Shams: Kings Trade Jonas Valunciunas to the Nuggets for Dario Saric; *UPDATE* - Trade is Now Official

[UcanUwill]

What if Sacramento knew Valanciunas wanted to go back to Eurpoe and offered the trade to Denver? That would be more bush league than Panathinaikos and JV making this deal happen. If they were caught off guard by, then so be it and disregard this. Just felt the need to say it, because who knows these days what people may or may not know.

I like to see that people like my guy Jonas, but I do not know why people want to shift blame from him so bad. It is on him, it is not on Panathinaikos or Sactown, it is on Jonas. Why would Sacramento even do this deal iof they new Jonas is leaving, like they actually want Dario Saric? Come on, they traded Jonas to shave money.
You usually do not see other teams approach under contract guys like that, because guys don't go - you know, f it, I will just leave my under contract team and go with you guys. - that does not happen, and it is all on Jonas here.

Clearly Denver wants to see him on their team and I personally hope he decides to man up and be a Denver Nugget.

Because Sacramento wouldn't want to hold onto Jonas if the deal fell through. They are doing it to save money. If they need that saved money for the other trades they have lined up, this renounced trade for Dario Saric would alter their team building plans.

Valanciunas might have to sacrifice this one year, then, if Denver waives him next summer when his contract is non-guaranteed, he can go play in Greece.

My understanding is that Jonas has deal done with Athens and he just wants his NBA contract terminated. If Kings wanted to shave money, they needed to keep Jonas and they would have mutually agreed to buy out where Kings pay basically nothing.

Anyway, even if Kings knew Jonas would try this, I am perfectly fine with them trying to unload him, its not a bush league move, negotiating a contract with another team when you still under contract for two years is a bush league move.

[magee]

I agree with you on that.

[Nuntius]

You signed the deal. You honor the deal.

At the very least, you talk to the team you're under contract with about what you're doing before doing it.

This was a garbage move from Val and the Greek team. Showed the Nuggets zero respect.

Totally unprofessional.

I don't like it at all. No matter if it was Val or an NBA team doing it.

Please, tell us examples from the past which show that the NBA teams actually respect the European teams and never approach players within contract I'll be waiting.

European players have an NBA out clause set at X dollars depending on how many years are left.

Nope. Not all of them. It depends on the contract they have signed. Some of them have an NBA out clause while others don't have such a clause.

[AleksandarN]

That alone is enough.
Read what you wrote again and give it a good thought.
He has no rights? Who are you to say something like this?
The contract wasn't signed with Denver either you like it, either you don't.
European basketball doesn't work like the NBA (thank god). Players actually have rights.
You don't have a clue what a player can do if he's unhappy. If Denver wants to keep a player against his will, good luck with the season. You are going to need it.

He has no rights to playing professional basketball other than the league in which he signed a contract(the NBA). No one forced him to sign that contract. No one. He alone forfeited his rights to play for any other team than the ones who hold his rights when he signed that contract.

In the NBA.
Panathinaikos is not in the NBA.
He will retire from the NBA giving up all the money in the contract and he will sign in Greece.
It's pretty simple actually.

Actually no it isn’t as he cannot legally sign to play anywhere professionally he is still under contract. All basketball governing bodies follow those.

I will repeat this again

Every NBA player signs a standard UPC, which has an “Exclusivity Clause.” This clause says the player must not play basketball for any other team or league during the NBA contract term, without the team’s express written consent.
FIBA governs International Transfer Certificates (ITCs) for players moving between national federations. To legally play for a EuroLeague team, the player needs a ITC from USA Basketball (the NBA’s national federation) to the new country’s federation. If the player’s NBA team or federation objects, they won’t issue the ITC. Playing without an ITC is an automatic violation of FIBA rules. Playing without an ITC is an automatic violation of FIBA rules. Under the FIBA rules they would forfeit every game they play with that ineligible player.

[Nuntius]

I mean he did sign a contract that says he has to play wherever his team sends him.
But it doesn't say that he has to play well, or play through pain (and every basketball player always has some kind of pain, somewhere).
Which is what NBA players most commonly do: they find a doctor who makes it look bad, and they stay home with their playstation.
In which case he eats into your cash, your cap space and your rotation space for no benefit whatsoever.
What are you gonna do?

Which is why players ultimately hold all the cards and when they really want to leave, their teams ultimately let them go.
The only thing the Nuggets can do is hold onto him for a while in case someone gives them something in return, which is obviously not gonna happen if the player says he doesn't want to play in the NBA anymore. Which is why the Nuggets will eventually let him do his thing.

Now, I agree with the gentleman before who said this is a pretty juvenile way to behave, he should've at least given the Nuggets a warning early enough to find someone else. Not that he would tell them himself, he would ask his agent to tell them.
So my question is, maybe he did? Valanciunas doesn't really strike me as the kind of dude to just up and go without talking to anyone.

Is it possible the Nuggets were told from the start and they pretend they didn't listen for some reason?
I don't actually know anything, just ticking all the boxes, checking all possibilities.

Mental gymnastics at a 10 here. You're ignoring the more simpler answer. He just doesn't want to play in Denver. Not that hard to figure out.

He doesn't want to play in the US anymore, period. It has nothing to do with Denver in particular.

[Nuntius]

I mean he did sign a contract that says he has to play wherever his team sends him.
But it doesn't say that he has to play well, or play through pain (and every basketball player always has some kind of pain, somewhere).
Which is what NBA players most commonly do: they find a doctor who makes it look bad, and they stay home with their playstation.
In which case he eats into your cash, your cap space and your rotation space for no benefit whatsoever.
What are you gonna do?

Which is why players ultimately hold all the cards and when they really want to leave, their teams ultimately let them go.
The only thing the Nuggets can do is hold onto him for a while in case someone gives them something in return, which is obviously not gonna happen if the player says he doesn't want to play in the NBA anymore. Which is why the Nuggets will eventually let him do his thing.

Now, I agree with the gentleman before who said this is a pretty juvenile way to behave, he should've at least given the Nuggets a warning early enough to find someone else. Not that he would tell them himself, he would ask his agent to tell them.
So my question is, maybe he did? Valanciunas doesn't really strike me as the kind of dude to just up and go without talking to anyone.

Is it possible the Nuggets were told from the start and they pretend they didn't listen for some reason?
I don't actually know anything, just ticking all the boxes, checking all possibilities.

He could have aproched his team - Sacramento after the season and asked them for release from contract. To go to Europe, close to home...He didn't do that. Why?

Because he didn't know it was an option. Panathinaikos had not offered him a contract yet

[AleksandarN]

I mean he did sign a contract that says he has to play wherever his team sends him.
But it doesn't say that he has to play well, or play through pain (and every basketball player always has some kind of pain, somewhere).
Which is what NBA players most commonly do: they find a doctor who makes it look bad, and they stay home with their playstation.
In which case he eats into your cash, your cap space and your rotation space for no benefit whatsoever.
What are you gonna do?

Which is why players ultimately hold all the cards and when they really want to leave, their teams ultimately let them go.
The only thing the Nuggets can do is hold onto him for a while in case someone gives them something in return, which is obviously not gonna happen if the player says he doesn't want to play in the NBA anymore. Which is why the Nuggets will eventually let him do his thing.

Now, I agree with the gentleman before who said this is a pretty juvenile way to behave, he should've at least given the Nuggets a warning early enough to find someone else. Not that he would tell them himself, he would ask his agent to tell them.
So my question is, maybe he did? Valanciunas doesn't really strike me as the kind of dude to just up and go without talking to anyone.

Is it possible the Nuggets were told from the start and they pretend they didn't listen for some reason?
I don't actually know anything, just ticking all the boxes, checking all possibilities.

Mental gymnastics at a 10 here. You're ignoring the more simpler answer. He just doesn't want to play in Denver. Not that hard to figure out.

He doesn't want to play in the US anymore, period. It has nothing to do with Denver in particular.

It doesn’t fit his narrative so he will ignore your post. The guy tried so hard to troll. It is said.

[AleksandarN]

Please, tell us examples from the past which show that the NBA teams actually respect the European teams and never approach players within contract I'll be waiting.

European players have an NBA out clause set at X dollars depending on how many years are left.

Nope. Not all of them. It depends on the contract they have signed. Some of them have an NBA out clause while others don't have such a clause.

You know who doesn’t have an out clause (in the NBA it is called a player option) Val. So maybe Val should have asked for one when he signed that contract

[Nuntius]

European players have an NBA out clause set at X dollars depending on how many years are left.

Nope. Not all of them. It depends on the contract they have signed. Some of them have an NBA out clause while others don't have such a clause.

You know who does have an out clause (in the NBA it is called a player option) Val. So maybe Val should have asked for one when he signed that contract

Technically true but I don't really recall any bench player getting a player option.

[sisibilio]

He has no rights to playing professional basketball other than the league in which he signed a contract(the NBA). No one forced him to sign that contract. No one. He alone forfeited his rights to play for any other team than the ones who hold his rights when he signed that contract.

In the NBA.
Panathinaikos is not in the NBA.
He will retire from the NBA giving up all the money in the contract and he will sign in Greece.
It's pretty simple actually.

Actually no it isn’t as he cannot legally sign to play anywhere professionally he is still under contract. All basketball governing bodies follow those.

I will repeat this again

Every NBA player signs a standard UPC, which has an “Exclusivity Clause.” This clause says the player must not play basketball for any other team or league during the NBA contract term, without the team’s express written consent.
FIBA governs International Transfer Certificates (ITCs) for players moving between national federations. To legally play for a EuroLeague team, the player needs a ITC from USA Basketball (the NBA’s national federation) to the new country’s federation. If the player’s NBA team or federation objects, they won’t issue the ITC. Playing without an ITC is an automatic violation of FIBA rules. Playing without an ITC is an automatic violation of FIBA rules. Under the FIBA rules they would forfeit every game they play with that ineligible player.

I guess FIBA or USA Basketball have no authority per se to obligue the NBA to do anything but they have a gentleman's agreement to honor contracts dating back to the Petrovic affair.

[AleksandarN]

Nope. Not all of them. It depends on the contract they have signed. Some of them have an NBA out clause while others don't have such a clause.

You know who does have an out clause (in the NBA it is called a player option) Val. So maybe Val should have asked for one when he signed that contract

Technically true but I don't really recall any bench player getting a player option.

You haven’t seen Booth work in Denver all of his signings had players option. Zeke, Bruce Brown when he was here the first time, Reggie Jackson and freaking Saric. So yes player options are signed by role players. Even ones who suck

[Nuntius]

You know who does have an out clause (in the NBA it is called a player option) Val. So maybe Val should have asked for one when he signed that contract

Technically true but I don't really recall any bench player getting a player option.

You haven’t seen Booth work in Denver all of his signings had players option. Zeke, Bruce Brown when he was here the first time, Reggie Jackson and freaking Saric. So yes player options are signed by role players. Even ones who suck

I guess that there's a reason why he was fired.

[Optms]

I mean he did sign a contract that says he has to play wherever his team sends him.
But it doesn't say that he has to play well, or play through pain (and every basketball player always has some kind of pain, somewhere).
Which is what NBA players most commonly do: they find a doctor who makes it look bad, and they stay home with their playstation.
In which case he eats into your cash, your cap space and your rotation space for no benefit whatsoever.
What are you gonna do?

Which is why players ultimately hold all the cards and when they really want to leave, their teams ultimately let them go.
The only thing the Nuggets can do is hold onto him for a while in case someone gives them something in return, which is obviously not gonna happen if the player says he doesn't want to play in the NBA anymore. Which is why the Nuggets will eventually let him do his thing.

Now, I agree with the gentleman before who said this is a pretty juvenile way to behave, he should've at least given the Nuggets a warning early enough to find someone else. Not that he would tell them himself, he would ask his agent to tell them.
So my question is, maybe he did? Valanciunas doesn't really strike me as the kind of dude to just up and go without talking to anyone.

Is it possible the Nuggets were told from the start and they pretend they didn't listen for some reason?
I don't actually know anything, just ticking all the boxes, checking all possibilities.

Mental gymnastics at a 10 here. You're ignoring the more simpler answer. He just doesn't want to play in Denver. Not that hard to figure out.

He doesn't want to play in the US anymore, period. It has nothing to do with Denver in particular.

So he suddenly decides this immediately after the trade? What a coincidence, huh.

[Cubbies2120]

Mental gymnastics at a 10 here. You're ignoring the more simpler answer. He just doesn't want to play in Denver. Not that hard to figure out.

He doesn't want to play in the US anymore, period. It has nothing to do with Denver in particular.

So he suddenly decides this immediately after the trade? What a coincidence, huh.

Yeah, he doesn't like Doncic and it's clear Doncic is coming to Denver soon...

[BelgradeNugget]

I mean he did sign a contract that says he has to play wherever his team sends him.
But it doesn't say that he has to play well, or play through pain (and every basketball player always has some kind of pain, somewhere).
Which is what NBA players most commonly do: they find a doctor who makes it look bad, and they stay home with their playstation.
In which case he eats into your cash, your cap space and your rotation space for no benefit whatsoever.
What are you gonna do?

Which is why players ultimately hold all the cards and when they really want to leave, their teams ultimately let them go.
The only thing the Nuggets can do is hold onto him for a while in case someone gives them something in return, which is obviously not gonna happen if the player says he doesn't want to play in the NBA anymore. Which is why the Nuggets will eventually let him do his thing.

Now, I agree with the gentleman before who said this is a pretty juvenile way to behave, he should've at least given the Nuggets a warning early enough to find someone else. Not that he would tell them himself, he would ask his agent to tell them.
So my question is, maybe he did? Valanciunas doesn't really strike me as the kind of dude to just up and go without talking to anyone.

Is it possible the Nuggets were told from the start and they pretend they didn't listen for some reason?
I don't actually know anything, just ticking all the boxes, checking all possibilities.

He could have aproched his team - Sacramento after the season and asked them for release from contract. To go to Europe, close to home...He didn't do that. Why?

Because he didn't know it was an option. Panathinaikos had not offered him a contract yet

He could have terminated his nba contract and seek new one in Europe.
So he didn't do it because he wanted to be in Europe, closer to family out of US, but because he got more guaranteed money from Panathinaikos.
I see

[mkot]

He doesn't want to play in the US anymore, period. It has nothing to do with Denver in particular.

So he suddenly decides this immediately after the trade? What a coincidence, huh.

Yeah, he doesn't like Doncic and it's clear Doncic is coming to Denver soon...

It would be soooo hilarious if those people have to come to Jokic's side

[AleksandarN]

He could have aproched his team - Sacramento after the season and asked them for release from contract. To go to Europe, close to home...He didn't do that. Why?

Because he didn't know it was an option. Panathinaikos had not offered him a contract yet

He could have terminated his nba contract and seek new one in Europe.
So he didn't do it because he wanted to be in Europe, closer to family out of US, but because he got more guaranteed money from Panathinaikos.
I see

He can’t just terminate his contract unless there are provisions in it such as a player option.

[Mirotic12]

Please, tell us examples from the past which show that the NBA teams actually respect the European teams and never approach players within contract I'll be waiting.

European players have an NBA out clause set at X dollars depending on how many years are left.

Nope. Not all of them. It depends on the contract they have signed. Some of them have an NBA out clause while others don't have such a clause.

I doubt if even 1 out of 10 contracts in Europe have an NBA out clause. The vast majority of players in Europe that go to the NBA are able to talk and negotiate with NBA teams anytime they want and there is nothing a European team can do about it and they get no compensation for it.

Also, the NBA doesn’t need permission from players in Europe to draft them. They can just draft them without the players even entering the draft. It's actually happened before with players from Europe saying they were drafted and did not want to be.

And then the NBA team that drafts them holds their rights and if they want to move to the NBA at some point as a free agent, they can't unless the team that drafted them wants them.

Some players from Europe never played in the NBA after being drafted because the team that drafted them never signed them. But also never traded or released their rights.

And now we have the examples of the NCAA taking young youth players from the European club's youth teams, with no compensation.

[AleksandarN]

European players have an NBA out clause set at X dollars depending on how many years are left.

Nope. Not all of them. It depends on the contract they have signed. Some of them have an NBA out clause while others don't have such a clause.

I doubt if even 1 out of 10 contracts in Europe have an NBA out clause. The vast majority of players in Europe that go to the NBA are able to talk and negotiate with NBA teams anytime they want and there is nothing a European team can do about it and they get no compensation for it.

Also, the NBA doesn’t need permission from players in Europe to draft them. They can just draft them without the players even entering the draft. It's actually happened before with players from Europe saying they were drafted and did not want to be.

And then the NBA team that drafts them holds their rights and if they want to move to the NBA at some point as a free agent, they can't unless the team that drafted them wants them.

Some players from Europe never played in the NBA after being drafted because the team that drafted them never signed them. But also never traded or released their rights.

And now we have the examples of the NCAA taking young youth players from the European club's youth teams, with no compensation.

Players, doesn’t matter where they come from, can withdraw from the draft. NBA can negotiate with players in Europe yea but they can’t sign them unless either they are a free agent, have an out clause or released from their contract by the team.

[KGtabake]

Nope. Not all of them. It depends on the contract they have signed. Some of them have an NBA out clause while others don't have such a clause.

I doubt if even 1 out of 10 contracts in Europe have an NBA out clause. The vast majority of players in Europe that go to the NBA are able to talk and negotiate with NBA teams anytime they want and there is nothing a European team can do about it and they get no compensation for it.

Also, the NBA doesn’t need permission from players in Europe to draft them. They can just draft them without the players even entering the draft. It's actually happened before with players from Europe saying they were drafted and did not want to be.

And then the NBA team that drafts them holds their rights and if they want to move to the NBA at some point as a free agent, they can't unless the team that drafted them wants them.

Some players from Europe never played in the NBA after being drafted because the team that drafted them never signed them. But also never traded or released their rights.

And now we have the examples of the NCAA taking young youth players from the European club's youth teams, with no compensation.

Players, doesn’t matter where they come from, can withdraw from the draft. NBA can negotiate with players in Europe yea but they can’t sign them unless either they are a free agent, have an out clause or released from their contract by the team.

They can definitely tamper them though and there's no penalty for that.