Holy Offseason I Can’t Believe it’s July FA/Trade/Waiver Thread

[hugepatsfan]

Doesn't have to be Hugo, would be great if he earns it though. Baylor is the main one to me. His minutes have to be up in Hauser or greater territory, if Simons isn't around. Get the dude 25-30mpg this year - why not? Then whoever out of Hugo, Minott, Walsh emerges for the rest of the time, great. If none really emerge, oh well.

Unfortunately, Hauser is problematic, if not right now, eventually he will be for this reason. Good player but what he does right now I think can be replaced by others. He's on a good deal I mean, after 9/7 what can a Simons/Hauser package get us? That's where my mind's going to.

I waffle on Sam. When he was hurt last year he was pretty rough. But, healthy, as your 8+ man, on that deal, he's solid.

I actually think you can't aggregate on top of Simons, tbh. I know we can technically if we stay under the apron, but with Jays and White, I just don't think you can fit another $30M+ guy on the roster going forward. I think you're going to need to get a couple rotation guys out of that money, not stack more on top of it for one really good guy.

I think you can fit another $30M guy on the roster. I think our current roster proves that. We're currently in position to be under the 2nd apron if we carried 14 guys instead of 15 and of our current 15 one is Tatum so we're kind of already doing the 14 man roster thing really. Simons at $27M basically is that $30M player.

Tatum - supermax
Brown - supermax
White - current extension
Simons - right about $30M
Hauser - $12M/year deal
Pritchard - $8M/year deal
Niang - $8M vet signing

Rest is rookie contracts and minimum signings.

I think our payroll structure is set up PERFECTLY for another $30M player to be an in-the-tax but below the 2nd apron team. That's where my expectation are for us to be during the rest of Tatum's prime, and be willing to go into the 2nd apron for a year or 2.

The issue right now is roster fit. Simons, as a scoring guard, simply isn't the right $30Mish player to have. Not when you have Pritchard as a similar archetype and then even some overlap with Hauser and your best rookie contract guys. I think our payroll structure is great right now, just need to swap some of them for similarly priced guys at different positions.

[bucknersrevenge]

Doesn't have to be Hugo, would be great if he earns it though. Baylor is the main one to me. His minutes have to be up in Hauser or greater territory, if Simons isn't around. Get the dude 25-30mpg this year - why not? Then whoever out of Hugo, Minott, Walsh emerges for the rest of the time, great. If none really emerge, oh well.

Unfortunately, Hauser is problematic, if not right now, eventually he will be for this reason. Good player but what he does right now I think can be replaced by others. He's on a good deal I mean, after 9/7 what can a Simons/Hauser package get us? That's where my mind's going to.

I waffle on Sam. When he was hurt last year he was pretty rough. But, healthy, as your 8+ man, on that deal, he's solid.

I actually think you can't aggregate on top of Simons, tbh. I know we can technically if we stay under the apron, but with Jays and White, I just don't think you can fit another $30M+ guy on the roster going forward. I think you're going to need to get a couple rotation guys out of that money, not stack more on top of it for one really good guy.

Check me on this, but the rule I read was 60 days before you can aggregate a traded player, hence the 9/7 reference. As for your second point, that is what I've been wrestling with as well. Ideally some of that money would've gone to Luke Kornet, or another guy I would've really loved: Steven Adams (**** you Ime).

[redslastlaugh]

OKC just maxed Chet and drafted a C
Hartenstein is a $30 million big, in his prime, who just started for a champion ... and he's not in OKCs longterm budget
So maybe he's the piece

Though Brad Stevens primary offensive belief is that shooting big men open the court for wings/guards to attack, and the only bigs Brad has acquired beyond minimums were shooting bigs (Al, KP, Theis) and Hartenstein doesn't shoot it, at all ... 0-19 on 3PTA last yr

The issue right now is roster fit. Simons, as a scoring guard, simply isn't the right $30Mish player to have. Not when you have Pritchard as a similar archetype and then even some overlap with Hauser and your best rookie contract guys. I think our payroll structure is great right now, just need to swap some of them for similarly priced guys at different positions.

[return2glory]

Vuc is an expiring contract and around 6m cheaper than Simons.

So if the Cs are not winning a chip in 2026 then why does it matter if Vuc is on the decline?

The more reason Vuc is not needed on this team this year. He will get in the development on Queta and Amari. Play these guys. See who out of the 2 can be counted on for 2026-2027, when winning will matter more. Play the younger guys more this coming season. Give them experience and reps and get in the lottery. I don't want to be a 6th, 7th or 8th seed and get bounced in the first round.

[Fierce1]

Vuc is an expiring contract and around 6m cheaper than Simons.

So if the Cs are not winning a chip in 2026 then why does it matter if Vuc is on the decline?

Not to answer your question with a question but:

If we agree that the C's aren't winning, what's the point of trading for him in the first place?

Because I want it to be Vuc and Coby White for Simons, Hauser, and Tillman.

Solves 2 issues, the cap apron thing and potential starting guard of the future in Coby White.

[Fierce1]

Vuc is an expiring contract and around 6m cheaper than Simons.

So if the Cs are not winning a chip in 2026 then why does it matter if Vuc is on the decline?

I think Simons is better to keep right now just because there's some semblance of long term value. If he plays well, maybe he'll be worth signing? Maybe it's worth signing him just to trade him later. Maybe you sign him and that frees you up to trade Pritchard at high value in a trade for a big. Maybe you can S&T him to create a TPE or land a player you like next year. Even in a world where Simons isn't himself a long term keeper, there's still a lot of scenarios where he's useful. Vuc - not so much.

Now if we get to the deadline and the team looks really good but Simons isn't a big piece of that and we really need roster balance, ok. But right now I don't see us competing in a meaningful way to where I'm trading long term value or even potential of it for a stop gap solution.

The deal is Vuc and Coby White for Simons, Sam, and Tillman.

If Brad needs to sweeten the deal then add picks because I think Coby White can be the guard of the future for the Cs.

[bucknersrevenge]

Vuc is an expiring contract and around 6m cheaper than Simons.

So if the Cs are not winning a chip in 2026 then why does it matter if Vuc is on the decline?

Not to answer your question with a question but:

If we agree that the C's aren't winning, what's the point of trading for him in the first place?

Because I want it to be Vuc and Coby White for Simons, Hauser, and Tillman.

Solves 2 issues, the cap apron thing and potential starting guard of the future in Coby White.

Interesting idea. I don't think Chicago is in a rush to trade Coby White any time soon but the idea is interesting. I don't think paying Simons (an older player than White btw) and getting Hauser is a big enough incentive for them to make a deal like this.

[djFan71]

Unfortunately, Hauser is problematic, if not right now, eventually he will be for this reason. Good player but what he does right now I think can be replaced by others. He's on a good deal I mean, after 9/7 what can a Simons/Hauser package get us? That's where my mind's going to.

I waffle on Sam. When he was hurt last year he was pretty rough. But, healthy, as your 8+ man, on that deal, he's solid.

I actually think you can't aggregate on top of Simons, tbh. I know we can technically if we stay under the apron, but with Jays and White, I just don't think you can fit another $30M+ guy on the roster going forward. I think you're going to need to get a couple rotation guys out of that money, not stack more on top of it for one really good guy.

I think you can fit another $30M guy on the roster. I think our current roster proves that. We're currently in position to be under the 2nd apron if we carried 14 guys instead of 15 and of our current 15 one is Tatum so we're kind of already doing the 14 man roster thing really. Simons at $27M basically is that $30M player.

Tatum - supermax
Brown - supermax
White - current extension
Simons - right about $30M
Hauser - $12M/year deal
Pritchard - $8M/year deal
Niang - $8M vet signing

Rest is rookie contracts and minimum signings.

I think our payroll structure is set up PERFECTLY for another $30M player to be an in-the-tax but below the 2nd apron team. That's where my expectation are for us to be during the rest of Tatum's prime, and be willing to go into the 2nd apron for a year or 2.

The issue right now is roster fit. Simons, as a scoring guard, simply isn't the right $30Mish player to have. Not when you have Pritchard as a similar archetype and then even some overlap with Hauser and your best rookie contract guys. I think our payroll structure is great right now, just need to swap some of them for similarly priced guys at different positions.

It also is a pretty thin / top heavy team. You don't really even have 5 starters there.

Might be splitting hairs, but that number is right around the tipping point. Rather than keeping a single $30ishM guy or aggregating it with Hauser $ to get a $40M guy, I'd rather have someone in the $20-25M range and another one in the MLE range. Then cheap out sooner on anyone above vet min

Tatum - supermax
Brown - supermax
White - current extension
$20-25M guy
MLE $ guy
Hauser - $12M/year deal
Pritchard - $8M/year deal
- no Niang level $
Rookies/vet mins

Comes down to the details of who, obviously. I'm not sure there's a tier difference going up to $30M that doesn't hit the diminishing returns of being the 4th/5th option. I think a lot of the deals are going to be in the $20Ms like Myles Turner type, not $30M+. Get your guy for a good amount over the MLE but not double it.

[hugepatsfan]

Vuc is an expiring contract and around 6m cheaper than Simons.

So if the Cs are not winning a chip in 2026 then why does it matter if Vuc is on the decline?

I think Simons is better to keep right now just because there's some semblance of long term value. If he plays well, maybe he'll be worth signing? Maybe it's worth signing him just to trade him later. Maybe you sign him and that frees you up to trade Pritchard at high value in a trade for a big. Maybe you can S&T him to create a TPE or land a player you like next year. Even in a world where Simons isn't himself a long term keeper, there's still a lot of scenarios where he's useful. Vuc - not so much.

Now if we get to the deadline and the team looks really good but Simons isn't a big piece of that and we really need roster balance, ok. But right now I don't see us competing in a meaningful way to where I'm trading long term value or even potential of it for a stop gap solution.

The deal is Vuc and Coby White for Simons, Sam, and Tillman.

If Brad needs to sweeten the deal then add picks because I think Coby White can be the guard of the future for the Cs.

He definitely needs to add picks. But even then, I think CHI would negatively value the Vuc/Simons swap. CHI is kind of in the same spot we're in competitively, they have an imbalanced roster with a ton of PG/SG/SF and a lack of PFs and they want to compete for the playoffs. Difference is they do have some legit centers in Vuc/Collins. They aren't going to want to undo that to worsen their roster balance. I don't see them having any interest in that component of a deal. It's a player they don't want long term at a spot they need in Vuc for a player they don't want long term at a spot they don't need in Simons. It's the reverse for us so all the reasons we'd do it are why they wouldn't.

I can see Hauser + pick for White though. Going from a guard to a SF actually helps them a bit with their balance, but it's also just a fair value trade. Hauser has long term value on his deal and a pick is always nice to add. Obviously they have to weight it out with their desire to compete, but it could make sense. That's the type of deal that prioritizes the future but still salvages a cohesive roster in the short term.

I do really like White for this team. The double White backcourt fits well and rounds out the starting unit well with Brown/Tatum playing the forward spots where their ball handling isn't as much in the spot light as if they're SG/SF. Have to assess what White's extension will look like though and still need a roster balance move to turn Simons' salary slot into a center.

But if we opened up 2026 with:

White / Pritchard
White / Hugo
Brown / Scheierman
Tatum / Niang (re-signed)
(Center from a trade) / Queta

I'd be ok with that... The center from a trade can come from a Simons deal mid year, a S&T with him next year, or a trade with Porzingis TPE, a MLE signing. We also have our pick to use as well.

[hugepatsfan]

I waffle on Sam. When he was hurt last year he was pretty rough. But, healthy, as your 8+ man, on that deal, he's solid.

I actually think you can't aggregate on top of Simons, tbh. I know we can technically if we stay under the apron, but with Jays and White, I just don't think you can fit another $30M+ guy on the roster going forward. I think you're going to need to get a couple rotation guys out of that money, not stack more on top of it for one really good guy.

I think you can fit another $30M guy on the roster. I think our current roster proves that. We're currently in position to be under the 2nd apron if we carried 14 guys instead of 15 and of our current 15 one is Tatum so we're kind of already doing the 14 man roster thing really. Simons at $27M basically is that $30M player.

Tatum - supermax
Brown - supermax
White - current extension
Simons - right about $30M
Hauser - $12M/year deal
Pritchard - $8M/year deal
Niang - $8M vet signing

Rest is rookie contracts and minimum signings.

I think our payroll structure is set up PERFECTLY for another $30M player to be an in-the-tax but below the 2nd apron team. That's where my expectation are for us to be during the rest of Tatum's prime, and be willing to go into the 2nd apron for a year or 2.

The issue right now is roster fit. Simons, as a scoring guard, simply isn't the right $30Mish player to have. Not when you have Pritchard as a similar archetype and then even some overlap with Hauser and your best rookie contract guys. I think our payroll structure is great right now, just need to swap some of them for similarly priced guys at different positions.

It also is a pretty thin / top heavy team. You don't really even have 5 starters there.

Might be splitting hairs, but that number is right around the tipping point. Rather than keeping a single $30ishM guy or aggregating it with Hauser $ to get a $40M guy, I'd rather have someone in the $20-25M range and another one in the MLE range. Then cheap out sooner on anyone above vet min

Tatum - supermax
Brown - supermax
White - current extension
$20-25M guy
MLE $ guy
Hauser - $12M/year deal
Pritchard - $8M/year deal
- no Niang level $
Rookies/vet mins

Comes down to the details of who, obviously. I'm not sure there's a tier difference going up to $30M that doesn't hit the diminishing returns of being the 4th/5th option. I think a lot of the deals are going to be in the $20Ms like Myles Turner type, not $30M+. Get your guy for a good amount over the MLE but not double it.

Yeah this makes sense too. Instead of one guy at $30M and Niang at $8M, you're merging that to a slightly smaller top guy and a full MLE guy. That works too. It really all depends on the specific guys available and how much you're getting out of those rookie scale/vet min guys and at what positions.

Our 2026 pick is a huge wildcard here. If they leave the roster as woeful as it is in the front court, that's probably a decent pick. Not saying we're getting the #1 pick or anything unless we have incredible luck, but realistically I'd expect our pick to be 10th-16th right now which means make the play in and then pick falls where you land in that. I say that because it feels like CLE/NYK/ORL/MIL/DET/ATL should all be better on paper if we can't fix the front court. It's also possible we do, but if we don't that pick should yield something with more upside than we're used to. If that's a starting caliber player, then you can consolidate money more in other spots.

The final allocation has to be looked at with real names, but as a general guidelines I like our payroll structure. I also think that once they reset the 2nd apron this year and next, they'll be willing to go into the 2nd apron again. People think of it like the boogeyman, but the 2nd apron really isn't that bad if you have a well built team and you aren't a repeater with those crazy pick penalties. The basketball limitations aren't that bad really so long as you have your core. It's trouble if you're still needing to make top of the roster swings to compete, but you have to be terrible mismanaged for that to be the case where you need that and are in the 2nd apron. Just need to make sure you only stay in it for 2 years.

[djFan71]

I think you can fit another $30M guy on the roster. I think our current roster proves that. We're currently in position to be under the 2nd apron if we carried 14 guys instead of 15 and of our current 15 one is Tatum so we're kind of already doing the 14 man roster thing really. Simons at $27M basically is that $30M player.

Tatum - supermax
Brown - supermax
White - current extension
Simons - right about $30M
Hauser - $12M/year deal
Pritchard - $8M/year deal
Niang - $8M vet signing

Rest is rookie contracts and minimum signings.

I think our payroll structure is set up PERFECTLY for another $30M player to be an in-the-tax but below the 2nd apron team. That's where my expectation are for us to be during the rest of Tatum's prime, and be willing to go into the 2nd apron for a year or 2.

The issue right now is roster fit. Simons, as a scoring guard, simply isn't the right $30Mish player to have. Not when you have Pritchard as a similar archetype and then even some overlap with Hauser and your best rookie contract guys. I think our payroll structure is great right now, just need to swap some of them for similarly priced guys at different positions.

It also is a pretty thin / top heavy team. You don't really even have 5 starters there.

Might be splitting hairs, but that number is right around the tipping point. Rather than keeping a single $30ishM guy or aggregating it with Hauser $ to get a $40M guy, I'd rather have someone in the $20-25M range and another one in the MLE range. Then cheap out sooner on anyone above vet min

Tatum - supermax
Brown - supermax
White - current extension
$20-25M guy
MLE $ guy
Hauser - $12M/year deal
Pritchard - $8M/year deal
- no Niang level $
Rookies/vet mins

Comes down to the details of who, obviously. I'm not sure there's a tier difference going up to $30M that doesn't hit the diminishing returns of being the 4th/5th option. I think a lot of the deals are going to be in the $20Ms like Myles Turner type, not $30M+. Get your guy for a good amount over the MLE but not double it.

Yeah this makes sense too. Instead of one guy at $30M and Niang at $8M, you're merging that to a slightly smaller top guy and a full MLE guy. That works too. It really all depends on the specific guys available and how much you're getting out of those rookie scale/vet min guys and at what positions.

Our 2026 pick is a huge wildcard here. If they leave the roster as woeful as it is in the front court, that's probably a decent pick. Not saying we're getting the #1 pick or anything unless we have incredible luck, but realistically I'd expect our pick to be 10th-16th right now which means make the play in and then pick falls where you land in that. I say that because it feels like CLE/NYK/ORL/MIL/DET/ATL should all be better on paper if we can't fix the front court. It's also possible we do, but if we don't that pick should yield something with more upside than we're used to. If that's a starting caliber player, then you can consolidate money more in other spots.

The final allocation has to be looked at with real names, but as a general guidelines I like our payroll structure. I also think that once they reset the 2nd apron this year and next, they'll be willing to go into the 2nd apron again. People think of it like the boogeyman, but the 2nd apron really isn't that bad if you have a well built team and you aren't a repeater with those crazy pick penalties. The basketball limitations aren't that bad really so long as you have your core. It's trouble if you're still needing to make top of the roster swings to compete, but you have to be terrible mismanaged for that to be the case where you need that and are in the 2nd apron. Just need to make sure you only stay in it for 2 years.

Yep, agree on all of that. Real names make the difference. If the perfect guy is $32M, then sure go for it.

And definitely agree on going back into the 2nd, and I'm pretty sure Brad does as well. The goal is to win titles. Be smart about keeping the penalties at bay by staying out of it when you're not in a position to contend, but once you are, go full bore.

I might even go a step further and say you can stay in beyond 2 years under the perfect scenario. If your core is locked in and winning titles, I'd be willing to have a pick frozen at 30 in the future for another shot at it. That was my thought for 25-26 in a perfect health scenario - they would have dumped Hauser to save a bunch of real money but gone for the 3-peat over the apron with Jrue/KP. It obviously didn't pan out that way, but if those 2 and Tatum were healthy and playing at their peak we could have won this year, and tried to go for it again next.

[colincb]

Hopefully, the Niang vs. Hauser debate is dead. Still, just for the record, Hauser's career advanced stats are clearly better than Niang's both during the regular season and playoffs, according to basketball-reference.com.

[bucknersrevenge]

I was thinking. Given that we are likely Simons best chance to both win after next season AND get paid at the same time, maybe Brad negotiate him down from a 27.7M AAV down closer to 20M if he adds more years. Simons definitely does want to win and be in the playoffs Sell him on 3/60M and we might be cooking.

[bucknersrevenge]

Hopefully, the Niang vs. Hauser debate is dead. Still, just for the record, Hauser's career advanced stats are clearly better than Niang's both during the regular season and playoffs, according to basketball-reference.com.

It's not really a debate I don't think. Both guys have skills that complement our core players. It's more about roster construction fit than it is a 1 v 1 talent evaluation.

[celticgreenie]

I wonder how a Coby White extension would look different or similar to an Anfernee Simons one. Part of me thinks White might get a bigger extension as he was more criminally underpaid the last few years.

[darrendaye]

Hopefully, the Niang vs. Hauser debate is dead. Still, just for the record, Hauser's career advanced stats are clearly better than Niang's both during the regular season and playoffs, according to basketball-reference.com.

Someone else posted a few pages back, Hauser is a 2/3 defensively. They're both threatening 3pt shooters. There is no real friction between the 2 for playing time.

[SuperDeluxe]

I was thinking. Given that we are likely Simons best chance to both win after next season AND get paid at the same time, maybe Brad negotiate him down from a 27.7M AAV down closer to 20M if he adds more years. Simons definitely does want to win and be in the playoffs Sell him on 3/60M and we might be cooking.

I read somewhere that Portland made Simons available because he wanted to get paid and the Blazers weren't ready to open their wallet for him. I can't imagine him willing to offer a discount to Boston, one of the reasons why he might never play a minute in green.

[Celts17Pride]

Vooch is like Simons, serves no purpose at all. Neither one will be on the Celtics in 2026/2027 and all they will do is help win games in a gap year when the Celtics don’t necessarily want to win. Need to move Simons and possibly a 1st round pick for someone you want to stick around in Boston the next 3-4 years. Simons and Vooch are not those players.

[djFan71]

Been a few days since I dropped the Kuz bomb, but MIL has a nice TPE now that fits Georges. On the T&T board, someone proposed MIL gets a couple 2nds from WAS in a 2026 1st round swap and then we get:

Kuzma + 2nds for Simons and Niang.

That saves $11M which gets us $1m below the 1st apron. $7M above the tax line.

You could do a myriad of things from that point:
- TPMLE this summer on a guy you want going forward for when we contend again.
- Al this summer - if he would
- Flip Kuz again to duck the tax. Keep him as expiring salary to trade next summer (or early expiring at the deadline).
- Hauser for someone making $3M or less to duck the tax now.
- Some combo of the above
- Nothing

[Riverwalk2021]

No offense to the Hauser fans here but he's just a decent player all things considered. He has an elite skill but he's average or worse in pretty much every other category. He moves the ball pretty well but he doesn't have great instincts or a nose for the ball (intangibles). Solid minutes eater during the regular season but over the past two postseasons, he's been mostly unplayable. He simply struggles to find his shot against the better teams like most guys at his level. I certainly wouldn't miss him if they swapped him for a similar level big. I think we have four (three if you exclude Tatum) guys who are playable in the playoffs right now.

All NBA > Tatum.
All-Star > Brown, White.
Elite bench player to solid starter > Pritchard.
Solid bench player to below average starter > Simmons, Niang, Hauser.
Fringe rotation to Wildcard > Baylor, Hugo, Queta, the 2 TWolves scrubs we signed, etc.
Terrorists > Walsh, Tillman.

Can Brad flip our mediocre/lousy players into Pritchard level guys w/o giving real draft capital? Not likely but hopefully we get one before the start of the season lol