Kon Air: The Kon Knueppel Thread

[fatlever]

I know there were some of you that were very disappointed that we didn't draft ace. But there is a very real human element to building basketball teams that goes just beyond stats on a spreadsheet. There is serious value to drafting players who vibe well with your coach and front office and legitimately want to play for your organization and in your city. It's very easy to overlook these things when playing the armchair general manager from the Internet.

[fatlever]

case and point - monk and bouknight
Neither of these guys wanted to be drafted for the Hornets. Neither of them worked out for the hornets or met with the Hornets leading up to the draft. Both of them gave off an air of disappointment during their first few months after being drafted. Both of them pretty quickly clashed with the coaching staff, because of overinflated egos, Thinking they should be given things rather than earning it. From day one they just had an a negative aura that kind of followed them around. It was toxic and it was felt by everyone.

[JMAC3]

None of that really matters to me, if he is a top 8 player from this class you live with the pick. If he isn’t then it is a bad pick no matter how nice he was over dinner.

Bouknight just sucked, that’s it. He was never good, so the attitude didn’t matter. That’s the reason he isn’t in the league. Monk was talented and that’s why he is making 20 million and honestly was a fine pick but we didn’t have the patience for him to develop.

[Braggins]

Whats this dudes middle name lol?

[JMAC3]

LaMelo is a great point of maybe not the best interview, maybe not the most media friendly player but at 3 he was an awesome pick even with all that.

Cody Zeller was the clean cut, try hard guy that you dream about drafting.

It’s not even close who is a better player or pick. Talent is what matters, if Kon is great then sweet, nobody is going to care he is a nice guy either way. If Kon sucks he sucks no matter what. We just saw this with Tidjane- nobody is saying what a great kid and influence he is and no matter what he was a good culture pick at 6.

[fatlever]

Whats this dudes middle name lol?

im scared to look.

[fatlever]

LaMelo is a great point of maybe not the best interview, maybe not the most media friendly player but at 3 he was an awesome pick even with all that.

Cody Zeller was the clean cut, try hard guy that you dream about drafting.

It’s not even close who is a better player or pick. Talent is what matters, if Kon is great then sweet, nobody is going to care he is a nice guy either way. If Kon sucks he sucks no matter what. We just saw this with Tidjane- nobody is saying what a great kid and influence he is and no matter what he was a good culture pick at 6.

always exceptions

relationships matter. people matter. personalities matter. the world is not binary.

[fatlever]

monk was immature, thought he was better than he was, not ready to work

his own words

"“I wasn’t putting that much effort into the game,” he admitted. “Wasn’t watching film, all the little things, I wasn’t doing them. I wasn’t breaking down the other team’s defense as much as I needed to be. I wasn’t looking at all my shots as much as I needed to be. This year, I grew up and really just took responsibility for myself by doing those things.”

“You’ve got to know what 25-year-olds know when you’re 19,” Monk said repeatedly during an interview with the Observer. “I went to Kentucky, and I still wasn’t ready for the NBA. “Some days you’re tired. Or your body hurts. Or you have a headache. And nobody wants to hear that. You’ve got to fight through that. That’s what I’ve really learned — that you’ve got to fight.”

Feuded with Clifford over perceived a lack of playing time...

then.... even after that...got suspended for coke

he signed a one year deal after leaving hornets

took him 5 years to figure it out

its awesome he Eventually he did. He was starting to turn the corner his last year in Charlotte, but you can't blame the Hornets for deciding to go in a different direction. It was pretty clear the two sides needed to go their separate ways.

So yeah the personality side of the business is real and important. I advocate hard for drafting players that are mentally ready for the grind. I think it's important to be able to get players in and interview them so that you can really learn more about their personality more than anything. And if you can't get him in for a workout hopefully you've got a chance to have some 1 on 1 time with him during the year.

And given all of the players we've drafted recently that have flamed out for reasons other than basketball (Or the guys still on the roster who have yet to really mentally mature) I can't blame the front office for being damn sure that the player they're taking is someone that is mentally ready from day one.

bouk and kai both sucked, But both of them would probably have a better chance of being on a roster next season if they weren't both so literally immature or not ready to put in the work or not interested in putting in the work We're not interested in being a quality teammate.

Personality maturity and work ethic often is what separates the very talented players at the top.

That's my personal feelings on the draft. Obviously all of this is big picture theories and there are always exceptions on both sides. No need to try to point out the exceptions. shades of grey. You're more than welcome to disagree. its fine.

[driveandkick]

I know there were some of you that were very disappointed that we didn't draft ace. But there is a very real human element to building basketball teams that goes just beyond stats on a spreadsheet. There is serious value to drafting players who vibe well with your coach and front office and legitimately want to play for your organization and in your city. It's very easy to overlook these things when playing the armchair general manager from the Internet.

Rutgers having two players as talented as Ace and Harper and being so terrible will always be weird to me. Sorry, it just will. At the college level having two top 5 draft picks you should at least be a tournament team and they weren’t anywhere close.

Meanwhile watch any Duke game and Kon is first to every loose ball even when they’re up 20 points. This matters, I swear it does. ESPECIALLY for a franchise that we constantly critique our best player because we don’t think he cares enough.

Sure sure sure you can’t expect a 19 year old to change the culture of a franchise that has perpetually been filled with losers. Got it. But you can’t say it might not be a step.

[KembaWalker]

Yeah nah man, you’re the Charlotte Hornets, you have to draft talent because you can’t sign talent without massively overpaying and you can’t trade for talent (without massive overpaying for guys that are massively overpaid). You can sign guys that will dive on the floor for a loose ball or whatever. You can sign guys that will be in the gym

If the problem with the team is that LaMelo isn’t being a professional then you move on from LaMelo. Don’t use top 5 draft picks to try to fix LaMelos problem. That’d be like if the Pelicans drafted DJ Burns in the lottery because he dropped 50lbs in a month before the draft and they want him to show Zion how to do it

[Braggins]

Do people think Kon was the only available player in their range that plays hard and dives for loose balls or something?

I also want them to draft players with good intangibles, but I don't want them to use top 5 picks on guys primarily because they have the best intangibles.

[BatumtheGlue]

We are the Hornets, i just can't expect more from this franchise. Hornets did it their way every single year. Their very own f*cking way.

I still pick this Kon guy over Ace tho.

[SWedd523]

When you're a destination franchise or one with established high end roster that needs role players you draft lunch pail guys

When you suck and pick in the lottery every year and haven't won a playoff series in two decades, you pick talent

[driveandkick]

When you're a destination franchise or one with established high end roster that needs role players you draft lunch pail guys

When you suck and pick in the lottery every year and haven't won a playoff series in two decades, you pick talent

I guess I just think Kon has much more of a ceiling than most on this forum do. I legit think being the second option on a contending team is in his range of outcomes. This sounds crazy ambitious but I honestly don’t think being a Klay-quality shooter that is better at passing the ball is in his range of outcomes. The caveat of course he’ll never be Klay on defense.

There’s some insanely troubling analytic stuff with Ace. I don’t think a player with that high of usage that simply doesn’t get assists has ever worked out. Literally ever

[KembaWalker]

you can see the difference in testicular fortitude between someone with experience like Ainge whiffing hard on Cody Williams and immediately no hesitation going for it, and our guys and people here that are appearing borderline PTSD after Salaun lol

[EmpireFalls]

This kid will not be good enough athletically to succeed in the NBA. I’m almost certain of it. Please, by all means, would love to be proven wrong. But I’m pretty sure we just drafted a defensive liability who won’t have much potential at #4.

So Hornets.

[driveandkick]

All the talk about his “lack” of athleticism but it rarely gets brought up how strong he is. Dude is built like a bull. Seems like today in the NBA a lot of the worst defenders are the ones who are scrawny and not strong and guys just barrel through them. That’s not happening with Kon but it would have with Tre. Kon was unquestionably a better defensive player than Tre in the NCAA last year, despite Tre’s better length and quickness. I know NBA is a different world.

[Braggins]

I think his slow feet are going to get attacked on defense his entire career. I think he'll have to do the Bojan Bogdanovic thing where he eventually ends up basically playing PF on defense even though hes SG size because hes super slow (but strong). Utah had some success limiting this issue with Bojan because they had Gobert, but it was always an issue and this team isn't necessarily going to have a Gobert defender to fall back on. I don't buy that he'll ever be a positive defender and even being average seems iffy to me.

I also don't see any reason to project him to do all that much as an on-ball creator. Hes slow/stiff and his handle is basic. Most of the tape people posted showing his attacking/finishing ability was him attacking in advantaged situations and still barely waddling his way to the rim and finishing a contested bunny.

The shooting, passing, and overall IQ, all look legit to me.

[KembaWalker]

I think his slow feet are going to get attacked on defense his entire career. I think he'll have to do the Bojan Bogdanovic thing where he eventually ends up basically playing PF on defense even though hes SG size because hes super slow (but strong).

100%, he was playing the bottom of 2-3 zones in high school
his college defense footage is absurdly handsy and arm flaily, he will simply foul out trying to compensate for his feet in the NBA the way he did at Duke

[driveandkick]

Also 2 years ago this whole forum was twerking for Scoot Henderson because he was a DAWG and a CULTURE SETTER! But now that’s not a reason to draft Kon?