Why I think the Kobe-Pau Lakers would be just as good today

[NZB2323]

Just as good as in win the championship and beat OKC? I don’t know about that.

[ballzboyee]

Just as good as in win the championship and beat OKC? I don’t know about that.

Because we would be asking Kobe to beat a modern version of himself in Shai with a completely loaded roster.

[tsherkin]

Just as good as in win the championship and beat OKC? I don’t know about that.

Because we would be asking Kobe to beat a modern version of himself in Shai with a completely loaded roster.

Well, and because Kobe's roster was terribly disposed to play well in a modern context. They didn't have the shooting, they were too slow, they weren't sufficiently advanced with screen entry, he didn't have a worthwhile secondary star or a bench of meaningful value.

That'd be pretty rough. OKC was a lot better this year relative to the league than the Lakers were.

Consider.

LAL 09: +4.5 O, -3.6 D, 3rd and 6th; +8.1 Net (3rd)
LAL 10: +1.2 O, -3.9 D, 11th and 4th; +5.1 Net (7th)
OKC 25: +5.8 O, -7.0 D, 3rd and 1st; +12.8 Net (1st)

There's a large order-of-magnitude difference between these teams relative to their own league, and the LA squads just weren't set up for this era.

So it isn't really any kind of shame that they would almost assuredly lose to the Thunder this year. That's an historic defense OKC dropped, while also being the 3rd-best O in the league while Shai went bonkers again, en route to his first MVP.

[balrog27]

32% 3 point shooter who's probably gonna chuck up like 10 3s a game today. yes would work.

[Peak Brunson]

The game today is just played way too different compared to how it was played back then.
It just doesn't make sense to compare that team with today's teams at face value, of course they would get destroyed today if they played like they did back then. But they would adapt, let's all remember players like Marc Gasol, Nikola Vucevic or Brook Lopez were not 3pt shooters at all when they came into the NBA. The only reason they started shooting them is because of the 3pt revolution and of course that they had a very good touch and midrange shooting capabilities. Pau Gasol had a very good midrange shot and I don't think he would've had much trouble getting Marc Gasol or Lopez numbers out of 3pt line, he just didn't train much for it because he was already going to retire soon.
Similarly with Kobe, if he came in this era, it's easy to see he would've practiced more his 3pt shooting and less his midrange shooting.

[tsherkin]

The game today is just played way too different compared to how it was played back then.
It just doesn't make sense to compare that team with today's teams at face value, of course they would get destroyed today if they played like they did back then. But they would adapt, let's all remember players like Marc Gasol, Nikola Vucevic or Brook Lopez were not 3pt shooters at all when they came into the NBA. The only reason they started shooting them is because if the 3pt revolution. Pau Gasol had a very good midrange shot and I don't think he would've had much trouble getting Marc Gasol or Lopez numbers out of 3pt line, he just didn't train much for it.

AGreed. And in his actual career, he WAS shooting quite well from 3, albeit on limited volume (around 1.6 per game). So he did showcase at least SOME degree of ability from 3, and he certainly had a nice long two-pointer in his actual career. BroPez has been around an 80% FT shooter on his career, and about a 39% shooter on long twos, which have been around 10% of his shooting volume on his career. He, like Al Horford, had some early makings there. Vucevic started to figure out the 3 in his 8th season, and is a career 77% FT, or thereabouts. Marc Gasol was also a career 77, 78% FT shooter who took about 16% of his shot volume from the long two, and shot 42% there, so he was another good example of someone with some potential which he ultimately realized.

I figure Pau would be fine in that regard.

[carlquincy]

As is, I dont think they can dominate. They need better shooters ard the core of Kobe, Pau and Lamar.

[oversteerdawg]

One thing I know is that Bynum wouldn't have been benched for shooting a 3

[bonita_the_frog]

As is, I dont think they can dominate. They need better shooters ard the core of Kobe, Pau and Lamar.

Oklahoma City Thunder @ 2025 NBA Finals
Field Goal % = .438
3-Point % = .345

LA Lakers @ 2009 NBA Finals
Field Goal % = .457
3-Point % = .372

[SlimShady83]

As is, I dont think they can dominate. They need better shooters ard the core of Kobe, Pau and Lamar.

Oklahoma City Thunder @ 2025 NBA Finals
Field Goal % =.438
3-Point % = .345

LA Lakers @ 2009 NBA Finals
Field Goal % = .457
3-Point % = .372

GG

[cupcakesnake]

They don't have enough 3pt shooting. Period. Their perimeter D would be problematic too.

I think the perimeter defense would be fine. Artest is a strength and footspeed monster in any era, Kobe is quick and strong, Odom was underrated guarding the perimeter. D-Fish probably struggles more in this era, but he's strong and hustly.

Agree with the 3-point shooting. Can't play 2-3 bigs, none of whom shoot the 3 well, with only average to below average shooters around them.

I think the rest of this team's strengths translate. Super giant and super skilled. Tons of playmaking in the frontcourt with Pau and Odom.

[hauntedcomputer]

Yep, Pau would still be carrying Kobe to rings and getting robbed of Finals MVPs just like the good ol' days

[165bows]

As is, I dont think they can dominate. They need better shooters ard the core of Kobe, Pau and Lamar.

Oklahoma City Thunder @ 2025 NBA Finals
Field Goal % =.438
3-Point % = .345

LA Lakers @ 2009 NBA Finals
Field Goal % = .457
3-Point % = .372

GG

Yeah except that Orlando team was trash and wouldn't have been there except for the KG injury.

The 105 ortg the Lakers won with in 2010 puts them in the Miami '23/Dallas '24 getting played off the court territory.

[tsherkin]

Yeah except that Orlando team was trash and wouldn't have been there except for the KG injury.

No they weren't. They were an extremely high-end defense, and they had done reasonably well against Boston in the RS anyway. That series would not have been a foregone conclusion, particularly with how tepid Boston tended to be on O in the postseason.

[165bows]

Yeah except that Orlando team was trash and wouldn't have been there except for the KG injury.

No they weren't. They were an extremely high-end defense, and they had done reasonably well against Boston in the RS anyway. That series would not have been a foregone conclusion, particularly with how tepid Boston tended to be on O in the postseason.

For an NBA Finals team they were.

[dhsilv2]

Yeah except that Orlando team was trash and wouldn't have been there except for the KG injury.

No they weren't. They were an extremely high-end defense, and they had done reasonably well against Boston in the RS anyway. That series would not have been a foregone conclusion, particularly with how tepid Boston tended to be on O in the postseason.

For an NBA Finals team they were.

+7.2 net rating with the number 1 defense isn't trash. Maybe they're below average?

[falcolombardi]

As is, I dont think they can dominate. They need better shooters ard the core of Kobe, Pau and Lamar.

Oklahoma City Thunder @ 2025 NBA Finals
Field Goal % = .438
3-Point % = .345

LA Lakers @ 2009 NBA Finals
Field Goal % = .457
3-Point % = .372

Field goal %gets dragged down by shooting so many more 3's as they get counted the same in fg% despite being worth 50% more, you have to use efg% there

3 point % at low volume is less relevant specially for spacing purposes

[165bows]

No they weren't. They were an extremely high-end defense, and they had done reasonably well against Boston in the RS anyway. That series would not have been a foregone conclusion, particularly with how tepid Boston tended to be on O in the postseason.

For an NBA Finals team they were.

+7.2 net rating with the number 1 defense isn't trash. Maybe they're below average?

It just wasn't a good team for the Finals. The entire team outside of Howard and maybe a couple other guys were out of the league or completely irrelevant within a year or two, one career AS appearance among the entire rest of the roster outside Howard.

They were ahead of their time re: shooting and roster construction though so they were def a sum of the parts is greater than the pieces kind of team so kudos for that.

[dhsilv2]

For an NBA Finals team they were.

+7.2 net rating with the number 1 defense isn't trash. Maybe they're below average?

It just wasn't a good team for the Finals. The entire team outside of Howard and maybe a couple other guys were out of the league or completely irrelevant within a year or two, one career AS appearance among the entire rest of the roster outside Howard.

They were ahead of their time re: shooting and roster construction though so they were def a sum of the parts is greater than the pieces kind of team so kudos for that.

I mean...I assume you're skipping Nelson because he was hurt in the playoffs. But the team literally had two guys make the allstar team other than Howard that year.

But Rashard Lewis, Turkaglu, JJ Redick, Gortat...all were around after and all had or were pretty good at their best.

Lee played another 11 years.

Alston and Anthony Johnson were the only guys out of the league soon after.

And this was 2 years after the 2007 Cavs made the finals.

[165bows]

+7.2 net rating with the number 1 defense isn't trash. Maybe they're below average?

It just wasn't a good team for the Finals. The entire team outside of Howard and maybe a couple other guys were out of the league or completely irrelevant within a year or two, one career AS appearance among the entire rest of the roster outside Howard.

They were ahead of their time re: shooting and roster construction though so they were def a sum of the parts is greater than the pieces kind of team so kudos for that.

I mean...I assume you're skipping Nelson because he was hurt in the playoffs. But the team literally had two guys make the allstar team other than Howard that year.

But Rashard Lewis, Turkaglu, JJ Redick, Gortat...all were around after and all had or were pretty good at their best.

Lee played another 11 years.

Alston and Anthony Johnson were the only guys out of the league soon after.

And this was 2 years after the 2007 Cavs made the finals.

Well I did forget about Nelson but it's the same point, he was not at all an all-star caliber player and that he and Lewis pulled AS appearances is exactly what I'm saying, that whole team was carried by Dwight, and Van Gundy being ahead of his time.

But that's not really true about the rest of the team, Lee was salary dumped off his next deal (4th in total minutes) and Pietrus flamed out the next year as well (6th in total minutes).

The point is Dwight carried a crap ton of mediocre guys that year to the finals and the best years of their careers, that Lakers team put up a 105 in the finals the next year which is a recipe these days to get run off the court in the Finals.