Stewie and Phee are owners of a rival womens basketball league that sources the same talent. They are also part of negotiating the CBA. Really don't get how that happens. Phee just responded to a fan about it on Twitter:
Phee is one of my favorite players but this is a horrible response. Also, her being part of the negotiations imo is dishonest. I'm not sure if this league is ready for the influx in money because this should never have been allowed to happen. And she shouldn't have responded on twitter unless it was looked at by her attorneys and the leadership team.
Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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sikma42
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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Green Chile
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
I agree that Phee probably shouldn't have responded, and I understand it's an odd situation.
But I don't really think there's a problem with Phee and Stewie being in their role.
I think it comes down to this....they serve at the will of the rest of the players. If the rest of the players don't trust Phee and Stewie to negotiate properly on their behalf, they are more than welcome to replace them. If they don't care, neither do I.
It's an odd situation, and "how it happened" is that nothing like this has really ever happened in other sports (to my knowledge). Players in other leagues may have considered starting their own alternative league, but nobody's ever done it. Which makes sense. W players don't make much, relatively, so the W has had no choice but to let them go make money elsewhere, as they've always done overseas.
That Phee and Stewie created something so monumental that so clearly helps the players in the negotiations also helps make the players trust them too, I"m sure. That's sort of what you want the reps to do.
Again, if the players thought it was a problem, I'd think it was a problem. And the real WNBPA President (Nneka) doesn't seem to have a problem with it. I'm glad other Twitter users alerted Evelyn DR that Nneka is the President, not Stewie.
But I don't really think there's a problem with Phee and Stewie being in their role.
I think it comes down to this....they serve at the will of the rest of the players. If the rest of the players don't trust Phee and Stewie to negotiate properly on their behalf, they are more than welcome to replace them. If they don't care, neither do I.
It's an odd situation, and "how it happened" is that nothing like this has really ever happened in other sports (to my knowledge). Players in other leagues may have considered starting their own alternative league, but nobody's ever done it. Which makes sense. W players don't make much, relatively, so the W has had no choice but to let them go make money elsewhere, as they've always done overseas.
That Phee and Stewie created something so monumental that so clearly helps the players in the negotiations also helps make the players trust them too, I"m sure. That's sort of what you want the reps to do.
Again, if the players thought it was a problem, I'd think it was a problem. And the real WNBPA President (Nneka) doesn't seem to have a problem with it. I'm glad other Twitter users alerted Evelyn DR that Nneka is the President, not Stewie.
Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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sikma42
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Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
Green Chile wrote:I agree that Phee probably shouldn't have responded, and I understand it's an odd situation.
But I don't really think there's a problem with Phee and Stewie being in their role.
I think it comes down to this....they serve at the will of the rest of the players. If the rest of the players don't trust Phee and Stewie to negotiate properly on their behalf, they are more than welcome to replace them. If they don't care, neither do it.
It's an odd situation, and "how it happened" is that nothing like this has really ever happened in other sports (to my knowledge). Players in other leagues may have considered starting their own alternative league, but nobody's ever done it. Which makes sense. W players don't make much, relatively, so the W has had no choice but to let them go make money elsewhere, as they've always done overseas.
Again, if the players thought it was a problem, I'd think it was a problem. And the real WNBPA President (Nneka) doesn't seem to have a problem with it. I'm glad other Twitter users alerted Evelyn DR that Nneka is the President, not Stewie.
I’m not sure sure the Players Association put it before the players. Just because they haven’t called for them to step away doesn’t mean they’ve agreed to this course of action.
At many organizations they’d have a set process to go through. It would be disclosed to the players and they’d be some mechanism where they deem it immaterial. Even it were deemed immaterial, the conflict would still exist.
Her response makes me think none of this happened. She tried to shame this fan and that level of thoughtlessness makes me thinks she doesn’t have a great understanding of the situation and that these processes may not have happened. Also makes me think (I’m obviously not in the wnba so doesn’t matter) that maybe she shouldn’t be part of negotiations.
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Green Chile
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
sikma42 wrote:Green Chile wrote:I agree that Phee probably shouldn't have responded, and I understand it's an odd situation.
But I don't really think there's a problem with Phee and Stewie being in their role.
I think it comes down to this....they serve at the will of the rest of the players. If the rest of the players don't trust Phee and Stewie to negotiate properly on their behalf, they are more than welcome to replace them. If they don't care, neither do it.
It's an odd situation, and "how it happened" is that nothing like this has really ever happened in other sports (to my knowledge). Players in other leagues may have considered starting their own alternative league, but nobody's ever done it. Which makes sense. W players don't make much, relatively, so the W has had no choice but to let them go make money elsewhere, as they've always done overseas.
Again, if the players thought it was a problem, I'd think it was a problem. And the real WNBPA President (Nneka) doesn't seem to have a problem with it. I'm glad other Twitter users alerted Evelyn DR that Nneka is the President, not Stewie.
I’m not sure sure the Players Association put it before the players. Just because they haven’t called for them to step down doesn’t mean they’ve agreed to this course of action.
At many organizations they’d have a set process to go through. It would be disclosed to the players and they’d be some mechanism where they deem it immaterial. Even it were deemed immaterial, the conflict would still exist.
Her response makes me think none of this happened. She tried to shame this fan and that level of thoughtlessness makes me thinks she doesn’t have a great understanding of the situation and that these processes may not have happened. Also makes me think (I’m obviously not in the wnba so doesn’t matter) that maybe she shouldn’t be part of negotiations.
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Agreed on a lot of that. I could see the other players not having a great process to express their concerns. Especially fringe players.
In any organization, it's hard for those with little power to express concerns without fear of retribution.
And like you said, I (we) don't know what means they have to do this.
But I still lean towards "it's fine" unless we hear something otherwise (understanding I could be wrong for the above reasons).
A couple things that help me think that.
-Nneka is the President, AC is one of the VP's. They have no stake in Unrivaled. This is a close-knit league. I trust people could get word to Nneka with no fear of retribution.
-I don't think a lockout ultimately helps Unrivaled. Maybe in January 2026, but long-term, I don't see anyway a WNBA lockout helps Unrivaled (in it's current form).
-Honestly, as much as I think of Phee and Stewie, I think any player or a few could express concerns, and they'd step down. Again, I'm making a lot of assumptions at that, so could certainly be wrong.
-Nearly 1/3rd of the WNBA participated in Unrivaled and has some sort of stake.
-Unrivaled seems so clearly like something they did to help fellow players (both to make some money and help with negotiations) much more so than to make money for themselves.
Frankly, as much as I enjoyed Unrivaled, I think it might be gone if this CBA goes in the players' favor. All the players would prefer to make a good living between May and October. If that becomes possible, for the first time, Unrivaled becomes unnecessary (at least for the top players).
If that's true, maybe that's a conflict too. But, to me, the overall upside of Unrivaled is so limited financially, if there's no WNBA, that it just makes it seem like there's no reason for Phee and Stewie to push too hard for a lockout.
But generally, I just trust the relationship Phee and Stewie have with the rest of the players.
Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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Doctor MJ
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
sikma42 wrote:Stewie and Phee are owners of a rival womens basketball league that sources the same talent. They are also part of negotiating the CBA. Really don't get how that happens. Phee just responded to a fan about it on Twitter:
Phee is one of my favorite players but this is a horrible response. Also, her being part of the negotiations imo is dishonest. I'm not sure if this league is ready for the influx in money because this should never have been allowed to happen. And she shouldn't have responded on twitter unless it was looked at by her attorneys and the leadership team.
Not a great response, but I’d be more concerned if she was the head of the player union.
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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sikma42
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
Doctor MJ wrote:sikma[emoji[emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]]]][emoji[emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]]]][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]]]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]]]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]]]] wrote:Stewie and Phee are owners of a rival womens basketball league that sources the same talent. They are also part of negotiating the CBA. Really don't get how that happens. Phee just responded to a fan about it on Twitter:
[tweet][emoji[emoji[emoji6
]
][emoji[emoji6
]]][emoji[emoji
Phee is one of my favorite players but this is a horrible response. Also, her being part of the negotiations imo is dishonest. I'm not sure if this league is ready for the influx in money because this should never have been allowed to happen. And she shouldn't have responded on twitter unless it was looked at by her attorneys and the leadership team.
Not a great response, but I’d be more concerned if she was the head of the player union.
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Never had any concerns about them being unethical before. Based on what we know now, the decision not to step down previously makes me think they could be shady.
Also these types of conflicts can open you up to litigation. In most situations, you’d isolate people like that so they’d have no influence on decision making even give up their ability to vote on the proposal.
I don’t think it’s a good look and think they will either step down or put forward a much more detailed clarification.
Just don’t get why someone with this type of conflict would want to be part of the discussions. It’s not normal. And I don’t see how it’s in the best interest of the players association.
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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Doctor MJ
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
sikma42 wrote:Doctor MJ wrote:sikma[emoji[emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]]]][emoji[emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]]]][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]]]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]]]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji6[emoji640][emoji637]]][emoji[emoji638][emoji639][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]][emoji[emoji6[emoji640][emoji638]][emoji640][emoji640]]]] wrote:Stewie and Phee are owners of a rival womens basketball league that sources the same talent. They are also part of negotiating the CBA. Really don't get how that happens. Phee just responded to a fan about it on Twitter:
[tweet][emoji
Phee is one of my favorite players but this is a horrible response. Also, her being part of the negotiations imo is dishonest. I'm not sure if this league is ready for the influx in money because this should never have been allowed to happen. And she shouldn't have responded on twitter unless it was looked at by her attorneys and the leadership team.
Not a great response, but I’d be more concerned if she was the head of the player union.
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Never had any concerns about them being unethical before. Based on what we know now, the decision not to step down previously makes me think they could be shady.
Also these types of conflicts can open you up to litigation. In most situations, you’d isolate people like that so they’d have no influence on decision making even give up their ability to vote on the proposal.
I don’t think it’s a good look and think they will either step down or put forward a much more detailed clarification.
Just don’t get why someone with this type of conflict would want to be part of the discussions. It’s not normal. And I don’t see how it’s in the best interest of the players association.
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So I’ll say, it probably is a good idea for Phee and Stewie to step down from official WNBA PA positions.
But it’s tough because Phee is in the position she’s in because she’s just a lot more business savvy than the vast majority of pro ballers. (Honestly, Stewie felt like a name more than a spearhead with Unrivaled.)
If the average WNBA player - who won’t have a place in Unrivaled - wants Phee out, she should be out, but they will be diminishing the capacity of their team.
Now mind you, I don’t think Prez Nneka is any kind of sap or push over, and she also did not play in Unrivaled last year despite having way more stature than necessary.
In general, I have faith in Nneka to keep a balanced perspective and not be dominated by other strong personalities.
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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hermes
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
how do these negotiations actually go? is the commish sitting in a room with phee/stewart or is it a team of lawyers and professional negotiators talking and taking proposals back. with the higher ups coming in for big meetings at the beginning and end
i'd hope its the latter, we're mid-season the players don't have time to sit in contract negotiation meetings
i'd hope its the latter, we're mid-season the players don't have time to sit in contract negotiation meetings
Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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hermes
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
i wonder what the long-term plan is for unrivaled. if the wnba gets to the point where players are making enough money that they don't need to go overseas anymore (or play in the off-season domestically), will they fold unrivaled and claim its goal accomplished? or will it keep going with rookies and deep bench players taking part because the stars are making enough money to not need to play
for example, in a few years if paige bueckers is making $5m a year in the wnba, will she bother with unrivaled?
for example, in a few years if paige bueckers is making $5m a year in the wnba, will she bother with unrivaled?
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cdubbz
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
Can the WNBA create an off-season plan to go against Unrivaled? Run a 5x5 round robin tournament and invite a lot of the fringe WNBA players to fill rosters. Maybe 8 teams?
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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ellobo
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
hermes wrote:i wonder what the long-term plan is for unrivaled. if the wnba gets to the point where players are making enough money that they don't need to go overseas anymore (or play in the off-season domestically), will they fold unrivaled and claim its goal accomplished? or will it keep going with rookies and deep bench players taking part because the stars are making enough money to not need to play
for example, in a few years if paige bueckers is making $5m a year in the wnba, will she bother with unrivaled?
It's an interesting question, but I think it's still a long way away. Right now, almost all of the players who make 200-250k still play in off-season leagues, with A'ja Wilson being the notable exception (and Clark, although her WNBA salary is much less). $5 million might be a different story. But it also depends on how the WNBA season schedule evolves. If the WNBA season evolves into a much longer schedule, which might be necessary to support much higher salaries, where it becomes very physically grueling and leaves little calendar time for off-season play, then there's a big factor beyond the money discouraging players from playing elsewhere.
On a tangential note, the Unrivaled 3 on 3 format is SO much better than FIBA 3x3 that I'd love to see it become the new 3 on 3 standard. But I don't think there's any realistic chance FIBA would go in that direction.
Just because it happened to you, doesn't make it interesting.
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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Green Chile
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
ellobo wrote:hermes wrote:i wonder what the long-term plan is for unrivaled. if the wnba gets to the point where players are making enough money that they don't need to go overseas anymore (or play in the off-season domestically), will they fold unrivaled and claim its goal accomplished? or will it keep going with rookies and deep bench players taking part because the stars are making enough money to not need to play
for example, in a few years if paige bueckers is making $5m a year in the wnba, will she bother with unrivaled?
It's an interesting question, but I think it's still a long way away. Right now, almost all of the players who make 200-250k still play in off-season leagues, with A'ja Wilson being the notable exception (and Clark, although her WNBA salary is much less). $5 million might be a different story. But it also depends on how the WNBA season schedule evolves. If the WNBA season evolves into a much longer schedule, which might be necessary to support much higher salaries, where it becomes very physically grueling and leaves little calendar time for off-season play, then there's a big factor beyond the money discouraging players from playing elsewhere.
On a tangential note, the Unrivaled 3 on 3 format is SO much better than FIBA 3x3 that I'd love to see it become the new 3 on 3 standard. But I don't think there's any realistic chance FIBA would go in that direction.
Yeah, I think the long-term plan all depends on the CBA (which, if true, means there isn't a long-term plan).
If I had to bet, I think Unrivaled lasts until the next CBA.
There's going to be growth in salaries, but I doubt it's going to be as big as people think. To do that, the season likely needs to be extended. I don't think anybody thinks that's a good thing right now.
There's a good thing going here from April to October. I don't mind if it extends more into the NFL season, but most wouldn't think that's a good idea.
I know this is going to sound crazy with all the numbers being thrown around, but IMO, the salaries roughly double. NBA is still taking a big cut off the top, don't know where that ends. Without extending the season, I don't see how we're getting to million dollar salaries.
Hope I'm wrong, but I have a feeling that's where we're heading with this CBA (give it another few years and see if the numbers keep climbing).
Anyway, if the salaries roughly double, I think Unrivaled remains mostly in it's current form (with a few more players sitting out). Really good players making $300-400k or so in HCOL cities could still use the extra scratch. And if they got time to toss in another $200k to hang out in Miami a couple months, why not?
Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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Green Chile
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
And in case it's not clear, I'm just pulling numbers out of my ###. I'm not privvy to the books. Only a few people are. And certainly not anybody in the media claiming they know how much the WNBA loses every year. Frankly, I suspect all those numbers are coming from NBA owners giving the media talking points during a labor negotiation.
But anyway, I don't know. Don't claim to.
I feel conservative on the numbers just based on past CBA negotiations in all leagues.
Have we ever seen a CBA negotiation in any league lead to player salaries quadrupling (as I think many are suspecting)?
Genuinely asking. I don't know.
But anyway, I don't know. Don't claim to.
I feel conservative on the numbers just based on past CBA negotiations in all leagues.
Have we ever seen a CBA negotiation in any league lead to player salaries quadrupling (as I think many are suspecting)?
Genuinely asking. I don't know.
Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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OriAr
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
Green Chile wrote:And in case it's not clear, I'm just pulling numbers out of my ###. I'm not privvy to the books. Only a few people are. And certainly not anybody in the media claiming they know how much the WNBA loses every year. Frankly, I suspect all those numbers are coming from NBA owners giving the media talking points during a labor negotiation.
But anyway, I don't know. Don't claim to.
I feel conservative on the numbers just based on past CBA negotiations in all leagues.
Have we ever seen a CBA negotiation in any league lead to player salaries quadrupling (as I think many are suspecting)?
Genuinely asking. I don't know.
We've never had CBA negotiations where popularity skyrocketed the way it has for the WNBA, so we are completely in uncharted territory here.
I'd love to be wrong, but I have a hard time seeing a deal being reached before a lockout happens... Luckily the off season is long so they might be able to reach a deal without losing games regardless.
The 2020 CBA was good for a league that was finding its niche and was fine being somewhat of a niche league, needless to say this is not true anymore in 2025, and I don't think either side (Players or owners) have fully digested what it means.
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
spotrac has the annual salary caps for all the leagues going back to the 1990s
https://www.spotrac.com/nba/cba
https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cba
https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/cba (not really sure what the tax threshold is, but mlb doesn't have a salary cap)
https://www.spotrac.com/wnba/cba
https://www.spotrac.com/mls/cba
https://www.spotrac.com/nwsl/cba
the nwsl is probably the best comparison point. in 2022 their cap increased 69% and then doubled in 2024. they also must have the cap set all the way out to 2030
interesting to me that despite basketball being much more popular than soccer in this country, the nwsl has a salary cap that is twice what the wnba's is
https://www.spotrac.com/nba/cba
https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cba
https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/cba (not really sure what the tax threshold is, but mlb doesn't have a salary cap)
https://www.spotrac.com/wnba/cba
https://www.spotrac.com/mls/cba
https://www.spotrac.com/nwsl/cba
the nwsl is probably the best comparison point. in 2022 their cap increased 69% and then doubled in 2024. they also must have the cap set all the way out to 2030
interesting to me that despite basketball being much more popular than soccer in this country, the nwsl has a salary cap that is twice what the wnba's is
Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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MrDollarBills
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
Doctor MJ wrote:sikma42 wrote:Stewie and Phee are owners of a rival womens basketball league that sources the same talent. They are also part of negotiating the CBA. Really don't get how that happens. Phee just responded to a fan about it on Twitter:
Phee is one of my favorite players but this is a horrible response. Also, her being part of the negotiations imo is dishonest. I'm not sure if this league is ready for the influx in money because this should never have been allowed to happen. And she shouldn't have responded on twitter unless it was looked at by her attorneys and the leadership team.
Not a great response, but I’d be more concerned if she was the head of the player union.
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This is how I feel. Ultimately she isn't the union boss.
Personally, seeing how Unrivaled is doing, I think having Phee and Stewie being apart of this talks is beneficial to the players since they might be the first ones to look at something and call foul on behalf of the players. There's nothing for them to gain via trying to derail talks or pull something underhanded to benefit Unrivaled. The entire purpose of Unrivaled is to keep our players home and out of unsafe countries, even though the United States is quickly becoming unsafe for LGBTQ players.
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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MrDollarBills
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
OriAr wrote:Green Chile wrote:And in case it's not clear, I'm just pulling numbers out of my ###. I'm not privvy to the books. Only a few people are. And certainly not anybody in the media claiming they know how much the WNBA loses every year. Frankly, I suspect all those numbers are coming from NBA owners giving the media talking points during a labor negotiation.
But anyway, I don't know. Don't claim to.
I feel conservative on the numbers just based on past CBA negotiations in all leagues.
Have we ever seen a CBA negotiation in any league lead to player salaries quadrupling (as I think many are suspecting)?
Genuinely asking. I don't know.
We've never had CBA negotiations where popularity skyrocketed the way it has for the WNBA, so we are completely in uncharted territory here.
I'd love to be wrong, but I have a hard time seeing a deal being reached before a lockout happens... Luckily the off season is long so they might be able to reach a deal without losing games regardless.
The 2020 CBA was good for a league that was finding its niche and was fine being somewhat of a niche league, needless to say this is not true anymore in 2025, and I don't think either side (Players or owners) have fully digested what it means.
I posted this a few days back but a USA Today reporter who has covered the league extensively since the 90s has repeatedly said that the league front office was ill prepared for the advent of Caitlin Clark and the rise of the league's popularity and I agree 100%.
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C: J. Valanciunas/T. Bryant
PF: K. Kuzma/C. Castleton
SF: T. Evbuomwan/J. Howard
SG: G. Allen/L. Kennard
PG: S. Curry (lol)/C. Payne
2025-2026 Indiana Pacers
C: J. Valanciunas/T. Bryant
PF: K. Kuzma/C. Castleton
SF: T. Evbuomwan/J. Howard
SG: G. Allen/L. Kennard
PG: S. Curry (lol)/C. Payne
Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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ellobo
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
IMO, this "controversy" is mostly nothing.
First, the main charge of a conflict is that a WNBA lockout would financially benefit Unrivaled. I don't see this as being the case. The popularity of the players in Unrivaled is based on their college and WNBA careers, and a lot of the interest in Unrivaled last year built on the momentum from the previous WNBA season. I don't think it is at all predictable how an interruption or cancellation of the WNBA season would impact Unrivaled.
Second, the two leagues' seasons don't overlap, so they are not in competition for players. Unrivaled is more of a direct competitor with off-season (WNBA off season) international leagues and domestic leagues like Athletes Unlimited.
Third, almost all (if not all) WNBA players have contractual obligations outside the WNBA and its official sponsors, whether that is player contracts with other leagues (not just Unrivaled) or endorsements of products that compete with official sponsors. Furthermore, AFAIK all of the regular rostered Unrivaled players have some degree of equity in Unrivaled. In other words, the economic landscape for women professional basketball player is extremely fragmented. In terms of basketball salary, the W is a side gig for almost everyone, so if that creates a conflict of interest, it doesn't just apply to two players.
Fourth, Unrivaled increases the WNBA players' leverage a lot, from the standpoints of providing an additional option of players to get paid, demonstrating a more player-friendly economic model, and the proof of concept and practical experience of making a more player-friendly model work, as well as tilting public perception about the economics of women's basketball.
Fifth, I personally don't doubt the integrity or intentions of Phee or Stewie, and if the WNBA rank and file didn't want them in leadership positions they wouldn't have voted them into those positions. If this was an issue coming from within the WNBAPA, I'd take it more seriously, but there aren't any indications that it is.
I mean potentially, if playing in the WNBA was so lucrative (and so time-consuming and physically demanding, such as an 82 game schedule) that no one needed or wanted to play in an off-season league, that would hurt or even kill Unrivaled. But that seems like it's a long way off and not relevant to the current negotiations, and it's not even the potential conflict that is being suggested in the post that Phee responded to.
First, the main charge of a conflict is that a WNBA lockout would financially benefit Unrivaled. I don't see this as being the case. The popularity of the players in Unrivaled is based on their college and WNBA careers, and a lot of the interest in Unrivaled last year built on the momentum from the previous WNBA season. I don't think it is at all predictable how an interruption or cancellation of the WNBA season would impact Unrivaled.
Second, the two leagues' seasons don't overlap, so they are not in competition for players. Unrivaled is more of a direct competitor with off-season (WNBA off season) international leagues and domestic leagues like Athletes Unlimited.
Third, almost all (if not all) WNBA players have contractual obligations outside the WNBA and its official sponsors, whether that is player contracts with other leagues (not just Unrivaled) or endorsements of products that compete with official sponsors. Furthermore, AFAIK all of the regular rostered Unrivaled players have some degree of equity in Unrivaled. In other words, the economic landscape for women professional basketball player is extremely fragmented. In terms of basketball salary, the W is a side gig for almost everyone, so if that creates a conflict of interest, it doesn't just apply to two players.
Fourth, Unrivaled increases the WNBA players' leverage a lot, from the standpoints of providing an additional option of players to get paid, demonstrating a more player-friendly economic model, and the proof of concept and practical experience of making a more player-friendly model work, as well as tilting public perception about the economics of women's basketball.
Fifth, I personally don't doubt the integrity or intentions of Phee or Stewie, and if the WNBA rank and file didn't want them in leadership positions they wouldn't have voted them into those positions. If this was an issue coming from within the WNBAPA, I'd take it more seriously, but there aren't any indications that it is.
I mean potentially, if playing in the WNBA was so lucrative (and so time-consuming and physically demanding, such as an 82 game schedule) that no one needed or wanted to play in an off-season league, that would hurt or even kill Unrivaled. But that seems like it's a long way off and not relevant to the current negotiations, and it's not even the potential conflict that is being suggested in the post that Phee responded to.
Just because it happened to you, doesn't make it interesting.
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Yesterday I was lying; today I'm telling the truth.
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is.
Yesterday I was lying; today I'm telling the truth.
Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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cdubbz
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
Big deal or not a big deal? Napheesa wearing unrivaled tee and mentioning Lunar Owls squad during all-star selection show.
Kuya wrote: a good agent collects all the data, including quotes to give them leverage in contract deals.
Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
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BlacJacMac
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Re: Stewie and Phee negotiating on behalf of the WNBAPA is an obvious Conflict of Interest
cdubbz wrote:Big deal or not a big deal? Napheesa wearing unrivaled tee and mentioning Lunar Owls squad during all-star selection show.
The smallest of deals.