Shams: Randle 3/100 staying with TWolves

[schaffy]

I would add, the Randle deal doesn’t necessarily mean NAW is gone.

As I explained in another thread, Connelly should outbid t-MLE offers and perhaps pay all the way up to the $14.1 MLE, and worry about payroll later.

I think the Dunc'd on podcast mentioned this back in Late April/Early May.

Basically all of their players (Naz/Randle/NAW) will be tradable on their new contracts. Sign them now, see where the team is in January/Early February. If they are a Top team in the NBA, maybe the owners pay this year like Cleveland and other franchises are doing. If they aren't playing at that level, they can move off of one of the deals.

There are 3 problems with this. This reply is also for @Shrink

1. There are draft pick penalties for being in the 2nd apron for more than 2 of a 5 year period. We were a 2nd apron team in 24/25. If we go into it in 25/26 then we are either out of it the next three seasons, or taking a poison pill for our pick 7 years out.

2. Roster space is at a premium for this team. We had 15 players, remove Ingles and add Joan and we are back at 15. Even if we let go of Garza we still don’t have a PG and now have an incredible tax bill to add even a minimum PG.

3. NAW log jams the rotation. Clark and TSJ both have great potential but cannot develop stuck behind NAW and DDV. If Dilly takes the backup PG minutes that forces multiple players to share the remaining SG/SF backup minutes. Better to clean the slate and try to get assets out of a sign and trade for NAW.

I think those are more considerations than problems.

1. Those penalties apply if you finish the season above the 2nd apron. The suggestion being the wolves resign NAW and evaluate midseason/trade deadline to potentially still drop below at that time. Its a risk but could be a worthwhile one.

2. We have 2 PGs on the roster. Both might have warts, but they are there. And I wouldn't be surprised to see Minot depart.

3. Finch admitted he played the top 8 guys a ton together to kinda force chemistry. There is no reason he can't open up the rotation more during the regular season this year after a full offseason/trainin camp together to save Conleys legs, dial back Ants minutes a bit, play more Jaden at the 4 to give the bigs a bit more of a breather, etc. He might not ever go full OKC mode and play 12, but he can certainly open up the rotation more even with NAW back.

Sent from my SM-S901U using RealGM mobile app

[winforlose]

Are we 100% that Joan is even coming over this year? Might make sense to park him in Europe for a season given the roster and tax constraints the Wolves are operating under.

The Wolves need a backup C. If they don’t bring him then they are gonna have the same problem they had last season. Running it back is a bad idea. Imbalance at the PG and C will cost us in the playoffs again.

Not a slight on Joan as a prospect but most likely whoever you can sign for the vet min is going to give you better NBA minutes next year than he is.

Could be true, but maybe not. A year of consistent 14-15 minutes behind Rudy could do him a world of good. Also with his size, athleticism, and hands it might be better to bring him over now. I really don’t know. Either way, roster balance is a problem.

[Devilanche]

Good to great deal for minny. Still interested how the rest of their offseason goes.

[winforlose]

I think the Dunc'd on podcast mentioned this back in Late April/Early May.

Basically all of their players (Naz/Randle/NAW) will be tradable on their new contracts. Sign them now, see where the team is in January/Early February. If they are a Top team in the NBA, maybe the owners pay this year like Cleveland and other franchises are doing. If they aren't playing at that level, they can move off of one of the deals.

There are 3 problems with this. This reply is also for @Shrink

1. There are draft pick penalties for being in the 2nd apron for more than 2 of a 5 year period. We were a 2nd apron team in 24/25. If we go into it in 25/26 then we are either out of it the next three seasons, or taking a poison pill for our pick 7 years out.

This is a rule of the new CBA. It doesn't mean teams should avoid it if they are title contenders.

2. Roster space is at a premium for this team. We had 15 players, remove Ingles and add Joan and we are back at 15. Even if we let go of Garza we still don’t have a PG and now have an incredible tax bill to add even a minimum PG.

Are Dillingham/Donte/Conley not Point Guards?

Even NAW is a PG defensively as a POA defender.

3. NAW log jams the rotation. Clark and TSJ both have great potential but cannot develop stuck behind NAW and DDV. If Dilly takes the backup PG minutes that forces multiple players to share the remaining SG/SF backup minutes. Better to clean the slate and try to get assets out of a sign and trade for NAW.

If you can't develop when stuck behind players of the caliber of NAW/DDV, maybe you aren't a good basketball player.

1. Poisoning your picks is no joke. 1sts are trade bait for roster improvement, freezing them and nuking them could jeopardize Ant’s window.

2. Dilly is a bad PG. He might develop, but if he started a playoff series, I expect we get swept. If last years Dilly played 20+ minutes, literally any team in 6 or 7 over us. Dilly looked terrible at the point. DDV has no instinct for the role and drives and turns it over way too much. Outside of Rudy he almost never passes anyone open, and Rudy is hit or miss. NAW cannot deal with ball pressure, nor can Randle. Mike is our only legit PG and he is 38 and showing his age.

3. Young players need minutes. I cannot make to make it simpler than that. They need them to develop chemistry with teammates, to adapt to the pace of the game, and to build their confidence. NAW sucked for chunks of the season and playoffs. I am not convinced he is better than TSJ if TSJ is given his role and minutes.

[zimpy27]

Good tradeable sized deal

[SkyHook]

Nice contract for the Wolves. Solid.

[shrink]

I think the Dunc'd on podcast mentioned this back in Late April/Early May.

Basically all of their players (Naz/Randle/NAW) will be tradable on their new contracts. Sign them now, see where the team is in January/Early February. If they are a Top team in the NBA, maybe the owners pay this year like Cleveland and other franchises are doing. If they aren't playing at that level, they can move off of one of the deals.

There are 3 problems with this. This reply is also for @Shrink

1. There are draft pick penalties for being in the 2nd apron for more than 2 of a 5 year period. We were a 2nd apron team in 24/25. If we go into it in 25/26 then we are either out of it the next three seasons, or taking a poison pill for our pick 7 years out.

2. Roster space is at a premium for this team. We had 15 players, remove Ingles and add Joan and we are back at 15. Even if we let go of Garza we still don’t have a PG and now have an incredible tax bill to add even a minimum PG.

3. NAW log jams the rotation. Clark and TSJ both have great potential but cannot develop stuck behind NAW and DDV. If Dilly takes the backup PG minutes that forces multiple players to share the remaining SG/SF backup minutes. Better to clean the slate and try to get assets out of a sign and trade for NAW.

I think those are more considerations than problems.

1. Those penalties apply if you finish the season above the 2nd apron. The suggestion being the wolves resign NAW and evaluate midseason/trade deadline to potentially still drop below at that time. Its a risk but could be a worthwhile one.

2. We have 2 PGs on the roster. Both might have warts, but they are there. And I wouldn't be surprised to see Minot depart.

3. Finch admitted he played the top 8 guys a ton together to kinda force chemistry. There is no reason he can't open up the rotation more during the regular season this year after a full offseason/trainin camp together to save Conleys legs, dial back Ants minutes a bit, play more Jaden at the 4 to give the bigs a bit more of a breather, etc. He might not ever go full OKC mode and play 12, but he can certainly open up the rotation more even with NAW back.

Great post schaffy!

[schaffy]

The Wolves need a backup C. If they don’t bring him then they are gonna have the same problem they had last season. Running it back is a bad idea. Imbalance at the PG and C will cost us in the playoffs again.

Not a slight on Joan as a prospect but most likely whoever you can sign for the vet min is going to give you better NBA minutes next year than he is.

Could be true, but maybe not. A year of consistent 14-15 minutes behind Rudy could do him a world of good. Also with his size, athleticism, and hands it might be better to bring him over now. I really don’t know. Either way, roster balance is a problem.

Could they use an improvement of a 4th big over Garza, absolutely they could.

But it's like a single digit minutes role. You'd have to dial back the other 3 guys minutes to 30/30/26 just to get 10 minutes open. Which wouldn't even account for any of Jaden at the 4 minutes that could happen. 14-15 mins for a teenage rookie big on a contending team just isn't likely in the cards outside of multiple sustained injuries.

Sent from my SM-S901U using RealGM mobile app

[winforlose]

Not a slight on Joan as a prospect but most likely whoever you can sign for the vet min is going to give you better NBA minutes next year than he is.

Could be true, but maybe not. A year of consistent 14-15 minutes behind Rudy could do him a world of good. Also with his size, athleticism, and hands it might be better to bring him over now. I really don’t know. Either way, roster balance is a problem.

Could they use an improvement of a 4th big over Garza, absolutely they could.

But it's like a single digit minutes role. You'd have to dial back the other 3 guys minutes to 30/30/26 just to get 10 minutes open. Which wouldn't even account for any of Jaden at the 4 minutes that could happen. 14-15 mins for a teenage rookie big on a contending team just isn't likely in the cards outside of multiple sustained injuries.

Sent from my SM-S901U using RealGM mobile app

I hear you. That said, we saw Naz and Randle get outsized against OKC in the playoffs. That combination with Jaden has some pretty volatile swings. Having a legit backup C who can rim protect and rebound is a must. I am not convinced that JB couldn’t outperform at least 10 of the 30 backup Cs on day one. Give him 82 games of 15 minutes per game plus mentorship from Rudy and I think that number may be closer to 15 by mid April. I am not asking him to be our 6th or 7th man, just our 9th.

[Texas Chuck]

I guess we can put the questions of whether the new ownership is willing to pay up to bed for a while.

NAW will tell us a bit more or if they dump DDV or somesuch, but yeah I was pretty skeptical about this new group so if they have a payroll deep into the tax, I will eat some crow for sure.

[schaffy]

Could be true, but maybe not. A year of consistent 14-15 minutes behind Rudy could do him a world of good. Also with his size, athleticism, and hands it might be better to bring him over now. I really don’t know. Either way, roster balance is a problem.

Could they use an improvement of a 4th big over Garza, absolutely they could.

But it's like a single digit minutes role. You'd have to dial back the other 3 guys minutes to 30/30/26 just to get 10 minutes open. Which wouldn't even account for any of Jaden at the 4 minutes that could happen. 14-15 mins for a teenage rookie big on a contending team just isn't likely in the cards outside of multiple sustained injuries.

Sent from my SM-S901U using RealGM mobile app

I hear you. That said, we saw Naz and Randle get outsized against OKC in the playoffs. That combination with Jaden has some pretty volatile swings. Having a legit backup C who can rim protect and rebound is a must. I am not convinced that JB couldn’t outperform at least 10 of the 30 backup Cs on day one. Give him 82 games of 15 minutes per game plus mentorship from Rudy and I think that number may be closer to 15 by mid April. I am not asking him to be our 6th or 7th man, just our 9th.

That feels wildly optimistic for him as a guy who will be 19 in November and has only been playing basketball since he was 14. I think it would be more fair to ask him to be the 13th man. Both Givony and Vecenie had him in the top 15 prospects of the draft. And both make it pretty clear he is very raw who still needs to learn the game. I dont think he'd be anywhere close to a middle of the pack backup center in year 1. Assuming moderate health of the front court, I think he'll be lucky to get to Garza's 200 minutes season total. But I have no doubt he'll get to play a ton in Iowa (if he comes over).

[cgf]

I think the Dunc'd on podcast mentioned this back in Late April/Early May.

Basically all of their players (Naz/Randle/NAW) will be tradable on their new contracts. Sign them now, see where the team is in January/Early February. If they are a Top team in the NBA, maybe the owners pay this year like Cleveland and other franchises are doing. If they aren't playing at that level, they can move off of one of the deals.

There are 3 problems with this. This reply is also for @Shrink

1. There are draft pick penalties for being in the 2nd apron for more than 2 of a 5 year period. We were a 2nd apron team in 24/25. If we go into it in 25/26 then we are either out of it the next three seasons, or taking a poison pill for our pick 7 years out.

2. Roster space is at a premium for this team. We had 15 players, remove Ingles and add Joan and we are back at 15. Even if we let go of Garza we still don’t have a PG and now have an incredible tax bill to add even a minimum PG.

3. NAW log jams the rotation. Clark and TSJ both have great potential but cannot develop stuck behind NAW and DDV. If Dilly takes the backup PG minutes that forces multiple players to share the remaining SG/SF backup minutes. Better to clean the slate and try to get assets out of a sign and trade for NAW.

I think those are more considerations than problems.

1. Those penalties apply if you finish the season above the 2nd apron. The suggestion being the wolves resign NAW and evaluate midseason/trade deadline to potentially still drop below at that time. Its a risk but could be a worthwhile one.

2. We have 2 PGs on the roster. Both might have warts, but they are there. And I wouldn't be surprised to see Minot depart.

3. Finch admitted he played the top 8 guys a ton together to kinda force chemistry. There is no reason he can't open up the rotation more during the regular season this year after a full offseason/trainin camp together to save Conleys legs, dial back Ants minutes a bit, play more Jaden at the 4 to give the bigs a bit more of a breather, etc. He might not ever go full OKC mode and play 12, but he can certainly open up the rotation more even with NAW back.

Sent from my SM-S901U using RealGM mobile app

Dibs on Minott if you let him go

And Thibs was fired for doing that same exact thing…so dibs on Finch if you let him go too

[cgf]

Could be true, but maybe not. A year of consistent 14-15 minutes behind Rudy could do him a world of good. Also with his size, athleticism, and hands it might be better to bring him over now. I really don’t know. Either way, roster balance is a problem.

Could they use an improvement of a 4th big over Garza, absolutely they could.

But it's like a single digit minutes role. You'd have to dial back the other 3 guys minutes to 30/30/26 just to get 10 minutes open. Which wouldn't even account for any of Jaden at the 4 minutes that could happen. 14-15 mins for a teenage rookie big on a contending team just isn't likely in the cards outside of multiple sustained injuries.

Sent from my SM-S901U using RealGM mobile app

I hear you. That said, we saw Naz and Randle get outsized against OKC in the playoffs. That combination with Jaden has some pretty volatile swings. Having a legit backup C who can rim protect and rebound is a must. I am not convinced that JB couldn’t outperform at least 10 of the 30 backup Cs on day one. Give him 82 games of 15 minutes per game plus mentorship from Rudy and I think that number may be closer to 15 by mid April. I am not asking him to be our 6th or 7th man, just our 9th.

Did they get outsized by OKC, or did they get rattled by the physicality the refs were allowing and play dumb?

[jayjaysee]

I would bring the rookie over this year if he’s willing.

I think a couple minutes a quarter most nights, and owning the 4th quarters in blowouts and being involved in practices with Rudy would be worth burning a year of the rookie contract..

[winforlose]

Could they use an improvement of a 4th big over Garza, absolutely they could.

But it's like a single digit minutes role. You'd have to dial back the other 3 guys minutes to 30/30/26 just to get 10 minutes open. Which wouldn't even account for any of Jaden at the 4 minutes that could happen. 14-15 mins for a teenage rookie big on a contending team just isn't likely in the cards outside of multiple sustained injuries.

Sent from my SM-S901U using RealGM mobile app

I hear you. That said, we saw Naz and Randle get outsized against OKC in the playoffs. That combination with Jaden has some pretty volatile swings. Having a legit backup C who can rim protect and rebound is a must. I am not convinced that JB couldn’t outperform at least 10 of the 30 backup Cs on day one. Give him 82 games of 15 minutes per game plus mentorship from Rudy and I think that number may be closer to 15 by mid April. I am not asking him to be our 6th or 7th man, just our 9th.

Did they get outsized by OKC, or did they get rattled by the physicality the refs were allowing and play dumb?

Both!