Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - Livingston Back on a 1 Year Deal - Page 76

[RRyder823]

We can debate Rollins ability to play point, but Rollins is a good defender with some size, who can switch.

Anthony isn't a point guard in my view. His skill is shooting, which he hasn't done very well. I expect his numbers will improve wth Giannis, but Rollins is a better overall player. He's more efficient and a better defender.

I said earlier that this isn't a champonship roster yet, because people are relying on Rollins and KPJ to be consistently good. That's a big ask, but I've seen enough of Anthony to want Rollins playing ahead of him.

Who you want to see playing ahead of whom is irrelevant. This is about filling out a rotation and having a viable backup guard that can handle the ball and shoot if Rollins and Porter don't meet these lofty expectations the board has set for them because we may be (probably?) asking too much of them, which you straight up agree with lol.

I don't know how many ways to say this. I don't think Anthony is a good player. That's the basis for not wanting him.

I do think he has more basketball skills than Kuzma, but I dont think he's a winning player. So if Rollins and KPJ flame out, this team is screwed and Anthony isn't going to solve that problem.

Anthony is an irrelevant signing only to the extent that Doc keeps him on the bench. If he's a 25 minute a game player, that's a probem.

Ok annnnnddddd?

Please name the vet minimum players that would solve that problem

How many guys that you would describe as "winning players" are available right now for the vet minimum?

He's a young guy who hopefully can rehab his value in a new location for cheap. If not you move on


Sent from my SM-S918U using RealGM mobile app

[JayMKE]

Doc isn't the modern and dynamic thinking coach we'd all want but I don't think he's actively evil and wants to lose, he did bench Lopez and Kuzma in the playoffs. For all the talk about Doc being a choker, he usually exceeds low expectations. Maybe its a cope but I'm trying to be optimistic, if they could locate larger 3 & D wing defender I'd really would like the balance of the roster.

who would you have preferred as a 3rd PG, Mark Sears?

[Knightro]

Cole Anthony is a good dude.

A little too emotional and that has impacted his confidence and play on the court, but he is really well liked in the locker room. A legit good guy for team chemistry.

As far as on the court... it's a mixed bag.

He's capable of having legitimately monster games where you're like "holy crap, this dude is awesome!"

Just over the past couple of years he's had...

35-8-9
22-4-9
27-3-4
24-7-4
30-7-7
25-6-5
23-10-9

All with good shooting percentages and all in victories. There will absolutely be two or three games this season that Cole is on fire and straight up wins for you.

He's also a VERY good rebounding guard, one of the better ones in the league.

But those monster games are, unfortunately, few and far between. There's way too many 0-7, 1-9, 3-12 kind of games where he just doesn't have it and really hurts the team when he's out there.

Defensively, he's not very good. His defensive metrics are bit inflated because he's such a good defensive rebounder. He's a one position defender because of his size and he's very grabby which leads to a lot of dumb fouls. He's a great load up and jump off two feet leaper, so he can actually fly in for some blocks out of nowhere, but otherwise he's just not overly helpful on the defensive end.

His 3PT shot is very inconsistent, only one season over 35.3% in his five year career. He takes them, but he just doesn't make enough of them.

He's a guy who really gets down on himself easily and that impacts his play. If Doc and his staff can get him feeling confident, he can be a good bench scorer like he was in 2023 when he averaged 13 PPG off the bench on a .570 TS%. That year earned him the 13M a year contract he got, but he sadly just regressed pretty badly right after that. There were some rumors that he dealt with some stuff in his personal life (break up maybe?) that negatively impacted things for him.

But he's a very likable dude. He's quirky and gives fun postgame interviews when he plays well.

I wish him all the best and hope he does well for your team except when he plays the Magic.

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

I'm still at a loss as to the negativity on the Anthony signing. There's nothing preventing Doc leaning more into 3-guard lineups, playing Kuzma less at the 3 and more at the 4, and cutting Prince entirely out of the rotation. As it's been stated multiple times in here, while not ideal, having GTJ or AJ start and play the minutes at the 3 was extremely effective last year due to the sheer firepower/spacing you get next to Giannis and the lack of elite offensive SFs around the league to make us pay for that. There's absolutely room for all 5 guards to get their playing time without cutting a guy like Rollins out of the rotation. And if one or two of those guys doesn't live up to expectations, having another option to try out is just a positive.

Because people love to say that we should always just force feed minutes to certain prospects/young players we like, until of course it becomes an Ajax situation and it actively costs the team wins. It's the same with the Prince stuff except even weirder because again, Anthony's literally the 2nd youngest guard on the roster right now. I'm interested to see how he looks with Giannis and as far away from that horrendous offensive/spacing environment that he had in Orlando.

Yeah, it is really weird to me how on one side we have a lot of people saying we need to find roster spots for guys like Cormac Ryan who will be 27 at the start of the season and give an extremely long leash to AJax, but then their standards on vet mins are so high that we are pooh-poohing a 25 year-old who was a part time starter on a playoff team to come in as out 3rd PG.

[JBucks]

How do we get Avdija from Portland? Does Kuzma and the 31 first (swap?) get it done?

[Chad34]

I'm still at a loss as to the negativity on the Anthony signing. There's nothing preventing Doc leaning more into 3-guard lineups, playing Kuzma less at the 3 and more at the 4, and cutting Prince entirely out of the rotation. As it's been stated multiple times in here, while not ideal, having GTJ or AJ start and play the minutes at the 3 was extremely effective last year due to the sheer firepower/spacing you get next to Giannis and the lack of elite offensive SFs around the league to make us pay for that. There's absolutely room for all 5 guards to get their playing time without cutting a guy like Rollins out of the rotation. And if one or two of those guys doesn't live up to expectations, having another option to try out is just a positive.

Because people love to say that we should always just force feed minutes to certain prospects/young players we like, until of course it becomes an Ajax situation and it actively costs the team wins. It's the same with the Prince stuff except even weirder because again, Anthony's literally the 2nd youngest guard on the roster right now. I'm interested to see how he looks with Giannis and as far away from that horrendous offensive/spacing environment that he had in Orlando.

Yeah, it is really weird to me how on one side we have a lot of people saying we need to find roster spots for guys like Cormac Ryan who will be 27 at the start of the season and give an extremely long leash to AJax, but then their standards on vet mins are so high that we are pooh-poohing a 25 year-old who was a part time starter on a playoff team to come in as out 3rd PG.

Exactly, no way Anthony isn’t going to be an upgrade over someone like Ajax

[c00lhand208]

Who you want to see playing ahead of whom is irrelevant. This is about filling out a rotation and having a viable backup guard that can handle the ball and shoot if Rollins and Porter don't meet these lofty expectations the board has set for them because we may be (probably?) asking too much of them, which you straight up agree with lol.

I don't know how many ways to say this. I don't think Anthony is a good player. That's the basis for not wanting him.

I do think he has more basketball skills than Kuzma, but I dont think he's a winning player. So if Rollins and KPJ flame out, this team is screwed and Anthony isn't going to solve that problem.

Anthony is an irrelevant signing only to the extent that Doc keeps him on the bench. If he's a 25 minute a game player, that's a probem.

Ok annnnnddddd?

Please name the vet minimum players that would solve that problem

How many guys that you would describe as "winning players" are available right now for the vet minimum?

He's a young guy who hopefully can rehab his value in a new location for cheap. If not you move on


Sent from my SM-S918U using RealGM mobile app

While I’m not on the Cole Anthony signing hate train, and I’m not sure there’s truly many who are given he’s projected as a depth PG on a minimum, I do think De’Anthony Melton is more of a “winning player” who’s still available and someone I hope the Bucks’ FO were in touch with. But, whether he would’ve signed a minimum to join the Bucks, who knows?

Guess we’ll have a better idea of his current market value once he signs a deal; though, it may also depend on the role he’s presented with whatever team he joins. With the Bucks, he would’ve been in a similar situation as Cole Anthony as a depth PG on a minimum or near minimum, but as a combo guard he could’ve seen some potential minutes at SG as well — just like KPJ & Rollins. And best of all, he wouldn’t have been as pigeonholed positionally or exploitable (aka targeted) as I fear Cole Anthony will be on the defensive end.

[M-C-G]

How do we get Avdija from Portland? Does Kuzma and the 31 first (swap?) get it done?

Discussed a bit a while back. Appears we don’t have close to the assets required unless we flip our 31 first into multiple firsts.

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

Not buying this statement.

Doc is Horst's guy. Horst probably doesn't have the authority to can him, but there's no doubt in my mind that the acquisition of Kuzma and Anthony (Docs teammate's son) was pushed by Doc. Doc is running the show, along with Horst, and I see no chasm between them.

Playing Kuzma was Doc's choice and playing Anthony will be the his choice.

how can you be sure that anthony was signed because of doc? literally 90% of this board supports this move. what if.... i know this is crazy.... but what if.... its just a good move that doc supports BECAUSE IT WAS A GOOD MOVE...... omfg

also.... prince and kuzma are switchable sf/pf's. we already have that. the last thing we need is another one. maybe an upgrade there but not another one

Prince and Kuzma aren't good defenders. If they are on the court, we have a losing team.

You can never have enough switchable defenders.

Anthony isnt very good. I've given the specifics of why- too short, can't attack the basket (per Orlando fan), low efficiency, bad three pointer, not good defender. He's tough and a good free throw shooter.

I want more complete players-Green, Trent, KPJ, and Rollins.

cole can dribble and attack. he can get a shot. we need guys like that too. hes young he has a pedigree and we need a playmaker. green, trent, kpj, and rollins either have no playmaking or a scarecrow brain for it. besides giannis we have not a true typical pg playmaker on the roster. you cant have an entire team of princeton guys like i know youd prefer. i have high hopes for cole and if he doesnt work out we can cut him loose cheap.

prince and kuzma are both nba average veteran defenders at the 3 and the 4. not great. mediocre-ish. if we find an good defender who hits 3's and plays smart along with another 30-40 million in cash to afford that guy then id be all for that guy.

[Ayt]

I think the question now is does Horst have one more swing up his sleeve this offseason or not? Do we get the Kuzma trade done for a championship caliber wing of note? Would Trey Murphy potentially be on the block after the Herb Jones extension? Honestly curious what everything thinks on the prospect of one more big move coming, because I think relying on the deadline to bring that guy in is a far riskier proposition. Horst needs to nail this next move for a chance to grab a true Middleton replacement #2, and he needs to do it sooner rather than later IMO.

With the modern CBA, trades like the Bucks need to make for a SF are made in season. The roster is mostly set. Horst has Kuzma's contract and the 1st round picks to figure out what he wants to do in a trade.

If our biggest concern is what 3rd PG the team signed for the veteran min then the team is sitting pretty well. Can’t let perfect be the enemy of good, we have to make do with what we have. I don’t really worry about guy’s “stealing” playing time, if Rollins or KPJ are the players you all think they are then they won’t be denied. They can’t be the only “point guards” on the team, so yeah, get over it.

That isn't true when your PG rotation consists of KPJ, Rollins, and Anthony. Every single one of them is a gigantic question mark. All three of them could end up being 3rd PG level players.

[Ayt]

How do we get Avdija from Portland? Does Kuzma and the 31 first (swap?) get it done?

Why would Portland trade him? He's super cheap, productive, and has upside.

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

If our biggest concern is what 3rd PG the team signed for the veteran min then the team is sitting pretty well. Can’t let perfect be the enemy of good, we have to make do with what we have. I don’t really worry about guy’s “stealing” playing time, if Rollins or KPJ are the players you all think they are then they won’t be denied. They can’t be the only “point guards” on the team, so yeah, get over it.

There is some big time naivete going on here. You, Swanson and Prez act like there is a meritocracy on the Bucks.

Doc is the coach and if we've learned anything it's that merit isn't the primary factor in playing time.

So ya, I'm concerned that Prince, Kuzma, and Anthony will have big roles on the team no matter what is merited.

I will say that out of those three, I'd rather have Anthony than the other two. Not a high bar.

DOC IS ON RECORD for saying he thinks green and trent will break out this year. his words. he started them in our last playoff game. rollins just got resigned for more than the minimum and drew interest around the league. kpj we know is likely the best talent of the bunch. if anything kpj will be the one that goes off reservation that he probably "overplays" instead of rollins and anthony

why do you insist in believing that players he literally benched in our biggest moments are going to come back in and steal minutes from the guys hes openly saying hes gonna ride or die with?

youre just being negative man. prince is a backup forward. anthony is a young high pedigree actual pg which we dont have on the roster. were taking a flyer on him. kuzma were actively and openly trying to trade. i think your read is like an actual 180 of whats really happening here

[gbmb34]

Guys, Prince isn't going to start.

As constructed now (but I do believe Kuzma is dealt before season just have to wait out some of the RFA guys)

PG - KPJ
SG - GTJ
SF - Kuzma
PF - Giannis
C - Turner

Rollins/Anthony/Green are backup guards, Prince is backup SF, Bobby backup big with Sims as a matchup center.

Harris/Smith/Thanasty/AJax/whatever collecting dust on the bench

[Daver]

I think a lot of you hoping and expecting that KPJ turns into a bonafide number 2/3 are going to be very disappointed lol. He definitely has the talent but we are going to spread shots around like we always do. He’s going to fill an important role here but don’t be shocked if both BP and Turner get more shots than he does.

Even if porter does 15/7/6 with good effeciancy i think 95% if this board will be very happy as will tbe bucks for that matter

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

Cole Anthony is a good dude.

A little too emotional and that has impacted his confidence and play on the court, but he is really well liked in the locker room. A legit good guy for team chemistry.

As far as on the court... it's a mixed bag.

He's capable of having legitimately monster games where you're like "holy crap, this dude is awesome!"

Just over the past couple of years he's had...

35-8-9
22-4-9
27-3-4
24-7-4
30-7-7
25-6-5
23-10-9

All with good shooting percentages and all in victories. There will absolutely be two or three games this season that Cole is on fire and straight up wins for you.

He's also a VERY good rebounding guard, one of the better ones in the league.

But those monster games are, unfortunately, few and far between. There's way too many 0-7, 1-9, 3-12 kind of games where he just doesn't have it and really hurts the team when he's out there.

Defensively, he's not very good. His defensive metrics are bit inflated because he's such a good defensive rebounder. He's a one position defender because of his size and he's very grabby which leads to a lot of dumb fouls. He's a great load up and jump off two feet leaper, so he can actually fly in for some blocks out of nowhere, but otherwise he's just not overly helpful on the defensive end.

His 3PT shot is very inconsistent, only one season over 35.3% in his five year career. He takes them, but he just doesn't make enough of them.

He's a guy who really gets down on himself easily and that impacts his play. If Doc and his staff can get him feeling confident, he can be a good bench scorer like he was in 2023 when he averaged 13 PPG off the bench on a .570 TS%. That year earned him the 13M a year contract he got, but he sadly just regressed pretty badly right after that. There were some rumors that he dealt with some stuff in his personal life (break up maybe?) that negatively impacted things for him.

But he's a very likable dude. He's quirky and gives fun postgame interviews when he plays well.

I wish him all the best and hope he does well for your team except when he plays the Magic.

thanks for this!!

so at the same age hes basically kpj if you traded high character for defense is what your saying?

looking at anthonys numbers and kpjs numbers...boxscore and advanced stats...... it would tough to know who the better player is thru their careers to this point.

why cant we all just be excited to give em a run this year maybe even together. they are by far the most dynamic, if not impactful, of the dudes on this roster besides giannis

[Daver]

I think a lot of you hoping and expecting that KPJ turns into a bonafide number 2/3 are going to be very disappointed lol. He definitely has the talent but we are going to spread shots around like we always do. He’s going to fill an important role here but don’t be shocked if both BP and Turner get more shots than he does.

If either one of those guys average more shots than he does the entire front office needs to be fired for malpractice.

It could definitely turn out that he's not capable of being efficient at that high of a load but we need to find out

I have a feeling Doc’s giant ball tendencies may come back into play. And having given Turner that contract, we are going to give him a lot of touches/shots. Wouldn’t be surprised to see him average a career high in FGA per game with us.

Seems like Kevin is going to get every opportunity to prove himself. His efficiency probably will come down, but not to unplayable levels.

Or on tbe other side a full TC n the chemistry hes already built with giannis might mske this year a breakout year for him where he does a 20/7/7 slash line n has super uber effeciancy 1 thing is without question hes by far our best ball handler

[emunney]

Who you want to see playing ahead of whom is irrelevant. This is about filling out a rotation and having a viable backup guard that can handle the ball and shoot if Rollins and Porter don't meet these lofty expectations the board has set for them because we may be (probably?) asking too much of them, which you straight up agree with lol.

I don't know how many ways to say this. I don't think Anthony is a good player. That's the basis for not wanting him.

I do think he has more basketball skills than Kuzma, but I dont think he's a winning player. So if Rollins and KPJ flame out, this team is screwed and Anthony isn't going to solve that problem.

Anthony is an irrelevant signing only to the extent that Doc keeps him on the bench. If he's a 25 minute a game player, that's a probem.

Ok annnnnddddd?

Please name the vet minimum players that would solve that problem

How many guys that you would describe as "winning players" are available right now for the vet minimum?

He's a young guy who hopefully can rehab his value in a new location for cheap. If not you move on


Sent from my SM-S918U using RealGM mobile app

I don't know if they have any interest in signing for the vet minimum or not, but Melton and Brogdon would otherwise qualify. IMO we should still sign one of them.

[Daver]

If either one of those guys average more shots than he does the entire front office needs to be fired for malpractice.

It could definitely turn out that he's not capable of being efficient at that high of a load but we need to find out

I have a feeling Doc’s giant ball tendencies may come back into play. And having given Turner that contract, we are going to give him a lot of touches/shots. Wouldn’t be surprised to see him average a career high in FGA per game with us.

Seems like Kevin is going to get every opportunity to prove himself. His efficiency probably will come down, but not to unplayable levels.

I think Doc and Horst are both in alignment right now on the volume sniper + Giannis approach, but I worry that it's a tenuous situation, particularly with Kuzma and Prince still on the roster. The conditions are right for backsliding if there are some early hiccups with the new approach. Unless they're confident Kuzma's going to take a different approach to the game, Horst has to figure out how to move him for somebody who doesn't clearly represent The Old Ways.

Spot on just what doc did last year yanked trent n put ajax in as a starter n jept trent on tbe bench till the playoffs.Trent never should of lost thst job especially to ajaz

[jakecronus8]

I maybe would've liked Brogdon for his ability to guard small 3s but I'm not gonna argue with going with the 25 year old athletic guy instead.

[MVP2110]

Read on Twitter

?t=ouYImvVrrXYcPNMiQYlAag&s=19