NEWS: Paolo Banchero Agrees to a 5-Year Maximum Extension

[KillMonger]

None of those guys had the roster Paolo had to deal with and really only ant edwards started to get double teamed only recently......most of those guys are a year or more older than Paolo that extra development matters.... There's always context missing in these arguments that doesn't quite make it an apples to apples comparison..... Plus consider the roles, some of those guys aren't bus drivers they're bus riders

Sent from my [Sidekick 5G] using RealGM mobile app

Cade?

Guy won 44 games with castoffs.

Beasley, Harris, Schroder, Hardaway are disposable cannon fodder in nba.
Schoder is 1 team away from record 11-different teams in nba.

Here's hard game: elect who is second best Pistons player.

All answers are wrong

Beasley 41%....harris 34%....Hardaway 36%...plus Duren is actually rebounding doing what centers are supposed to do at least 10 a game.... They had enough spacing for cade to do his thing without worrying about help from the defense... I mean I wanted Beasley instead of KCP, Beasley averaged 16 a game.....beasely.... Let that sink in....its just too hard to place this year without looking at the context for me..... Cade is definitely a bus driver but he doesn't have KCP, Cole Anthony Gary harris and Cory Joseph as rotation pieces... Only so much you can do with that

Sent from my [Sidekick 5G] using RealGM mobile app

[tiderulz]

At least everyone here has seen like 80-100% of Paolo’s games. There’s a respect required to listening/responding to their opinion. General board knowledge is like 10% of the knowledge on Paolo compared to here and for being 200% more opinionated than here.

I’m still worried we need one more experienced wing with elite shooting. TDS was sniper-level 50/40/90 in 19 games with high-usage, high minutes (from team injuries), but he didn’t prove it on a smaller usage alongside some starters.
I think it could/will be Jase by Playoffs time, but its his rookie year and we still benefit from another one with some real 3/2 size and veteran experience (for 1-2 years).
I don’t know if I fell into sociology/confidence nonsense too much, but I really wanted a practice lineup that drains 3’s at 100% and comes on the floor in the games as 3-man, 4-man units for a few minutes and doing the same at 38%. Just giving the Magic the vibe of a reset and a confidence boost in team-wide shooting.

TDS also was a mid-first round pick and a rookie. so there will be ups and downs. also getting used to a much longer season. I am hoping he makes the jump to be more consistent this next year. but i agree we could use another experienced wing.

[eyriq]

I mean, of course he'll have to perform, but he and Ant have pretty identical efficiency issue stuff throughout their first three seasons, and the max was given to Scottie Barnes, LaMelo, Cade, Mobley, etc. Some people on RealGM acting like he shouldn't get it is just funny. I mean, if you think NOBODY should get it, that's one thing, but that's an entirely different discussion.

Ant was year younger when he was drafted. Ant is still 23 (for about a month ).

I'm looking at those numbers and ...i don't really see it.

Edwards Regular season



Edwards playoffs


Paolo RS



Paolo Playoffs




And keeping in mind, average guard efficiency is solid 3-4% TS below forwards efficiency. But Paolo efficiency is worst than Edwards sophomore year in both RS and PO. It goes without saying that overall Paolo simply isn't Edwards tear of talent. Edwards on East would *probably* carry one team to finals already. Guy went to two WCF as best player before he turned 24. And Edwards is top 10 player today.
Even "scalps" he took are impressive : Lebron, Curry, Jokić all were beaten in last two years by Edwards led teams.

From people you mentioned, Lamelo's contract is terrible and i can't even find suitor in nba to get rid of him. Last two days on GB i had several posts how Hornets are worst ran team in nba. Lamelo's contract (and drafting, and roster building) are one of reasons why. But it all circles back to Lamelo who makes sick money, has playing style that makes nobody better ( actually worst), plays no defense and worst of all- plays like 30 games a year.

Cade is point guard in era where great point guards are both: pivotal for success and rare to find. Cade fits the bill.
Evan is DPOY, x2 all nba defensive team, all nba second team. Even if he is worst on offense (18 ppg, 63% TS) than he is, it's instant lock for max contract. Very rare combination of speed, size, mobility and still gifted enough to provide on both ends.
When you see his EPM , it suggests Mobley is top 15 player, impact vise.


Paolo deserves max on potential. But he has to prove he can be more than Rudy Gay / Derozan / Josh Smith ( but no defense) type player.
He also has to improve defense in regular season. But above all, him and Franz need to share the ball with rest of a team.
And it's on coaching to upgrade offensive system from 2004- elbow isolation to 2025-26 - team oriented basketball.

Edwards spent his first three years beside Towns (28), Gobert (32), Conley (36), Anderson (30), and McDaniels (23), so his growing pains were cushioned by a roster already built for playoff runs. Paolo carried Franz and Suggs, both 22, plus Black at 20 and Wendell at 25. One star grew inside a contender, the other lifted a college-aged group from 22 to 47 wins, which made a rookie-max an easy call.

[pepe1991]

I mean, of course he'll have to perform, but he and Ant have pretty identical efficiency issue stuff throughout their first three seasons, and the max was given to Scottie Barnes, LaMelo, Cade, Mobley, etc. Some people on RealGM acting like he shouldn't get it is just funny. I mean, if you think NOBODY should get it, that's one thing, but that's an entirely different discussion.

Ant was year younger when he was drafted. Ant is still 23 (for about a month ).

I'm looking at those numbers and ...i don't really see it.

Edwards Regular season



Edwards playoffs


Paolo RS



Paolo Playoffs




And keeping in mind, average guard efficiency is solid 3-4% TS below forwards efficiency. But Paolo efficiency is worst than Edwards sophomore year in both RS and PO. It goes without saying that overall Paolo simply isn't Edwards tear of talent. Edwards on East would *probably* carry one team to finals already. Guy went to two WCF as best player before he turned 24. And Edwards is top 10 player today.
Even "scalps" he took are impressive : Lebron, Curry, Jokić all were beaten in last two years by Edwards led teams.

From people you mentioned, Lamelo's contract is terrible and i can't even find suitor in nba to get rid of him. Last two days on GB i had several posts how Hornets are worst ran team in nba. Lamelo's contract (and drafting, and roster building) are one of reasons why. But it all circles back to Lamelo who makes sick money, has playing style that makes nobody better ( actually worst), plays no defense and worst of all- plays like 30 games a year.

Cade is point guard in era where great point guards are both: pivotal for success and rare to find. Cade fits the bill.
Evan is DPOY, x2 all nba defensive team, all nba second team. Even if he is worst on offense (18 ppg, 63% TS) than he is, it's instant lock for max contract. Very rare combination of speed, size, mobility and still gifted enough to provide on both ends.
When you see his EPM , it suggests Mobley is top 15 player, impact vise.


Paolo deserves max on potential. But he has to prove he can be more than Rudy Gay / Derozan / Josh Smith ( but no defense) type player.
He also has to improve defense in regular season. But above all, him and Franz need to share the ball with rest of a team.
And it's on coaching to upgrade offensive system from 2004- elbow isolation to 2025-26 - team oriented basketball.

Edwards spent his first three years beside Towns (28), Gobert (32), Conley (36), Anderson (30), and McDaniels (23), so his growing pains were cushioned by a roster already built for playoff runs. Paolo carried Franz and Suggs, both 22, plus Black at 20 and Wendell at 25. One star grew inside a contender, the other lifted a college-aged group from 22 to 47 wins, which made a rookie-max an easy call.

No.

Gobert didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
McDaniels was nba nobody until Edwards 3rd year ( bench player and part time starter before )
Conley didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
Slo Mo didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.

Edwards won 46 games in second year with starting 5 of:
PG: Russell
SG: Pat Bew
SG-SF: Edwards
PF: Vanderbilt
C: Towns

McDaniels started 31 games, Reid was rotation player but nothing special, Josh Okogie started 6 games, Beasley started some games, both Pat Bev and Russell got hurt, at some point Jordan McLaughlin was in rotation and started at PG 3 games.

Edwards is simply better player than Banchero.
Fact that he carried, at age of 20 , above mentioned team to 46 wins is living proof. 3/5 starters from that roster, 3 years later, are out of nba or on their way out of nba. Russell is on vet's minimum, Vanderbilt out of rotation, Pat Bev out of job (for full year now).

Like, is there anybody who actually believes that Banchero is better player ?

[RichCollab]

We have added shooting and play making. Hopefully we come into the season healthy and remain that way.

I would expect efficiency improvements.

[eyriq]

Ant was year younger when he was drafted. Ant is still 23 (for about a month ).

I'm looking at those numbers and ...i don't really see it.

Edwards Regular season



Edwards playoffs


Paolo RS



Paolo Playoffs




And keeping in mind, average guard efficiency is solid 3-4% TS below forwards efficiency. But Paolo efficiency is worst than Edwards sophomore year in both RS and PO. It goes without saying that overall Paolo simply isn't Edwards tear of talent. Edwards on East would *probably* carry one team to finals already. Guy went to two WCF as best player before he turned 24. And Edwards is top 10 player today.
Even "scalps" he took are impressive : Lebron, Curry, Jokić all were beaten in last two years by Edwards led teams.

From people you mentioned, Lamelo's contract is terrible and i can't even find suitor in nba to get rid of him. Last two days on GB i had several posts how Hornets are worst ran team in nba. Lamelo's contract (and drafting, and roster building) are one of reasons why. But it all circles back to Lamelo who makes sick money, has playing style that makes nobody better ( actually worst), plays no defense and worst of all- plays like 30 games a year.

Cade is point guard in era where great point guards are both: pivotal for success and rare to find. Cade fits the bill.
Evan is DPOY, x2 all nba defensive team, all nba second team. Even if he is worst on offense (18 ppg, 63% TS) than he is, it's instant lock for max contract. Very rare combination of speed, size, mobility and still gifted enough to provide on both ends.
When you see his EPM , it suggests Mobley is top 15 player, impact vise.


Paolo deserves max on potential. But he has to prove he can be more than Rudy Gay / Derozan / Josh Smith ( but no defense) type player.
He also has to improve defense in regular season. But above all, him and Franz need to share the ball with rest of a team.
And it's on coaching to upgrade offensive system from 2004- elbow isolation to 2025-26 - team oriented basketball.

Edwards spent his first three years beside Towns (28), Gobert (32), Conley (36), Anderson (30), and McDaniels (23), so his growing pains were cushioned by a roster already built for playoff runs. Paolo carried Franz and Suggs, both 22, plus Black at 20 and Wendell at 25. One star grew inside a contender, the other lifted a college-aged group from 22 to 47 wins, which made a rookie-max an easy call.

No.

Gobert didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
McDaniels was nba nobody until Edwards 3rd year ( bench player and part time starter before )
Conley didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
Slo Mo didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.

Edwards won 46 games in second year with starting 5 of:
PG: Russell
SG: Pat Bew
SF: Edwards
PF: Vanderbilt
C: Towns

McDaniels started 31 games, Reid was rotation player but nothing special, Josh Okogie started 6 games, Beasley started some games, both Pat Bev and Russell got hurt, at some point Jordan McLaughlin was in rotation and started at PG 3 games.

Fair enough on the timelines, but the gap I’m pointing to is still there. Ant’s Year-2 lineup had a 26-year-old All-NBA Towns stretching the floor at 41 percent from three, a 25-year-old Russell taking primary-creation reps, and Pat Bev at 33 setting the table on defense and spacing. That group finished 8th in offense and 12th in three-point percentage. Paolo’s Year-2 teammates were Franz and Suggs at 22, Black still a teenager, and Wendell at 24, and they dragged the 24th worst three-point rate while sitting 22nd in offense. Ant’s efficiency got to grow in a runway already paved; Paolo was laying asphalt while he drove. That context is why the Magic jumped from 22 to 47 wins and still ranked near the bottom offensively, and it is why the max made sense the moment Paolo was eligible.

[pepe1991]

Edwards spent his first three years beside Towns (28), Gobert (32), Conley (36), Anderson (30), and McDaniels (23), so his growing pains were cushioned by a roster already built for playoff runs. Paolo carried Franz and Suggs, both 22, plus Black at 20 and Wendell at 25. One star grew inside a contender, the other lifted a college-aged group from 22 to 47 wins, which made a rookie-max an easy call.

No.

Gobert didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
McDaniels was nba nobody until Edwards 3rd year ( bench player and part time starter before )
Conley didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
Slo Mo didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.

Edwards won 46 games in second year with starting 5 of:
PG: Russell
SG: Pat Bew
SF: Edwards
PF: Vanderbilt
C: Towns

McDaniels started 31 games, Reid was rotation player but nothing special, Josh Okogie started 6 games, Beasley started some games, both Pat Bev and Russell got hurt, at some point Jordan McLaughlin was in rotation and started at PG 3 games.

Fair enough on the timelines, but the gap I’m pointing to is still there. Ant’s Year-2 lineup had a 26-year-old All-NBA Towns stretching the floor at 41 percent from three, a 25-year-old Russell taking primary-creation reps, and Pat Bev at 33 setting the table on defense and spacing. That group finished 8th in offense and 12th in three-point percentage. Paolo’s Year-2 teammates were Franz and Suggs at 22, Black still a teenager, and Wendell at 24, and they dragged the 24th worst three-point rate while sitting 22nd in offense. Ant’s efficiency got to grow in a runway already paved; Paolo was laying asphalt while he drove. That context is why the Magic jumped from 22 to 47 wins and still ranked near the bottom offensively, and it is why the max made sense the moment Paolo was eligible.

Team who pays guy max contract for nothing but offense shouldn't be in position to be dead last offense in first place, because it signals that player isn't as good as you may think.

Wolves offense before 19 years old Edwards addition ( with Towns, Wiggins, Russell, Beasley ) =107,6

Wolves offense after adding 19 years old Edwards, losing Wiggins = 109,3

Wolves offense in second year = 113,8 (7th best, in context that would be Banchero's first year )

That is impact you expect from star offensive player after he gains some footing.

I find it silly talking in positive fashion about bums like Pat Bev or Russell. Especially because we all knew Magic spacing / No PG problems for years. But if you want to suck up for Jett Weltman, than you can't lay up book of excuses for Banchero in same breath. Because one contradicts other. Nothing stopped Weltman from making more logical roster around Banchero in past but- Jeff Weltman.
Current "changes" happened both:
- at least year too late
- costed x10 more than it would cost if they happened on time and in times when Magic asset was salary cap

But no, we had to watch clown show of Cole, Fultz, Suggs and Black pretending to be play makers of future until Weltman's a**didn't catch heat ( not that Bane is really solving everything but at least can shoot ... never mind paying for him Luka Dončić- level- haul and how that will age ).

[eyriq]

No.

Gobert didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
McDaniels was nba nobody until Edwards 3rd year ( bench player and part time starter before )
Conley didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
Slo Mo didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.

Edwards won 46 games in second year with starting 5 of:
PG: Russell
SG: Pat Bew
SF: Edwards
PF: Vanderbilt
C: Towns

McDaniels started 31 games, Reid was rotation player but nothing special, Josh Okogie started 6 games, Beasley started some games, both Pat Bev and Russell got hurt, at some point Jordan McLaughlin was in rotation and started at PG 3 games.

Fair enough on the timelines, but the gap I’m pointing to is still there. Ant’s Year-2 lineup had a 26-year-old All-NBA Towns stretching the floor at 41 percent from three, a 25-year-old Russell taking primary-creation reps, and Pat Bev at 33 setting the table on defense and spacing. That group finished 8th in offense and 12th in three-point percentage. Paolo’s Year-2 teammates were Franz and Suggs at 22, Black still a teenager, and Wendell at 24, and they dragged the 24th worst three-point rate while sitting 22nd in offense. Ant’s efficiency got to grow in a runway already paved; Paolo was laying asphalt while he drove. That context is why the Magic jumped from 22 to 47 wins and still ranked near the bottom offensively, and it is why the max made sense the moment Paolo was eligible.

Team who pays guy max contract for nothing but offense shouldn't be in position to be dead last offense in first place, because it signals that player isn't as good as you may think.

Wolves offense before 19 years old Edwards addition ( with Towns, Wiggins, Russell, Beasley ) =107,6

Wolves offense after adding 19 years old Edwards, losing Wiggins = 109,3

Wolves offense in second year = 113,8 (7th best, in context that would be Banchero's first year )

That is impact you expect from star offensive player after he gains some footing.

I find it silly talking in positive fashion about bums like Pat Bev or Russell. Especially because we all knew Magic spacing / No PG problems for years. But if you want to suck up for Jett Weltman, than you can't lay up book of excuses for Banchero in same breath. Because one contradicts other. Nothing stopped Weltman from making more logical roster around Banchero in past but- Jeff Weltman.

I'm not getting caught up in little nitpicky distractions. The offense struggled because the roster was built around defense, youth, and almost no shooting. Paolo and Franz had to create every tough bucket while defenders crowded the paint. Ant, in contrast, developed next to Towns, an All-NBA scorer who stretched the floor as well as any big in the league. The difference in environments is obvious. Blame the spacing, not the forwards. With Bane and Tyus now adding perimeter gravity, expect Paolo and Franz to guide this team into the top-15 offenses.

[Last Guardian]

The way I see it is OKC was mediocre just a couple seasons ago, and awful before that. But SGA was always pretty damn good. He just got more dangerous and efficient as his team got better. Paolo could similarly become more unstoppable as long as the roster keeps improving.

[VFX]

My issue with Paolo isn’t due to numbers or comparisons to other players at specific ages. It also has nothing to do with paying him this particular contract. The way the league works he’s going to get his. Orlando paid him what he’s due.

I just don’t like his game. Even if he was the most efficient player (he’s not at all), his bag is what it is. Hes a huge bodied PF that just doesn’t use his size.

If you have to compare him, he’s a bigger Carmelo Anthony that relies on taking extremely difficult shots and is arguably less efficient somehow inside around the rim. Thats not a system offensively that won anything built on efficiency. It’s not ideal that your #1 option on offense is largely inefficient playing on hard mode shot selection 90% of the time. It’s also not great when that skillset on high usage leads to bottom ranked offense multiple seasons in a row.

Now, if people want to argue that the roster surrounding him was the reason he plays specifically that way, then that’s fine. I don’t buy it, but fine. If people want to believe he will develop every other aspect of a well rounded player with better on ball playmaking, defense, rebounding, off-ball action, outside shot making, etc. then that’s also fine. He has years to show that now.

Where it gets to be a bit much is when posters here will tell people, that have watched nearly every game he’s played since entering the league, that others aren’t seeing what they are watching with Paolo. Like his game isn’t exactly as described. The card you can play in this argument is that “he’s not a finished product” and that’s fine.

Yeah the GB don’t really know what they are talking about half the time. They don’t watch Magic games exclusively. They look at box scores and draw conclusions. But those conclusions are sometimes brought about due to the actual basketball being played. Is there lacking context sometimes? Yes. But it’s not entirely dismissible.

Regardless, you obviously pay him and hope it all works out. The same is said for guys like Cade, Chet, and Mobley who have vastly different skillsets and flaws.

[JoshuaPotter]

Again, don't care about the max contract. It's simply the cost of business. He would be the max player any other time period whether he deserves it or not based on comparing him to generational players I am simply not sure is a good investment of time.

As many here have said, the stats don't lie but neither does the eye test. We can all pick and chose what stats / elements of his game to like / not like. At the end of the day though, he has that potential "it factor". That on paper if we surround him with the correct players it would boost him.

[eyriq]

My issue with Paolo isn’t due to numbers or comparisons to other players at specific ages. It also has nothing to do with paying him this particular contract. The way the league works he’s going to get his. Orlando paid him what he’s due.

I just don’t like his game. Even if he was the most efficient player (he’s not at all), his bag is what it is. Hes a huge bodied PF that just doesn’t use his size.

If you have to compare him, he’s a bigger Carmelo Anthony that relies on taking extremely difficult shots and is arguably less efficient somehow inside around the rim. Thats not a system offensively that won anything built on efficiency.

Now, if people want to argue that the roster surrounding him was the reason he plays specifically that way, then that’s fine. I don’t buy it, but fine. If people want to believe he will develop every other aspect of a well rounded player with better on ball playmaking, defense, rebounding, off-ball action, outside shot making, etc. then that’s also fine. He has years to show that now.

Where it gets to be a bit much is when posters here will tell people, that have watched nearly every game he’s played since entering the league, that others aren’t seeing what they are watching with Paolo. Like his game isn’t exactly as described. The card you can play in this argument is that “he’s not a finished product” and that’s fine.

Yeah the GB don’t really know what they are talking about half the time. They don’t watch Magic games exclusively. They look at box scores and draw conclusions. But those conclusions are sometimes brought about due to the actual basketball being played. Is there lacking context sometimes? Yes. But it’s not entirely dismissible.

Regardless, you obviously pay him and hope it all works out. The same is said for guys like Cade, Chet, and Mobley who have vastly different skillsets and flaws.

Paolo’s tape is a collage of influences. He isolates into high-degree mid-range jumpers that recall Carmelo, powers through traffic like Griffin on downhill drives, then sprays passes with a hint of Webber’s vision. The frame is built for brute force, yet the handle and footwork live on the perimeter. It is a hybrid style that at tempo becomes his own version of the beautiful game.

[JoshuaPotter]

There you go, Chet just got the rookie max for him.

I would consider Paolo better overall then Chet currently. But if he was on this team, I imagine chet would have been maxed as well.

[VFX]

My issue with Paolo isn’t due to numbers or comparisons to other players at specific ages. It also has nothing to do with paying him this particular contract. The way the league works he’s going to get his. Orlando paid him what he’s due.

I just don’t like his game. Even if he was the most efficient player (he’s not at all), his bag is what it is. Hes a huge bodied PF that just doesn’t use his size.

If you have to compare him, he’s a bigger Carmelo Anthony that relies on taking extremely difficult shots and is arguably less efficient somehow inside around the rim. Thats not a system offensively that won anything built on efficiency.

Now, if people want to argue that the roster surrounding him was the reason he plays specifically that way, then that’s fine. I don’t buy it, but fine. If people want to believe he will develop every other aspect of a well rounded player with better on ball playmaking, defense, rebounding, off-ball action, outside shot making, etc. then that’s also fine. He has years to show that now.

Where it gets to be a bit much is when posters here will tell people, that have watched nearly every game he’s played since entering the league, that others aren’t seeing what they are watching with Paolo. Like his game isn’t exactly as described. The card you can play in this argument is that “he’s not a finished product” and that’s fine.

Yeah the GB don’t really know what they are talking about half the time. They don’t watch Magic games exclusively. They look at box scores and draw conclusions. But those conclusions are sometimes brought about due to the actual basketball being played. Is there lacking context sometimes? Yes. But it’s not entirely dismissible.

Regardless, you obviously pay him and hope it all works out. The same is said for guys like Cade, Chet, and Mobley who have vastly different skillsets and flaws.

Paolo’s tape is a collage of influences. He isolates into high-degree mid-range jumpers that recall Carmelo, powers through traffic like Griffin on downhill drives, then sprays passes with a hint of Webber’s vision. The frame is built for brute force, yet the handle and footwork live on the perimeter. It is a hybrid style that at tempo becomes his own version of the beautiful game.

He doesn’t “live on the perimeter”.
He doesn’t finish like Griffin at the rim.
He has a poor a/to ratio for a “passer”

So while he possesses hints of those players and abilities they don’t equal efficiency, at least right now they certainly don’t.

And when I’m comparing his game to Melo I’m talking about tendencies. What he is choosing to go to during games the majority of time.

[GelbeWand09]

I mean, of course he'll have to perform, but he and Ant have pretty identical efficiency issue stuff throughout their first three seasons, and the max was given to Scottie Barnes, LaMelo, Cade, Mobley, etc. Some people on RealGM acting like he shouldn't get it is just funny. I mean, if you think NOBODY should get it, that's one thing, but that's an entirely different discussion.

Ant was year younger when he was drafted. Ant is still 23 (for about a month ).

I'm looking at those numbers and ...i don't really see it.

Edwards Regular season



Edwards playoffs


Paolo RS



Paolo Playoffs




And keeping in mind, average guard efficiency is solid 3-4% TS below forwards efficiency. But Paolo efficiency is worst than Edwards sophomore year in both RS and PO. It goes without saying that overall Paolo simply isn't Edwards tear of talent. Edwards on East would *probably* carry one team to finals already. Guy went to two WCF as best player before he turned 24. And Edwards is top 10 player today.
Even "scalps" he took are impressive : Lebron, Curry, Jokić all were beaten in last two years by Edwards led teams.

From people you mentioned, Lamelo's contract is terrible and i can't even find suitor in nba to get rid of him. Last two days on GB i had several posts how Hornets are worst ran team in nba. Lamelo's contract (and drafting, and roster building) are one of reasons why. But it all circles back to Lamelo who makes sick money, has playing style that makes nobody better ( actually worst), plays no defense and worst of all- plays like 30 games a year.

Cade is point guard in era where great point guards are both: pivotal for success and rare to find. Cade fits the bill.
Evan is DPOY, x2 all nba defensive team, all nba second team. Even if he is worst on offense (18 ppg, 63% TS) than he is, it's instant lock for max contract. Very rare combination of speed, size, mobility and still gifted enough to provide on both ends.
When you see his EPM , it suggests Mobley is top 15 player, impact vise.


Paolo deserves max on potential. But he has to prove he can be more than Rudy Gay / Derozan / Josh Smith ( but no defense) type player.
He also has to improve defense in regular season. But above all, him and Franz need to share the ball with rest of a team.
And it's on coaching to upgrade offensive system from 2004- elbow isolation to 2025-26 - team oriented basketball.

Edwards spent his first three years beside Towns (28), Gobert (32), Conley (36), Anderson (30), and McDaniels (23), so his growing pains were cushioned by a roster already built for playoff runs. Paolo carried Franz and Suggs, both 22, plus Black at 20 and Wendell at 25. One star grew inside a contender, the other lifted a college-aged group from 22 to 47 wins, which made a rookie-max an easy call.

Stats say Franz, the bench and the defense carried Paolo from 22 to 47 wins.

[jezzerinho]

Folks.

Let's do this.

Let's watch this season - and especially.the 2nd half after new players, coaches and systems are embedded - and draw our conclusions about Paolo then. How good is he really? Did he deserve the extension with PO? Can he be efficient? Is he a budding superstar or Randle.2.0?

Because however much both sides of those arguments would like to believe they are knowable answers as of today.... they're really not.

Give the kid a year in a team that actually values and knows somewhat how to play offense and then come back to these questions. Otherwise it's pure conjecture.

[Idiosyncratic]

You have to extend Paolo based off how good he can be. I don't really disagree with those who say he hasn't been that good yet. The efficiency and defense are both holding him back from being super valuable at this point.

But if you watch him play you see the obvious talent and he doesn't need a huge jump in efficiency to be worth a max. I think he will get there. I think without the injury last year we may have even seen like a 57 TS% already. I don't know if I see MVP like some people do, but I think he will be an all-star level max player. It is a bet we have to make regardless IMO.

[bigdogdylan5]

Ok I know some of you didn’t want to max Paolo but there was only one other choice. You would have to trade him. He wasn’t and shouldn’t take anything less than the max. I know you all want to only max out top 5 players but that’s not reality… there are a lot of teams that would max out Paolo in a heart beat. So instead of just pointing out issues you could give a solution but you refuse to do that because you just want to bitch.

It all comes back to Jeff believing in one of Suggs or Black to DEVELOP into the long term PG. I don’t think that is an unfair belief. Point guard is a hard position not dissimilar from QB in NFL some come in and succeed right away but most need development. NBA history is littered with PG that took some time to develop… Because of our roster we don’t even need a star point guard. I just don’t know how why people can’t wrap their heads around both Black and Suggs getting better as they get more experience. Fine let’s say they never do and it’s a real problem then we move Franz for that PG.

[tiderulz]

Ant was year younger when he was drafted. Ant is still 23 (for about a month ).

I'm looking at those numbers and ...i don't really see it.

Edwards Regular season



Edwards playoffs


Paolo RS



Paolo Playoffs




And keeping in mind, average guard efficiency is solid 3-4% TS below forwards efficiency. But Paolo efficiency is worst than Edwards sophomore year in both RS and PO. It goes without saying that overall Paolo simply isn't Edwards tear of talent. Edwards on East would *probably* carry one team to finals already. Guy went to two WCF as best player before he turned 24. And Edwards is top 10 player today.
Even "scalps" he took are impressive : Lebron, Curry, Jokić all were beaten in last two years by Edwards led teams.

From people you mentioned, Lamelo's contract is terrible and i can't even find suitor in nba to get rid of him. Last two days on GB i had several posts how Hornets are worst ran team in nba. Lamelo's contract (and drafting, and roster building) are one of reasons why. But it all circles back to Lamelo who makes sick money, has playing style that makes nobody better ( actually worst), plays no defense and worst of all- plays like 30 games a year.

Cade is point guard in era where great point guards are both: pivotal for success and rare to find. Cade fits the bill.
Evan is DPOY, x2 all nba defensive team, all nba second team. Even if he is worst on offense (18 ppg, 63% TS) than he is, it's instant lock for max contract. Very rare combination of speed, size, mobility and still gifted enough to provide on both ends.
When you see his EPM , it suggests Mobley is top 15 player, impact vise.


Paolo deserves max on potential. But he has to prove he can be more than Rudy Gay / Derozan / Josh Smith ( but no defense) type player.
He also has to improve defense in regular season. But above all, him and Franz need to share the ball with rest of a team.
And it's on coaching to upgrade offensive system from 2004- elbow isolation to 2025-26 - team oriented basketball.

Edwards spent his first three years beside Towns (28), Gobert (32), Conley (36), Anderson (30), and McDaniels (23), so his growing pains were cushioned by a roster already built for playoff runs. Paolo carried Franz and Suggs, both 22, plus Black at 20 and Wendell at 25. One star grew inside a contender, the other lifted a college-aged group from 22 to 47 wins, which made a rookie-max an easy call.

No.

Gobert didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
McDaniels was nba nobody until Edwards 3rd year ( bench player and part time starter before )
Conley didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
Slo Mo didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.

Edwards won 46 games in second year with starting 5 of:
PG: Russell
SG: Pat Bew
SG-SF: Edwards
PF: Vanderbilt
C: Towns

McDaniels started 31 games, Reid was rotation player but nothing special, Josh Okogie started 6 games, Beasley started some games, both Pat Bev and Russell got hurt, at some point Jordan McLaughlin was in rotation and started at PG 3 games.

Edwards is simply better player than Banchero.
Fact that he carried, at age of 20 , above mentioned team to 46 wins is living proof. 3/5 starters from that roster, 3 years later, are out of nba or on their way out of nba. Russell is on vet's minimum, Vanderbilt out of rotation, Pat Bev out of job (for full year now).

Like, is there anybody who actually believes that Banchero is better player ?

right now? no. Edwards does have 2 more years in the league than Paolo, which is a lot in the early stage. Could Paolo end up better? possibly. Edwards isnt some defensive stalwart himself. Will be hoping that Paolo plays more efficiently and hoping better guard play will help

[Audi]

Ant was year younger when he was drafted. Ant is still 23 (for about a month ).

I'm looking at those numbers and ...i don't really see it.

Edwards Regular season



Edwards playoffs


Paolo RS



Paolo Playoffs




And keeping in mind, average guard efficiency is solid 3-4% TS below forwards efficiency. But Paolo efficiency is worst than Edwards sophomore year in both RS and PO. It goes without saying that overall Paolo simply isn't Edwards tear of talent. Edwards on East would *probably* carry one team to finals already. Guy went to two WCF as best player before he turned 24. And Edwards is top 10 player today.
Even "scalps" he took are impressive : Lebron, Curry, Jokić all were beaten in last two years by Edwards led teams.

From people you mentioned, Lamelo's contract is terrible and i can't even find suitor in nba to get rid of him. Last two days on GB i had several posts how Hornets are worst ran team in nba. Lamelo's contract (and drafting, and roster building) are one of reasons why. But it all circles back to Lamelo who makes sick money, has playing style that makes nobody better ( actually worst), plays no defense and worst of all- plays like 30 games a year.

Cade is point guard in era where great point guards are both: pivotal for success and rare to find. Cade fits the bill.
Evan is DPOY, x2 all nba defensive team, all nba second team. Even if he is worst on offense (18 ppg, 63% TS) than he is, it's instant lock for max contract. Very rare combination of speed, size, mobility and still gifted enough to provide on both ends.
When you see his EPM , it suggests Mobley is top 15 player, impact vise.


Paolo deserves max on potential. But he has to prove he can be more than Rudy Gay / Derozan / Josh Smith ( but no defense) type player.
He also has to improve defense in regular season. But above all, him and Franz need to share the ball with rest of a team.
And it's on coaching to upgrade offensive system from 2004- elbow isolation to 2025-26 - team oriented basketball.

Edwards spent his first three years beside Towns (28), Gobert (32), Conley (36), Anderson (30), and McDaniels (23), so his growing pains were cushioned by a roster already built for playoff runs. Paolo carried Franz and Suggs, both 22, plus Black at 20 and Wendell at 25. One star grew inside a contender, the other lifted a college-aged group from 22 to 47 wins, which made a rookie-max an easy call.

No.

Gobert didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
McDaniels was nba nobody until Edwards 3rd year ( bench player and part time starter before )
Conley didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.
Slo Mo didn't play with Edwards until Edwards 3rd year.

Edwards won 46 games in second year with starting 5 of:
PG: Russell
SG: Pat Bew
SG-SF: Edwards
PF: Vanderbilt
C: Towns

McDaniels started 31 games, Reid was rotation player but nothing special, Josh Okogie started 6 games, Beasley started some games, both Pat Bev and Russell got hurt, at some point Jordan McLaughlin was in rotation and started at PG 3 games.

Edwards is simply better player than Banchero.
Fact that he carried, at age of 20 , above mentioned team to 46 wins is living proof. 3/5 starters from that roster, 3 years later, are out of nba or on their way out of nba. Russell is on vet's minimum, Vanderbilt out of rotation, Pat Bev out of job (for full year now).

Like, is there anybody who actually believes that Banchero is better player ?

I will say this - Paolo is closer to being a better player than Edwards than he is to being the next Rudy Gay, Derozan, or Josh Smith. Maybe you weren’t implying that though.