Kuminga to SAC, is there a middle ground?

[BoogieTime]

Kangz about to Kangz. Any pick is too many picks if he is paid nore than the MLE. If GSW don't want to retain him this should be something like Monk and 2nds for Kuminga.

not if they deem the contracts we are sending as contracts they might not want. its been reported they want to save cap and we are trying to send monk who has 3 years...

then its Kuminga and making up what the warriors feel is negative value

[SNPA]

Offers they have now and the offers they'll have in January will likely be different. Misconception is that trading Kuminga now has to be done. It doesn't.

Are you assuming GSW signs him to a multi-year deal and then trades him in Jan?

Yes

It's not up to the Warriors. It's JK decision to make.

Monk and a protected first that turns into the worst of Sac/Minny in 31 is already a very generous offer. Monk is a top five player on that GS team. Sac shouldn't bend any more. They've made a serious offer, the only one on the table.

FYI - I like that this keeps Carter in Sac. Longterm he is a better option for what Sac is trying to build under Christie than Monk.

[ChuckDurn]

Kangz about to Kangz. Any pick is too many picks if he is paid nore than the MLE. If GSW don't want to retain him this should be something like Monk and 2nds for Kuminga.

not if they deem the contracts we are sending as contracts they might not want. its been reported they want to save cap and we are trying to send monk who has 3 years...

then its Kuminga and making up what the warriors feel is negative value

Bingo.

Plus to make the money work for the Warriors (because of Kuminga’s Base-Year Compensation status), the Warriors would also need to trade either Moody or Hield to a third team, which probably means the Warriors have to send some draft capital out.

Even though Hield has only been with the Warriors 1 year, he connected super-well in the locker room - Butler, Curry, and Draymond love the guy. And if the Warriors trade Moody, on top of Kuminga, they have big roster balance issues, with way too many guards and hardly any forwards.

So yeah, from the Warriors’ perspective, it becomes Kuminga + Hield or Moody + a draft pick for Monk + a protected #1. Definitely not a no-brainer from the Warriors’ side, not even counting the items around Hield and Moody that I mentioned above.

[OGSactownballer]

Offers they have now and the offers they'll have in January will likely be different. Misconception is that trading Kuminga now has to be done. It doesn't.

Are you assuming GSW signs him to a multi-year deal and then trades him in Jan?

Yes

And how???


He signs the QO if he stays. That means he vetoes all trades and screws the team. That’s what you’re buying that way.

Have fun!

[giberish]

Kangz about to Kangz. Any pick is too many picks if he is paid nore than the MLE. If GSW don't want to retain him this should be something like Monk and 2nds for Kuminga.

not if they deem the contracts we are sending as contracts they might not want. its been reported they want to save cap and we are trying to send monk who has 3 years...

then its Kuminga and making up what the warriors feel is negative value

Monk and a lightly protected 1st might be a reasonable value for Kuminga, and if the Warriors were in rebuilding mode they should probably take it. However it leaves the Warriors horribly imbalanced and hard-caps the team at the 1st apron so they have very little ability to fix their imbalance.

For next season keeping Kuminga on either a QO or a longer deal is clearly better for the Warriors then a Monk + pick deal and the Warriors with Curry/Butler/Green on thinking on a very short timetable.

IMO a Kuminga to Sacramento deal is going to need a 3rd team (or more) to connect the dots and get immediate help for GS - in terms of money (really helps to keep GS from being hard-capped at the 1st apron), fit (big wing able to fill PF minutes is a huge rotation hole) and quality (Kuzma is terrible). Right now I don't see the team or teams that make sense to close the deal (which is why I'm not posting trade proposals) so I'd bet that Kuminga is back with GS one way or another.

[NW]

Are you assuming GSW signs him to a multi-year deal and then trades him in Jan?

Yes

And how???


He signs the QO if he stays. That means he vetoes all trades and screws the team. That’s what you’re buying that way.

Have fun!

Why does he sign the QO over a richer deal? While most analysts acknowledge it as an option, they don't consider it likely. Heck he and his agent brought the three year deal offer to the Warriors. It's team/player option negotiations at this point imo.

[NW]

Are you assuming GSW signs him to a multi-year deal and then trades him in Jan?

Yes

It's not up to the Warriors. It's JK decision to make.

Monk and a protected first that turns into the worst of Sac/Minny in 31 is already a very generous offer. Monk is a top five player on that GS team. Sac shouldn't bend any more. They've made a serious offer, the only one on the table.

FYI - I like that this keeps Carter in Sac. Longterm he is a better option for what Sac is trying to build under Christie than Monk.

You're welcome to him. 6'2 guards who can't shoot or run point aren't the best investment imo.

JK does have a say, true. We'll see if he passes on $40 mil. The Monk offer is not a talent issue, it's a contract one. Kings been trying to dump him because of his. Honestly, that first is probably the cost the Kings would need to pay for a team to take his contract. So there's a matter of the return for Kuminga at that point

[brackdan70]

Yes

It's not up to the Warriors. It's JK decision to make.

Monk and a protected first that turns into the worst of Sac/Minny in 31 is already a very generous offer. Monk is a top five player on that GS team. Sac shouldn't bend any more. They've made a serious offer, the only one on the table.

FYI - I like that this keeps Carter in Sac. Longterm he is a better option for what Sac is trying to build under Christie than Monk.

You're welcome to him. 6'2 guards who can't shoot or run point aren't the best investment imo.

JK does have a say, true. We'll see if he passes on $40 mil. The Monk offer is not a talent issue, it's a contract one. Kings been trying to dump him because of his. Honestly, that first is probably the cost the Kings would need to pay for a team to take his contract. So there's a matter of the return for Kuminga at that point

I think the pick would be a combination of return for Kuminga and monk’s contract. Monk’s contract is not terrible, though it’s probably not positive I’d agree. In a sign and trade situation you are not going to get full value for Kuminga because you don’t have leverage. Also the need to be matching Salary or close to coming back in most cases.
I don’t think the Warriors will get better.
If the hardball Kuminga to hard he will either decline the QO and become a free agent or take the QO and leave after next season, but will have a no trade clause.

[NW]

It's not up to the Warriors. It's JK decision to make.

Monk and a protected first that turns into the worst of Sac/Minny in 31 is already a very generous offer. Monk is a top five player on that GS team. Sac shouldn't bend any more. They've made a serious offer, the only one on the table.

FYI - I like that this keeps Carter in Sac. Longterm he is a better option for what Sac is trying to build under Christie than Monk.

You're welcome to him. 6'2 guards who can't shoot or run point aren't the best investment imo.

JK does have a say, true. We'll see if he passes on $40 mil. The Monk offer is not a talent issue, it's a contract one. Kings been trying to dump him because of his. Honestly, that first is probably the cost the Kings would need to pay for a team to take his contract. So there's a matter of the return for Kuminga at that point

I think the pick would be a combination of return for Kuminga and monk’s contract. Monk’s contract is not terrible, though it’s probably not positive I’d agree. In a sign and trade situation you are not going to get full value for Kuminga because you don’t have leverage. Also the need to be matching Salary or close to coming back in most cases.
I don’t think the Warriors will get better.
If the hardball Kuminga to hard he will either decline the QO and become a free agent or take the QO and leave after next season, but will have a no trade clause.

A pick with a 95% chance of being a Spurs pick with Wemby in his prime, and thus bottom 20s, isn't THAT valuable imo.

If he doesn't take the QO, he remains a restricted FA. If he takes it, you're correct, but that's passing on $40+ mil to make $7mil and risk the market being better to where someone will make that offer next summer. Warriors have made clear they'll call his bluff on doing that.

His agent likely won't let him considering he tried it when he was Victor Oladipo's agent and it backfired and he got fired. Far more likely GS and Kuminga come to an agreement on a 2-3 year deal once team or player option is worked out and Kuminga is dealt in January when no BYC makes the trade terms easier.

[jscott]

You're welcome to him. 6'2 guards who can't shoot or run point aren't the best investment imo.

JK does have a say, true. We'll see if he passes on $40 mil. The Monk offer is not a talent issue, it's a contract one. Kings been trying to dump him because of his. Honestly, that first is probably the cost the Kings would need to pay for a team to take his contract. So there's a matter of the return for Kuminga at that point

I think the pick would be a combination of return for Kuminga and monk’s contract. Monk’s contract is not terrible, though it’s probably not positive I’d agree. In a sign and trade situation you are not going to get full value for Kuminga because you don’t have leverage. Also the need to be matching Salary or close to coming back in most cases.
I don’t think the Warriors will get better.
If the hardball Kuminga to hard he will either decline the QO and become a free agent or take the QO and leave after next season, but will have a no trade clause.

A pick with a 95% chance of being a Spurs pick with Wemby in his prime, and thus bottom 20s, isn't THAT valuable imo.

If he doesn't take the QO, he remains a restricted FA. If he takes it, you're correct, but that's passing on $40+ mil to make $7mil and risk the market being better to where someone will make that offer next summer. Warriors have made clear they'll call his bluff on doing that.

His agent likely won't let him considering he tried it when he was Victor Oladipo's agent and it backfired and he got fired. Far more likely GS and Kuminga come to an agreement on a 2-3 year deal once team or player option is worked out and Kuminga is dealt in January when no BYC makes the trade terms easier.

A guy getting paid market value that no one really seems to want doesn’t have a lot of value either.

[Nate the Great]

This from a longtime Bay Area sportswriter…

Read on Twitter

[gswhoops]

This from a longtime Bay Area sportswriter…

Read on Twitter

Yeah Kawakami's generally pretty plugged into the Warriors' FO/ownership. Not saying this is the unimpeachable gospel truth but I'd be inclined to believe it.

[parsnips33]

Warriors love to enter the season with at least one guy who does not want to be there

[giberish]

I haven't' seen a plausible S&T proposal that makes GS better next season than just keeping JK. They all leave the team with hard-cap issues that would prevent their planned FA signings, leave a massive forward hole in the depth chart, have a bunch of salary taken up with below-rotation quality players or all of the above. Maybe there's a future pick added that won't help until after Curry/Butler/Green are no longer relevant but that's not really helping.

Everybody's just going to have to be professional next season (or perhaps until a midseason trade if he signs a multi-year deal).

[One_and_Done]

I continue to wonder why the Kings are offering any value at all for Kuminga.

[Nate the Great]

I continue to wonder why the Kings are offering any value at all for Kuminga.

They’re not. If they were, they might have Kuminga, but all the offers have been “guys we want to dump and a late pick six years from now” types of offers.

[One_and_Done]

I continue to wonder why the Kings are offering any value at all for Kuminga.

They’re not. If they were, they might have Kuminga, but all the offers have been “guys we want to dump and a late pick six years from now” types of offers.

As they should be.

[jayjaysee]

I’d trade about 12 Mavs, who are under contract, for a pick 6 years out from Sacramento..

[gswhoops]

I’d trade about 12 Mavs, who are under contract, for a pick 6 years out from Sacramento..

There's obviously a deal here then:

SAC: Kuminga
DAL: Monk + 1st
GSW: Cooper Flagg

[gswhoops]

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1mhq4zz/amick_golden_state_doesnt_want_to_move_either/

A quick (and belated) follow-up on the Jonathan Kuminga reporting from Friday: Anyone saying the first-round pick protections are the only obstacle to a Kings-Warriors sign-and-trade is wrong, as I'm told Golden State really doesn't want to move either Buddy Hield or Moses Moody (which would be required). And yes, as Tim Kawakami reported, the Warriors are indeed signaling that they expect Kuminga to be on their roster next season. That being said, nearly two months remains before his qualifying offer deadline (Oct. 1). Plenty of time for something to change here.