NBA Trade Thread #12

[Chi town]

If we trade for Simons we will have to be trading Ayo as well. Not enough mins.

[bulletbill]

if the Rockets want to go all in - Coby & Ayo for Sheppard, Whitmore & pick ?

[NecessaryEvil]

I don’t foresee anyone trading for Vooch at this point.

[bulletbill]

I don’t foresee anyone trading for Vooch at this point.

Dallas would be a great fit

[Guru]

Is that 90M in dead money more likely to go to Free agents next offseason or to be traded this year for a star(s)? If a team that thinks they are a contender decides they aren't and wants to tank?

In what area are we likely to get the more impactful player?

[tunit213]

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We could try a Vuc for Collins swap.

Collins has no trade value, likely because he's overpaid, and the Jazz want to tank and play their young guys. They take Vuc and buy him out. They'd save 5M buying out Vuc vs Collins. They could save even more if Vuc is willing to return some of the money.

We get Collins for one year. I'm not the biggest fan of Collins, but he'd be the best PF we've had since Lauri.

Why pick up Collins to take away development minutes from Buz and Essengue though? We need a five to play beside them.

We have 2 fives. Zach Collins and Smith.

Few players on this team are worth investing in. Just play Buz and Essengue. Pat, Terry, and Phillips shouldn't take minutes away from them.

Giddey/Tre
Coby/Ayo
Huerter/Matas
Collins/Noa
Z.Collins/Smith

This is a fine 10-man rotation.

You forgot Okoro who will most likely be our starting SF next season as he fits perfectly with Giddey and Coby.

[HomoSapien]

Why pick up Collins to take away development minutes from Buz and Essengue though? We need a five to play beside them.

We have 2 fives. Zach Collins and Smith.

Few players on this team are worth investing in. Just play Buz and Essengue. Pat, Terry, and Phillips shouldn't take minutes away from them.

Giddey/Tre
Coby/Ayo
Huerter/Matas
Collins/Noa
Z.Collins/Smith

This is a fine 10-man rotation.

You forgot Okoro who will most likely be our starting SF next season as he fits perfectly with Giddey and Coby.

There were plenty of times where trading for Collins made sense. A scenario where Matas is forced to the bench for him is not one of them.

[HomoSapien]

If Ayo and or Pat and two firsts can this done, then this is the trade to make. He raises our defensive ceiling exponentially.

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[Almost Retired]

If Ayo and or Pat and two firsts can this done, then this is the trade to make. He raises our defensive ceiling exponentially.

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Although I'd hate to part with the Draft capital this trade would make sense because the east is depleted this year. And Kessler is young enough to have a big window for playing with Matas, Not and Giddey. Milwaukee just handcuffed themselves getting rid of Lillard and taking a cap hit of over $20 Million for the next 5 years. Giannis might decide to look for a different team if he wants to be on a contender. Indiana won't have Halliburton and Myles Turner jumped ship. Boston made some moves. Maybe this makes the Knicks the favorite, with Detroit looking better as well. I could see us making it into the 2nd round of the playoffs by adding Kessler. And in the following years the front court of Matas, Noa and Kessler could be dominant and make us a real contender to make the Finals.

[Infinity2152]

If Ayo and or Pat and two firsts can this done, then this is the trade to make. He raises our defensive ceiling exponentially.

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Although I'd hate to part with the Draft capital this trade would make sense because the east is depleted this year. And Kessler is young enough to have a big window for playing with Matas, Not and Giddey. Milwaukee just handcuffed themselves getting rid of Lillard and taking a cap hit of over $20 Million for the next 5 years. Giannis might decide to look for a different team if he wants to be on a contender. Indiana won't have Halliburton and Myles Turner jumped ship. Boston made some moves. Maybe this makes the Knicks the favorite, with Detroit looking better as well. I could see us making it into the 2nd round of the playoffs by adding Kessler. And in the following years the front court of Matas, Noa and Kessler could be dominant and make us a real contender to make the Finals.

Would 500% prefer to trade for Gafford or Lively. The cost to get them would be way less, and Kessler is in his last cheap contract year. Gafford's only 26, locked up for years, and is just as or even more effective in the same ways as Kessler overall, and a far better rim runner and faster.

[sco]

If Ayo and or Pat and two firsts can this done, then this is the trade to make. He raises our defensive ceiling exponentially.

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Although I'd hate to part with the Draft capital this trade would make sense because the east is depleted this year. And Kessler is young enough to have a big window for playing with Matas, Not and Giddey. Milwaukee just handcuffed themselves getting rid of Lillard and taking a cap hit of over $20 Million for the next 5 years. Giannis might decide to look for a different team if he wants to be on a contender. Indiana won't have Halliburton and Myles Turner jumped ship. Boston made some moves. Maybe this makes the Knicks the favorite, with Detroit looking better as well. I could see us making it into the 2nd round of the playoffs by adding Kessler. And in the following years the front court of Matas, Noa and Kessler could be dominant and make us a real contender to make the Finals.

I would be all in on him but his FT shooting is terrible, and that appears to be an exploitable weakness in today's NBA (especially in the playoffs). I wouldn't mind getting him but giving up 2 1sts for that limitation seems rich. If you said some combo of Ayo/Phillips/Smith plus Por 1st, I'd sign up to that sort of thing.

[burlydee]

I would not trade a high level first round pick for Kessler. I consider any Bulls pick a likly lottery pick, and therefore off limits. A trade I like involving Kessler

Utah trades: Kessler, KJ Martin
Utah receives: Pat Williams, 2028 Golde State 1st rounder, Portland pick (via chicago)

Bulls trade: Pat Williams, Terry or Carter, Portland Pick
Bulls receive: Kuminga (3 years, 81 million)

Golden State receives: Kessler, Terry or Carter, KJ Martin
Golden State trades: Kuminga, 2028 1st round pick

Bulls trade two bad contracts (Pat Williams and Terry/Carter) plus the Portland Pick to get Kuminga. Utah gets draft capital for Kessler and a chance to see if they can rehab Pat Williams. Golden State gets Kessler to make a run this year and some deep bench guys. I suspect they'd rather have Carter, the vet, but you never know.

[Infinity2152]

New perspective: The Bulls do not have any bad contracts right now worth worrying about. If we make absolutely no moves from now until next season, we have a TON of cap space in 2026.

The time to worry about contracts is when you need the cap space. We don't need it this summer. I don't think we'll even use our full exception. Let's relax about trading Pat Will's contract. His value can't get lower, can only go up. His contract would be easier to move with another year gone and a rising cap even if he doesn't improve. Stop worrying about the $18 mill right now or this season, it wouldn't make much difference if it was half of that in what we can do. Right now Pat's like a stock that's dropped in value, you only lose if you sell too soon. There is such a thing as bag holding, but he's only played 1 year of the contract. Selling for a loss is premature. Consider him a $8 mill role player for now, if that makes it easier.

Don't see us needing cap space until next summer. So Terry, Carter, Phillips, don't care much about their little money right now. We're not missing out on star deals an extra $5 mill would have changed. We need 15 players, and 4-5 will get DNP's every game.

Last note: We're willing to give Kuminga a chance but not Pat. Kuminga's on one of the most professional, best coached teams in the league. They lost talent and could desperately have used him as a major part years ago. They're clearly willing to let him go, and I don't think I've ever heard Kerr talking about how a player just won't fit in their system before. KD came there and learned to fit in. They have vets and Steph, Wiggins and Draymond and couldn't do it with Kuminga.

Everybody's pissed about Pat's $18 mill. AK should have seen it coming. What have we seen from Kuminga? Can't shoot 3's on a team designed for 3pt shooting and spacing. 70% FT. Hasn't averaged 5rbs a game yet in his career. Less than .5 blocks and .6 steals a game. Negative BPM and DPBM his whole career. On an efficient, well run team with vets. Guys in here are talking about Coby White and Giddey shouldn't get $30 mill. Kuminga's flaws aren't the same as Pat's but they're just as big and obvious. Couldn't this contract end up just as bad or worse than Pat's? Shouldn't we see it coming?

Then to top it off, we have absolutely no use for him. Hopefully Matas is our PF for the future. Noa's our lottery pick, I'm not giving up assets to replace him before he plays a single game, lmao! Kuminga's instantly a stumbling block in both of their ways. If we drafted Cooper Flagg nobody would want Kuminga at $30 mill. Give Noa a year or two to get ready. Could end up surprise contender for the ROY if no Kuminga on the team.

[Dan Z]

Is that 90M in dead money more likely to go to Free agents next offseason or to be traded this year for a star(s)? If a team that thinks they are a contender decides they aren't and wants to tank?

In what area are we likely to get the more impactful player?

Is there a star player that you think will be available in the near future? Will said player want to come to Chicago?

Plus, will that player be worth giving up expiring contracts and picks for?

[sco]

New perspective: The Bulls do not have any bad contracts right now worth worrying about. If we make absolutely no moves from now until next season, we have a TON of cap space in 2026.

The time to worry about contracts is when you need the cap space. We don't need it this summer. I don't think we'll even use our full exception. Let's relax about trading Pat Will's contract. His value can't get lower, can only go up. His contract would be easier to move with another year gone and a rising cap even if he doesn't improve. Stop worrying about the $18 mill right now or this season, it wouldn't make much difference if it was half of that in what we can do. Right now Pat's like a stock that's dropped in value, you only lose if you sell too soon. There is such a thing as bag holding, but he's only played 1 year of the contract. Selling for a loss is premature. Consider him a $8 mill role player for now, if that makes it easier.

Don't see us needing cap space until next summer. So Terry, Carter, Phillips, don't care much about their little money right now. We're not missing out on star deals an extra $5 mill would have changed. We need 15 players, and 4-5 will get DNP's every game.

Last note: We're willing to give Kuminga a chance but not Pat. Kuminga's on one of the most professional, best coached teams in the league. They lost talent and could desperately have used him as a major part years ago. They're clearly willing to let him go, and I don't think I've ever heard Kerr talking about how a player just won't fit in their system before. KD came there and learned to fit in. They have vets and Steph, Wiggins and Draymond and couldn't do it with Kuminga.

Everybody's pissed about Pat's $18 mill. AK should have seen it coming. What have we seen from Kuminga? Can't shoot 3's on a team designed for 3pt shooting and spacing. 70% FT. Hasn't averaged 5rbs a game yet in his career. Less than .5 blocks and .6 steals a game. Negative BPM and DPBM his whole career. On an efficient, well run team with vets. Guys in here are talking about Coby White and Giddey shouldn't get $30 mill. Kuminga's flaws aren't the same as Pat's but they're just as big and obvious. Couldn't this contract end up just as bad or worse than Pat's? Shouldn't we see it coming?

Then to top it off, we have absolutely no use for him. Hopefully Matas is our PF for the future. Noa's our lottery pick, I'm not giving up assets to replace him before he plays a single game, lmao! Kuminga's instantly a stumbling block in both of their ways. If we drafted Cooper Flagg nobody would want Kuminga at $30 mill. Give Noa a year or two to get ready. Could end up surprise contender for the ROY if no Kuminga on the team.

Yeah Kuminga is quite the box of chocolates. He will likely exhibit the same limitations here as he did there, but "there's a chance" he'll be great...and that's the appeal. I'm not on board with a $30M deal for him, but $20M is low enoug that it won't cripple us and may become tradeable down the road.

[Dan Z]

New perspective: The Bulls do not have any bad contracts right now worth worrying about. If we make absolutely no moves from now until next season, we have a TON of cap space in 2026.

The time to worry about contracts is when you need the cap space. We don't need it this summer. I don't think we'll even use our full exception. Let's relax about trading Pat Will's contract. His value can't get lower, can only go up. His contract would be easier to move with another year gone and a rising cap even if he doesn't improve. Stop worrying about the $18 mill right now or this season, it wouldn't make much difference if it was half of that in what we can do. Right now Pat's like a stock that's dropped in value, you only lose if you sell too soon. There is such a thing as bag holding, but he's only played 1 year of the contract. Selling for a loss is premature. Consider him a $8 mill role player for now, if that makes it easier.

Don't see us needing cap space until next summer. So Terry, Carter, Phillips, don't care much about their little money right now. We're not missing out on star deals an extra $5 mill would have changed. We need 15 players, and 4-5 will get DNP's every game.

Last note: We're willing to give Kuminga a chance but not Pat. Kuminga's on one of the most professional, best coached teams in the league. They lost talent and could desperately have used him as a major part years ago. They're clearly willing to let him go, and I don't think I've ever heard Kerr talking about how a player just won't fit in their system before. KD came there and learned to fit in. They have vets and Steph, Wiggins and Draymond and couldn't do it with Kuminga.

Everybody's pissed about Pat's $18 mill. AK should have seen it coming. What have we seen from Kuminga? Can't shoot 3's on a team designed for 3pt shooting and spacing. 70% FT. Hasn't averaged 5rbs a game yet in his career. Less than .5 blocks and .6 steals a game. Negative BPM and DPBM his whole career. On an efficient, well run team with vets. Guys in here are talking about Coby White and Giddey shouldn't get $30 mill. Kuminga's flaws aren't the same as Pat's but they're just as big and obvious. Couldn't this contract end up just as bad or worse than Pat's? Shouldn't we see it coming?

Then to top it off, we have absolutely no use for him. Hopefully Matas is our PF for the future. Noa's our lottery pick, I'm not giving up assets to replace him before he plays a single game, lmao! Kuminga's instantly a stumbling block in both of their ways. If we drafted Cooper Flagg nobody would want Kuminga at $30 mill. Give Noa a year or two to get ready. Could end up surprise contender for the ROY if no Kuminga on the team.

Yeah Kuminga is quite the box of chocolates. He will likely exhibit the same limitations here as he did there, but "there's a chance" he'll be great...and that's the appeal. I'm not on board with a $30M deal for him, but $20M is low enoug that it won't cripple us and may become tradeable down the road.

Right now the Bulls have Matas and PW at PF. Can Jalen Smith play there at times? Philips?. At SF they have Okoro, Noa Essengue, Huerter, Matas, PW and Julian Philips.

If you add Kuminga to the roster then PW gets less minutes? That's okay, but does Noa also get less minutes? Probably.

I don't think Kuminga is worth the risk. He might improve, but if he doesn't then the Bulls are stuck with a 25 million (or so) contract that many teams won't want. The team already has a bad contract with PW.

[Infinity2152]

Kuminga would be a tough decision at $25-$30 mil as a UFA who had us as his top choice. People keep talking about his potential, what is he great at? This is one of those moves we'd be making just because it's there. He doesn't fit a need, cost a lot, would actively take time from Matas and Noa, and hasn't shown an elite NBA skill. With maturity issues. What if he doesn't even want to be here, but comes for the biggest payday?

And we'd have to send positive value to take that chance. The Warriors will want positive value in return. People are talking about Coby White. those assets could be used to get something that's not as risky, better value and better need.

Is Kuminga likely to be better than most players we could get in FA next year for $25-$30 mill, without spending any assets?

[2weekswithpay]

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The market for SGs is rough. If we do keep Coby, maybe this will suppress his value.

[MGB8]

Vuc trade ideas:

1) Vuc to CHA for Sexton - they need another center, Sexton is also expiring, 26 y/o, and would be a Coby hedge.

2) Vuc + Ayo to BOS for Simons + a 2nd rounder or two. Similar need profile, Stevens would do well with Ayo, and Simons is similar to Sexton (and also expiring).

3) RISKY BUT I PROB WOULD: Vuc + Pat + Ayo (or Carter) for Vassell and Barnes and maybe Bassey. Spurs signed Kornet behind Wemby but might want another for a year. Also have a guard logjam. Barnes is expiring and would be a vet mentor. Vassell is signed for the same # of years as Pat, but for an extra 9 million. He is hurt a lot and not that efficient. Still, he has flashed a bit on offense and he showed a high bball IQ at least in college. Another hedge for Coby (with less lead guard skills), but an upgrade over Pat (if healthy). Maybe too risky?

4) SIMILARLY RISKY, AND DOUBT ORL WOULD: Vuc + Pat (or Ayo + Carter) + Portland Pick for Suggs. Suggs injury history makes this risky, but also only reason it could be possible. Orlando likely could use another center, and the commitment to Pat would be almost half as little as to Suggs (and Ayo plus Carter even less).

[Salo23]

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The market for SGs is rough. If we do keep Coby, maybe this will suppress his value.

https://www.nbcsportsbayarea.com/nba/sacramento-kings/jonathan-kuminga-malik-monk-dennis-schroder-trade/1859850/?amp=1

Kings -> Schroder, Kuminga
Warriors - > Devin Carter, Dario Saric, 2 2nds
Pistons -> Monk