Bill Simmons RIPS the Raptors roster and salaries. (UPDATE Zach Lowe & Rob Mahoney go in on Raptors)

[Shakril]

I'd actually like to hear your argument. In the past 3 years 7 teams have failed to win 100 combined games. We are one of those 7. Imagine I told you we missed the playoffs 3 years in a row and our clear best prospect was still Barnes, who was drafted in 2021. Our highest draft pick was 9th after missing the playoffs 3 years in a row.

If you think we haven't been poorly managed over the past 3 years you're not being objective. Our overall record and lack of high upside prospects are the proof. Not to mention waiting too long to move off our vets which resulted in sub-par returns (compared to the rest of the league) or flat out losing them for nothing (FVV).

This has been talked about ad nauseum. The biggest issue was FVV leaving.

Yeah, and that’s a terrible argument.

FVV/OG/Barnes/Siakam/Poeltl: +9 net rating

Dennis/OG/Barnes/Siakam/Poeltl: -1 net rating

Both lineups played around 350 minutes.

Do you know how much of an impact +10 net rating has on wins? It’s about 15 games.

All of sudden all of our misfortune is from losing FVV, a guy who half this board wanted jettisoned because he was “selfish”? Now he’s worth 15 wins to this team?

The excuses around here are getting crazy. It’s ok to say we’ve been a poorly run team the past few years guys.

You are cherry picking stats. I have seen FVV throw away so many games, even the last one as a raptor he contributed a lot to us losing a sure win.

FVV in the end is and was overrated and what we needed was simply a pass first PG. We got Schroeder and that was never going to work, so its more about that the replacement was bad rather that FVV is good.

[GLF]

It's only "hard to argue" with this because I've got deadlines, and this stuff has been litigated to death.

Suffice it to say I disagree with you, sir.

I'd actually like to hear your argument. In the past 3 years 7 teams have failed to win 100 combined games. We are one of those 7. Imagine I told you we missed the playoffs 3 years in a row and our clear best prospect was still Barnes, who was drafted in 2021. Our highest draft pick was 9th after missing the playoffs 3 years in a row.

If you think we haven't been poorly managed over the past 3 years you're not being objective. Our overall record and lack of high upside prospects are the proof. Not to mention waiting too long to move off our vets which resulted in sub-par returns (compared to the rest of the league) or flat out losing them for nothing (FVV).

Unless we got Wemby, Scottie would still be our best prospect.

And this has been beaten to death but the offers for Pascal the year prior to when he was dealt were not good. Neither were the offers for OG. Taking those deals would actually have put us in a worse position.

There have been missteps but the problem is the ones who go to great lengths to criticize the moves this FO has made can never tell us the moves they missed out on. Who are these blue-chip prospects we missed out on? What trades did they miss out on? Would AJ Griffin and Kobe Bufkin put us in a better position to compete than BI, Ochai and Walter?

Exactly. I get the hate for the Jakob trade but people keep acting like they had some crystal ball to know for sure we would get Wemby. I can’t remember who else was drafted in the lottery in that year but I’m pretty sure none of them are better than Scottie. So Scottie as you said more likely than not would have still been our best player. I too also remember the offers that we heard for Pascal and OG a year earlier weren’t good. Do you remember what those offers were?

[Los_29]

I'd actually like to hear your argument. In the past 3 years 7 teams have failed to win 100 combined games. We are one of those 7. Imagine I told you we missed the playoffs 3 years in a row and our clear best prospect was still Barnes, who was drafted in 2021. Our highest draft pick was 9th after missing the playoffs 3 years in a row.

If you think we haven't been poorly managed over the past 3 years you're not being objective. Our overall record and lack of high upside prospects are the proof. Not to mention waiting too long to move off our vets which resulted in sub-par returns (compared to the rest of the league) or flat out losing them for nothing (FVV).

Unless we got Wemby, Scottie would still be our best prospect.

And this has been beaten to death but the offers for Pascal the year prior to when he was dealt were not good. Neither were the offers for OG. Taking those deals would actually have put us in a worse position.

There have been missteps but the problem is the ones who go to great lengths to criticize the moves this FO has made can never tell us the moves they missed out on. Who are these blue-chip prospects we missed out on? What trades did they miss out on? Would AJ Griffin and Kobe Bufkin put us in a better position to compete than BI, Ochai and Walter?

Exactly. I get the hate for the Jakob trade but people keep acting like they had some crystal ball to know for sure we would get Wemby. I can’t remember who else was drafted in the lottery in that year but I’m pretty sure none of them are better than Scottie. So Scottie as you said more likely than not would have still been our best player. I too also remember the offers that we heard for Pascal and OG a year earlier weren’t good. Do you remember what those offers were?

Amen Thompson, Scoot, Miller, Wallace and Lively were the best of the bunch after Wemby. Not a great list there.

2024 draft was very mediocre.

For Pascal I only remember the Hawks offer which was horrendous. Although there were those rumors for Kuminga but I don’t think those were legitimate. For OG, I remember the Grizzlies being rumoured to offer three FRPs. These picks were not good quality picks. At the time of the trades last year, many gave the Raptors a good grade for both.

I have yet to see a better path that this FO could’ve taken and yet we keep hearing about how much they messed up.

[OakleyDokely]

Remember when Kuminga was made Tre Mann level untouchable by GS? Those were the days. Although, I think that was more ownership than management. Steve Kerr probably wanted to send him to the moon a few times.

[GLF]

Unless we got Wemby, Scottie would still be our best prospect.

And this has been beaten to death but the offers for Pascal the year prior to when he was dealt were not good. Neither were the offers for OG. Taking those deals would actually have put us in a worse position.

There have been missteps but the problem is the ones who go to great lengths to criticize the moves this FO has made can never tell us the moves they missed out on. Who are these blue-chip prospects we missed out on? What trades did they miss out on? Would AJ Griffin and Kobe Bufkin put us in a better position to compete than BI, Ochai and Walter?

Exactly. I get the hate for the Jakob trade but people keep acting like they had some crystal ball to know for sure we would get Wemby. I can’t remember who else was drafted in the lottery in that year but I’m pretty sure none of them are better than Scottie. So Scottie as you said more likely than not would have still been our best player. I too also remember the offers that we heard for Pascal and OG a year earlier weren’t good. Do you remember what those offers were?

Amen Thompson, Scoot, Miller, Wallace and Lively were the best of the bunch after Wemby. Not a great list there.

2024 draft was very mediocre.

For Pascal I only remember the Hawks offer which was horrendous. Although there were those rumors for Kuminga but I don’t think those were legitimate. For OG, I remember the Grizzlies being rumoured to offer three FRPs. These picks were not good quality picks. At the time of the trades last year, many gave the Raptors a good grade for both.

I have yet to see a better path that this FO could’ve taken and yet we keep hearing about how much they messed up.

Amen might end up being better than Scottie, I really like him, but that’s it. And again there is no guarantee we would have drafted where he landed. I’m not high on Kuminga, I rather what we ended up getting in BI and Ja’Kobe than him. Yea the Atlanta deal was not good, but I remember people being high on it because of AJ Griffin lmao. Three FRPs for OG from Memphis wouldn’t have been good picks and the likelihood of whoever we may have drafted being better than IQ or RJ is low. But people love the mystery box on this board so there are probably people who would have loved that lol. Yea the front office did just fine with those trades, people just want to complain because they wanted us to rebuild right after the Tampa season or some people even before that which is insane lmao

[Madvillainy2004]

Exactly. I get the hate for the Jakob trade but people keep acting like they had some crystal ball to know for sure we would get Wemby. I can’t remember who else was drafted in the lottery in that year but I’m pretty sure none of them are better than Scottie. So Scottie as you said more likely than not would have still been our best player. I too also remember the offers that we heard for Pascal and OG a year earlier weren’t good. Do you remember what those offers were?

Amen Thompson, Scoot, Miller, Wallace and Lively were the best of the bunch after Wemby. Not a great list there.

2024 draft was very mediocre.

For Pascal I only remember the Hawks offer which was horrendous. Although there were those rumors for Kuminga but I don’t think those were legitimate. For OG, I remember the Grizzlies being rumoured to offer three FRPs. These picks were not good quality picks. At the time of the trades last year, many gave the Raptors a good grade for both.

I have yet to see a better path that this FO could’ve taken and yet we keep hearing about how much they messed up.

Amen might end up being better than Scottie, I really like him, but that’s it. And again there is no guarantee we would have drafted where he landed. I’m not high on Kuminga, I rather what we ended up getting in BI and Ja’Kobe than him. Yea the Atlanta deal was not good, but I remember people being high on it because of AJ Griffin lmao. Three FRPs for OG from Memphis wouldn’t have been good picks and the likelihood of whoever we may have drafted being better than IQ or RJ is low. But people love the mystery box on this board so there are probably people who would have loved that lol. Yea the front office did just fine with those trades, people just want to complain because they wanted us to rebuild right after the Tampa season or some people even before that which is insane lmao

I also just don't see how we're in a super dire situation lmao what's to stop them from tanking again if they're bad and sending Ingram and IQ to cancun in January. If you hate Scottie you can trade him too lmao then in 2028 we can just try again. If we capped out and had 0 picks it's one thing but you can basically choose to suck whatever year you want and if not we can just let this team ride out for 2 years. Also they're not super old would it be insanely inprecetented for IQ to take a step or Scottie or maybe the Jakobe/CMB/Dick guys break out.

I think all the doom posting is a but silly. The basically accidentally won 30 games last year. Now the east lost Tatum Dame and Hali for a whole year. I think 43-48 wins is pretty attainable.

[MEDIC]

You can throw stones all you want. What are these guys suggesting the Raps SHOULD have done? Keep OG? Keep Siakam? I am not sure where you are going with those two either. I guess you would have to trade Scottie & filler for the 3rd piece to play with these two.

The Raptors want to be a playoff team. Nothing wrong with that.

I personally like this approach for this franchise. We have seen management tinker in the past & find the right group of players.

Right now they have collection of.players who (could potentially) figure things out & make Masai & Bobby look like geniuses. If it doesn't work out, you look at the deficiencies of the lineup & look for opportunities to find better fits. They have a ton of youngsters who can play. It's not like they are over the hill.

Quickleys contract is an overpay for sure. BI's contract is a risk (but it isn't very long).

This is basically a 2 year plan to see what kind of success this group can have. If it doesn't work out........it's only 2 years & they will have a bunch of chunky expiring deals to trade over the next few seasons.

Absolutely nothing wrong with the direction they took. Raptors fans get to cheer on a young team that is trying to compete for a playoff spot over the next 2 seasons (after having nothing to cheer for 5 years). They have also kept things fresh and interesting. Lots of good storylines this season. This is an entertainment business after all.

I think it's a good situation for everyone.

[Psubs]

Bill Simmons said Chicago. The other guy Ryen said Toronto.

I know OP says Toronto was 3rd by Simmons, but the title is misleading.

[GLF]

Amen Thompson, Scoot, Miller, Wallace and Lively were the best of the bunch after Wemby. Not a great list there.

2024 draft was very mediocre.

For Pascal I only remember the Hawks offer which was horrendous. Although there were those rumors for Kuminga but I don’t think those were legitimate. For OG, I remember the Grizzlies being rumoured to offer three FRPs. These picks were not good quality picks. At the time of the trades last year, many gave the Raptors a good grade for both.

I have yet to see a better path that this FO could’ve taken and yet we keep hearing about how much they messed up.

Amen might end up being better than Scottie, I really like him, but that’s it. And again there is no guarantee we would have drafted where he landed. I’m not high on Kuminga, I rather what we ended up getting in BI and Ja’Kobe than him. Yea the Atlanta deal was not good, but I remember people being high on it because of AJ Griffin lmao. Three FRPs for OG from Memphis wouldn’t have been good picks and the likelihood of whoever we may have drafted being better than IQ or RJ is low. But people love the mystery box on this board so there are probably people who would have loved that lol. Yea the front office did just fine with those trades, people just want to complain because they wanted us to rebuild right after the Tampa season or some people even before that which is insane lmao

I also just don't see how we're in a super dire situation lmao what's to stop them from tanking again if they're bad and sending Ingram and IQ to cancun in January. If you hate Scottie you can trade him too lmao then in 2028 we can just try again. If we capped out and had 0 picks it's one thing but you can basically choose to suck whatever year you want and if not we can just let this team ride out for 2 years. Also they're not super old would it be insanely inprecetented for IQ to take a step or Scottie or maybe the Jakobe/CMB/Dick guys break out.

I think all the doom posting is a but silly. The basically accidentally won 30 games last year. Now the east lost Tatum Dame and Hali for a whole year. I think 43-48 wins is pretty attainable.

Couldn’t agree more. I truly don’t understand why so many people on here have to act like the sky is falling when that couldn’t be furthest from the truth. One thing the Raptors are perfectly set up to do is pivot if things don’t work out. That’s a great place to be in my opinion.

[Psubs]

You can throw stones all you want. What are these guys suggesting the Raps SHOULD have done? Keep OG? Keep Siakam? I am not sure where you are going with those two either. I guess you would have to trade Scottie & filler for the 3rd piece to play with these two.

The Raptors want to be a playoff team. Nothing wrong with that.

I personally like this approach for this franchise. We have seen management tinker in the past & find the right group of players.

Right now they have collection of.players who (could potentially) figure things out & make Masai & Bobby look like geniuses. If it doesn't work out, you look at the deficiencies of the lineup & look for opportunities to find better fits. They have a ton of youngsters who can play. It's not like they are over the hill.

Quickleys contract is an overpay for sure. BI's contract is a risk (but it isn't very long).

This is basically a 2 year plan to see what kind of success this group can have. If it doesn't work out........it's only 2 years & they will have a bunch of chunky expiring deals to trade over the next few seasons.

Absolutely nothing wrong with the direction they took.

If they had kept Pascal and OG and not traded for Poeltl, they might be where Orlando is.

PG Shead/Davion
SG OG - Dick - Battle
SF Pascal - OG - Mogbo
PF Scottie - Fleming
C Edey - Mamu

[GLF]

You can throw stones all you want. What are these guys suggesting the Raps SHOULD have done? Keep OG? Keep Siakam? I am not sure where you are going with those two either. I guess you would have to trade Scottie & filler for the 3rd piece to play with these two.

The Raptors want to be a playoff team. Nothing wrong with that.

I personally like this approach for this franchise. We have seen management tinker in the past & find the right group of players.

Right now they have collection of.players who (could potentially) figure things out & make Masai & Bobby look like geniuses. If it doesn't work out, you look at the deficiencies of the lineup & look for opportunities to find better fits. They have a ton of youngsters who can play. It's not like they are over the hill.

Quickleys contract is an overpay for sure. BI's contract is a risk (but it isn't very long).

This is basically a 2 year plan to see what kind of success this group can have. If it doesn't work out........it's only 2 years & they will have a bunch of chunky expiring deals to trade over the next few seasons.

Absolutely nothing wrong with the direction they took. Raptors fans get to cheer on a young team that is trying to compete for a playoff spot over the next 2 seasons (after having nothing to cheer for 5 years). They have also kept things fresh and interesting. Lots of good storylines this season. This is an entertainment business after all.

I think it's a good situation for everyone.

Thank you! And the thing is most of these people did not want to keep Pascal and OG. They would have been pissed if Bobby kept them both lol. Everyone wanted them and Fred gone because they were stifling Scottie’s growth lol. So no for most complaining that was not even an option for them. They just love to play make believe GM and act like they are in these front offices and know all the deals that came through for those guys over the years and can say with certainty Bobby messed up in trading them too late. It’s laughable at this point lol.

[TheGeneral99]

The NBA landscape is also changing rapidly because of all these new cap rules...it's almost impossible to construct super teams via trades or free agent signings like we used to see, and teams are going to struggle mightily to keep multiple stars on the roster together while keeping their depth. A team like the Thunder, for example, will have Chet and J-Will become restricted free agents in 2026 and both those guys would likely garner max contracts on the open market...will they be able to keep both those guys? I don't think so.

This is why we have had major parity these last few years and I think we will see teams fluctuate season by season more often. I'm anticipating way more star player movement and trades these coming years because teams are going have to adjust to the cap penalties.

[tecumseh18]

I'd actually like to hear your argument. In the past 3 years 7 teams have failed to win 100 combined games. We are one of those 7. Imagine I told you we missed the playoffs 3 years in a row and our clear best prospect was still Barnes, who was drafted in 2021. Our highest draft pick was 9th after missing the playoffs 3 years in a row.

If you think we haven't been poorly managed over the past 3 years you're not being objective. Our overall record and lack of high upside prospects are the proof. Not to mention waiting too long to move off our vets which resulted in sub-par returns (compared to the rest of the league) or flat out losing them for nothing (FVV).

Unless we got Wemby, Scottie would still be our best prospect.

And this has been beaten to death but the offers for Pascal the year prior to when he was dealt were not good. Neither were the offers for OG. Taking those deals would actually have put us in a worse position.

There have been missteps but the problem is the ones who go to great lengths to criticize the moves this FO has made can never tell us the moves they missed out on. Who are these blue-chip prospects we missed out on? What trades did they miss out on? Would AJ Griffin and Kobe Bufkin put us in a better position to compete than BI, Ochai and Walter?

Exactly. I get the hate for the Jakob trade but people keep acting like they had some crystal ball to know for sure we would get Wemby. I can’t remember who else was drafted in the lottery in that year but I’m pretty sure none of them are better than Scottie. So Scottie as you said more likely than not would have still been our best player. I too also remember the offers that we heard for Pascal and OG a year earlier weren’t good. Do you remember what those offers were?

Poeltl trade was a fork in the road decision. Arguments both ways. Masai has basically admitted he perhaps should have made a different decision, but wanted to give it one more shot with the reunited bench mob.

But one questionable decision does not mean the team was "badly managed". In every other respect - especially in the draft - it is a well managed team. Pascal for BI, Ochai and JaKobe (and the cap space to acquire Shead) is not a bad set of transactions on its face, and history could look favourably on it. OG is an excellent defensive player (when healthy) but is NOT a difference maker, RJ, IQ and even Mogbo collectively give us WAY more depth than we had before, and can be fine players in their own right.

And we still have Poeltl. An above average C on a decent contract for the long term. I've seen WAY worse decisions/outcomes.

[MEDIC]

You can throw stones all you want. What are these guys suggesting the Raps SHOULD have done? Keep OG? Keep Siakam? I am not sure where you are going with those two either. I guess you would have to trade Scottie & filler for the 3rd piece to play with these two.

The Raptors want to be a playoff team. Nothing wrong with that.

I personally like this approach for this franchise. We have seen management tinker in the past & find the right group of players.

Right now they have collection of.players who (could potentially) figure things out & make Masai & Bobby look like geniuses. If it doesn't work out, you look at the deficiencies of the lineup & look for opportunities to find better fits. They have a ton of youngsters who can play. It's not like they are over the hill.

Quickleys contract is an overpay for sure. BI's contract is a risk (but it isn't very long).

This is basically a 2 year plan to see what kind of success this group can have. If it doesn't work out........it's only 2 years & they will have a bunch of chunky expiring deals to trade over the next few seasons.

Absolutely nothing wrong with the direction they took.

If they had kept Pascal and OG and not traded for Poeltl, they might be where Orlando is.

PG Shead/Davion
SG OG - Dick - Battle
SF Pascal - OG - Mogbo
PF Scottie - Fleming
C Edey - Mamu

Possibly. I am not big on that lineup. I like our current lineup better. Younger. More versaitile. Deeper. I feel like with the lineup above, you have really committed hard to making it work somehow. The current luneup.is easier to tinker with or.blow up if needed. I would not want OG's contract & he didn't seem very happy here towards the end.

You get two vets with championship experience & an aging Siakam. You also have Siakam & Scottie who like to occupy the same spaces. I like BI & Scotties fit offensively more than I like Scotty/ Siakam.

Bill would still be complaining about the contract that we gave OG & Pascal.

[TheGeneral99]

Unless we got Wemby, Scottie would still be our best prospect.

And this has been beaten to death but the offers for Pascal the year prior to when he was dealt were not good. Neither were the offers for OG. Taking those deals would actually have put us in a worse position.

There have been missteps but the problem is the ones who go to great lengths to criticize the moves this FO has made can never tell us the moves they missed out on. Who are these blue-chip prospects we missed out on? What trades did they miss out on? Would AJ Griffin and Kobe Bufkin put us in a better position to compete than BI, Ochai and Walter?

Exactly. I get the hate for the Jakob trade but people keep acting like they had some crystal ball to know for sure we would get Wemby. I can’t remember who else was drafted in the lottery in that year but I’m pretty sure none of them are better than Scottie. So Scottie as you said more likely than not would have still been our best player. I too also remember the offers that we heard for Pascal and OG a year earlier weren’t good. Do you remember what those offers were?

Poeltl trade was a fork in the road decision. Arguments both ways. Masai has basically admitted he perhaps should have made a different decision, but wanted to give it one more shot with the reunited bench mob.

But one questionable decision does not mean the team was "badly managed". In every other respect - especially in the draft - it is a well managed team. Pascal for BI, Ochai and JaKobe is not a bad set of transactions on its face, and history could look favourably on it. OG is an excellent defensive player (when healthy) but is NOT a difference maker, RJ, IQ and even Mogbo collectively give us WAY more depth than we had before, and can be fine players in their own right.

That team was definitely missing a center. We did finish 15-11 with Poeltl and unfortunately blew that lead against the Bulls in the play-in.

I really do believe had we kept Vanvleet the following season, we probably would have been a 45-50 win team.

But at the end of the day the biggest issues on that team were 1) depth, and 2) shooting...defensively we were fantastic, but we couldn't score well consistently and our bench sucked. A guy like Myles Turner would have been a better fit with Fred, Siakam, Barnes and OG because he could stretch the floor. Barnes, Siakam and Fred that year shot relatively poorly from 3, Poeltl can't shoot at all...so only OG was a reliably consistent 3 point shooter. I also recall that our bench finished something like 29th or 30th in the league in offensive production, just abysmal.

[MEDIC]

I think one thing "experts" fail to recognize sometimes is that every market is different & every market has to build rosters in a way that works for that market. You can't hold them all to the same set of roster building norms.

What works for Miami, doesn't necessarily work for Toronto. What works for LAL, doesn't necessarily work for Indiana or Utah.

[Los_29]

Exactly. I get the hate for the Jakob trade but people keep acting like they had some crystal ball to know for sure we would get Wemby. I can’t remember who else was drafted in the lottery in that year but I’m pretty sure none of them are better than Scottie. So Scottie as you said more likely than not would have still been our best player. I too also remember the offers that we heard for Pascal and OG a year earlier weren’t good. Do you remember what those offers were?

Amen Thompson, Scoot, Miller, Wallace and Lively were the best of the bunch after Wemby. Not a great list there.

2024 draft was very mediocre.

For Pascal I only remember the Hawks offer which was horrendous. Although there were those rumors for Kuminga but I don’t think those were legitimate. For OG, I remember the Grizzlies being rumoured to offer three FRPs. These picks were not good quality picks. At the time of the trades last year, many gave the Raptors a good grade for both.

I have yet to see a better path that this FO could’ve taken and yet we keep hearing about how much they messed up.

Amen might end up being better than Scottie, I really like him, but that’s it. And again there is no guarantee we would have drafted where he landed. I’m not high on Kuminga, I rather what we ended up getting in BI and Ja’Kobe than him. Yea the Atlanta deal was not good, but I remember people being high on it because of AJ Griffin lmao. Three FRPs for OG from Memphis wouldn’t have been good picks and the likelihood of whoever we may have drafted being better than IQ or RJ is low. But people love the mystery box on this board so there are probably people who would have loved that lol. Yea the front office did just fine with those trades, people just want to complain because they wanted us to rebuild right after the Tampa season or some people even before that which is insane lmao

Yeah exactly. I’d definitely take Amen over Scottie. Amen is a dreadful shooter and will likely stay like that for his career but he’s an elite defensive player and is more efficient than Scottie. Even in a reduced role, Scottie has never been as efficient as Amen.

But like you said, you have to get the right bounces in the lottery to even get him. So Wemby and Amen in the last three years are players that you’d put ahead of Scottie. That tells you everything you need to know.

[TheGeneral99]

Amen Thompson, Scoot, Miller, Wallace and Lively were the best of the bunch after Wemby. Not a great list there.

2024 draft was very mediocre.

For Pascal I only remember the Hawks offer which was horrendous. Although there were those rumors for Kuminga but I don’t think those were legitimate. For OG, I remember the Grizzlies being rumoured to offer three FRPs. These picks were not good quality picks. At the time of the trades last year, many gave the Raptors a good grade for both.

I have yet to see a better path that this FO could’ve taken and yet we keep hearing about how much they messed up.

Amen might end up being better than Scottie, I really like him, but that’s it. And again there is no guarantee we would have drafted where he landed. I’m not high on Kuminga, I rather what we ended up getting in BI and Ja’Kobe than him. Yea the Atlanta deal was not good, but I remember people being high on it because of AJ Griffin lmao. Three FRPs for OG from Memphis wouldn’t have been good picks and the likelihood of whoever we may have drafted being better than IQ or RJ is low. But people love the mystery box on this board so there are probably people who would have loved that lol. Yea the front office did just fine with those trades, people just want to complain because they wanted us to rebuild right after the Tampa season or some people even before that which is insane lmao

Yeah exactly. I’d definitely take Amen over Scottie. Amen is a dreadful shooter and will likely stay like that for his career but he’s an elite defensive player and is more efficient than Scottie. Even in a reduced role, Scottie has never been as efficient as Amen.

But like you said, you have to get the right bounces in the lottery to even get him. So Wemby and Amen in the last three years are players that you’d put ahead of Scottie. That tells you everything you need to know.

Hmmm...it's a bit more difficult to say through because Amen was the 4th option behind Green, Fred, and Sengun and took only 10 shots a game.

How would Amen look like if he was the #1 or #2 option like Scottie has been for the past 2 seasons taking 16-17 shots a game?

Also yes Amen is more efficient but that's because he almost never shoots or takes 3s (averaging 1 three a game) whereas Scottie has been taking more difficult mid-range shots (among the top 10 in mid-range fadeaways) and 3s (4-5 a game). If Scottie was only taking 10 shots a game and they were only high percentage paint shots, I'm sure his TS would be incredibly high.

[OakleyDokely]

Maybe the Raptors overachieve, win 45 games and use their picks/rookie contracts to jump another tier.

Maybe the Raptors underachieve, and get another lottery pick and a chance at a top pick.

When you have options, things are never bleak.

The CBA is designed so that it's very difficult for any franchise to be in a truly bleak situation. Maximum contract lengths, max salaries, the inability to trade two 1sts in consecutive years, heavy penalties for exceeding the salary thresholds are in place so owners can't set their franchises back decades.

The only teams that are really screwed are the teams that have traded 1sts and swaps for the next half decade, are well past the tax and aren't competing for a title. Every other situation is fixable with the right management team.

[TheGeneral99]

Maybe the Raptors overachieve, win 45 games and use their picks/rookie contracts to jump another tier.

Maybe the Raptors underachieve, and get another lottery pick and a chance at a top pick.

When you have options, things are never bleak.

The CBA is designed so that it's very difficult for any franchise to be in a truly bleak situation. Maximum contract lengths, max salaries, the inability to trade two 1sts in consecutive years, heavy penalties for exceeding the salary thresholds are in place so owners can't set their franchises back decades.

The only teams that are really screwed are the teams that have traded 1sts and swaps for the next half decade, are well past the tax and aren't competing for a title. Every other situation is fixable with the management team.

Yes.

The good thing about our team is we have all our picks and cap flexibility.

Ingram and Barrett are on relatively short-term reasonable contracts and can be traded if need be. Poeltl is also someone on a reasonable contract and could be a valuable trade piece.