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winsomme2 wrote:
Also, as far as the soft tank, I just don't see JB being okay with sitting when he's healthy. It's just not his makeup. If Brad intentionally puts together a crappy roster, it's going to not sit well with him imo.
Fierce1 wrote:Hal14 wrote:Fierce1 wrote:https://sports.yahoo.com/article/jayson-tatum-gives-celtics-fans-193028042.html
Will Jayson Tatum play next season
If Justin Tatum's estimation proves true, then Tatum may be able to play during the 2025–2026 regular season, as an eight- to nine-month recovery time places his return during February or March.
Justin Tatum is not a doctor and is not employed by the Celtics. I take what he says with a grain of salt. He is obviously biased towards his son and just wants to see his son out there playing sooner rather than later.
Here's where Marc Spears says what Justin Tatum said:
"His dad said he expects him to be out 8-9 months". But who is his dad to say that? Is Justin Tatum a doctor? Is Justin Tatum the one on the Celtics medical staff who's in charge of leading Jayson through his rehab? No and no. So his dad saying this means nothing.
In that same article it also says:
"Tatum's likelihood of playing in the 2025 – 2026 regular season is doubtful, ESPN reporting said." and "There is no official timetable for Tatum's return to regular season action."
Chat GPT says: the Celtics are planning as though he’ll miss the entire 2025–26 regular season, with a possible (but unlikely) return in the postseason."
Like I said, 8 months from now we'll know for sure.
winsomme2 wrote:Fierce1 wrote:Hal14 wrote:Justin Tatum is not a doctor and is not employed by the Celtics. I take what he says with a grain of salt. He is obviously biased towards his son and just wants to see his son out there playing sooner rather than later.
Here's where Marc Spears says what Justin Tatum said:
"His dad said he expects him to be out 8-9 months". But who is his dad to say that? Is Justin Tatum a doctor? Is Justin Tatum the one on the Celtics medical staff who's in charge of leading Jayson through his rehab? No and no. So his dad saying this means nothing.
In that same article it also says:
"Tatum's likelihood of playing in the 2025 – 2026 regular season is doubtful, ESPN reporting said." and "There is no official timetable for Tatum's return to regular season action."
Chat GPT says: the Celtics are planning as though he’ll miss the entire 2025–26 regular season, with a possible (but unlikely) return in the postseason."
Like I said, 8 months from now we'll know for sure.
ESPN has no more of a clue than anybody else whether Tatum will end up playing next year. What could they possibly be basing that on??
For me, the only important factor in this whole situation is the answer to this question: Is Tatum TRYING to return next year?
Right now, all the evidence is saying that he wants to play next year.
As for how his rehab will actually go, NO ONE KNOWS. Not Marc Spears, not ESPN, not any of us here, not Tatum's Dad, not Brad, not the DRs, not even Tatum himself.
But if he wants to come back next year, it is very possible and every report on his rehab (including having the surgery the next day in order to speed up his recovery time) has so far said that he is ahead of schedule.
Every single piece of speculative "likelihoods" is completely irrelevant.
All that matters now is: is Tatum trying to come back and how's his rehab going....
winsomme2 wrote:Fierce1 wrote:Hal14 wrote:Justin Tatum is not a doctor and is not employed by the Celtics. I take what he says with a grain of salt. He is obviously biased towards his son and just wants to see his son out there playing sooner rather than later.
Here's where Marc Spears says what Justin Tatum said:
"His dad said he expects him to be out 8-9 months". But who is his dad to say that? Is Justin Tatum a doctor? Is Justin Tatum the one on the Celtics medical staff who's in charge of leading Jayson through his rehab? No and no. So his dad saying this means nothing.
In that same article it also says:
"Tatum's likelihood of playing in the 2025 – 2026 regular season is doubtful, ESPN reporting said." and "There is no official timetable for Tatum's return to regular season action."
Chat GPT says: the Celtics are planning as though he’ll miss the entire 2025–26 regular season, with a possible (but unlikely) return in the postseason."
Like I said, 8 months from now we'll know for sure.
ESPN has no more of a clue than anybody else whether Tatum will end up playing next year. What could they possibly be basing that on??
For me, the only important factor in this whole situation is the answer to this question: Is Tatum TRYING to return next year?
Right now, all the evidence is saying that he wants to play next year.
As for how his rehab will actually go, NO ONE KNOWS. Not Marc Spears, not ESPN, not any of us here, not Tatum's Dad, not Brad, not the DRs, not even Tatum himself.
But if he wants to come back next year, it is very possible and every report on his rehab (including having the surgery the next day in order to speed up his recovery time) has so far said that he is ahead of schedule.
Every single piece of speculative "likelihoods" is completely irrelevant.
All that matters now is: is Tatum trying to come back and how's his rehab going....
No NBA player since Jose Juan Barea in 2019 has returned sooner than 10½ months after an Achilles rupture, suggesting the Celtics should plan on Tatum missing the entire 2025-26 regular season. A postseason return is more realistic, but there's basically no precedent for that.
The only NBA player I could find who returned from a season long injury in the playoffs was Larry Krystkowiak with the Milwaukee Bucks in 1991, when he came back from an ACL repair to play three games and total two points. Although Krystkowiak was a starter before the injury, the stakes weren't quite the same as with an All-NBA first teamer.
Postseason returns were discussed when both Kevin Durant and Klay Thompson suffered injuries in the 2019 NBA Finals, but neither came to pass. The Golden State Warriors' 2019-20 season was long over by the time Thompson was cleared -- he later suffered a subsequent Achilles rupture in a pickup game that offseason. Durant, meanwhile, opted not to join the Brooklyn Nets for the bubble restart in the summer of 2020 and returned a year and a half after his Achilles rupture at the start of the 2020-21 campaign.
Based on that history, Boston might want to approach 2025-26 as if Tatum won't play at all, even in the playoffs. That dramatically changes the thinking for a team that has won 15 playoff series in the seven years since drafting Tatum No. 3 in 2018.
Hal14 wrote:No NBA player since Jose Juan Barea in 2019 has returned sooner than 10½ months after an Achilles rupture, suggesting the Celtics should plan on Tatum missing the entire 2025-26 regular season. A postseason return is more realistic, but there's basically no precedent for that.
The only NBA player I could find who returned from a season long injury in the playoffs was Larry Krystkowiak with the Milwaukee Bucks in 1991, when he came back from an ACL repair to play three games and total two points. Although Krystkowiak was a starter before the injury, the stakes weren't quite the same as with an All-NBA first teamer.
Postseason returns were discussed when both Kevin Durant and Klay Thompson suffered injuries in the 2019 NBA Finals, but neither came to pass. The Golden State Warriors' 2019-20 season was long over by the time Thompson was cleared -- he later suffered a subsequent Achilles rupture in a pickup game that offseason. Durant, meanwhile, opted not to join the Brooklyn Nets for the bubble restart in the summer of 2020 and returned a year and a half after his Achilles rupture at the start of the 2020-21 campaign.
Based on that history, Boston might want to approach 2025-26 as if Tatum won't play at all, even in the playoffs. That dramatically changes the thinking for a team that has won 15 playoff series in the seven years since drafting Tatum No. 3 in 2018.
As the article says, the soonest players come back from a torn achilles is 10.5 months. Tatum got injured May 12. So 10.5 months from then puts him around March 27, 2026. So like a couple weeks left in the reg season. It's unprecedented for a player to come back from an injury that severe, *that* late in the season.
What happened with KD, what happened with Jamal Murray, Chet Holmgren, many others and what's going to happen with Haliburton is to take it slow, not rush them back and get the entire offseason of 2026 to rest, recover and rehab and shoot for a return on opening night of the 26-27 season. Better to come back in a lower stakes game.
Fierce1 wrote:Kobe Bryant tore his achilles in April 2013 and 8 months later, Kobe returned to action in December 2013.
Celts17Pride wrote:Fierce1 wrote:Kobe Bryant tore his achilles in April 2013 and 8 months later, Kobe returned to action in December 2013.
and was never the same player.
Fierce1 wrote:Kobe Bryant tore his achilles in April 2013 and 8 months later, Kobe returned to action in December 2013.
Hal14 wrote:Fierce1 wrote:Kobe Bryant tore his achilles in April 2013 and 8 months later, Kobe returned to action in December 2013.
a) that's an outlier. Per Chat GPT, the average recovery timeline for an NBA player coming back from a torn achilles is 10-14 months
b) He came back in December, yet only played in 6 games during the 13-14 season. He only played in 35 games the year after that. He was a shell of his former self for the rest of his career. Because he was getting up there in age but also probably because he rushed it too much coming back from the torn achilles. He made 0 all-NBA teams and won 0 titles after coming back so soon after the torn achilles
c) That was also 12 years ago so less relevant to today's NBA and today's players
d) Kobe being so old and on not getting paid nearly as much as Tatum is on his contract, also meant there was much less risk in Kobe trying to rush a return
Fierce1 wrote:Kobe Bryant tore his achilles in April 2013 and 8 months later, Kobe returned to action in December 2013.
hugepatsfan wrote:Fierce1 wrote:Kobe Bryant tore his achilles in April 2013 and 8 months later, Kobe returned to action in December 2013.
Yup, and then 6 games into his return he broke his leg, with medical experts believing that rushing back from his Achilles injury played a role in it because of how rushing back from injury like that affects your body:
Obviously have to see how his rehab plays out and see where the team is. I think it's kind of silly to be expecting him back next year though. God bless him if he does come back, but expecting guys to follow clear outlier recovery timelines doesn't seem smart.
Fierce1 wrote:Celts17Pride wrote:Fierce1 wrote:Kobe Bryant tore his achilles in April 2013 and 8 months later, Kobe returned to action in December 2013.
and was never the same player.
Reason for that is Kobe was old when he tore his achilles.
JT is just 27 years old and had surgery 12 hrs after suffering the injury.
And JT is not the type who relies on superior athletic ability.
You don't need to be super athletic to jack up 3s.
Hal14 wrote:Fierce1 wrote:Celts17Pride wrote:and was never the same player.
Reason for that is Kobe was old when he tore his achilles.
JT is just 27 years old and had surgery 12 hrs after suffering the injury.
And JT is not the type who relies on superior athletic ability.
You don't need to be super athletic to jack up 3s.
If all Tatum is going to be when he comes back from the torn achilles is a guy who jacks up 3's and nothing else, we don't have a shot in hell at winning anymore titles with him
That's why you take it slow. Nice and easy. Don't rush it. So that he can come back as close to the player he was pre-injury as possible. The longer the recovery takes, the better he will be on the court - the better chance we have at winning another ring with him.
Also, Tatum is only 27 but:
a) The younger the player is (and the more $ you are paying him, the bigger the role is he has on your team), the more risk there is if you rush him back and he gets hurt again
b) Haliburton is younger than Tatum (25) and it's been announced Haliburton will miss the entire 25-26 season.
Chet Holmgren (age 20) had a foot injury and missed his entire rookie year. It was reported that he was healthy enough to play in like March/April but wasn't worth the risk to bring him back that late in the season.
Jamal Murray was 24 yrs old..sat out the entire season with torn ACL. They didn't rush him back..same thing, he probably could've tried to come abck in March/April but was not worth the risk..there's a greater risk with a player that young, especially when they are such a key piece of your team and getting paid so much $.
Embiid was basically out for the entire season in his first 3 years of his career. He was young and was seen as their franchise player. So they took it slow, didn't rush him back and he turned into an MVP.
The Corey's wrote:brackdan70 wrote:The Corey's wrote:
The question is, if it's to make us better in the future, I asked how.
So you're saying much better but you've not mentioned how?
You're on record that the pieces we got in return are going to be better than the pieces we sent out? That's the "much better position" you're referring to?
Flexibility. The ability to make trades and ad free agents. Without the trades that was not there.
Ok. But that goes to my point. They can't add anyone of significance in free agency due to cap limitations and if they're going to go the route of trading, they only have so much to offer.
The Jays, Hauser, White and Pritchard is about all the value they have left to work with.
It's not going to be easy.