The Official 2025 Offseason Thread #4 Free Agency Opens!

[BobbieL]

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Maybe Ish will surprise us and not stretch and waive

[503Suns]

Ask me after we see what happens with the Beal situation but with ishbia - I don’t have faith. I like Maulauch and Flemings. Williams might be nice but if it means stretching Beal - it’s stupid. There was 23m of easy cap space to closer to apron levels .

I know people around here are convinced this was very well planned and well thought out but I just don’t see it after digging deeper.

Suns knew there was a possibility Malauch could fall to them hence why they are talking to Rich Paul. But then traded away for Williams who failed a physical the year prior and hasn’t played over 45 games in a year. They used their 29th pick (and a future 1st)to trade for him when they could have just kept the 29th pick and selected Fleming. Instead of waiting to see how the draft played out first, they over played their hand to (over)trade for Williams. Then wasted their second night wasting more draft picks to move back up to get Fleming. This is, not a formula to success any other GM in the league would do.

Then regarding the KD trade, they ended up with a Booker clone in Green. (which by the way was the biggest flaw of this team the last two years was this team had too many clones of Booker). Green was a no more than a salary dump for Houston. Green stats are super stagnant after 4 years in the league which is very concerning.

Now you are going to pair Booker and Green into the starting unit who have almost no court vision and Booker has proven he is NOT capable of elevating the players around him but decide to surround him with players that need someone to elevate them. Booker as full time PG is a known disaster AND the FO already talked about getting Booker out of the PG roll and put him back in the SG roll full time to allow him to flourish but they renig and put Booker back at PG.

There is no rhyme or rhythm to what this front office is doing. Now they are in cost cutting mode and foolishly trying to stretch Beal after foolishly trading for him (Ishbia hold yourself accountable since this is your mess and stop firing people for your failures, please).

I’m sorry I’m not buying what people are trying to sell (this is was a good off season).

Then feel free to leave and follow another team.

Yes, please find another team to hate on

[dremill24]

Ask me after we see what happens with the Beal situation but with ishbia - I don’t have faith. I like Maulauch and Flemings. Williams might be nice but if it means stretching Beal - it’s stupid. There was 23m of easy cap space to closer to apron levels .

I know people around here are convinced this was very well planned and well thought out but I just don’t see it after digging deeper.

Suns knew there was a possibility Malauch could fall to them hence why they are talking to Rich Paul. But then traded away for Williams who failed a physical the year prior and hasn’t played over 45 games in a year. They used their 29th pick (and a future 1st)to trade for him when they could have just kept the 29th pick and selected Fleming. Instead of waiting to see how the draft played out first, they over played their hand to (over)trade for Williams. Then wasted their second night wasting more draft picks to move back up to get Fleming. This is, not a formula to success any other GM in the league would do.

Then regarding the KD trade, they ended up with a Booker clone in Green. (which by the way was the biggest flaw of this team the last two years was this team had too many clones of Booker). Green was a no more than a salary dump for Houston. Green stats are super stagnant after 4 years in the league which is very concerning.

Now you are going to pair Booker and Green into the starting unit who have almost no court vision and Booker has proven he is NOT capable of elevating the players around him but decide to surround him with players that need someone to elevate them. Booker as full time PG is a known disaster AND the FO already talked about getting Booker out of the PG roll and put him back in the SG roll full time to allow him to flourish but they renig and put Booker back at PG.

There is no rhyme or rhythm to what this front office is doing. Now they are in cost cutting mode and foolishly trying to stretch Beal after foolishly trading for him (Ishbia hold yourself accountable since this is your mess and stop firing people for your failures, please).

I’m sorry I’m not buying what people are trying to sell (this is was a good off season).

Not a lot they could do about KD and the Houston offer. Other teams offered less than the #10 pick, Brooks, Green, and six 2nd rounders. Still a pretty good haul turning it into Green, Maluach, Fleming and Brea. So four young guys in exchange for KD.

Second, I believe Williams was working out in Phoenix with Richards and the Suns staff had a pretty good idea of his medical situation. The reason why I suggest this is that Williams twitter location said at the time of his trade "In the lab". Speculation sure but why "in the lab" when that is the name of the Suns training facility.

"In the lab" is just slang for working on individual skill development, no matter the location.

[Sunsdeuce]

I know people around here are convinced this was very well planned and well thought out but I just don’t see it after digging deeper.

Suns knew there was a possibility Malauch could fall to them hence why they are talking to Rich Paul. But then traded away for Williams who failed a physical the year prior and hasn’t played over 45 games in a year. They used their 29th pick (and a future 1st)to trade for him when they could have just kept the 29th pick and selected Fleming. Instead of waiting to see how the draft played out first, they over played their hand to (over)trade for Williams. Then wasted their second night wasting more draft picks to move back up to get Fleming. This is, not a formula to success any other GM in the league would do.

Then regarding the KD trade, they ended up with a Booker clone in Green. (which by the way was the biggest flaw of this team the last two years was this team had too many clones of Booker). Green was a no more than a salary dump for Houston. Green stats are super stagnant after 4 years in the league which is very concerning.

Now you are going to pair Booker and Green into the starting unit who have almost no court vision and Booker has proven he is NOT capable of elevating the players around him but decide to surround him with players that need someone to elevate them. Booker as full time PG is a known disaster AND the FO already talked about getting Booker out of the PG roll and put him back in the SG roll full time to allow him to flourish but they renig and put Booker back at PG.

There is no rhyme or rhythm to what this front office is doing. Now they are in cost cutting mode and foolishly trying to stretch Beal after foolishly trading for him (Ishbia hold yourself accountable since this is your mess and stop firing people for your failures, please).

I’m sorry I’m not buying what people are trying to sell (this is was a good off season).

Then feel free to leave and follow another team.

Yes, please find another team to hate on

Ok, child. Unless you can contribute more to the conversation stay out and go find another team to mindlessly support everything they do.

[BobbieL]

Then feel free to leave and follow another team.

Yes, please find another team to hate on

Ok, child. Unless you can contribute more to the conversation stay out and go find another team to mindlessly support everything they do.

I want the Suns to be good. Hence on this forum . That said- Ishbias moves leave a lot to be desired. And from purely competing for a title, stretching and waiving Beal is stupid . So it saves him money, I don’t care. And if he does something stupid like sign a player to sign a player - especially multi years, that negates stretching

[Saberestar]

Gerald Bourguet says that the new 2nd acquired is from 2026, but not more info for now.

Edit: OK, it's 2026 2nd (2nd most favorable of
ОКС/DAL/ РНІ)

[Sunsdeuce]

Yes, please find another team to hate on

Ok, child. Unless you can contribute more to the conversation stay out and go find another team to mindlessly support everything they do.

I want the Suns to be good. Hence on this forum . That said- Ishbias moves leave a lot to be desired. And from purely competing for a title, stretching and waiving Beal is stupid . So it saves him money, I don’t care. And if he does something stupid like sign a player to sign a player - especially multi years, that negates stretching

Ishbia has to earn praise by providing a competitive product. The product has not been competitive. Thus he does not deserve the respect or praise. If this roster turns out to be a playoff contender, then he should get praise. Until then, the results so far don’t deserve respect. I’m not going to church up what he has done or what he is doing just to lie to myself that everything is great. Not my thing. Respect is earned, not given.

[Saberestar]

With the new 2nd acquired in the KD trade we have 4 2nds available to use in any trade.

• 2026 2nd (2nd most favorable of
ОКС/DAL/РНІ).
• 2026 2nd (worse of Nuggets/Warriors).
• 2029 2nd (own)
• 2032 2nd (own)

[BobbieL]

Gerald Bourguet says that the new 2nd acquired is from 2026, but not more info for now.

Edit: OK, it's 2026 2nd (2nd most favorable of
ОКС/DAL/ РНІ)

Is this the Durant trade 2nd?

So they started with 5 but through other trades it’s now just the one?

[Saberestar]

Gerald Bourguet says that the new 2nd acquired is from 2026, but not more info for now.

Edit: OK, it's 2026 2nd (2nd most favorable of
ОКС/DAL/ РНІ)

Is this the Durant trade 2nd?

So they started with 5 but through other trades it’s now just the one?

We finally got 6 2nds.

We used 5 of them to get Fleming and Brea.

[BobbieL]

Ok, child. Unless you can contribute more to the conversation stay out and go find another team to mindlessly support everything they do.

I want the Suns to be good. Hence on this forum . That said- Ishbias moves leave a lot to be desired. And from purely competing for a title, stretching and waiving Beal is stupid . So it saves him money, I don’t care. And if he does something stupid like sign a player to sign a player - especially multi years, that negates stretching

Ishbia has to earn praise by providing a competitive product. The product has not been competitive. Thus he does not deserve the respect or praise. If this roster turns out to be a playoff contender, then he should get praise. Until then, the results so far don’t deserve respect. I’m not going to church up what he has done or what he is doing just to lie to myself that everything is great. Not my thing. Respect is earned, not given.

Just hope they have a plan when Beal is gone .. especially waive and stretch. Don’t do something stupid to fo something

[Sunsdeuce]

I want the Suns to be good. Hence on this forum . That said- Ishbias moves leave a lot to be desired. And from purely competing for a title, stretching and waiving Beal is stupid . So it saves him money, I don’t care. And if he does something stupid like sign a player to sign a player - especially multi years, that negates stretching

Ishbia has to earn praise by providing a competitive product. The product has not been competitive. Thus he does not deserve the respect or praise. If this roster turns out to be a playoff contender, then he should get praise. Until then, the results so far don’t deserve respect. I’m not going to church up what he has done or what he is doing just to lie to myself that everything is great. Not my thing. Respect is earned, not given.

Just hope they have a plan when Beal is gone .. especially waive and stretch. Don’t do something stupid to fo something

I’m really starting to believe those rumors Ishbia may be broke. But either way, I’m with you. Don’t do something stupid

[Djedefre]

We have convinced ourselves this is a good “reload” “around Booker”. Good lawd, our standards are so low now.

Very uninspiring set of moves, but when you think of it, not trading Booker is the main limiting factor. We all knew Durant alone won't fetch us anything substantial. This is still dysfunctional team with a hole at PG. I like Gillespie, but let's be real, he is not a starter.

Now we are waiting for the next idiotic and shortsighted move with Beal, to round out yet another year of refusing to accept the obvious - that this ship has sunk and full rebuild is a must.

Just wait till you know who reads your post and replies with “go find another team”. Remember, suns realgm forum is now a dictatorship where you are only allowed to support this front office regime with praise, if you criticize it, you should be deported from this forum.

Do you think i care? That kind of a response says a lot more about it's author. The idea that someone believes they have the mandate to decide who is a true fan and who isn't, and to act as a censor on the forum, is completely misplaced and ultimately quite childish.

[BobbieL]

Ishbia has to earn praise by providing a competitive product. The product has not been competitive. Thus he does not deserve the respect or praise. If this roster turns out to be a playoff contender, then he should get praise. Until then, the results so far don’t deserve respect. I’m not going to church up what he has done or what he is doing just to lie to myself that everything is great. Not my thing. Respect is earned, not given.

Just hope they have a plan when Beal is gone .. especially waive and stretch. Don’t do something stupid to fo something

I’m really starting to believe those rumors Ishbia may be broke. But either way, I’m with you. Don’t do something stupid

I don’t need him to use the TPMLE because he can. Using the normal MLE would just be dumb putting them back above apron levels


I just want to know why they kept Richards.. that just seems short sighted

[bwgood77]

Interesting stuff.

Barry Jackson (who covers the Heat) said yesterday that a good player who is interested in the Heat is gonna be available pretty soon.

Too many questions, negative comments and he finally deleted the tweet.

He probably was talking about Beal. We will know more about it in the next couple of days.

I am sure the Beal thing will get done in the next couple days. It will be just whether its the two year buyout so to speak or the stretch/waive. My guess, Ishbia will do the s/w as that saves him the most money. But than he will follow it up by overpaying for a person on the TPMLE or maybe even teh MLE or something that offsets the savings and he will still pay the tax to some degree.

It seems like we will likely stretch him to get under the 2nd apron. Obviously if he takes a buyout for around 2 years of the tax mle (assuming that is what Miami would give him) then we'd only save about $5 million I believe so would still need to cut quite a bit more.

I can't remember what the amount we need under the cap would be but I think it would be wiser to just buy out Beal and save the $5 million per year or whatever, and then stretch Allen, which saves over $9 million. That might not be QUITE enough, but that means we have a cap hit for $7.7 million for 7 years instead of like near $20 million for 5. It would be over $10 million of savings next year and over $11 million the following year, and then you have the $7.7 million hit for 4 years, but with a massively increased cap, that's nothing. It wouidn't kill our cap space 2027-2030.

Sure we could maybe get a 2nd and a player for Allen but I think he is overpaid despite being a great shooter, a bit like Duncan Robinson (though a better defender).

I'd rather have the extra $12 million or so in cap space in the summers of 2026 and 2027 then a 2nd or two (if we could even get that).

I bet though that we just stretch Beal because Ishbia doesn't think long term implications with money. He just thinks about now.

[TeamTragic]

When this team actually completes and plays hard all the sky is falling posts will turn into why did we pay Booker.

This FO could build a Finals team and we would still have the usual suspects on this board complain that Ishbia didn't give them enough relish on their hotdog.

[Hook_Em]

Paying a non-superstar $75m a year starting in 2027-28’ for past production is just dumb but not surprising.

[TeamTragic]

Paying a non-superstar $75m a year starting in 2027-28’ for past production is just dumb but not surprising.

Which attainable player would you rather pay 75M/year?

Would you rather that we field an entire rookie team like the Nets?

[Sunsdeuce]

Paying a non-superstar $75m a year starting in 2027-28’ for past production is just dumb but not surprising.

It ain’t just the front office that is striving for mediocracy, it’s the player too. I always ask, how much is enough to make someone happy?

[enigmatics]

Paying a non-superstar $75m a year starting in 2027-28’ for past production is just dumb but not surprising.

It's utterly obnoxious.