My hot take - Billups is the 3rd best PG all time

[Stan]

Definitely a dumb take, but Billups is underappreciated by most fans though.

[jowglenn]

Billups was one of those "he's so underrated" guys for so long that he's now become overrated, to the point of this wild take (I do love that OP has taken his shot on this, though... I would never have the gumption to make such a claim.)

The part of him being underrated came from a few things - he wasn't the offensive wizard that a guy like Nash was, and he was on a team & era that was very defense-oriented and grinding. Yeah he didn't average a ton of points, but who did with those Pistons? They were regularly winning games with scores of 84-72 and **** like that.

His defense is being insulted in this thread for no good reason. Those Pistons were a historically good defensive team. Billups may have been the worst defender in their starting lineup, but that's like being the worst musician in the Beatles. 90% of point guards could have slotted into that team and been the worst defender on the team!

I do maintain that Ben Wallace was the "best player" on that Pistons team - he was the heart and soul of their defense, rightfully won 4 DPOYs, and absolutely set the tone of their entire ethos and style. He was SCARY. But I can definitely see merit to Billups being the 2nd most important guy.

As far as his rank as a point guard? I haven't given it much thought, but off the top of my head I'd definitely take Magic, Curry, Robertson, Stockton, Kidd, Nash, Paul over him.

[Yank3525]

My hot take - Billups is the 3rd best PG all time - tell me why I’m wrong

Billups isn’t on most lists of top 10pgs. I hate how under appreciate he is. Stats aside here are my biggest decision makers

1. Billups destroyed MVP candidate prime Chris Paul in 2009 playoffs. He put up 23ppg on 74% TS while holding Paul to 16ppg on 50% TS.

2. Billlups for Iverson tanked Detroit and elevated Denver to contender status.

3Billups destroyed Parker in 2005 finals

4. Billups destroyed Kidd in the 2004 playoffs. He has massive game 5 and 7 performances and held Kidd scoreless in game 7.

5. This

Watch on YouTube

Im a huge AI fan, but he was falling off when he was traded for Billups, and his decline was very fast. Denver won 4 more games the following season with Billups as they did with AI the previous year. They just didn't run into buzzsaws in the first round like the 2007 championship Spurs and 2008 championship Lakers like Denver did when AI was there. They played New Orleans and a Dallas team with no depth on their way to the WCF in 09

Yup. Also west as a whole was weaker in 2009 then it was in 2008 and 2010.

[azcatz11]

Definitely a dumb take, but Billups is underappreciated by most fans though.

No. He is the inverse of Allen Iverson who everyone thinks sucks now. He is overrated and Iverson was better

[dhsilv2]

Billups was their weakest defender, not really a good point of attack defender. His teammates laughed when he made all defensive teams. Inefficient chucker that often relied on others to create offense. Got his shots on quick pull up transition and offense generated by teammates gravity. Not a great playmaker.

Don't even want to trash the guy, but like I said was never the best player on his team. Best means best... It's not a difficult definition.

It’s hard to say who the best player on that team was because each of the starters made such great contributions… I’ve heard plenty argue for Billups, plenty for the Wallace’s, and even a few for Rip. So I get disagreeing about him being the best on the Pistons, and no way is he 3atgpg… but hold on…

1. Chauncey was his team’s weakest defender? That take is wilder than OP’s.
2. His teammates laughed when he made all defensive teams? Is there a source for this?

When you make up stuff like this it feels like you are trying to trash the guy.

Prince and Wallace were their best players.. Billups set the tone and Rip and sheed were their go to players

Prince was best at WHAT? WTF am I even reading here...

[dhsilv2]

Man, certainly one of the most underrated guys. But 3rd is just absurd. He's better than Zeke though, the clear most overrated nba player of all time.

[Ito]

It’s hard to say who the best player on that team was because each of the starters made such great contributions… I’ve heard plenty argue for Billups, plenty for the Wallace’s, and even a few for Rip. So I get disagreeing about him being the best on the Pistons, and no way is he 3atgpg… but hold on…

1. Chauncey was his team’s weakest defender? That take is wilder than OP’s.
2. His teammates laughed when he made all defensive teams? Is there a source for this?

When you make up stuff like this it feels like you are trying to trash the guy.

Prince and Wallace were their best players.. Billups set the tone and Rip and sheed were their go to players

Prince was best at WHAT? WTF am I even reading here...

Prince was the difference maker and Ben Wallace.. Sheed was prolly their go to player and Rip who they ran plays for or bailed them out when they couldn’t get a shot off.. Billups was the floor captain

[dhsilv2]

Prince and Wallace were their best players.. Billups set the tone and Rip and sheed were their go to players

Prince was best at WHAT? WTF am I even reading here...

Prince was the difference maker and Ben Wallace.. Sheed was prolly their go to player and Rip who they ran plays for or bailed them out when they couldn’t get a shot off.. Billups was the floor captain

Difference maker at what? He was the worst starter on the team by a far.

[Ito]

Prince was best at WHAT? WTF am I even reading here...

Prince was the difference maker and Ben Wallace.. Sheed was prolly their go to player and Rip who they ran plays for or bailed them out when they couldn’t get a shot off.. Billups was the floor captain

Difference maker at what? He was the worst starter on the team by a far.

You are bugging.. his long arms alone got them rings all season long bothering everybody changing everybody shot

[flow]

Prince and Wallace were their best players.. Billups set the tone and Rip and sheed were their go to players

Prince was best at WHAT? WTF am I even reading here...

Prince was the difference maker and Ben Wallace.. Sheed was prolly their go to player and Rip who they ran plays for or bailed them out when they couldn’t get a shot off.. Billups was the floor captain

Prince was the difference maker in Game 2 v. Indiana. I'll give you that.

He was a good, solid, important player who was their best perimeter defender, and who ranked 5th among the 5 starters.

.

[dhsilv2]

Prince was the difference maker and Ben Wallace.. Sheed was prolly their go to player and Rip who they ran plays for or bailed them out when they couldn’t get a shot off.. Billups was the floor captain

Difference maker at what? He was the worst starter on the team by a far.

You are bugging.. his long arms alone got them rings all season long bothering everybody changing everybody shot

He was a good point of attack defender for sure. He wasn't as good a defender as either Wallace. His offense wasn't remotely close to Rip, Billups or Sheed. He was a good point of attack defender who could hit an open shot and in a pinch could create a bad shot. That's all he was.

[SkyBill40]

Come on, dude. It's too early in the morning on a Thursday for this kind of pure nonsense. Billups was nice as a player and that much isn't in dispute; however, the assertion that he's in front of a lot of other all time great players and hall of famers is laughable.

[HMFFL]

Prince and Wallace were their best players.. Billups set the tone and Rip and sheed were their go to players

Prince was best at WHAT? WTF am I even reading here...

Prince was the difference maker and Ben Wallace.. Sheed was prolly their go to player and Rip who they ran plays for or bailed them out when they couldn’t get a shot off.. Billups was the floor captain

RIP was always their go to player and #1 option on offense.
I will agree that Billups was the captain.

Even in the Finals, RIP was the #1 option on offense, and when they let Sheed have more freedom, I remember him missing all of his 3-point attempts in the game ( 6 or 7?). The Lakers blew that game.

EDIT: Game 4 of the Finals
Rasheed went 0 for 5 from three and it was the only time he was the firdt option.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200406130DET.html

[bonita_the_frog]

Even in the Finals, RIP was the #1 option on offense, and when they let Sheed have more freedom, I remember him missing all of his 3-point attempts in the game ( 6 or 7?). The Lakers blew that game.

EDIT: Game 4 of the Finals
Rasheed went 0 for 5 from three and it was the only time he was the firdt option.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200406130DET.html

But was Billups the #1 option on offense at the end of games? Cos his nickame is Mr Big Shot.

[HMFFL]

Prince was best at WHAT? WTF am I even reading here...

Prince was the difference maker and Ben Wallace.. Sheed was prolly their go to player and Rip who they ran plays for or bailed them out when they couldn’t get a shot off.. Billups was the floor captain

Difference maker at what? He was the worst starter on the team by a far.

Defense for sure.
The year he won the Finals was his sophmore season. He eventually made a handful of all defensive teams. The Lakers felt his presence for sure in the Finals.

[tsherkin]

Does Billups deserve more love? Absolutely.

Is he the 3rd best PG of all-time? No, that's insane nonsense not really worth addressing.

Is there a difference between peak Billups and his whole career? Absolutely. He took a while to get going. But he knew how to draw fouls, hit 3s and manage a game, for sure. He was excellent for Detroit, and then later on for Denver. Even had some brief impact in New York before the injuries took him.

But no, definitely not the 3rd best PG of all-time. He gets hurt in ATG conversations for a wide variety of reasons, but using one-off H2H matchups to make a point doesn't really sell, either.

[dhsilv2]

Prince was the difference maker and Ben Wallace.. Sheed was prolly their go to player and Rip who they ran plays for or bailed them out when they couldn’t get a shot off.. Billups was the floor captain

Difference maker at what? He was the worst starter on the team by a far.

Defense for sure.
The year he won the Finals was his sophmore season. He eventually made a handful of all defensive teams. The Lakers felt his presence for sure in the Finals.

It was a solid 5 man starting lineup. And Prince was for sure a good point of attack defender who's length especially bugged Kobe in that series. But was he more a difference maker than others? Not really. And certainly not if we look at the totality of the playoffs and not just one matchup that he was especially suited for.

[flow]

Even in the Finals, RIP was the #1 option on offense, and when they let Sheed have more freedom, I remember him missing all of his 3-point attempts in the game ( 6 or 7?). The Lakers blew that game.

EDIT: Game 4 of the Finals
Rasheed went 0 for 5 from three and it was the only time he was the firdt option.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200406130DET.html

But was Billups the #1 option on offense at the end of games? Cos his nickame is Mr Big Shot.

Yes, most of the time.

.

[tmorgan]

I guess it’s been 20 years now, so a lot of folks have faulty memories of how that Pistons team worked.

Billups was the engine. Ran the sets. The most efficient scorer on a team that didn’t score particularly efficiently. The calming influence on a team with three very emotional starters. Good but not great defender, matchup dependent.

Rip was the rabbit. Amazing motor. Constant motion, tons of sets with him off screens. He wasn’t a three point shooter yet when they won, but became a good one later. Good size for a 2, but not a consistently good defender, definitely the weakest of the starters. His role was getting midrange buckets and running out in transition.

Tayshaun was the wing defender. He was the youngest and clearly 5th starter, as he was in his second season. Really disruptive wing defender with his length. Good athlete as a young guy, made open threes, had just started working on his NBA iso game. Didn’t get many shots yet.

Sheed was the enigma. On nights he was motivated and locked in, which was most of 03-04, the Pistons interior defense was almost impregnable. Not an efficient scorer at this stage, but he had his moments. ATG post defender, which further unlocked Ben to be the best help defender of his generation. Talent was never a question with Sheed, but he wasn’t always reliable.

Big Ben was the heart of a defense-first team. Monster help defender and rebounder, always engaged. Really bad offensive player, poor touch, no range, but the team always ran a few things for him because he deserved it. He could pass a little, which helped. Could guard literally anyone in the league.

[Kent]

I love the boldness of this take.

He wouldn't be third on my list, but my team was at the receiving end of his brilliance for years, so it felt like he was an ATG.