Shams: Lonzo for Okoro

[Chi town]

I like what Gottlieb said…

This raises our floor but lowers our ceiling as it takes mins from Buz and Noa.

Let me say it again…

AK wants to win not build a winner.

That would be evidence of the premise if Gottlieb’s underlying speculation was not obvious horse dung about Matas. And I’d rather have Okoro “eating” Noa’s minutes than a non-NBA scrub like Terry.

Noa is an 18 year old sushi-raw prospect. His minutes won’t be eaten by anyone. They will be inherently limited to some degree a matter of development. Someone has to play.

I guess people are excited about Pat and Terry getting all that run. Whoda thunkit?

I just want to pump and dump Pat. Want his mins up until he’s traded and then Noa takes over. Much like Buz last year post Lavine trade.

[meekrab]

Bulls continue to trade their assets at the worst possible times.

[CobysHairpick]

AK traded Caruso for Giddey who he likened to Lonzo for his playmaking and ability to push the pace. Now he traded Lonzo for Okoro who I imagine he likens to Caruso and Javonte Green.

The Bulls needed a lockdown perimeter defender who can guard stars and now they have one. Based on Okoro's 3pt% and elite FT rate (higher rate than SGA and Brunson), maybe he can develop a viable offensive game. I'll reserve judgment until after the season like I did with Giddey who proved his worth.

[_txchilibowl_]

PW hasn't been good, but how does burying him on the bench help this team? His value goes down even more?

I guess that would make him even more difficult to trade than it is now.

That would be ok if the team was a real contender and if Okoro had more potential (besides a solid 3&D player). But theyre not contenders and his potential is limited.

To me here's the history with motivating Pat:

- Drafted him high, gave him all the opportunity in the world to start and play. Didn't work.

- Stuck with him through injuries, rewarded him with a big extension (undeservedly). Didnt work.

- Benched him! This is still new, so too early to tell.
- Brought in a direct competitor in position and role

The way I see it, this is the last ditch effort to motivate Pat if we're gonna be "stuck" with him.

I'm not suggesting the Bulls give him big minutes, but burying him on the bench won't do anything. It won't matter if he improved because its likely that he won't be able to showcase it.

Like I said I'd feel different if the Bull were a contender, but they're not. They have to think about the teams future (AK seems to only think about the present).

They just drafted an 18 year old. How is that not a future thinking move?

[ghostinthepost1]

We like athletic young guys who can play defense and shoot. We also like guys who were drafted early (Duarte-Smith-Giddey-Huerter somewhat)

Career 35% from 3 (low volume) and 73% from FT line… I mean, he *can* shoot. Shoot well though…. Eh….

39% in 2023
37% in 2024, started the year at 49% before hurting his shoulder after which he shot 29%.

I don't think there is any reason he can't be at ~38% shooter on 4-5 attempts a game

[nomorezorro]

Bulls continue to trade their assets at the worst possible times.

...should we have traded lonzo ball in his first two months of playing with us, or do you think it would have been better to trade him at some point during his two-year injury odyssey when it was unclear if he would ever play basketball again?

[Dan Z]

Despite being on the team for four season and being given a 2-year extension, Lonzo Ball only played in 70 official games as a Bull and has never played a single playoff game in his career. Okoro is younger, less injury-prone (at least compared to Lonzo) and actually plays a position of need as a backup 2/3. If the plan was to re-sign Giddey and attempt to bring back Jones then this allows us the flexibility to do so. The only thing I don't like about this is the second year is guaranteed while Lonzo's contract had a team option. But other than that it's not a bad move, it just doesn't move the needle a ton.

How does this help re-sign Giddey and Jones? Its a 1 for 1 trade, so it doesn't help with roster spots and Okoro makes a million more per year than Lonzo.

It opens up more minutes at the 1. Guys want playing time to showcase their skills. Had Lonzo been healthy, Jones would have been further buried in the rotation last season most likely. It also allows Giddey to keep a high USG%. If you have a healthy Giddey/Ball/Jones you have a USG% of roughly 20/16/16. This means there will be rotations where at least one guy is having to play off-ball and you still have Coby at 24+% thrown into the mix. Okoro is a guy 13% guy which means he's mostly playing off-ball.

That makes sense, even though I think Jones can get a better opportunity elsewhere.

[SirKaiser]

AK traded Caruso for Giddey who he likened to Lonzo for his playmaking and ability to push the pace. Now he traded Lonzo for Okoro who I imagine he likens to Caruso and Javonte Green.

The Bulls needed a lockdown perimeter defender who can guard stars and now they have one. Based on Okoro's 3pt% and elite FT rate (higher rate than SGA and Brunson), maybe he can develop a viable offensive game. I'll reserve judgment until after the season like I did with Giddey who proved his worth.

I like your argument here and do have a feeling that the change of scenery could work to the same effect that it had on Giddey.

The problem will be when we choose to look at this trade in a vacuum and decide the kneejerk winner or loser in a trade. If Okoro is the next Lauri Markkanen, will anyone care that we "lost" this trade?

[GoBlue72391]

Okoro is basically a shorter Pat. And Dalen and Phillips are similar too.

Okoro is probably the best of the bunch, but that's not saying much. We have 4 forwards who don't do anything and a guard in Carter just wasting away.

So much dead weight on this roster. Hope more trades come soon

[Dan Z]

I like what Gottlieb said…

This raises our floor but lowers our ceiling as it takes mins from Buz and Noa.

Let me say it again…

AK wants to win not build a winner.

That would be evidence of the premise if Gottlieb’s underlying speculation was not obvious horse dung about Matas. And I’d rather have Okoro “eating” Noa’s minutes than a non-NBA scrub like Terry.

Noa is an 18 year old sushi-raw prospect. His minutes won’t be eaten by anyone. They will be inherently limited to some degree a matter of development. Someone has to play.

I guess people are excited about Pat and Terry getting all that run. Whoda thunkit?

I don't think PW is very good, but if he gets not minutes does that mean he's an 18 million per year sunken cost? No attempt to up his value a bit (even if it's just a little)?

[Dan Z]

To me here's the history with motivating Pat:

- Drafted him high, gave him all the opportunity in the world to start and play. Didn't work.

- Stuck with him through injuries, rewarded him with a big extension (undeservedly). Didnt work.

- Benched him! This is still new, so too early to tell.
- Brought in a direct competitor in position and role

The way I see it, this is the last ditch effort to motivate Pat if we're gonna be "stuck" with him.

I'm not suggesting the Bulls give him big minutes, but burying him on the bench won't do anything. It won't matter if he improved because its likely that he won't be able to showcase it.

Like I said I'd feel different if the Bull were a contender, but they're not. They have to think about the teams future (AK seems to only think about the present).

They just drafted an 18 year old. How is that not a future thinking move?

If AK really thought about the future that pick would've been higher than 12, but I agree...drafting an 18 year old is one of the few future thinking moves he's made and it's only because he went with BPA (like he should).

[Dan Z]

I asked this earlier, but I'll ask it again because I forgot that some of you think Giddey should play SF (on defense).

What do the minutes/rotation look like for the Bulls forwards next year?

[jump]

I remember how everyone bitched and moaned about the players we got in the Lavine trade. Now we all hope to resign Jones, and we're happy with Huerter and Collins. There's a reason Okoro was the 5th pick in the draft. Hopefully the change of scenery will allow him to break out.

[chicago paxsons]

I don’t dislike the trade, but it’s not exciting obviously.

We lose lonzo, who’s better when healthy, but he’s NEVER healthy, so at least we got someone who can stay on the court.

We also free up the logjam at the 1 and hopefully, this trade is a precursor to moving pat.

[TheSuzerain]

I remember how everyone bitched and moaned about the players we got in the Lavine trade. Now we all hope to resign Jones, and we're happy with Huerter and Collins. There's a reason Okoro was the 5th pick in the draft. Hopefully the change of scenery will allow him to break out.

Speak for yourself.

Jones, Huertet, and Collins are meaningless fodder.

We'd be better off cutting all 3.

[Chi town]

I asked this earlier, but I'll ask it again because I forgot that some of you think Giddey should play SF (on defense).

What do the minutes/rotation look like for the Bulls forwards next year?

Tre 24 Ayo 24
Coby 32 Okoro 16
Giddey 32 Huerter 16
Buz 32 Pat 16 Noa DNP Blowout mins
Vuc 24 Collins 12 Smith 12

[NecessaryEvil]

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[DuckIII]

It hurts my brain to keep seeing posts slotting Giddey in on offense and defense as the “small forward.”

No coach in the NBA thinks that way. He’s the PG and the position he guards will vary every night depending on who we play. That is how it works.

You guys think we drafted Essengue to be the full time
Center or something? The plan is obviously Giddey at the point and Matas and Essengue playing the hybrid 3/4 spot at the same time.

Stop slotting Giddey in as the SF at anything.

[NecessaryEvil]

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Dam lol