The Official 2025 Offseason Thread #4 Free Agency Opens!

[Mr Puddles]

That means we're stretching him

Which is the worst outcome imo

If this goes through it's Ishbia being short sighted once again and making disastrous moves with lasting consequences. Sure we will save some money this season and the next but that money is going to be on the books for a long time.

Why would anyone including Ishbia pay 230M in tax to keep Beal on this team?

Ask any owner in this league and they would have made the same decision.

Second this puts the team outside BOTH tax aprons which allows for more flexibility.

Does that extended cap hit hurt the franchise? Maybe but at least the cap is slightly increasing and Beal is not on this team.

Maybe think about that before trading away all our picks to assemble to most expensive team in NBA history?

Not having control over our picks AND having less capspace than any other team in the league is essentially the worst possible situation a team can be in.

If the Suns wanted to be under the second apron, they could have not picked up Richards and done the Detroit deal Miami made (Duncan will make about the same as Allen while being a worse player).

That deal would have put us in the 2nd apron, and we could have let Beal expire in two years, and we'd have a bunch of space when the free agency market looks flooded with talent. The 2027 free offseason is basically our way out of the current mess, but instead our front office seems to think we'll be fine assembling a roster with 25 mil of dead money on our books for half a decade.

To NOW bring up the 230 mil in tax after Isbiah actively traded to put us in this situation seems ridiculous. "here's all our picks, please give me your big name players, I'll pay whatever is needed... Oh wait, I'm paying how much?? Nevermind, let's just kill our capspace while letting the rest of the league pick up the players we traded our future for at Temu prices.

[Frank Lee]

Just wait till you know who reads your post and replies with “go find another team”. Remember, suns realgm forum is now a dictatorship where you are only allowed to support this front office regime with praise, if you criticize it, you should be deported from this forum.

But hey, it’s what you voted for.



Whoops, wrong forum

[TeamTragic]

If this goes through it's Ishbia being short sighted once again and making disastrous moves with lasting consequences. Sure we will save some money this season and the next but that money is going to be on the books for a long time.

Why would anyone including Ishbia pay 230M in tax to keep Beal on this team?

Ask any owner in this league and they would have made the same decision.

Second this puts the team outside BOTH tax aprons which allows for more flexibility.

Does that extended cap hit hurt the franchise? Maybe but at least the cap is slightly increasing and Beal is not on this team.

Maybe think about that before trading away all our picks to assemble to most expensive team in NBA history?

Not have control over our picks AND having less capspace than any other team in the league, is essentially the worst possible situation a team can be in.

If the Suns wanted to be under the second apron, they could have not picked up Richards and done the Detroit deal Miami made (Duncan will make about the same as Allen while being a worse player).

That deal would have put us in the 2nd apron, and we could have let Beal expire in two years, and we'd have a bunch of space when the free agency market looks flooded with talent. The 2027 free offseason is basically our way out of the current mess, but instead our front office seems to think we'll be fine assembling a roster with 25 mil of dead money on our books for half a decade.

To NOW bring up the 230 mil in tax after Isbiah actively traded to put us in this situation seems ridiculous. "here's all our picks, please give me your big name players, I'll pay whatever is needed... Oh wait, I'm paying how much?? Nevermind, let's just kill our capspace while letting the rest of the league pick up the players we traded our future for at Temu prices.

You are assuming 2027 will have players hitting the market which likely won't be the case.

Many here don't trust Ishbia yet they want to talk about cap space.

You can give him hate for the KD/Beal trade but let's not pretend he hasn't done an amazing job reloading around Booker.

[lilfishi22]

That means we're stretching him

Which is the worst outcome imo

If this goes through it's Ishbia being short sighted once again and making disastrous moves with lasting consequences. Sure we will save some money this season and the next but that money is going to be on the books for a long time.

He’s out of money. I’m 100% convinced. He came in and talked a big game and went broke. He’s only looking at the short term because he has no money to look at the long term.

Calling my shot. Ishbia will own the suns shorter time than Mikhail Dmitrievich Prokhorov owned the Nets. Ishbia going down the same path.

Not gonna lie but I too think he's less liquid than the amount of spending he's been doing suggests.

[zimpy27]

Yep called the stretch and waived of Beal back in February. This is a move to duck the tax and reset the repeater, not to just get under 2nd apron.

I know it's not popular here but it's smart. Suns can duck the tax this year and reset the repeater.

Think about the tax savings from this being used to pay tax in future seasons when you actually have a contender.

Next offseason will be a strong one for the Suns. Suns will have the MLE and BAE next offseason.

[TeamTragic]

Yep called the stretch and waived of Beal back in February. This is a move to duck the tax and reset the repeater, not to just get under 2nd apron.

I know it's not popular here but it's smart. Suns can duck the tax this year and reset the repeater.

Think about the tax savings from this being used to pay tax in future seasons when you actually have a contender.

Next offseason will be a strong one for the Suns. Suns will have the MLE and BAE next offseason.

Yup. Picks are no longer locked.

[RaisingArizona]

Yep called the stretch and waived of Beal back in February. This is a move to duck the tax and reset the repeater, not to just get under 2nd apron.

I know it's not popular here but it's smart. Suns can duck the tax this year and reset the repeater.

Think about the tax savings from this being used to pay tax in future seasons when you actually have a contender.

Next offseason will be a strong one for the Suns. Suns will have the MLE and BAE next offseason.

Good take! Agreed although it is starting to feel like if you don't agree with the majority here you are an outcast.

[lilfishi22]

If this goes through it's Ishbia being short sighted once again and making disastrous moves with lasting consequences. Sure we will save some money this season and the next but that money is going to be on the books for a long time.

He’s out of money. I’m 100% convinced. He came in and talked a big game and went broke. He’s only looking at the short term because he has no money to look at the long term.

https://beinsure.com/world-richest-people/

Possible and though he is rich he's not even in the top 50 richest people list so he certainly can't afford to keep spending close to half a billion on the roster every year.

Having a high net worth doesn't necessarily mean you have a lot of liquid cash to throw at other ventures like running an NBA team. There's a lot of rich billionaire owners who consistently try to not just duck under the aprons but duck under the luxury tax. Maybe they are just tight with money but it could also be because they have a lot of their net worth tied to their ownership of a company but to have liquid cash, they either need to get/extend their line of credit or sell some of their shares in the company.

I never actually thought Ishbia was that rich so for him to be willing to spend the money he's spent was always a bit of a pleasant surprise to me. It seems like after 2.5 years at the helm, he's already found his ceiling.

[Phnxsports]

Curious what the board thinks. Sign and trade Allen and O'Neil for Kuminga? Shorter PF but 7'0 reach and continues youth movement. GS may not get much better offers. Just rosterbating.

[TeamTragic]

Curious what the board thinks. Sign and trade Allen and O'Neil for Kuminga? Shorter PF but 7'0 reach and continues youth movement. GS may not get much better offers. Just rosterbating.

We did have interest. Warriors probably just bring him back.

[lilfishi22]

If this goes through it's Ishbia being short sighted once again and making disastrous moves with lasting consequences. Sure we will save some money this season and the next but that money is going to be on the books for a long time.

Why would anyone including Ishbia pay 230M in tax to keep Beal on this team?

Ask any owner in this league and they would have made the same decision.

Second this puts the team outside BOTH tax aprons which allows for more flexibility.

Does that extended cap hit hurt the franchise? Maybe but at least the cap is slightly increasing and Beal is not on this team.

Maybe think about that before trading away all our picks to assemble to most expensive team in NBA history?

Not having control over our picks AND having less capspace than any other team in the league is essentially the worst possible situation a team can be in.

If the Suns wanted to be under the second apron, they could have not picked up Richards and done the Detroit deal Miami made (Duncan will make about the same as Allen while being a worse player).

That deal would have put us in the 2nd apron, and we could have let Beal expire in two years, and we'd have a bunch of space when the free agency market looks flooded with talent. The 2027 free offseason is basically our way out of the current mess, but instead our front office seems to think we'll be fine assembling a roster with 25 mil of dead money on our books for half a decade.

To NOW bring up the 230 mil in tax after Isbiah actively traded to put us in this situation seems ridiculous. "here's all our picks, please give me your big name players, I'll pay whatever is needed... Oh wait, I'm paying how much?? Nevermind, let's just kill our capspace while letting the rest of the league pick up the players we traded our future for at Temu prices.

Another avenue for rebuild that is now severely impacted is the ability to take on other team's unwanted salary for potentially premium draft capital.

Between 10-15% of our available cap space is now locked away in dead salary, completely unusable until 2031. You know it's bad management when you reach the ceiling for dead salary and not just for 1 or 2 years but for 5.

[bigfoot]

He’s out of money. I’m 100% convinced. He came in and talked a big game and went broke. He’s only looking at the short term because he has no money to look at the long term.

https://beinsure.com/world-richest-people/

Possible and though he is rich he's not even in the top 50 richest people list so he certainly can't afford to keep spending close to half a billion on the roster every year.

Having a high net worth doesn't necessarily mean you have a lot of liquid cash to throw at other ventures like running an NBA team. There's a lot of rich billionaire owners who consistently try to not just duck under the aprons but duck under the luxury tax. Maybe they are just tight with money but it could also be because they have a lot of their net worth tied to their ownership of a company but to have liquid cash, they either need to get/extend their line of credit or sell some of their shares in the company.

I never actually thought Ishbia was that rich so for him to be willing to spend the money he's spent was always a bit of a pleasant surprise to me. It seems like after 2.5 years at the helm, he's already found his ceiling.

Cash liquidity for the uber rich is not correct optics. These guys take out low interest loans against their net worth (stocks they hold). They use these loans to live on, buy property, and other businesses. The interest for the loan is just another write off meaning they show little to no income and pay little to no taxes. If he lacks the cash needed, he (or the business) just obtains another loan. Now of course its stupid to pay $230m plus in luxury tax when you can waive Beal and save a ton of money. You only do that if you are competing for a championship because that increases the net worth of the Suns and makes more money available in loans. Its a crazy game that wealthy people get to play this game while us W-2 earners run around like ants for them.

[KdoubleDees23]

Just wait till you know who reads your post and replies with “go find another team”. Remember, suns realgm forum is now a dictatorship where you are only allowed to support this front office regime with praise, if you criticize it, you should be deported from this forum.

But hey, it’s what you voted for.



Whoops, wrong forum

Yep ! Also I’m a proud American! Strongest the US has been in quite sometime ! We already know Franks rocking orange hair and protesting daily !

[Fo-Real]

Curious what the board thinks. Sign and trade Allen and O'Neil for Kuminga? Shorter PF but 7'0 reach and continues youth movement. GS may not get much better offers. Just rosterbating.

I would but its because I don't like either of them, not because I'm rationally thinking of basketball.

[Fo-Real]

Just wait till you know who reads your post and replies with “go find another team”. Remember, suns realgm forum is now a dictatorship where you are only allowed to support this front office regime with praise, if you criticize it, you should be deported from this forum.

But hey, it’s what you voted for.



Whoops, wrong forum

Yep ! Also I’m a proud American! Strongest the US has been in quite sometime ! We already know Franks rocking orange hair and protesting daily !

.SHEESH!!

[Saberestar]

Gambo:

If the Suns activate the waive and stretch on Beal it is not such a bad thing / only if they were unwilling to go over the cap in future years would it be a detriment BUT they are! so getting under the punishing aprons, aggregating salaries, unlocking a frozen pick, being able to trade a future pick next year all positives.

Cap keeps going up so I wouldn’t focus on what will be what like 7-8% of the cap in a few years. Not an issue - better to get off a player who just did not work here.

[Saberestar]

Brett Siegel:

The Suns and Bradley Beal have been discussing and negotiating the terms of a buyout throughout Sunday and into the evening, league sources told @ClutchPoints.

An official announcement should come on Monday.

He is expected to give back around $14 million upon agreement.

Beal held a full no-trade clause in his contract, and the Suns couldn’t generate a market for him.

Upon the completion of the buyout, Beal will be an unrestricted free agent.

Miami is Beal’s top suitor.

The Lakers, Clippers, Warriors, and Bucks will all hold interest.

[lilfishi22]

Gambo:

If the Suns activate the waive and stretch on Beal it is not such a bad thing / only if they were unwilling to go over the cap in future years would it be a detriment BUT they are! so getting under the punishing aprons, aggregating salaries, unlocking a frozen pick, being able to trade a future pick next year all positives.

Cap keeps going up so I wouldn’t focus on what will be what like 7-8% of the cap in a few years. Not an issue - better to get off a player who just did not work here.

It'll be over 11% if you take Dame's buyout as indication. This year Dame's buy out will be 14.6% of the cap, then 13.6%, 12.4%, 11.8% and 11.2%.

[Saberestar]

Gambo:

If the Suns activate the waive and stretch on Beal it is not such a bad thing / only if they were unwilling to go over the cap in future years would it be a detriment BUT they are! so getting under the punishing aprons, aggregating salaries, unlocking a frozen pick, being able to trade a future pick next year all positives.

Cap keeps going up so I wouldn’t focus on what will be what like 7-8% of the cap in a few years. Not an issue - better to get off a player who just did not work here.

It'll be over 11% if you take Dame's buyout as indication. This year Dame's buy out will be 14.6% of the cap, then 13.6%, 12.4%, 11.8% and 11.2%.

Lillard's buyout is more expensive because he didn't agree to any reduction of his salary.

$112.5M for Lillard.
Probably $96/97M for Beal.

[sunsbg]

15% of our cap is dead money
35% of our cap is Booker

50% of our salary is used up on a non All-Star and a ghost for the next 5 years. I sure hope the housing market comes back around because the only way towards success for the next 5 years is to overpay free agents and go over the salary cap.

I've accepted Suns will be middle of the pack team at best for next 5 seasons. Just don't trade any picks past '31 is my hope for this team to have brighter future after Booker and Beal era. And yes the later will not be physically on the team, but his ghost will be here for quite some time now.