Kon Air: The Kon Knueppel Thread

[JMAC3]

from NBA.com sDay 9 tandouts:

Monday’s outing highlighted a game that contains depth beyond the obvious shooting skill: sure, there’s the 16 points on 5-for-10 shooting (3-5 3PM), but the 10 rebounds and four assists reveal the Duke product’s commitment to finding contributions. If he can serve as a connector while playing alongside LaMelo Ball and Brandon Miller, Knueppel could ensure the Hornets flummox opponents on that end of the floor

To their point you have to evaluate Kon not solely on the points he's scoring but whether he is playing his Kon the Konnector role making the team better than the sum of its parts. That appeared to be the team objective in selecting him over a pure scorer like Tre, so while that objective may not suit everyone's opinion of a Top 4 pick its fair that's how he should be evaluated

Guess it depends on how good you think LaMelo and Brandon Miller are. If you think they are both top 25-30 players in the league then sure surround them with good role players and "winning players". If you think they are more top 60ish talents then having them as your two best players isn't probably winning anything surrounded by "connective" players.

[MasterIchiro]

I’m skeptical that Kons passing is going to be super relevant in the big boy league, summer league against disorganized defenses and guys trying to market themselves with highlight plays. In the NBA guys won’t be rushing over to help Kon drives, especially when they realize he can’t shoot off the dribble. Centers will just step over off Moussa and Plumdog which is basically sacrificing nothing if Kon actually gets by a defender. Hard to imagine. Guess we’ll see.

This team simply does not have the personnel at the 5 to run a truly competent offense that makes sense

I buy Kon's court vision, therefore trust he can develop plus passing and playmaking. He seems to play heady, always aware of oncoming traffic, finds open lanes and space. I think he definitely has potential as a secondary playmaker which is a much needed skill to complement his outside shooting (which he will need because he can't break down a defense to get to the rim). LaMelo and Miller can space and shoot. Kon really fits with them and so does Liam.

Big improvement over the Salaün pick.

[SWedd523]

Gettin buckets isn't the only way to help a team win. He can shoot, sure, but the rotational ball movement, spacing, dribble drives are all important too. We have lacked guys who know how to play basketball correctly for awhile now. I think they are addressing that systematically now.

[Chapelchilla]

And don't forget, both Kon and Liam can shoot from deep. Josh Green wasn't respected out there and that clogged everything up. The floor will be much more open once these 2 rooks get up to speed. Of course we will have half the board in hysterics and melting if it takes more then a couple weeks to get used to the pro game. Can't wait for the laughs...anyway hopefully we win against the Spurs.

[MasterIchiro]

And don't forget, both Kon and Liam and shoot from deep. Josh Green wasn't respected out there and that clogged everything up. The floor will be much more open once these 2 rooks get up to speed. Of course we will have half the board in hysterics and melting if it takes more then a couple weeks to get used to the pro game. Can't wait for the laughs...anyway hopefully we win against the Spurs.

Liam and Kon will get the reps they need while Josh Green is injured. And the org should NOT let him just waltz back onto the court and reclaim his starting spot. That belongs to Sexton now.

Kon and Liam have a chance to make Josh Green irrelevant eventually as far as PT goes. Give it one year and maybe both make lineups more functional than Green does. Not a hard bar to clear, as Green is invisible.

I welcome rookie mistakes from these two. One of the great failures of the last 2 regimes was playing scrap heap players who make fewer mistakes over first round picks, from MCW over Monk, to Thor over Kai Jones. I know those examples are not the best given how unprepared those 1st round prospects were for the pros. But this whole philosophy of players learning best through scrimmage or Gleague instead of actual games was an excuse Clifford used to keep his wins up and to protect his job security.

Its fundamentally flawed.

First round investments need to play IN THE NBA and make mistakes. That benefits player development, and who cares if the coach secures a couple marginal wins extra.

Josh Green has no longterm future with this team, and he's not carrying this team to the play-in. If he disappeared, no one would notice he's gone. Sorry, coach.

[KembaWalker]

it says a lot that even the super optimists are bucketing Kon and Liam as the same thing

we should be holding Kon to the standard of guys that got drafted at 4 like Amen Thompson, Scottie Barnes, Stephon Castle. Nobody out there saying Kon should be getting 16/7/4 and gunning for ROY like Barnes did. I don't think anyone is doing that..why? Cause we drafted a guy at 4 that doesnt have that talent level? even the homers are down bad on this guy and they can barely hide it

[amcoolio]

it says a lot that even the super optimists are bucketing Kon and Liam as the same thing

we should be holding Kon to the standard of guys that got drafted at 4 like Amen Thompson, Scottie Barnes, Stephon Castle. Nobody out there saying Kon should be getting 16/7/4 and gunning for ROY like Barnes did. I don't think anyone is doing that..why? Cause we drafted a guy at 4 that doesnt have that talent level? even the homers are down bad on this guy and they can barely hide it

He’s basically going to have to improve his handle so much he turns into a Mark Price type. Here’s hoping

[JustBuzzin]

Best case scenario Klay Thompson

More likely scenario Mike Miller

[SWedd523]

it says a lot that even the super optimists are bucketing Kon and Liam as the same thing

we should be holding Kon to the standard of guys that got drafted at 4 like Amen Thompson, Scottie Barnes, Stephon Castle. Nobody out there saying Kon should be getting 16/7/4 and gunning for ROY like Barnes did. I don't think anyone is doing that..why? Cause we drafted a guy at 4 that doesnt have that talent level? even the homers are down bad on this guy and they can barely hide it

But he knows how to play basketball

[wilson115]

Guy did the hard work so we don't have to

Watch on YouTube

[Bassman]

Peterson, and to a degree Lee, are starting to remind me of some poor managers I fired over the years. One was inherited, and one was transferred into my region early in my corp career.

Managers look for a lot of things when hiring people, especially in other managers of their employees. I was really pretty good at making quality hires. But these two guys had fatal flaws when interviewing. One, they were suckers to be played because they exposed their own desires and biases early to candidates. Good actors knew how to script responses. Second, they fell in love with a “type”, and prejudged the candidate’s fit before sticking to the process. Consequently the production from their hires was uneven, leading to poor retention rates. They just weren’t good managers so I replaced them quickly.

Peterson and Lee strike me as good people, certainly professionals who’ve climbed up to earn their advancements. But I think their love of a type of player prejudiced their evaluations in both year’s lottery selections. Tiddy became an infatuation, and to them an easy pick in a weaker draft when Castle and Sheppard were both gone. I think they were overly influenced by Kon’s numbers in the ACC tournament (something they mentioned) and loved their interview with him. He fit the character and hard work mantra. I hope they both work out for us. Kon should be a good connector, glue guy in lineups. Hope Tiddy improves enough this year to be worth keeping into year 3.

[Chapelchilla]

I think they did a realistic assessment of what we were lacking - shooting, hard workers / non trouble makers, ball movement, maturity and BBIQ and went out deliberately to address it. If we are not looking a LOT better as a team by this time next summer I will be pretty shocked.

[Bassman]

I think they did a realistic assessment of what we were lacking - shooting, hard workers / non trouble makers, ball movement, maturity and BBIQ and went out deliberately to address it. If we are not looking a LOT better as a team by this time next summer I will be pretty shocked.

No doubt they brought in quality players. Sexton and company will be a huge difference from the G-League teams fielded much of last year. Finding the right players among vets who’ve already proven themselves with track records and reputations. My point above was relative to selecting talent in the past two drafts, particularly at lottery level. Still need a quality center to help make all this work. As Lowe said, who is Melo going to throw lobs to? Who can realistically defend the paint against the horde of guards and wings blowing past our merely average or below perimeter defenders?

[Chapelchilla]

I think they did a realistic assessment of what we were lacking - shooting, hard workers / non trouble makers, ball movement, maturity and BBIQ and went out deliberately to address it. If we are not looking a LOT better as a team by this time next summer I will be pretty shocked.

No doubt they brought in quality players. Sexton and company will be a huge difference from the G-League teams fielded much of last year. Finding the right players among vets who’ve already proven themselves with track records and reputations. My point above was relative to selecting talent in the past two drafts, particularly at lottery level. Still need a quality center to help make all this work. As Lowe said, who is Melo going to throw lobs to? Who can realistically defend the paint against the horde of guards and wings blowing past our merely average or below perimeter defenders?

I agree that we need a top center to be truly good. I think we will be trading for one when the time is right. We aren't quite ready to really go for it yet but I think it is getting close!

[yosemiteben]

Nobody out there saying Kon should be getting 16/7/4 and gunning for ROY like Barnes did. I don't think anyone is doing that..why? Cause we drafted a guy at 4 that doesnt have that talent level?

Because it's extremely unusual for any rookie to put up those numbers. After a quick look at their stats, it appears that no other 4 pick has posted that stat line their rookie season in the last 15 seasons.

So maybe you are the one with unreasonable views on what a historically reasonable set of expectations should be for a 4 pick in their rookie season.

[JDR720]

I mean, if Kon as a rookie put up those stats we'd be a top 3 seed in the East.

He's, at best, the 4th or 5th scoring option. Something like 10/2/3 on above average efficiency is reasonable for what his role and playing time will be.


Rookies in general tend to not average high stats unless they're on bad teams and get to chuck, or are generational level players. Ace and Tre are going to be in the former category, so I'm sure it'll be fun comparing their stat lines to Kon's while ignoring context. Ace is probably going to average 20pts on 20 shots and Tre will probably average 18pts on 15 shots or something like that.

[KembaWalker]

Nobody out there saying Kon should be getting 16/7/4 and gunning for ROY like Barnes did. I don't think anyone is doing that..why? Cause we drafted a guy at 4 that doesnt have that talent level?

Because it's extremely unusual for any rookie to put up those numbers. After a quick look at their stats, it appears that no other 4 pick has posted that stat line their rookie season in the last 15 seasons.

So maybe you are the one with unreasonable views on what a historically reasonable set of expectations should be for a 4 pick in their rookie season.

well i meant something equivalent for his position as a stumpy 6'4" SG not necessarily the literal exact same statline as Scottie Barnes

its highly concerning that the expectations surrounding an offensively focused, weak defensively 4th overall pick in ostensibly a good draft according to experts that landed in the 29th ranked offense are being bucketed with a near 2nd round pick already. to me. maybe not you

[vexco]

Nobody out there saying Kon should be getting 16/7/4 and gunning for ROY like Barnes did. I don't think anyone is doing that..why? Cause we drafted a guy at 4 that doesnt have that talent level?

Because it's extremely unusual for any rookie to put up those numbers. After a quick look at their stats, it appears that no other 4 pick has posted that stat line their rookie season in the last 15 seasons.

So maybe you are the one with unreasonable views on what a historically reasonable set of expectations should be for a 4 pick in their rookie season.

well i meant something equivalent for his position as a stumpy 6'4" SG not necessarily the literal exact same statline as Scottie Barnes

Didn't he measure out at 6'5" flat without shoes?

[Chapelchilla]

Because it's extremely unusual for any rookie to put up those numbers. After a quick look at their stats, it appears that no other 4 pick has posted that stat line their rookie season in the last 15 seasons.

So maybe you are the one with unreasonable views on what a historically reasonable set of expectations should be for a 4 pick in their rookie season.

well i meant something equivalent for his position as a stumpy 6'4" SG not necessarily the literal exact same statline as Scottie Barnes

Didn't he measure out at 6'5" flat without shoes?

Yes, he did. Nothing stumpy about him. Don't take the troll bait, lol. He got 10 rebounds last game too.

[KembaWalker]

Because it's extremely unusual for any rookie to put up those numbers. After a quick look at their stats, it appears that no other 4 pick has posted that stat line their rookie season in the last 15 seasons.

So maybe you are the one with unreasonable views on what a historically reasonable set of expectations should be for a 4 pick in their rookie season.

well i meant something equivalent for his position as a stumpy 6'4" SG not necessarily the literal exact same statline as Scottie Barnes

Didn't he measure out at 6'5" flat without shoes?

maybe with his best posture lol, everyone can see how he looks out on the floor and his wingspan