The Official 2025 Offseason Thread #4 Free Agency Opens!

[NapoleonII]

You are free to believe what you believe (for the record I'm a bit skeptical as well), but you can't really argue the fact that you can't be proven right or wrong for a few years. This is true of ALL draft picks, even more polished young players take quite a while to reach their ceiling. So like...you can be grumpy about that response but that doesn't make it any less true.

Andrew Bynum is the only player I remember being a project who played less that 7 minutes a game his first year as a center who turned into a stud (VERY VERY brief stud because he was out of the league by 27 years old).

Can you think of any centers who barely played their first 2-3 years and turned into studs?

I'll take Joel Embiid for $500, Alex.

But if I'm being honest, that's a pretty easy pick. The question is much harder when considering players today as there aren't many that are true centers seeing how much the league and game have changed to one of being somewhat positionless.

I can think of a few....

-Zubac averaged 9 mins a game in his second year, and like ~15-16 mins a game through his first 4. Granted he was being played by a trash Lakers org (2016-2019)

-Bam Adebayo didn't have a super impressive rookie season 6.9 pts on 51% FG/ 5.5 rebounds / 1 assist and I think Mal could easily beat it if he can actually earn some minutes over Mark Williams (who is better across the board at this point)

-Sabonis had an even worse rookie season....5.9/3.6 rebounds on 39% FG.

Granted, these guys were all older than our project #10 pick who has 5 years of organized ball under his belt? And quite a few of them had better tools....Zubac has Rodman's nose for the ball with a true center's length / decent foot speed. Sabonis and Bam are freakishly strong. Adebayo can move in space like a small forward.

But my point is, I think Mal is an intriguing project and I was / am totally good with the org swinging for the fence with him. Big men historically take time, and Mal comes in the league as one of the youngest players.

If he locks down his three ball and the game slows down for him around February/March, plays hard, etc....it would solve a lot of problems for this org.

[handsome salary]

If you have a max contract player on your roster, anything under 35 wins is unacceptable. Even 35 wins is unacceptable.

Under 30 wins and my guess, Booker asks for a trade out

I can see it now. Suns 20-62 next season. Third worst team in the league. Rookies look lost, rest of the guys look like they'd be 7-10 players on very good teams. Their top five pick goes to whoever owns it. Dead cap money. Booker mopes especially when he doesn't make an all star selection.
Every team knows they can offer they crappiest of crap packages for him cause he's not worth the contract and Suns are always in desperation to win now/bad move mode.

I'm just basing this off of watching Booker's career and Ishbia's decision making.

[dremill24]

Our rookies not exactly impressing.

NBA Summer League disappointments: Nets’ draft class, the Pelicans and more
https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6512060/2025/07/25/nba-summer-league-disappointments-nets-pelicans/



This is why I hated this pick. Project players should NEVER be taken top 10! Top 10 players should be able to contribute right away (even at a minimum 15 minutes a game). I said it on draft day, he’s going to bust hard! I’m sticking with that projection. I’m sitting at the table asking to prove me wrong but the only answer i will get is going to be “give him 2 or 3 years”. My retort is “good Luck”!

Ceiling:( taller version) Bismack Biyombo
Floor: Hasheem Thabeet

You are free to believe what you believe (for the record I'm a bit skeptical as well), but you can't really argue the fact that you can't be proven right or wrong for a few years. This is true of ALL draft picks, even more polished young players take quite a while to reach their ceiling. So like...you can be grumpy about that response but that doesn't make it any less true.

Andrew Bynum is the only player I remember being a project who played less that 7 minutes a game his first year as a center who turned into a stud (VERY VERY brief stud because he was out of the league by 27 years old).

Can you think of any centers who barely played their first 2-3 years and turned into studs?

I dunno man...Ben Wallace & Jermaine O'Neal certainly didn't play a lot early on. The 7mpg threshold is quite particular and quite low too, kinda moving the goal posts here.

Also I don't think simple playing time without context is really an appropriate measure. Many rookie, project big men play on rebuilding teams whose priority is just to play them and lose, which are different priorities from the Suns this year.

And even so, I would bet Maluach gets much more than 7mpg this season. Even if he's terrible, they're going to want to get a look at him here & there, plus Mark Williams is pretty much guaranteed to miss time, opening up a lot of minutes. I imagine he'll get 10+ minutes per game this year, plus G-League time, which would be in line with a lot of young, raw big men.

Maluach could certainly end up not being very good, but if that happens, I don't think it'll be because he didn't play many minutes as a first-year player.

[Sunsdeuce]

You are free to believe what you believe (for the record I'm a bit skeptical as well), but you can't really argue the fact that you can't be proven right or wrong for a few years. This is true of ALL draft picks, even more polished young players take quite a while to reach their ceiling. So like...you can be grumpy about that response but that doesn't make it any less true.

Andrew Bynum is the only player I remember being a project who played less that 7 minutes a game his first year as a center who turned into a stud (VERY VERY brief stud because he was out of the league by 27 years old).

Can you think of any centers [u]who barely played their first 2-3 years and turned into studs?[/u]

I'll take Joel Embiid for $500, Alex.

But if I'm being honest, that's a pretty easy pick. The question is much harder when considering players today as there aren't many that are true centers seeing how much the league and game have changed to one of being somewhat positionless.

Embid played 25 minutes a game during his rookie season and averaged 20 PPG and 7 rebounds. His season was shortened by a stress fracture in his right foot. 25 minutes a game is a LOT OF GAME time. So I’m not sure why you think he barely played. Can you go into detail why you think he barely played?

[Sunsdeuce]

Andrew Bynum is the only player I remember being a project who played less that 7 minutes a game his first year as a center who turned into a stud (VERY VERY brief stud because he was out of the league by 27 years old).

Can you think of any centers who barely played their first 2-3 years and turned into studs?

I'll take Joel Embiid for $500, Alex.

But if I'm being honest, that's a pretty easy pick. The question is much harder when considering players today as there aren't many that are true centers seeing how much the league and game have changed to one of being somewhat positionless.

I can think of a few....

-Zubac averaged 9 mins a game in his second year, and like ~15-16 mins a game through his first 4. Granted he was being played by a trash Lakers org (2016-2019)

-Bam Adebayo didn't have a super impressive rookie season 6.9 pts on 51% FG/ 5.5 rebounds / 1 assist and I think Mal could easily beat it if he can actually earn some minutes over Mark Williams (who is better across the board at this point)

-Sabonis had an even worse rookie season....5.9/3.6 rebounds on 39% FG.

Granted, these guys were all older than our project #10 pick who has 5 years of organized ball under his belt? And quite a few of them had better tools....Zubac has Rodman's nose for the ball with a true center's length / decent foot speed. Sabonis and Bam are freakishly strong. Adebayo can move in space like a small forward.

But my point is, I think Mal is an intriguing project and I was / am totally good with the org swinging for the fence with him. Big men historically take time and Mal comes in the league as one of the youngest players.

If he locks down his three ball and the game slows down for him around February/March, plays hard, etc....it would solve a lot of problems for this org.

What time in history are you referring to? Because up till the early 2000, if you were a center drafted in the lottery you were expect to start and be impactful. I’m guessing you are referring to more modern centers.

Centers that were lottery picks that were considered “projects” in the 90s were expect to start right away. Even if they turned out to be bad. Big Country (if you know 90s ball, you know who that is), Shawn Bradley, Michael Olowokandi to name a few.

[Djedefre]

Imagine giving up any asset to get Kuminga. We are a joke. And a very bad one.

[BobbieL]

If you have a max contract player on your roster, anything under 35 wins is unacceptable. Even 35 wins is unacceptable.

Under 30 wins and my guess, Booker asks for a trade out

I can see it now. Suns 20-62 next season. Third worst team in the league. Rookies look lost, rest of the guys look like they'd be 7-10 players on very good teams. Their top five pick goes to whoever owns it. Dead cap money. Booker mopes especially when he doesn't make an all star selection.
Every team knows they can offer they crappiest of crap packages for him cause he's not worth the contract and Suns are always in desperation to win now/bad move mode.

I'm just basing this off of watching Booker's career and Ishbia's decision making.

Plus, at the end of the game, press conference, lounging back, monotone voice "just have to play harder. fix the little things" as he scores 27 with a -18 for the game.

Hence, why I wanted to traded Booker this summer but that wasn't an option.

[Puff]

"The Beat Goes On" - The negativity on this board is unbelievable and will not stop.

You are not a lucky NBA fan, you are annoying. Sometimes it is better to say nothing, if you have nothing good to say about someone or something.

[Fo-Real]

"The Beat Goes On" - The negativity on this board is unbelievable and will not stop.

You are not a lucky NBA fan, you are annoying. Sometimes it is better to say nothing, if you have nothing good to say about someone or something.

This guy gets it!! Lol, you forgot to add a link of some random talking head who you agree with about us sucking. "Here is a link of Jagoff Durst, I agree with him about our situation, YOU ALL SHOULD READ IT"!!

[Sunsdeuce]

Imagine giving up any asset to get Kuminga. We are a joke. And a very bad one.

Wait what did I miss. Did the suns get him?

[Sunsdeuce]

"The Beat Goes On" - The negativity on this board is unbelievable and will not stop.

You are not a lucky NBA fan, you are annoying. Sometimes it is better to say nothing, if you have nothing good to say about someone or something.

Then why come here if you don’t want to have different opinions other than your own opinion? Just create an account and a forum just made for you so you can agree with everything you post.

In my view, all you do is fight with people here and call them names and bring no actual value to conversations. So you want to subliminally talk crap about me because that’s all you have shown to be capable of. You want an echo chamber, get a truth social account otherwise stop being to rude to people because they don’t have the same view as you!

[Sunsdeuce]

"The Beat Goes On" - The negativity on this board is unbelievable and will not stop.

You are not a lucky NBA fan, you are annoying. Sometimes it is better to say nothing, if you have nothing good to say about someone or something.

This guy gets it!! Lol, you forgot to add a link of some random talking head who you agree with about us sucking. "Here is a link of Jagoff Durst, I agree with him about our situation, YOU ALL SHOULD READ IT"!!

Oh you mean your boy who just posts Reddit links. Because it wasn’t me.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/s/ObPQPTCKsn

[John Gambadoro] Adjustment here on the Suns plans this year:

Green will be the PG. Gillespie is the backup.

Point Book wears him down too much.

[Fo-Real]

"The Beat Goes On" - The negativity on this board is unbelievable and will not stop.

You are not a lucky NBA fan, you are annoying. Sometimes it is better to say nothing, if you have nothing good to say about someone or something.

This guy gets it!! Lol, you forgot to add a link of some random talking head who you agree with about us sucking. "Here is a link of Jagoff Durst, I agree with him about our situation, YOU ALL SHOULD READ IT"!!

Oh you mean your boy. Because it wasn’t me.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/s/ObPQPTCKsn

[John Gambadoro] Adjustment here on the Suns plans this year:

Green will be the PG. Gillespie is the backup.

Point Book wears him down too much.

I have no boy and you have never seen me quoting anyone. This is an "If the shoe fits", kinda thing, you must have felt some kind of way. Did it tingle somewhere? If not, why the hell are you responding like you are offended? What a Maroon!! ~Bugs Bunny

[SkyBill40]

Andrew Bynum is the only player I remember being a project who played less that 7 minutes a game his first year as a center who turned into a stud (VERY VERY brief stud because he was out of the league by 27 years old).

Can you think of any centers [u]who barely played their first 2-3 years and turned into studs?[/u]

I'll take Joel Embiid for $500, Alex.

But if I'm being honest, that's a pretty easy pick. The question is much harder when considering players today as there aren't many that are true centers seeing how much the league and game have changed to one of being somewhat positionless.

Embid played 25 minutes a game during his rookie season and averaged 20 PPG and 7 rebounds. His season was shortened by a stress fracture in his right foot. 25 minutes a game is a LOT OF GAME time. So I’m not sure why you think he barely played. Can you go into detail why you think he barely played?

The qualifier was missing time and he didn't play at all because of it. He missed, due to injury, his first two seasons. So, effectively, his "rookie" season was really his third and that still meets the criteria.

[Sunsdeuce]

This guy gets it!! Lol, you forgot to add a link of some random talking head who you agree with about us sucking. "Here is a link of Jagoff Durst, I agree with him about our situation, YOU ALL SHOULD READ IT"!!

Oh you mean your boy. Because it wasn’t me.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/s/ObPQPTCKsn



Green will be the PG. Gillespie is the backup.

Point Book wears him down too much.

I have no boy and you have never seen me quoting anyone. This is an "If the shoe fits", kinda thing. You must have felt some kind of way. Did it tingle somewhere? If not, why the hell are you responding like you are offended? What a Maroon!! ~Bugs Bunny

Seriously, all you do is harass people on the board here. Get a DAMN LIFE!

[Sunsdeuce]

I'll take Joel Embiid for $500, Alex.

But if I'm being honest, that's a pretty easy pick. The question is much harder when considering players today as there aren't many that are true centers seeing how much the league and game have changed to one of being somewhat positionless.

Embid played 25 minutes a game during his rookie season and averaged 20 PPG and 7 rebounds. His season was shortened by a stress fracture in his right foot. 25 minutes a game is a LOT OF GAME time. So I’m not sure why you think he barely played. Can you go into detail why you think he barely played?

The qualifier was missing time and he didn't play at all because of it. He missed, due to injury, his first two seasons. So, effectively, his "rookie" season was really his third and that still meets the criteria.

I get what you are saying. Do you think he was considered a project at the time when he was drafted?

[Biff]

"The Beat Goes On" - The negativity on this board is unbelievable and will not stop.

You are not a lucky NBA fan, you are annoying. Sometimes it is better to say nothing, if you have nothing good to say about someone or something.

This guy gets it!! Lol, you forgot to add a link of some random talking head who you agree with about us sucking. "Here is a link of Jagoff Durst, I agree with him about our situation, YOU ALL SHOULD READ IT"!!

There isn't a sports writer out there that thinks the Suns have anything other than a bleak rest of the 2020's ahead of them. There's very little to be optimistic about and I don't blame anyone for dooming.

[SkyBill40]

Embid played 25 minutes a game during his rookie season and averaged 20 PPG and 7 rebounds. His season was shortened by a stress fracture in his right foot. 25 minutes a game is a LOT OF GAME time. So I’m not sure why you think he barely played. Can you go into detail why you think he barely played?

The qualifier was missing time and he didn't play at all because of it. He missed, due to injury, his first two seasons. So, effectively, his "rookie" season was really his third and that still meets the criteria.

I get what you are saying. Do you think he was considered a project at the time when he was drafted?

Maybe a bit of a reclamation with hope for a dominating presence given his injury status? Yeah. But there a difference between project and project. He definitely wasn't the latter.

[Djedefre]

"The Beat Goes On" - The negativity on this board is unbelievable and will not stop.

You are not a lucky NBA fan, you are annoying. Sometimes it is better to say nothing, if you have nothing good to say about someone or something.

This guy gets it!! Lol, you forgot to add a link of some random talking head who you agree with about us sucking. "Here is a link of Jagoff Durst, I agree with him about our situation, YOU ALL SHOULD READ IT"!!

There isn't a sports writer out there that thinks the Suns have anything other than a bleak rest of the 2020's ahead of them. There's very little to be optimistic about and I don't blame anyone for dooming.

Yeah. Literally every basketball head out there is trashing the Suns. Just a day or two ago, i came across an article where Quinn from CBS ranks us among 4 worst FO's in the league. Still generous, tho.

[TeamTragic]

Did the usual suspects forget to take their pills this morning?

You are an insufferable lot and nobody cares about your opinions.

Find a different team if you think the sky is falling.