to sacrifice a little upside for fit? By all accounts I’d have CMB as the worst fit with Barnes of anyone available.

I’m no draft expert but I can’t believe CMB has so much upside that we had to take him no matter how badly he fits with our franchise player.

Now, if you want to tell me the FO is down on Barnes then yeah, CMB is a fine pick. But if that’s the case what the f*ck are we doing trying to build around him?

Nobody outside the Raps knows how highly he was rated, I'm just saying that I'm taking BPA over fit, especially when you're talking about 18/19/20 years olds. Most of these guys aren't going to be ready to seriously contribute positively for 2-3 years and by then your roster will look a lot different given how high the roster turnover is in the NBA.

Barnes isn't a franchise player. He's not SGA, Jokic or Giannis. He's a really good player, but you can't completely avoid positions because he exists. He's not nearly good enough for that. And this is coming from a Barnes fan.

Why are we holding onto Barnes? He’s making franchise player money. He’s the guy we decided to keep. Why are we building a team around him if he’s not a franchise guy?

"He’s the guy we decided to keep" you don't decide sh**.

Was he on the trade block? No. Why keeping him ? Because he's a talented player, who can be a cornerstone for a successful future. That's why. Only bums with zero knowledge expected him to be Kawhi Jordan and be the ultimate franchise guy. It's your own fault that you became so grim.

[OakleyDokely]

Obviously I’m ignoring the Suggs stuff. That wasn’t really my point.

You’re acting like CMB is some 90/100 level prospect and every guy taken below him is 78/100. There’s just no way the gap between CMB and some of the guys taken after him is that big. If we’re committed to Barnes doesn’t it make sense to sacrifice a little upside for fit? By all accounts I’d have CMB as the worst fit with Barnes of anyone available.

I’m no draft expert but I can’t believe CMB has so much upside that we had to take him no matter how badly he fits with our franchise player.

Now, if you want to tell me the FO is down on Barnes then yeah, CMB is a fine pick. But if that’s the case what the f*ck are we doing trying to build around him?

Nobody outside the Raps knows how highly he was rated, I'm just saying that I'm taking BPA over fit, especially when you're talking about 18/19/20 years olds. Most of these guys aren't going to be ready to seriously contribute positively for 2-3 years and by then your roster will look a lot different given how high the roster turnover is in the NBA.

Barnes isn't a franchise player. He's not SGA, Jokic or Giannis. He's a really good player, but you can't completely avoid positions because he exists. He's not nearly good enough for that. And this is coming from a Barnes fan.

Why are we holding onto Barnes? He’s making franchise player money. He’s the guy we decided to keep. Why are we building a team around him if he’s not a franchise guy?

He's the best we have for now.

[ConSarnit]

A bench of Shead/Ochai/JaKobe/CMB/JoMo is going to be a freaking wood chipper on D. Prepare to see opposing benches cry and go back to school to become accountants.

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None of them besides Ochai can shoot

I think Walter can shoot. Remove his first 6 games and he shot 37% from 3.

[Godaddycurse]

A bench of Shead/Ochai/JaKobe/CMB/JoMo is going to be a freaking wood chipper on D. Prepare to see opposing benches cry and go back to school to become accountants.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using RealGM mobile app

None of them besides Ochai can shoot

I think Walter can shoot. Remove his first 6 games and he shot 37% from 3.

Who needs shooting when you can cause turnovers/crash the boards and score off transition Flash back to nick nurse days lol

[PhilBlackson]

So my not so quick summation of how I feel about this pick overall...

I'd say this pick was the ultimate "luxury to have but not necessarily practical" decision. ie/ You'd love to have a certain item, it's great etc but you also know it's really not all that practical but you grab it anyways lol that's what this pick is to me.



1. Like yes I LOVE all the toughness, swagger, nastiness, defence etc...I've always liked these great defending almost kinda "enforcer" types of PFs ie/ Charles Oakley, Xavier McDaniels, Anthony Mason and of course Draymond types. That can guard 1-5, be an emotional leader on/off the court, have grit that other teammates feed off etc. And to CMB's credit unlike Draymond, he's incredibly mature, takes accountability *ahem, not entitled or a know it all etc...he basically has all the positives of Draymond w/out the negatives which is amazing. PLUS he's not limited to just basically being a passer as he has some post, mid game and ability to drive the basketball. But of course the Achilles Heel here is.....the shooting!

2. This is the crux of the matter and where I take issue with the FO's decision. No one is saying he won't be incredibly valuable, he'll be a bust etc etc, so in that way you can't completely tear into them because the biggest thing is you want to come out of the draft with a good player and I'm pretty confident we've done that BUUUUUUUT what's the "VISION (69)" here?!? And how practical is it really????!




Yeah it's nice to say we develop & improve our players and of course I give them their dues for that but we can't just pretend/assume either of Scottie or CMB are gonna figure out their shooting. I do think Darko & his staff are great at helping these guys better understand the game, I think they've shown they can create a very effective scheme/system BUUUUT most importantly WHO IS OUR SHOOTING COACH?!? That I want to know specifically and what is his credentials etc???

Because it's easy to point back to how Norm or Pascal's shot developed in time but wasn't that Nurse's brother's work or someone else from the PREVIOUS staff?! We can't just assume similar breakthroughs if we have a different person teaching it and if I look at not only how Scottie but also Gradey have been doing as "shooters"; I'm not very encouraged at all about how we will develop CMB's jumper.

I'm not even joking when I say the FO should be scouring bball training everywhere to find a top of the line shooting coach because that investment could be the greatest of them all with the players we've now invested to. And until that happens CMB is a fantastic get but he's more of a "luxury to have than a practical decision". Because yes I think every team would love to have a guy like him but how EFFECTIVE will it actually be and how wise was it to use probably your lone top 10 pick on what projects to either be your backup forward or potentially a player where you have to decide on trading him or Scottie long term to better fit the overall roster?!

So like I said, I don't hate the playa (actually love having him on the roster) but I hate the game/fit lol and unless they have a clear way to correct the game idk think it was the wisest way to play the game.

[rafterman]

A bench of Shead/Ochai/JaKobe/CMB/JoMo is going to be a freaking wood chipper on D. Prepare to see opposing benches cry and go back to school to become accountants.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using RealGM mobile app

if ochai can be like he was last year with incremental improvements while shead + jakobe level up, then we are cooking.

that POA defense with CMB behind them could be world class. just need that lob threat at center for some different options.

i'm on board bringing back precious or koloko on whatever's left of the cap under tax but not sure if darko likes those type of bigs.

I agree about Koloko. I never want to see Previous in a Raps uniform again. The lineup as it stands is stocked with a bunch of really smart, versatile, fast game processors. They need to keep pushing in that direction.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using RealGM mobile app

[ConSarnit]

Nobody outside the Raps knows how highly he was rated, I'm just saying that I'm taking BPA over fit, especially when you're talking about 18/19/20 years olds. Most of these guys aren't going to be ready to seriously contribute positively for 2-3 years and by then your roster will look a lot different given how high the roster turnover is in the NBA.

Barnes isn't a franchise player. He's not SGA, Jokic or Giannis. He's a really good player, but you can't completely avoid positions because he exists. He's not nearly good enough for that. And this is coming from a Barnes fan.

Why are we holding onto Barnes? He’s making franchise player money. He’s the guy we decided to keep. Why are we building a team around him if he’s not a franchise guy?

"He’s the guy we decided to keep" you don't decide sh**.

Was he on the trade block? No. Why keeping him ? Because he's a talented player, who can be a cornerstone for a successful future. That's why. Only bums with zero knowledge expected him to be Kawhi Jordan and be the ultimate franchise guy. It's your own fault that you became so grim.

There is zero evidence he can be a cornerstone of a successful future. The guy was maybe the worst volume scorer in the entire league last year. But sure, keep telling yourself that’s cornerstone material.

[raptor jesus]

CMB was in the 88th percentile of ISO scoring, and he's a good passer (21% ASTr to 15% TOr). There's a path for him to be a guy who can shoulder a decent chunk of usage i.e. be more than a role guy.

[ConSarnit]

None of them besides Ochai can shoot

I think Walter can shoot. Remove his first 6 games and he shot 37% from 3.

Who needs shooting when you can cause turnovers/crash the boards and score off transition Flash back to nick nurse days lol

Hopefully we can re-live the halcyon days of getting run over by the lowly Bulls in the play-in

[OakleyDokely]

Fans were asking the same questions about Demar/Lowry. Why are we building around them?

Maybe Barnes ends up like Demar and he's traded for a better player. Maybe he's Lowry and he becomes a key contributor on a winning team. I don't think you need to rush to these decisions, especially with Barnes so early into his career.

[ATLTimekeeper]

Yeah, talent acquisition is a good thing. But what we do with said talent is also important, right? Redundancy reduces value.

Like I said, I have the same concerns. CMB on their board must have been far and away the best prospect and maybe they view his potential as even higher than Scottie's and they couldn't pass that up or they actually think these guys are interchangeable and will be able to play together. I have my doubts.

There has to be an almost 100% chance there will be a better player taken after CMB. And another very high chance there will be another player of a similar level but different position taken after CMB. The front office must believe he has enormous potential given his flaws (shooting, not easy to fix) and his ill fit with Barnes (our theoretical franchise player).

They must be extremely confident they can fix CMB’s shooting.

I think you're overthinking this. They used Watson to find players that play the way they want to play, regardless of who is already on the team. They never draft from Europe. This has given them very stable results in the first round over the years. When I look at who followed CMB in the draft, it's a lot of low data and risk players.

[Grew]

I think he makes Scottie uncomfortable. He's either going to force Scottie to work harder or he will take his spot. Ultimately I think he will push Scottie out and the front office knows that.

The front office acts really chummy with these guys. The open gym stuff tries to potray them as one big happy family. In reality they would pivot off any one of these guys if it means getting just a little bit better.

Someone once told me the difference between an American and a Canadian is an American would risk 100 dollars to make 10 and the Canadian wouldn't. Definitely feels like we have an American front office in that sense.

[And1Skip]

Based on the Raptors IG account's response to CMB's post, looks like CMB will wear #12 because Ochai has #30.

[CazOnReal]

I think CMB's floor is achiuwa with (much) higher IQ.

Achiuwa is significantly more athletic than Collin

[Kingsway_fan]

Not certain what people expect from 9th pick?... i expected good backup player... we seem to have gotten one to backup Barnes... where we had zero depth last year. Now, we need to see about 5...

[PushDaRock]

Like I said, I have the same concerns. CMB on their board must have been far and away the best prospect and maybe they view his potential as even higher than Scottie's and they couldn't pass that up or they actually think these guys are interchangeable and will be able to play together. I have my doubts.

I mean, if he can set a screen, his potential relative to Barnes has to be higher already, no?

I'd like to think our FO/coaches aren't daft enough to think these guys will play well together, though. If it was 20 or 30 years ago, I'd be more open to the notion but not now. I still remember what those 05 Sonics were doing with Reggie Evans and Danny Fortson, heh.

lol I would think the FO is higher on Scottie than we are.

[ConSarnit]

Like I said, I have the same concerns. CMB on their board must have been far and away the best prospect and maybe they view his potential as even higher than Scottie's and they couldn't pass that up or they actually think these guys are interchangeable and will be able to play together. I have my doubts.

There has to be an almost 100% chance there will be a better player taken after CMB. And another very high chance there will be another player of a similar level but different position taken after CMB. The front office must believe he has enormous potential given his flaws (shooting, not easy to fix) and his ill fit with Barnes (our theoretical franchise player).

They must be extremely confident they can fix CMB’s shooting.

I think you're overthinking this. They used Watson to find players that play the way they want to play, regardless of who is already on the team. They never draft from Europe. This has given them very stable results in the first round over the years. When I look at who followed CMB in the draft, it's a lot of low data and risk players.

Doesn’t this imply a “throw sh*t at the wall approach”? It doesn’t exactly speak to much confidence in the current team when they draft a guy who is extremely similar (and a bad fit) with the current franchise player.

I don’t understand the how they can draft a guy “who plays the way they want” while also being a really bad fit with other players on the roster. How much does play style matter when you’re compromising the end results due to poorly fitting pieces? “I know we’re playing the way we want to but unfortunately we can’t shoot at all and it’s really hurting our offense”. Doesn’t make a lot of sense to me.