Poll: Odd man out: Gradey, Ja'Kobe or Ochai?

[OAKLEY_2]

RJ is the real answer (but it's going to be Ochai, unfortunately).

Well MLSE just stated in a hastily organized presser they are in the middle of a rebuild and thus accumulating assets. You do not keep the trade asset that is not a "prospect" headed towards 9 mil salary over the two entry level legit prospects. It is not fortunately vs. unfortunately other than to say unfortunately we are not the 6th seed where keeping Ochai makes more sense.

[tsherkin]

OK but when?

Well, let's give him more than 114 games to figure out the NBA game and get himself adjusted. He isn't FAR from where Herro was in his second season either. At the time, Herro was a 15.1 / 5/0 / 3.4 guy for a 40-32 Miami team across 54 games and 15 starts... at 54.3% TS (95 TS+). He was a -43.2 TSAdd guy that year, very similar to Gradey this season.

So, patience. Breathe.

Guys who aren't immediately titanic superstars can develop if they have some functional tools to work with and you don't write them off after like a season and a half. It's after 3, 4, 5 years that they aren't showing you an arc of improvement that it becomes more of a problem.

[Tofubeque]

Go look at Peja's and Reddicks start to their careers.

Gradey being the odd man out in favor of Ochai is short sighted.

You can't want to draft offense first teenagers in the lottery, and then when we actually have one, decide you can't wait for them to develop.

People around here decided things about Gradey literally in his first summer league, and continue to dwell on his weaknesses without giving him any credit for the improvement he has made.

Feels like this board has old man yelling at clouds syndrome when it comes to Gradey. Are you jealous of a skinny white boy making the league? It feels like an irrational level of hate towards a guy that seems like a nice hardworking kid who just wants to get better and help this team win.

You can't be around here complaining about how bad we are offensively if you're also going to non stop complain about how bad Gradey is on D. Obviously they are trying to get him stronger, it takes time...

You can't be around here complaining that we only draft long arm defense first tweeners, and then non stop cry about how the offensive first kid can't deal with a big body vet going after him around the hoop.

You can't be upset with the team trying to make the playoffs, our ceiling not being high enough, and then say one of our highest ceiling guys is taking to long, so he's the odd man out.

If your ceiling is Tyler Herro and you are struggling to hit that, realistically how much time and effort should we invest here?

Funny enough Herro and Dick had the exact same .543 TS% in their second years, at the same age. Dick shot 1% worse from 3 on higher volume in the same minutes, while starting every game. If Dick is struggling to be Tyler Herro, so did Herro.

I don't think they have the same playstyle really, one is more on ball vs off ball. But a cheaper Herro with more height and weight isn't some big investment to have around.

[Tom_Foolery]

OK but when?

Well, let's give him more than 114 games to figure out the NBA game and get himself adjusted. He isn't FAR from where Herro was in his second season either. At the time, Herro was a 15.1 / 5/0 / 3.4 guy for a 40-32 Miami team across 54 games and 15 starts... at 54.3% TS (95 TS+). He was a -43.2 TSAdd guy that year, very similar to Gradey this season.

So, patience. Breathe.

Guys who aren't immediately titanic superstars can develop if they have some functional tools to work with and you don't write them off after like a season and a half. It's after 3, 4, 5 years that they aren't showing you an arc of improvement that it becomes more of a problem.

I disagree, OKC traded Josh Giddey for Alex Caruso and they ended up winning a championship. We can't just be caught up in potential and numbers.

So patience can also result in missed opportunities.

He's entering his 3rd year and our spots 2-3 spots are too stacked. Unless he opts for a G-League stay, how does he compete and get time?

[DG88]

In all honesty it's RJ. Dick and Ja'Kobe are on rookie deals. Ochai actually performed above his contract.

[tsherkin]

I disagree, OKC traded Josh Giddey for Alex Caruso and they ended up winning a championship. We can't just be caught up in potential and numbers.

That's not a disagreement, that's an example of a one-off transaction. Yes, if something good comes up, then you take the deal, sure. But that isn't the same as saying "don't get up his ass because he hasn't turned into an All-Star after a season and a half of games played."

He's entering his 3rd year and our spots 2-3 spots are too stacked. Unless he opts for a G-League stay, how does he compete and get time?

Be better than that Walter, I guess. Walter hasn't really done a ton to suggest he's a lot more worthy at this time either. He has more defensive potential, for sure, but he's wholly unremarkable offensively at the moment. We'll see what happens with training camp and the preseason and such (again, unless something exciting along comes and it makes sense to move Gradey).

[LoveMyRaps]

Does this solve our tax issues?

[Tom_Foolery]

I disagree, OKC traded Josh Giddey for Alex Caruso and they ended up winning a championship. We can't just be caught up in potential and numbers.

That's not a disagreement, that's an example of a one-off transaction. Yes, if something good comes up, then you take the deal, sure. But that isn't the same as saying "don't get up his ass because he hasn't turned into an All-Star after a season and a half of games played."

He's entering his 3rd year and our spots 2-3 spots are too stacked. Unless he opts for a G-League stay, how does he compete and get time?

Be better than that Walter, I guess. Walter hasn't really done a ton to suggest he's a lot more worthy at this time either. He has more defensive potential, for sure, but he's wholly unremarkable offensively at the moment. We'll see what happens with training camp and the preseason and such (again, unless something exciting along comes and it makes sense to move Gradey).

It's a real example of why you shouldn't be married to your uncertain draft pick. We're not even asking him to be an All-Star, just him coming off the bench can be a question mark at times.

Walter does everything better than Gradey except 3pt shooting and even that I'm curious to see this coming season.

[tsherkin]

It's a real example of why you shouldn't be married to your uncertain draft pick. We're not even asking him to be an All-Star, just him coming off the bench can be a question mark at times.

Walter does everything better than Gradey except 3pt shooting and even that I'm curious to see this coming season.

Again, we're not really disagreeing that if a good move comes up, then we take it. He isn't a centerpiece player, so that seems obvious. But giving up on his development and potential would be a little hasty at this particular juncture.

I am also curious to see if Walter can improve. Because right now, he doesn't impress me any more than Gradey on offense, but obviously I do like his defense more.

[Tom_Foolery]

It's a real example of why you shouldn't be married to your uncertain draft pick. We're not even asking him to be an All-Star, just him coming off the bench can be a question mark at times.

Walter does everything better than Gradey except 3pt shooting and even that I'm curious to see this coming season.

Again, we're not really disagreeing that if a good move comes up, then we take it. He isn't a centerpiece player, so that seems obvious. But giving up on his development and potential would be a little hasty at this particular juncture.

I am also curious to see if Walter can improve. Because right now, he doesn't impress me any more than Gradey on offense, but obviously I do like his defense more.

We can't keep everyone. Someone has to be the odd man out.

That's why I think it's best for Gradey to go in the G-League. He's the least athletic out of the bunch and until he overcomes this, I won't be completely sold on his upside.

[tsherkin]

We can't keep everyone. Someone has to be the odd man out.

Sure. And from a contract perspective, it's probably RJ, even if that is a little sad. We have cheap control over Gradey, he's young, he has a desirable skillset and flashed some potential beyond just C+S early in the season. We'll see what he can do. I'm not in a hurry to move him, nor should anyone be.

[djsunyc]

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[S.W.A.N]

Does this solve our tax issues?

We don't have a tax issue. That trade would solve a none-existent problem.

We only do a RJ trade for talent not savings.

[ash_k]

Due to that Kansas connection and what Gradey showed(that amazing potential), Ja'Kobe should be the odd man out.

[OAKLEY_2]

If your ceiling is Tyler Herro and you are struggling to hit that, realistically how much time and effort should we invest here?

TBF, Herro would be a NICE ceiling. He's an AS, he's been a 6MOY, and the past 4 years, he's averaging about 22/5/5, and just had a phenomenal offensive season. He's not a superstar, but he IS a very good player, and was so particularly in 2025.

That'd be a brilliant outcome for Gradey.

When will he improve is a more annoying commentary than if. Sure there is no time like the present but... he is a prospect through and through. The if he is or will become legit is a concern with all prospects and despite Freddie surpassing his ceiling and then some he was full of haters in this very place due to size and getting to the net. For the most part Fred had enough tools to allay fears and get 40 mil per. Our haters and tankers would have traded him for 10 cents on the Raptor dollar. Gradey is worth being patient with but I would say his ceiling is Luke Kennard.

[OAKLEY_2]

We can't keep everyone. Someone has to be the odd man out.

Sure. And from a contract perspective, it's probably RJ, even if that is a little sad. We have cheap control over Gradey, he's young, he has a desirable skillset and flashed some potential beyond just C+S early in the season. We'll see what he can do. I'm not in a hurry to move him, nor should anyone be.

This.

[dTox]

In all honesty it's RJ. Dick and Ja'Kobe are on rookie deals. Ochai actually performed above his contract.

This. And with all the noise from trade rumors of RJ being involved, it looks like the FO is also feeling the same.

[tsherkin]

When will he improve is a more annoying commentary than if. Sure there is no time like the present but... he is a prospect through and through. The if he is or will become legit is a concern with all prospects and despite Freddie surpassing his ceiling and then some he was full of haters in this very place due to size and getting to the net. For the most part Fred had enough tools to allay fears and get 40 mil per. Our haters and tankers would have traded him for 10 cents on the Raptor dollar. Gradey is worth being patient with but I would say his ceiling is Luke Kennard.

There are certainly no guarantees with Gradey. There's just potential at this point. It is, however, very early. Scottie's had a lot more time, and people are still out there trying to sell his potential to us in all of his areas of critical weakness (and to a lesser extent, RJ as well), but are ready to give up on Gradey? It doesn't make a lot of sense.

I don't know that Herro is his ceiling; I think Herro is more athletic, which helps him a bunch. Kennard, however, peaked around 16 ppg and twice led the league in 3P%. Gradey's bigger than him, and has a little more capacity for attacking close-outs to my eye, so I think his potential ceiling is a little higher than Kennard, personally. Whether or not he REACHES that, of course, is another story.